1.-3.

32

894. How many bundles did Brissenden give you ?—Not less than three or more than four. 895. The Chairman.] Will you describe again your object in going to that field ? What was your object in going from the Thames to Ohinemuri ?—To get a share in this Prospectors' Claim. 896. And did you succeed in getting a share in the Prospectors' Claim ? —Tes ; but I got it through the amalgamation at a subsequent period. Even if I had not marked out, I would have had a share under the amalgamation with Thorpe. 897. You had made this arrangement prior to the 3rd of March ?—Tes. 898. And you were satisfied with that arrangement, and did not intend to try for anything else ?— I did not intend to mark out any ground that day. 899. Now, when you received these rights from Brissenden, I understand that you met him, and that you went back to the house, and got them. Did you pay him for them ? —No ; I did afterwards. 900. Did you pay him for these rights then ?—No. 901. And how had these rights been procured ? —I do not know. 902. Could they have been procured without payment ?—I do not think so, but Ido not know. 903. You paid for them at a subsequent period ?—Yes. 904. It would appear from that, then, that Brissenden did not receive the money for these rights at the time he gave them to you ?—No. 905. He held you accountable to pay him the money for them at some subsequent period ?—No ; I was not accountable at all for them; I was only responsible for my own. 906. When he gave you these rights, he gave them to you without payment. Now, did not that strike you as something extraordinary, that a stranger to you should give you several bundles of rights ? —No ; I dare say some one told him who I was, and that he would be safe in sending them by me. 907. You believe that when Brissenden got these rights he must have paid for them himself?— Yes ; I think so. 908. Did you know, then, that he had not received any payment for them himself ? —No; he afterwards told me he wanted the money for them. 909. Your own right was included among them ?—Yes, I think it was with them. 910. Did you pay him at that period for your own right ?—No. 911. Is that not an extraordinary way to get rights, including your own, without payment?—No; he knew, I suppose, that I would pay him for my own at least. 912. Can you suggest a motive which could have induced Brissenden to do this most extraordinary thing ?—I knew nothing of Brissenden, and never saw him before the 3rd of March. 913. A total stranger puts rights representing a lot of money into your hands without receiving anything for them?— The only thing I thought at the time was, that he knew most of these parties, and that he would get the money from them. 914. And you think, then, that he did not do it as a matter of pure benevolence ?—I did not think about it at all. I merely took the rights from him to certain parties on the Karangahake Hill. He told me not to give them away until 10 o'clock, although I may have given some of them away before that time, but I am not certain. 915. When you reached the hill, did any person come up to you, and ask you whether you had rights ?—No. 916. How did it become known that you had these rights in your possession on the hill?—I went to two or three of those whose rights were included, and told them, 917. Were these people waiting there by arrangement instead of going to the office ?—Not waiting for me. They may have been waiting for the rights. There may have been some other mate of theirs waiting at the booth for them, for all I know. 918. And you told the people you had those rights, and some time afterwards you gave them to them. Did they pay you for them then ?—No, not then; before I left the hill two or three of them paid me. 919. Did you know at the time you received them from Brissenden, that Brissenden had not received the money ?—No, I do not remember his telling me so. 920. When you gave the rights to those people on the hill, did you know whether these people had paid Brissenden for them or not ?—No, but before I left the hill that day two or three gave me money to pay for them. They did not know from whom I got the rights. 921. Did any conversation occur when they paid you?— No. 922. Then how came you to take the money if you did not know whether Brissenden had been paid. This money was not handed to you in consideration of your services in bringing them there ?— Certainly not. 923. Did you keep a list of the names of the people who paid you these moneys ? —I did, so as to remember who had paid me. 924. Sir Q. Grey.~] Did Brissenden tell you how many rights he gave you ?—I think not. 925. Did you count them ? —No. 926. The Chairman.'] At this subsequent period, when Brissenden asked you for the payment, did he then tell you how many rights he had given you ? —I do not think so. He did not ask me for the money, but merely said he was going away, and that if I could get some of the money for him he would be obliged. 927. Did he explain to you at this time his reason or motive for his benevolence in buying these rights ?—He did not. 928. And it did not excite your curiosity ?—No ; as I said before, I took these rights from him to oblige him, just to give them to the people for whom they were intended. 929. Mr. T. L. Shepherd.] Do you know Michael O'Haire ? —Yes ; he is a miner. 930. Has he a share ? —Yes ; 1 heard so.

Mr. Dillon,

21st Sept., 1875,

931. Do you know the Home Rule Claim ?—Yes. 932. Are you aware that Brissenden's miners' rights were used to peg out a claim called the Home Rule Claim at 10 o'clock ?—No.