E.—3,

11

162. Is the Native title extinguished absolutely on those blocks? —I speak, of course, from the Government return, and judge it is. One part of the return is "Negotiations completed," and the other ia " Negotiations still in Progress." The blocks that have been purchased in Manawatu, Otaki, and Waikanae comprise 214,152 acres; and the number between Foxton and Waikanae upon which there are negotiations in progress embrace 128,630 acres. Between Foxton and Waikanae the Government actually own 74,717 acres. 163. Can you give us any information aa to the export trade of the Manawatu District from Foxton—what it consists of? —It consists mostly of timber, for the simple reason that the people cannot export from the country where the oats and other produce are grown —that is, Sandon. They are selling oats there at Is. per bushel. People cannot get them away. The settlers have told me repeatedly that they would crop ten times the extent of country that they do at present, if there were any means of getting their stuff away. 104. Has the timber trade increased or greatly decreased of late ?—During the past six or eight months it has gone down very much, although from Foxton 1 believe there has been more timber shipped during that period than for some time before. The timber trade in the Upper Manawatu District, I believe, is not prospering so well as it was. 165. That, I understand, is the principal export; you have no other export worth mentioning?— Of course there is the wool, which is a large item ; but, so far as wheat and other cereals are concerned, the reason they are not exported is, because there is no communication between the pore and the districts where they are grown. One very great reason why the people in the grain-growing districts desire a railway from Foxton to South Manawatu is, that so soon as the timber country south of the Mauawatu is settled, they would have a near market for their produce. 166. Would the proposed district railway from Sandon to Foxton open up Government land or Native land? —No ; it is all private land. 167. Of very inferior quality ? —No. I was over a portion of it yesterday at Campbelltown, and there it is splendid land. 168. Mr. Thynne informed us that the soil was so light, and the draught so heavy, that the produce was carted from the Saudon District about 24 miles to Palmerston, and sent thence by railway to Foxton, in preference to carting it direct. I wish to know whether that is due to sandy soil, or, as far as your knowledge goes, to what cause is it due ?—lt is for this reason : that the soil is sandy, and there is no gravel in the district; hence the people are unable to make roads. I think Mr. Thynne explained that towards the north gravel was obtained ; hence roads were made between Sandon and both Palmerston and Feilding. Between Carnarvon Junction and Sandon, until you get one or two miles off the road towards where the bush country lies, the land is mostly very light. The soil being sandy, aud there being no gravel, it would be impossible, without enormous expense, to construct macadamized roads. 169. From Carnarvon, what distance is it to the bush in the direction of Sandon ?—About 8 or 9 miles. 170. So that that district railway would only traverse 4 or 5 miles of good country?—No; because the light country drops off or slopes down into a natural basin ; and directly you pass over the shelf you come on to very fine country, including some open land. 171. On the track of the proposed railway, which you told us would be 12 miles from Carnarvon to Sandon, some 4 or 5 miles only would be through bush land? —Yes. Much of the land is pastoral land, and in many parts it is extremely rich, especially some of the land owned by Mr. Campbell on both sides of the road. 172. Mr. Clark.'] Is Carnarvon the name of the station on the present line ? —Yes. 173. Is it the nearest station to the Sandon District? —Yes, on this side. 174. Then what is the distance from Greatford to Sandon ? —lt is 3 miles from Greatfordto Bulls, and4 from Greatford into Sandon —7 miles into Sandon, and then 12 miles on to Carnarvon. 175. Then the village of Sandon, I suppose, is in the centre of the Sandon District? —Yes. 176. So that, in reality, if the desire of the growers of grain is to have a railway constructed, 7\ miles is the distance from the centre of the district to the nearest station ?—Yes. 177. What is the distance between Greatford and Wanganui, which would then be their nearest port? —About 37 miles. I have been recently over part of the South Manawatu country, within a few miles of Otaki, on this side of it, and I can speak of the excellent character of the soil. There are a number of natural clearings, and upon these the grass was growing almost up to the horse's thighs. The Maoris who own the land between Foxton and Otaki have expressed themselves strongly in favour of the line extending to Foxton. They signed a petition to that effect, which I presented to the Minister of Public Works some few months ago in Wellington. 178. Mr. Wright.'] Did they put any value upon their land when they asked for a railway to be made this way ? —No. 179. Were they willing to give the land required ? —I question i£ they would do that. They have given land for a road between Foxton and Otaki, and they are now making it. It is the agreement that each lia-pu shall make the road through its own part of the land. 180. To be paid for by Government? —Id is paid for out of a vote of £3,000. The road ia being constructed under the supervision of the County Council.

Otaki, Saturday, 13th Maecii, 1880. Mr. Sydney Smith sworn and examined. 181. The Chairman.'] I believe you drive the coach regularly between Foxton and "Wellington? — Ido not regularly drive the coach. I am the town agent for Hastwell, Macara, and Co., coach-pro-prietors. Our coaches work daily, one up and one down. There is another coach between Pahautanui and Wellington, but it does not run on the beach to Poxton. 182. Can you give us any idea as to the number of passengers you usually take on the through line from Toxton to Wellington ? —All the accounts pass through my hands, and I know exactly how many