WESTLAND IN THE PROVINCIAL COUNCIL.

West Coast Times, Issue 367, 26 November 1866, Page 1 (Supplement)

WESTLAND IN THE PROVINCIAL COUNCIL.

Tuesday, Nov. 20. (FBOM THE IYITELTON- TIIIUS, SOY. 21. ) WEST COASI ESTIMATES. On the motion of Mr S+ewart, the House went into committee on the csti-' mates of receipts and expenditure for the West Canterbury Goldfields. Mr Stewart said he would not detain the House long with the remarks he had to make. He would first direct the attention of hon. members to that portion of the comparative statement in which the expenditure on the West Coast for the last twelve months was dealt with. They would find that L 167,734 2s 8d had been voted, and L 217,522 19s lOd expended, making a total over-expenditure of L 59,788 1 7s 2d. The over-expenditure had been principally on police, harbor works, hospitals, aud puMic buildings, all of which had been found absolutely unavoidable. It would be seen that while there had been this over-expendi-ture on the subjects mentioned, several of the votes showed a considerable unexpended balance, amounting in all to L 45.139 3s lid. He would now direct their attention to the estimates of receipts and expenditure for tho financial year 1866-7. On turning to the summary iw their hands, hon. members would find that the customs duty was expected to produce L 45,000. This estimate was considered a moderate one, for the receipts from this source had been L 40,446 for the past year. The gold export duty, which last j ear produced L 45.247, was estimated at L 50,000, which was not thought too much by those best qualified to judge. From miners' rights, licenses, foes and fines, and publicans.' licences, the estimated receipts, were L 29,000, these having produced L 22,198 in the past year. Boatmen's licenses, auctioneers' licenses, and hospital fees were expected to make LI OSO. The telegraph fees, which were put down at L 2500, were expected to reach a far larger sum. Altogether, the Government counted on receiving LI 27,9 75, to which must be added L 30,000, the estimated amount to be received from the sale of land on the West Coast, making in all L 157,975. Against these estimated receipts was put a total estimated expenditure of L 157,489 12s, Laving a balance of L 485 Bs. It was necessary that he should say a few words with regard to some items in the proposed expenditure. The vote for the Commissioner's department was slightly increased, but not more so than the circumstances of the case warranted. The estimated expenditure on surveys was L 13 ,19-3, and although, it was not likely to be all expended, it was cou# sidered better to put that sum on the estimates. The administration of justice, the estimated expenditure on which was L 30,800 2s, might be considered a large item, but it was not so when com pared with the expenditure for the same purposes on other goldfields. The administration of justice on the Otago goldfields in 1863, for instance, was L 59,000 or L 60,000. The votes asked for the various public works and buildings had been calculated on a scale which was thought reasonable, while it left a sufficient margin for any unforeseen occurrences. Although it might appear that LI 0,000 was a large sum for new roads and contingencies, it would be admitted by the House that nothing was so essential to the development of the goldfields as roads, and that the outlay which might be found necessary on these was exceedingly difficult to foregee. For the overland road from Christchurch to Hokitika the Government asked a sum of L 30,000, and under this head they included a largo estimated expenditure on the road from the Arahura to Hokitika. The other items in the detailed estimates, and which were included under the general head of miscellaneous, were all judged necessary. In framing these estimates the Government had been guided in a great measure by the representations of the hon. members for Westland, who, it would be allowed, were the best judges of the requirements of the district. Tt was necessary that he should say a few words with regard to the system of Government which it was proposed to establish on the West Coast. Hon. members were aware that considerable dissatisfaction had been expressed by the population on the goldfields at the indifference and negligence of their interests, which, they stated, had characterised th" action of past government. It was quite poss-ble that the exigencies of the Government might, in some instances, have caused delay ; and that insufficient information may have led to expenditure in advance of requirements, or not in accordance with them : but when the peculiar position of the West Coast, in its relation to an Eastland Government was considered, very considerable allowance must be made for any shortcomings which may have occurred in the management of its affairs. The Government, however, ! were about to give Westland a larger j share in the management of matters, i and intended to initiate a measure which would have the desired effect. The Government proposed to appoint a Commission, composed of gentlemen resident on the West Coast, to enquire into the present arrangements for the conduct of the Government business, and to report on the best mode of conductiug it in future. The object of the Commission

would be to inform the Government on all points considered necessary for the good government of the West Coast. The Commission would go to work during the recess, and action would be taken on any report they might make at the earliest possible moment. The Go Vermont thought this assurance would be suiTicient to show that they intended to deal with the affairs of Westlaud in a just and liberal spirit. He might be allowed to refer for a moment to the valuable- assistance the Government had received from the Goldfields Commissioner, Mr Sale. That gentleman had worked early aud late, and to him the Government felt much indebted for the exertions he had made in the public service. With regard to the sale of land on the West Coast, the Government intended to avail themselves of the provisions of a law passed during last session of the General Assembly, immediately upon the rising of the Council, and would, therefore, bring into operation the Goldfield s Act, 1866, with- a view to the pale of land on the West Coast. The Commission he had already referred to would be instructed to enquire into the subject, in order to settle what lands were available for sale. It was absolutely necessary that the land should be sold, and the Government intended to sell it. The Commission would also bo instructed to enquire into the debt which it was alleged was due from West to East Canterbury. They would be requested to consider the expenditure causing the debt, and authority would be given them to entertain any objection as to omissions or otherwise, which might be brought forward on cither side. It was quite possible that there might be a considerable increase or decrease in the account as it at present stood. The matter would be fully gone into, and all accounts fairly chargeable to the West Coast would be so charged. The Government intended to bring in a bill for handing over Gibson's Quay to the Municipality of Hokitika, as an endowment for the use of the town ; and they also intended to lay before the Council a resolution, having for its object the authorisation of guarantees to tramway and other companies. The only object which ihe Government had in view in dealing with Westland affairs was secure to the population that measured attention which they were fully entitled to (hear, hear). Mr Stewart concluded by moving that the House go into committPC of supply to consider the estimates of receipts and expenditure for West Coast.

Mr Beswick said he wished to make a few remarks on the estimates which hid at last, and by degrees, been brought before the Hoiisc. He had had the honor of a scat in that Council for four or five years, and he was bound to say that he had never before seen the estimates dealt with as they had been by the present Government. In what he was going to say he bogged the House to remember that although he might bo apparently, acting in a spirit of antagonism to the Government, he was only exercising that privilege of fair criticism which as an independent member he had a right to exercise. . lie had already declared his intention ot giving the Government a general support, but that declaration did not preclude him from expressing those opinions he conscientiously entertained, lie believed that he expressed the general opinion of the House when he said the estimates, as brought down, were very unsatisfactory (hear, hear). Although they had been informed in his Honor's address that the Council was called for the express purpose of considering the estimates, fully a month had elapsed before they weie brought down. He thought the estimates should be brought down at the very earliest period, so that lion, members might fully inform themselves as to their extent and bearing. (Hear, hear.) He might say that although the estimates had been brought down, the House had heard no financial statement. (Flear, hear.) There were many omissions which he had expected to be filled up, and many explanations, which were highly necessary, but which were not made. It appeared from the estimates of ordinary receipts and expenditure that there was a deficiency of upwards of L 22,000, and no explanation was offered as to how this was to be met. It had been the aim of every Government to cut down as much as possible ihe expenditure, and last year the deficiency on this account had been only LIO,OOO. It seemed to him that if the province went on in the way proposed it would soon be in the position of Southland, aud asking the protection of the court. Although the Government had put on the estimates a sum of L 10,000 to bo received from the Hospital and Charitable Aid rate, they could not expect to receive it : so that the deficiency on the ordinary receipts and expenditure account was upwards of L30.Q00. He would repeat that no explanation had been given as to how this deficiency was to be met. He thought on looking over the items of expenditure, that a saving might be made in the police department. On the Land and Works account there was again a deficiency, and again an absence of any explanation as to how it was to be met. The expenditure on surveys appeared enormous. According to his calculations, the survey of land cost about 4s per acre. The contract surveys were especially objectionable. It was a oommon

romark that any man who got a contract survey had got a little fortune. (Hear, hear.) He had endeavored to understand the Railway and Harbor Works account, but had failed. He could not, for instance, see how L2OOO could be expected from the Timaru landing service, when it was proposed to hand over that service to the municipality of Timaru. He had been greatly disappointed in lookiug at tho proposed expenditure on accouur of railways, and had come to believe that the Northern railway, although greatly more needed than the Southern, was a farce, so far as the intentions of the Government were concerned. Ho hoped the hon. members for the North would look into the question, and contrast the proposed expenditure on Northern railways with that asked for the South. He had in-" tended to go into the West Coast estimates at some length, but he would not do so. He must,' however, protest against the principle of separating one district of the province from all the others in the way done by the Government. Why was the West Uor.st not asked to contribute to the ordinary revenue of the whole province ? lie had heard nothing of tho debt which Westland owed to the Government. (Hear, hear.) He did not wish to remind the representatives of Westland of that debt unduly, but he thought some mention ought to have been made of it in the way of a proposal for its liquidation. (Hear, hear.)

Mr J. S. Williams said that the House, after waiting for a considerable time, had at last received the whole of the estimates. But although a large array of figures had been read over to them and laid' before them, they had heard no regular financial statement. The Provincial Secretary gave them the figures, and appeared to expect that they would make the best of them. He thought the Government were to blame in putting on the estimated receipts a sum which, they did not expect to receive. It might be all very well to estimate the Customs revenue at L 40,000 for this year, but would that, or any sum be received in future ? He had expected to hear of a general scheme of retrenchment, and he believed the feeling of the House was strongly in favor of it (Hear, hear.) The Government had proposed a Commission for the West Coast, but ho thought a Commission to enquire into the Civil Service of the province would be a greater service. (Hear, hear.) He did not think that the West Coast policy ought to form the subject of a Commission, although it might be necessary to make large enquiries into the general working of departments in that district. He noticed that in the department of Public Works a very large amount was set down j for salaries and departmental expenses. He was astonished to find that the large debt due to the bank was not touched on more fully. No doubt the subject was a most disi.greeable one, but it would have to be met soon, for j hon. members could hardly believe that the bank would allow so large a deficit to remain long outstanding. The debt due by the West Coast has not been brought forward as a debit, although it appeared that the Government admitted the principle from the manner in which they had dealt with other accounts. He asked for no more than justice in the adjustment of this debt. The West Coast had not been asked to contribute to the ordinary expenditure, such, for instance as che Superintendent's salary, the expenses of the Executive, and other items their fair share in which they could not expect to escape. He must say that he had never heard anything with greater astonishment than tho declaration that the Government intended to appoint a Commission to enquire into and decide on the best mode of governing the West Coast. (Hear, hear.) What, he might ask, was the use of a Government, if not to govern? The Treasury benches were now strongly represented, and the gentlemen who sat there might well occupy their time in devising some scheme of Government for Westland. If they did not do so, it was possible other gentlemen might be found who would relieve them of the duty. (Laughter.) This Commission was a most unconstitutional way of getting rid of work, and he hoped the Government would reconsider their determination. If not, the subject would be forced upon them by the House. (Applause.) Mr Thomson said the idea of appointing a Commission to enquire into the affairs of Westland appeared to him most absurd. It appeared as if the Government had no confidence in themselves. (Laughter.) Mr Buckley said that he would endeavor to recapitulate the main features of the estimates, showing how it was I proposed to meet the deficits. Mr Buckley then went over the various accounts, and showed that the general deficit, which was over L 177,000, would be met by the sale of debentures. There had been a great cry about retrenchment,' but it had not been clearly shown how it was to be brought about. The expenditure on public works could be regulated by the House, and the Government took credit for having proposed to appoint a Commission to enquire into tin 1 whole Civil Service of the province, in order to see in what respects it might be reorganised. Fault had been found with the contract surveys, but he believed that it was the cheapest way of getting

the work done. The debt due by the West Coast had been incurred before the present Government came into office. It was proposed to recoup it by the sale of land in that district. It had been said that the shire of customs to the provinces might soon bo stopped. In that case, there was only one way to meet the difficulty; the ordinary expenses must bo met by an appropriation from the laud fund. There was no use, however, in anticipating such a thing as the stoppage of the customs allowance. The object in appointing the Commission for the West Coast had apparently been misunderstood. The Commission would enquire into the working of departments, would make suggestions for their re-arrange-mcut and consolidation, and would give advice about the sale of land. The new Goldfields Act empowered the Government to deal with the lands, and the Commission would advise the Government as to what lands were available without interfering with the interests of the miners

Mr Oassius said that he believed the receipts from the West Coast had been uuder-estimated in one or two instances. He felt bound to protest against the proposed expenditure of L 30,000 on the West Coast road. He could onlylook on that road as an expensive experiment, undertaken, not only without the consent, but against the express wishes of the inhabitants ot Westland. If it Avas to cost L 30,000 every year to keep it in repair, it would indeed be a costly experiment. He wished to see a larger sum set aside for opening up new tracks, and repairing those already in existence. Although ho was not an advocate for the reduction of salaries, and especially on a goldfield, he must bay that he considered the salary proposed for the Commissioner on the West Coast too high. Alone, it would not be so, but when that gentleman enjoyed the salaries of other offices, he did not think he was wrong in asking for a reduction.

Mr B.irff thought that the receipts from Westland had been very much under-estimated. He should like to see some retrenchment made in the salaries. The Engineer's and Police departments might be reduced as far as regards salaries ; he thought that the "police, especially, were altogether overpaid, and were far too numerous. After' alluding to some of the items on the estimates, • the hon. member expressed his hopft that another hospital would s6*tJlt*be established in Westland, and passed in review some of the works to be undertaken, and the sums to be expended upon them. He objected to the item of L 30,000 for the overland road to Christchurch. lie was sure that the expenses of keeping the road in repair would be considerable, aud he did not believe that the West Coast would derive an equivalent for the money expended. With regard to the Commission suggested for Westland, he was in favor of it. It would be very desirable to have a lengthened and accurate report of the condition of the West Coast, and he suggested some alterations in the present system of ! managing the affairs of Westiand. It had been stated that the appointment of such a commission would bo unconstitutional, but he saw no force in the objection. Ho was glad to see a sum placed upon the estimates for the purposes of education in Weslland, and he hoped that at the next meeting of the Council a still larger sum would be asked for. He should also like to see LIOOO placed upon the estimates for distribution amongst the various religious denominations, all of which are in debt, in order to enable them to erect places of worship. The subject of the sale of lands would require great attention on the part of the proposed commission.

Mr Wylde would like to know what course the Government intended to pursue with regard to the unexpended balance of the L 500,000 loan. Unless the subject was carefully looked after, he feared that the balance would be absorbed in some great works. Mr Maude remarked that it had been stated that the revenue from Westland had been under-estimated. He was glad to hear this ; it was most gratifying both for East and West Canterbury. With regard to the allocation of the balance of the loan, he could only say that, if he had remained in office, the original application of it would have been carried out. He approved of the proposed West Coast Commission, as it would give the inhabitants an opportunity of obtaining redress for any grievances which they might deem themselves to be suffering from. Besides, the Commission would be the means ot bringing the two portions of the province into closer union. A supervision would also be exercised over the expenditure of the Westland funds, and it would ensure such funds being expended for the greater benefit of the West Coast. The Commission would act as advisers to the Executive, and would report upou the affairs of Westland. They would also determine what blocks of laud it would be advisable to sell. They would supply information to the Government which it would otherwise be impossible for the latter to obtain, and that information would guide the Government as to their course of action.

Mr Bright was strongly in favor of the appointment of the proposed Commission, as he thought that it would supply a want which had been long felt. It would also be the means of enabling

the inhabitants to obtain the means of exorcising a control over their own affairs, a privilege which every Englishman so highly valued. He thanked the Government for having brought forward tho motion. The district he represented was willing to discharge its obligations to the eastern portion. An equitable arrangement might be made so that the burden of the expenditure might be fairly borne. He hoped that the Government were prepared to. place the western side of tho province on an equal political footing with the eastern, by giving the former a share of representation in tho Council equal to that possessed by the eastern portion. Mr Muriay-Aynsleysaw no provision made in the printed estimates for paying off the overdraft against the Government. Nor was it stated to what bank or banks the amount was due. This ought to be looked to, for the province might be called upon to pay off the sum at any moment. The hon. \ member concluded by reviewing some I of the items of the estimates, and by expressing his hope that an equitable ad- j justment of the expenses incurred by the West Coast would be made. The House then adjourned. On the following day a message was announced from his Honor the Superintendent with reference to the- Westland Board of Education Bill, recently passed, in which his Honor recommended the recommittal of the till for the further consideration and amendment of one clause. Mr Stewart laid on the table certain returns asked for. The House then went into cmmiltee, when the debate on the estimates was resumed by Mr Wynn Williams, who addressed the Council at very considerable length. Mr Wynn Williams was followed by Mr Brown, who reviewed tl.e estimates as brought down. Mr Stewart replied on behalf of the Government, when the House went into Committee of Supply, and the first item on the West Coast estimates namely LI4OO for the Commissioner's department, was agreed to. Progress was then reported, with leave to sit again, and the House adjourned for a quarter of an hour. On resuming the House went into Committee of Supply on the estimates of ordinary expenditure, when the foil iwiug items were passed : — For the Provincial Secretary's department, L 1385 ; Provincial Treasurer's department, L7lO 8s 4d ; Provincial Auditor's department, L 15 0; Provincial Solicitor's department, L 500; Electoral, 1/250 ; Legislative, LISOO ; Supreme Court, LI 81 2 10s; liesident Magistrate's Court, LloO ; Lyttelton Gaol, L 4308 7s; Christchurch Gaol, LBO6 17s 8d; Timaru Gaol, L 519 12s 6d ; Police, L 12,486 12s 6d; Education, L 8033 63 8d; Hospit.ls, L 5148 11s 8d ; Lunatic Asylum, L 3386 os lOd ; Inspection of Sheep, Ll9O-1 8s 4d ; Weights and Mea sures* L 20 0; Lyttelton Harbor, L2o9j 1 7s 6d ; Timaru Hai'bor, L 450 ; Aknroa Harbor, LSO; Kaiapoi Harbor, LI 50; Saltwater Creek Harbor, LI 16 os; and Defences, L 1950. Progress was then reported, with leave to sit again, and the House resumed. Notices of motion having been given, the House adjourned till 5 p.m. next day.