G.—2.

528. Taurua -. When the 2,000 acres were reserved at Otauto, 1,000 acres were given to Komene and his people. It was on the other side of Whenuakura ; and Sir Donald McLean said that 500 acres were to be in the bush, and 500 acres out in the open. Komene then took this land between Patea and Whenuakura, adjoining the 2,000-acre reserve. 1 said to Komene, " You should have taken the reserve where it was pointed out to you by Sir Donald McLean, and not here between Patea and AV^honuakura, where I shall dispute it." 529. Komene said: Sir Donald McLean gave 1,000 acres to Pukorokoro at Whenuakura. Mr. Parris was there at the time, and agreed to it; and Hone Pihama1 was there also, and agreed to it; he too was a Commissioner. It was chosen on the other side of Whenuakura. I said, "No ; bring it this side of Whenuakura, next to the piece of land belonging to Taurua." Captain Blake then took Taurua, Ngahina, and myself to see the boundary lines, and he pointed out Taurua's land, and pointed out mine as being next to it. 530. The Commissioners.'] Have you lived there yourself ? Are your whores on that land, on this side of the river?—My houses are on the land pointed out to me by Captain Blake. The cartload of potatoes that I brought in this morning were grown on the land. 531. Taurua : I will speak about all the land between the mountains and Mr. Richmond's boundary line, which is one and a half miles from the sea, and extending three miles from one river to the other. It was while I was in Patea that this land was sold, after I had repeatedly asked that it should not be dealt with. It was sold here by Captain Wray. If I had been told, when I was tried in Wellington, that my land was to be taken for my offences against the Queen, then I should have understood it; but I was not told so at the time. My body was punished for my offences. 532. The Commissioners : There are several things which the Commissioners have to say, in answer to what you have said. The first point is in reference to what you have just said about not having been told about your land at the time when you were tried. The duty of the Judge was only to administer the law : he had nothing whatever to do with the land or the confiscation, and had no po wer to say anything on the subject. That is why you were never told in the Supreme Court what would be the result of your insurrection. Nevertheless you and all the people knew in 1866, after the first war, that if you broke out in insurrection again the land would certainly be taken by the Government. 533. Taurua -. All the blocks I have mentioned were given to us before the second outbreak, and they were not taken from us after the disturbance as payment. 534. The Commissioners : The reason why Taiporohenui was not taken was on account of Te Ngohi (Hone Pihama). His name preserved that land, and it is recorded in the papers before the Parliament that it was on account of the manner in which Ngohi himself had behaved that none of that land was taken. It was preserved and saved by his good conduct. When the second war broke out there had been no reserve made north of that line of Mr. Richmond's; but afterwards it became necessary, in consequence of the second insurrection, that white people should be put upon the land. You must understand that all those engagements of Mr. Richmond, and all arrangements made before the second insurrection, were swept away altogether by that insurrection. If you had been present at the sitting of the Commission at Hawera, you would have heard references to other reserves there which had also gone in the same way. Now, at the time when the land between Patea and Whenuakura was sold, there were two other things done: one was to grant a piece of land on the river side of the Kaharoa track for the University, and the other was to make a reserve, also on that ridge, of 1,000 acres for Komene. Those two things were done, besides the selling of the land ; and now there is no ground for us to interfere with either of those things any more than with the sales that have been made to the Europeans. You must remember that after the second insurrection, the Europeans wanted the Government not to allow you or any of your people to return to the land at all. But the Grovernment had consideration for you and your people, because you (Taurua) had received much greater punishment than any of the others. We must refer to something that took place between Sir Donald McLean and Sir D. Bell years ago. At the time when you were brought back in 1873 by Sir Donald McLean, Sir Dillon Bell said to Sir Donald, " Look how small a piece of land has been given to Taurua compared with other pieces, like Taiporohenui, which were given to the other tribes who were equally in rebellion." He added, "It is true that the name of Ngohi has protectedth.it land, but still the quantity for Taurua is very small." You have heard the word we have said to you, that all these promises of Mr. Richmond were swept away by the second insurrection. But when Sir Donald McLean and Sir D. Bell spoke about that, they both agreed that consideration ought to be shown to you, principally on account of your having suffered the punishment which you did, and also because, after your return from Otago, you and the people whom you immediately controlled behaved well. ■ With reference to the land at Mokoia which you were just speaking about, there is land there for your people, and at Manutahi. And because you have always behaved well since, and also because we remember what happened to you, our word to the Governor will be to recommend that some portion of the land in the Kaharoa, between Patea and Whenuakura Rivers, shall be reserved for you. We cannot say how much it will be yet, because we must first see what the Governor has to say to it. But j*ou must not suppose that it will extend back to the mountain, because in every other case where reserves have been made, there has always been a reasonable back boundary fixed. Therefore you must leave it until we have been able to think carefully over the land and the boundaries ; but you may be sure we shall recommend to the Governor that there shall be some further reserve made to you, and it will be for the Governor to say whether he consents or not. That is all we have to say. You must remember that we ar.e only carrying out the promises of former days since the second insurrection. It is not for us to undo that which was done by Sir Donald McLean or any other Minister, otherwise we should be asked to undo a great many other things besides. If you have anything more to urge, we will give you another opportunity of speaking. 535. Taurua : I have said all I have to say ; I have finished ; I will leave it with you now. I will not forget it, but will bear it in mind. I leave the rest to you. 536. The Commissioners: You must not think that any of the words which have passed to-day will be forgotten or passed lightly over, It will not be long before our word will go to the Governor, and we hope it will be oranga (consolation) for you.

38