E—No. 4

OF THE NATIVE INSURRECTION.

57. Was there aPa on the disputed Block before the migration? —-I do not know. 58. Have you ever heard that King asked permission of Ram to build a Pa on the South Bank, »nd do you believe that he did so?—I have heard so. I believe I know the reason why he asked permission. On their return from Waikanae they were all rather anxious that they might be on the safe side of the river as they dreaded that the Waikato would return. This fear was more particularly expressed by Tamati Ram who thought that Wm. King might as well occupy their side of the river. The reason of his making it a request was not on account of his having land there—for there was within a few chains the land of his brother-in-law—but he desired to build the Pa a few chains nearer the river than it would have been on that land. 59. Who is the head of the Ngatituaho?—Undoubtedly Te Patukakariki. 60. Do you know Ropoama te Onee?—Yes, I have known him for the last 20 years. 61. What is his rank in the Tribe?—He might possibly rank as a Chicf —but most certainly under Te Patukakariki. 62. Are you aware whether Ropoama has consented to the sale?—lam not personally aware whether he assented to it or not. I have heard so many contradictory statements. Ropoama had a personal quarrel with Wm. King's brother and would have gladly co-operated in anything likely to annoy W. King. I have heard reports that some payment had been made to Kopoama which he now wanted to return ; also that the Chief Commissioner bad offered him £100 for his claim to the disputed land at Waitara. I never heard that he approved of the sale, but on the contrary that he positively refused to be a party to the sale. I have this on very good authority. 63. Are you acquainted with the details of negotiations for land in the New Plymouth district since the disallowance of Spain's Award?—l have read the documents laid on the table of the House, and have heard a good deal, but living 200 miles from the spot —I could not say that I was acquainted with '.he details. 64. Of whom was the Bell Block bought ?—Principally, I believe, from returned slaves from Waikato, so 1 have been informed. 65. Of whom was the Hua Block bought ?—I do not know. GO. Of whom was the Tarurutangi bought ?—I do not know. C 7. To what hapus of the Ngatiawa do Riwai Te Ahu, Hohepa, and the Waikanae claimants belong ?—Riwai belongs to Ngatikura and Ngatihinga : the other claimants to the same hapu. GB. Did William King receive any payment for Mangati or Bell Block ?—I don't know whether he did or not. 69. You say King is the head of four hapus,—where is the Territorial boundary of these four hapus ?—I am not acquainted with the boundaries of the land owned by those four hapus, of which William King is the hend. I have only been for a few dnys at Taranaki of late. I have never professed to be acquainted with the boundaries. 70. Did King receive a payment from Colonel Wakefield in 1839, and for what ? —I believe that William King receivedno payment in the year 1839. I presume the question hae reference to a deed ■which is published and to which his signature is attached. I was rather surprised to see that document relied upon —but lam aware that King received no payment, or anything for Waitara. lie may have picked up a few figs of tobacco on board the " Tory." In reference to the a»rard of Mr. Spain,—he distinctly informed me that when he looked at the deed he treated it as waste paper, and told me that there had been no award made under that deed. 1 was requested by Governor Hobson to attend a meeting, at which were present the late Chief Justice, the late Attorney-General, Mr. George Clarke, Colonel Wakefield and others, who were about to examine this deed On that occasion, I suggested that, as the deed was drawn up before this was a British colony, and in the English language, that it was probable the Natives did not understand it. The person who interpreted it to the Natives was sent for. This person was Mr. Brooks, who afterwards lost his life at the Wairau. He was sent for, and asked to interpret it. After stammering for some minutes, it was found that he was utterly unable to translate a line of it. It was consequently considered as of no importance. Colonel Wakefield told me that lie never had any intention of taking possession of any land under that deed, and it was only intended " to throw dust in the eyes of the Sydney land sharks," that he might keep them away, or that if they came he could assert a primary claim to the land, which would invalidate any other claim. William King received no payment or any compensation, except what he may have picked up on the deck of the " Tory." 71. Mr. C. 11. Broion.~\ Are you aware of any cause of personal enmity betwen Teira and William King, prior to Teira having offered the land in dispute for sale?—l am. I have been informed that Tβ Teira bore enmity to William King, on account of a girl who was affianced to his brother, having been married to William King's son. 72. Do men of high rank sometimes descend in rank—" Ne/ce te tupu ?"—A man of good descent, even of the best blood of the tribe, may lose all rank in the tribe, and be treated simply as a tutua. Th law of primogeniture does not exist among them, in reference to Chieftainship. 74. Would he lose his claims to land by that'descent ?—A man would not lose his claim to land by becoming a lulua. His title would not be affected by it. What he would lose would be his rank and position in the tribe. 74. What was King's conduct, with regard to the King movement, up to the time of the dispute about the land at Waitara ?—He always decidedly objected to have anything to do with the King movement. When I saw him, three years ago, he repudiated all connection with it. And up to last January, ho decidedly refused to have any thiiigto do with it.

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