LETTERS TO THE EDITOR.

Wanganui Chronicle, Volume 7, Issue 371, 26 November 1863, Page 3

LETTERS TO THE EDITOR.

THE WANGANUI STEAM NAVIGATION COMPANY. LIMITED. November 24, 1863. Sir, —At the meeting in Auckland, on the 11th of this month, of the New Zealand Steam Navigation Company, Captain Rhodes is reported to have said, — “ The Wanganui Steam Navigation Company intended to hand its vessel over to the new Company, and the Directors of the Hawke’s Bay Company had intimated their intention to do the same He mentioned these facts to show the general wish to get up a Company on a large scale, &e. &c.” Will you oblige the Directors by letting the public know, through your columns, that the Wanganui Company do not intend anything of the sort. Such a thing has never been contemplated eveu by any of the Directors, nor, as far as they know, by any of the shareholders. The Company was formed in order that this community might have a boat or boats, at its own service and under its own control, to do the carrying trade of the district in live stock and goods ; and, with its first steamer probably pretty close at hand, and the experiment untried, it is not very likely the Directors woidd so defeat the very object they had in view, after all the trouble they have been at in getting a steamer which they are advised possesses admirably all the requisites for carrying out the wishes of the Proprietary, and making the settlement independent in a great degree of other companies. Captain Rhodes has either been misreported or imposed upon by the misrepresentations of some whose “ wish was (perhaps) father to the thought.” Your obedient servant, Thos. Waters, Chairman Wanganui S. N. Co.

Newtonlees, Nov. 9, 186 w Sib, —I was glad to see in your last issue a short paragraph calling attention to the Thistle. With your permission I will say a few words on the subject. I am of opinion the Thistle demands the most serious attention of every landowner and occupier iu the country. The Thistle is not now confined to any particular locality, as it was a few years back, but is now general over the district, and, should it be allowed to flower and seed this season as last, many of us may as well join the Defence Force or be off to the Diggings, for the good we shall be able to do on our lands. lam certain, if all owners and occupiers were to make an effort this season, and what could not be got up by the roots were even cut off so as to stop their seeding, they woidd receive a very salutary check. If thistles are allowed to grow unchecked, those that have been ambitious for acquiring land will soon curse the day they became landowners. The thistle will soon prove as great a bar to agricultural pursuits in Wanganui as the rebel Maories are to the colonising of New Zealand. Seeing this before us, should it not stimulate us to action? One and all must be up and doing ; we must all put our shoulders to the wheel, and then much will be accomplished in one season. Now is the time. The thistle is just coming into flower, and if got up now will not seed this season. Those that will not bestir themselves be made an example of. Could you oblige me and others by publishing the Thistle Act ? I believe it might prove a stimulant to many ; some are indifferent, others ignorant of the liability, which if the act was placed before them it might stir them to action. There is another point which should not be neglected, and that is, the Native Magistrate (Mr. White) should call the attention of the Natives to the lands occupied by them, which in many places is quite overgrown with thistles. I believe, if the nuisance which will arise from their allowing the thistle to spread was properly represented to them, they woidd see the necessity for immediate action, and like ourselves do something towards eradicating the same. Hoping something will be done to check the growth of the thistle in our district, I am, sir, yours, &c. John Morgan.

■' * • November 21 at, 1863. Sir, —Is it a fact that Road Wardens are in the habit of taking contracts under the Board of which they are members ? lam told it is so, at least in one instauce, although I can scarcely believe that a gentleman, elected by a community to a most important public trust, could so far forget what ought to be the disinterestedness of his position as to take a contract where he himself tenders and opens such tender—is a party to accepting it—is judge as to whether the contract taken under the tender is properly performed—votes himself the pay-ment—-and, lastly, puts his hand into the cashbox and pays himself. You know the story of Cmsar’s wife. lam acquainted with the Chairman of the Board to which I allude ; he is a most disinterested honorable man and gentleman, and, I believe and may say, the best chairman we have yet had; still good nature may be imposed on to permit infringement of the integrity of a represeintative institution, as the following case of my own experience would seem to indicate. , , Some time since, in floundering on horseback through a road contract taken by a Warden my horse got nearly bogged to death in a vile tenacious clay, or mud, surmounted by a slight sprinkling of shingle, which the Warden and contractor would, by a slight stretch of judgment, call metalling; it, however, bore no more relation to metalling than the sailor s wretched duff bore to honest English plumpuddino- in the former the plums were not within lail of each other, whereas m the latter you know what real plumpudding is. It would have been far better for the public if double the money had been given for this contract (dear as the present one is) to a man who would have done his work well, in place of being wretchedly botched and patched and clawed as at present. Your obedient servant, RATErAYES.

AUCKLAND. We have Auckland news to the 16th lust. , I The principal item is the arrival of the Himalaya, with 800 troops, and bringing 15 days later European News. Drafts of the 7 1 th, 18th, 4 f 'th, 65tn, and 57th, making a total of 13 officers 412 men are in readiness to embark from London and Cork. War appeared imminent between England, France and Austria, on the one side, and Russia, on the other, respecting the Polish question. In America the news was of the old type. General Lee had received large reinforcements, and was threatening Washington ; while at Charlestown, the Federals, had destroyed Fort Sumter, and were discharging Greek fire into the city, which the defenders declared they would maintain to the last. The Foreign consuls had protested against the barbarous style of warfare adopted by the Federals, but without avail. There is nothing new in respct to the war at Auckland, except that an orderly of the Defence Force had his horse shot down under him by some 8 or 10 natives hid among some flax bushes near Mauku. A hundred men went iu pursuit of the Maoris, but only saw one of them, and could not catch him. A very formidable I’edoubt is being constructed by the troops at Meremere by the troops. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES. FINANCIAL STATEMENT. [Delivered in tlie House of Representatives, Tuesday, November 10, 1863.] Tlra House having, according to order, resolved itself into Committee of Ways and Means, Mr. Reader Wood, the Colouial Treasurer, spoke as follows : Mr. O’Rorke, the arrangement which I propose to adopt in making this statement to night, is, first of all, to recite to this committee the position of the various loans that hove been authorised by this House, and a few miscellaneous matters ; secondly, to give a statement of the revenue and expenditure for the financial year, which closed on the 30th June last ; thirdly, a statement of the extraordinary expenditure on account of the war, which has been incurred since the Ist of July last ; fourthly, an estimate of revenue and expenditure for the current year ; aDd fifthly, the proposals of the Government with reference to the financial arrangements which will be neccessary in consequence of the present state of affairs. In doing this, 'sir, I shall use large figures, and endeavour to group into masses the estimates of receipt and expenditure, in order that I may occupy as little time as possible of the committee consistently with the object which I have in view—that of making a clear statement of the financial position of the colony to this committee to-night. [Here the Colonial Treasurer gave a history of previous loans, the particulars of which must be familiar to our readers fi-orn the statements made in former sessions. He then proceeded]— Having thus given you the dry bones of these loans, 1 will now turn to the second part of this statement, namely, the revenue and expenditure from July Ist, 1862, to June 30th, 1863, an account I think which will be found something more interesting than those which I have just gone through. Sir, last year we estimated the customs revenue at 413,000/. It has realised 486, i 50/; and I think it will be rather interesting to ascertain how the estimates which 'my hon. friend, iu his financial statement last year, gave of the various amounts of customs revenue which it was expected to obtain from the vai-ious provinces come out. The customs revenue of the province of Auckland was estimated last year at 92,000/, and it actually produced 92,880/ ; the estimate for Taranaki was 8000/. actual yield 7,429/ ; the estimate for Wellington 40,000/, actual yield 41,737/ ; the estimate for Napier 9,000/, actual yield 2(J05/; the estimate for Nelson 22,5001, actual yield 22,185/; the estimate for Marlborough 2uOOZ, actual yield 3,099/; the estimate for Canterbury 50,000/, actual yield 60,364/ ; tlie estimate for Otago 180,000/, actual yield 215,623/ ; Southland 9,500/, actual yield 36,714/; a small sum of 114/ was also received from the Chatham islands, making a total actually received of 489,150/ —an increase of 18 percent, beyond what we estimated. Sir, I think that is a very satisfactory statement indeed of the customs revenue of the country.

Now, Sir, I come to the other side of the account —the expenditure. And I will follow, with reference to the expenditure, the same plan I have adopted with reference to the receipts. I will show the amounts estimated and the amounts expended. For the Civil List, which is fixed by Act, 2-5,000/ was estimated and 25,000 expended ; the permanent charges were estimated at 82,796/, of which only 79,003/, was expended ; this saving is through 3,000/ and 4,000 less of interest being required than the House voted. In the appropriations, the Executive department was set down at 4,275/, and 4,000 was expended ; under the .head Legislative 15,050/ was voted and 15,000/ expended ; judical, 600/ ; registration, 2,800/ ; customs (Chatham Islands establishment, <fec.), 675/ ; postal, 47,100/ ; militia, 9,581/ ; miscellaneous 12,156, and 12,156/ were all voted and expended, With reference to those items which are charged provincially, the votes were either wholly expended or nearly so, making a total of 290,667. The threeeights customs revenue secured to the provinces amounts to 183,280/, thus leaving a .surplus of 76,016/. The surplus estimated last year was something under 10,000. It will be seen then that upon

the sum voted last year there has been a saving of something like 6,000/; but there has been expended, wiihout previous appropriation, about 12,000/, which however, is practically only 6,000/ over the amount voted last year, and when we consider that the revenue has increased at the rate of 20/ per cent., whilst the unauthorised expenditure • does not amount to quite 1/ per cent, and while a great deal of this is nothing more than aa excess of some matters, such as printing, stationery, and things of that kind, over the amount estimated. I think I may say that for the year ending 30th of dune last, there has been no excessive expenditure beyond the amount voted by this House. Now, Sir, with reference to the surplus of 76,016/, I propose to charge upon that the sum of 1,672/ supplementry expenditure for the year 1861-2, still unprovided for ; also the supplementary expenditure for the past year of 12,/00/ ; and I also propose to charge upon it the cost of erecting a new custom house, at Dunedin, 11,600/. Then there is a sum which has been outstanding fox* some time, and which has been the cause of a great deal of coi-respondence with the Post-office authorities. It is an accumulation of errors for the last five or six years, and arose in this way :—By the Treasury minute of November, 1855, the colony understood that it was not liable to contribute to the main line, before the branch service from Sydney was established, but' the Post-office authorities from the very - commencement have charged the colony with its contribution to that main line. The colony also understood that it was to pay for that main line in proportion to the number of letters which it despatched but the Post-office authorities from the very first have called upon the colony to pay in a combined ratio, according to the number of letters despatched, and the distance of the colony from Galle ; and, thirdly, the colony understood that it was to be credited with all the postal revenue which was paid within the' colony, all lettei’s pre-paid, whilst the Post office authorities have demanded that we should account to them for a sum of tourpeno*upou every letter despatched from New Zealand to Australia. Well, sir, these various items have been resisted time, after time, and despatches have been written and minutes have been written, of which information may be found iu the blue-books before the House, and the arguments have been very good and remarkably convincing, but the Postoffice authoi’ities stick to their point, and tel-1 us that if we don’t forward this'money, they won’t send our letters. When Mr. Crosbie Ward, went to Eugland, he was authorised to settle these matters with them, and he found, them as stiff as possible, but ultimately arranged to pay 300/ a year, instead of accounting to them for 4d. on every letter despatched to New South Wales. Now. sir, the total amount of these errors is 26,300/, half of which, 13,300/, is to be charged upon the supplementary expenditure of this year, and provision made for the payment of the other half out of the revenue of the current year. Therefore that account will stand in this way :—Taking 76,016/ as the surplus we propose to charge upou it ; supplementary expenditure 1861 1862,1,672/; supplementary expenditure 1862-1863, 12,700 ; cost of Custom house Dunedin, 11,600 ; and half of postal errors, 13,300 ; in all 39,292, which being deducted leaves still a surplus for distributinn of 36,744/. Sir, with reference to the supplementary expenditure for the financial year ended 30tli June, 1863, 12,716/-asl have already stated, it is made up of a number of items, details of which will be laid on the table of the House in full. Now, Sir, that concludes the statement of revenue and expenditure for last year. I will now turn to a matter which, I think, has excited some interest in this committee, namely, a statement of the expenditure arising out of the uative insurrection, from the Ist July to the 13th October, and supplemented up to the 31st of this month. Thei-e is first of all cliar-ged against this tlie purchase of the £ Sandfly,’ and the amounts which have been already paid for the' steamer on the Waikato, 9471/ 3s : the cost of removal of settlers from Raglan to Wairoa, 543/ 18s ; expenditure in the erection of blockhouses, 2,31>8/ 12s 6d ; for native forces, guides, and interpreters, 493/ Is 5d ; pay of the whole-of the colonial forces, 49,221/ 12s lid ; passage of Volunteers from Gtago, Melbourne, and cost of stores, arms, Ac., 42,590/ 13s ; on account of horses purchased for the Colonial Defence Force, including arms, 5,024/ 14s ; miscellaneous items, 2380/ ; road clearing on Great South Road, 2,700/; remittances for similar purposes forwarded to the Sub-Treasurers of New Plymouth, Wellington, Wanganui,., and Napier, and to the agent in London, 31,300/ —making a total from the Ist July to the 13th October of 146,194/ ; from that time to the Ist of this month, and including all further expenditure and liabilities, the sum of 200,DU0/ will cover the whole—(hear, hear) —expense for a period of four months. Now, sir, considering all that has been written upon this question, the extravagant and extraordinary estimates that have been made of the sums we were spending, considering all the difficulties that the Government has been placed in, and the demands made upon them at a moment’s notice for militia and men under our direction, I think, notwithstanding all that has been done, notwithstanding all that has been said, it will be generally considered that a great economy has been exercised in what we have done in this matter, and for which we have not received credit. (Cheers.) ■ Sir, before I proceed to an estimate of the Customs Revenue for the current year I wish to say a few words about the Tariff. My hon. friend the member for

the Gold Fields proposes to-morrow to put a question to the Government with i 'derenee to the Tariff, and I think it is very advisable that he anJ this Committee should be in possession of some information with reference to that subject which I have now to give, and which may perhaps modify his opinion very considerably as to the necessity of making any very material alterations. Sir, the value of the imports for the six months ended June 30th, --was 2,970,5021, of which 1,428,2521 entered duty freehand the remainder to the value of 1,351,250/ paid duty. IVe all know what the duty is upon spirits,-wine, sugar, and tea, and on all other such things as these, but duty is levied upon a variety of articles at 4s. per cubic foot, and upon other at 3s. per hundred-weight. I have never yet seen any statement, exhibiting the per contage that is paid upon the value of these imports, and very exaggerated notions are abroad of the amount of taxation paid by the people of this colony. Now, sir, the duty which is paid upon spades and shovels is per cent ad valorem ; the total value imported during the last six months;! inge 51°,785/ s 1°,785/ and the duty upon them 294 Is. 7d. Upon boots and shoes, which were imported to the value of 96,485/ the duty levied was 5,368,/ or a per centage of s|. Upon candles the duty amounted to 24 per cent ; upon cotton goods 5J per cent (hear, hear), upon silk 34 per cent, upon slop-clothing, 6£ per cent (hear, hear), upon woollen clothing per cent, and upon other kinds of goods of similar description 6£ per cent. (Hear, hear). Upon dried fruits, an article of great luxury I should say, (Oh !) the duty comes to 17 and 1-1 Oth, per cent ; upon bottled fruit 124 per cent ; upon hardware and cutlery, 2.£ per cent; on holloware 5£ per cent ; on ironmongery 24 per cent; on oilman’s stores nearly 14 per cent, and upon soap nearly 7 per cent. "With the exception of some few article#*-which may be classed as those of considerable luxury, consumed only by persons who can veiy well; afford it. I consider that the amount of duty which is levied is not hard upon the people of this colony. (Oh ! Oh !). Six’, for the current year upon, which we ha\ T e entered, we estimate the total Customs. Revenue at 6,03,600/ ; the post office revenue we estimate at 40,000/ ; the judicial at 25,000/; the registration- at 12,000/; the fees for registration. of hirtlxs, deaths, and marriages, 2,500/; fees on. issue of Crown.grauts, 3,000/; misceihuK eous items, 5,500/ ; Total estimated

revenue, 691,600/. There is, sir, one consideration which, I think, must be felt to be a source of satisfaction to every one, —that from the very commencement of repesentative institutions in this colony there has been no single instance of speculative finance, no, single instance, however much pressed the Finance Minister has been, of over-estimating the resources of the colony, no single instance in which the ordinary revenue has. been estimated over the amount which has been realised ; but instances ai’e innumberable where it has been estimated at considerably less than it has realised And I may say in this case there is no speculative finance. These items which. I have read to, yon are actually now being, received by the various collectors. of revenues in this colony, and there cannot be any reasonable doubt that the .sum of 691,600/ will be realised during the current financial year; but on the contrary there is every reason to suppose that it will be very considerably exceeded. »Sir, I will not detaiu the committee- bygiving more than an abstract of the expenditure we "propose for the current financial yeax*. The estimates belaid on the table immediately, and. you will there see full details. I will simply content myself with a resume of the whole. For the current- financial year, we set down the civil list at 25,000/, exactly the same as last year ; the permanent charges will be increased very considerably by the amount of interest which will be required for the proposed loan, and will amount to- 130,490/; the expenditure on account of the executive departments wsxs estimated at 4,825/; legislative 12,310/ ; judicial, 1,950/ ; registration, 6,460/’; customs (general charges) 1,375/; postal 80,430/ ; militia, 25,000/ ; and various miscellaneous items, 10,000. Total estimate of expenditui'e, 297,840. There will be then the three-eightlis of the customs revenue to be handed over to the provinces, amounting to 226,350/; thus leaving a sxxrplus of 12,096/, to balance with the estimated revenue.

' Sir, I now- proceed to the last subject on which I propose to occupy your attention f to-night, namely—to the financial proposals of the Govei’mnent in l'eference to the existing, state of affairs in this country. My hon. friend the Colonial Secretary, whenlie addressed youtlieother day, stating the policy of the pi'eseut Government, told you that we intended to provide for the extraordinai'y expenditure on account .of the war by means of a large loan. Six', the Government have two objects in view : first of all, the suppression of the present rebellion ; and secondly, if possible, the rendering it impossible that there should be any further rebellion in future. The rebellion can be suppressed at the present time only by one means—bv the use of'force—force against .force. The exact amount that it ’ will cost the colony to suppress the rebellion, it is of course impossible for me to say, unless I can be told the length of time the present war will last, and the demands which the General will make upon the Government of the colony for men and means. Sir, X am not one of those who think that by any one great battle, the natives in this counti’y will be subdued, and we shall all of a sudden pass from a period of wai-, and trouble and anxiety to a period of serenity and peace. Nor am I one of those who ll» ink that this wai'will be iix-

terminable or lasting for many years. Sir, I am very much of the opinion of my hon. friend the member for Southland, who said that these natives were simply men and women, very much like ourselves ; and I believe that when they see as they soon will see, that all their efforts against us ax*e practically unavailing—when they see, as they soon will see, that we ai*e by far the superior power, they will then do that which we want them to do, namely, submit to the sovereignty of the Queen, and to the law. .Before peace is secux’ed in this country, however thei'e must necessarily be a considerable amount of expence incurred in the suppression of the rebellion. Exactly what that amount will be, it is impossible either for me or any one else to say : but what the Government is anxious to do in the matter, is to ask the House to. vote a sum which they believe in itself is not moi’e than we may reasonably expect will be requix’ed to be expended for this purpose. Sir, we ask the House to vote a sum to be raised by loan, for the purpose of waxexpenditure in connexion, with the suppression of the present l-ebellion, of a million of money. Then supposing the war over, or supposing that it is driven far from our dooi's at the present time, then we propose to commence a system of immigration, a system of colonization by which a population will occupy the waste lands of the rebel d.isti-icts, and prevent the possibility at any future time of these natives again rising, in insurrection against us ; and for the introduction of this population—the exact time in which it will be possible to introduce it, I cannot say : nor can I tell the exact- number which it will be necessary to introduce, but we- think, that it is advisable that steps should be taken immediately to commence that; immigration—we ask then for the purpose of immigration the sum of 300,000/. This population which we propose to. introduce, —and, in point of fact, the whole population of the whole colony, ought to be armed, and we propose to ask the- House to appropriate 100,000/ to. be expended in arms. There will be a vai'iety of expences incurred in the location of these immigrants, and it will be neccessaiy for their employment, and for the pi'oper colonization of the country, that public woi'ks to a considerable extent should be commenced. Exactly what those works should be, it is of coui'se. impossible to say; and exactly the amount that will be required to be expended upon,them., iti.sequ.allyimpossi.be to. say. But, sii', we desire, as much as possible, to make use of the natui'al resources of this country. The settlements of Raglan and Tauranga can beappi’oached by the great highway of the ocean, and Raglan and- Tauranga are on the flanks of the Ngatimaniapoto country. The river Thames, and Waipa run up towards that very counti-y, and we pi’opose to locate the settlei's at proper positions upon those rivers: and we propose also, ’n order that thei'e should be no delay in locating those settlers at the very earliest opportunity, and m.iantaining communication with them, to render these l’ivers navigable for-steamers of a light draft. We believe this could be done at a very inconsiderable expence —an expence very much less than would be l-equired to make roads from oue end of the countiy to the other ; and there will be this advantage connected with it, independently of the saving of money—that communication can be obtained almost immediately with the settlements that are planted, and the settlements themselves can be planted in positions where it would be impossible .to place them, if the only means of access to, them, would be by l’oads. For these public works—roads, bridges, rendering rivers navigable, surveys, and general expences of location—we propose to ask the House to appropi’iate 900,000/. We likewise think it advisable that a sum of money should be set apart for the purpose of constructing an electric telegraph whre it is possible an electric telegraph can be constructed in this counti’y. It can be constructed throughout the whole of the middle Island, and cari’ied by submarine cable aci'oss Cook’s sti'aits. We propose that measured should be taken almost immediately to commence a work of that kind in conjunction with the Provincial Governments of the Middle Island who have already taken steps in the matter. And though I myself have indicated a plan to continue that submarine cable from D’Urville’s Island to the Manukau, yet, upon further consideration we think jit better not to undei’take a scheme so extensive as that at present; but rather to wait another year to see if it may not perhaps be possible to continue the telegraph communication from Cook’s straits to other parts 'of this Northern Island. It would be impossible of coui-se to do it at the present time ; but it is not perhaps too wild a supposition to aup- ' pose that it may be practicable to commence it in another yeai'. At any rate we propose a sum of 15.0,000/ to be set apart for the purpose of constructing electric telegraphs ; and a further sum of 50,000/ for a not less useful work, the construction of lighthouses upon vai'ious pai-ts of the coast of New Zealand. That makes up a total of 2,500,000/ which we shall ask the House to appropriate for the various purposes, which I will recapitulate :—War expenditui'e, 1,000,000/ ; immigration 300,000/ ; public woi’ks, 900,000/; 100,000/ for arms; electric telegraph, 150,000/ ; and lighthouse 51,000—making a total oi 2,500,000. With reference to the loan of 500,000, of last year, for which we have not yet received the Imperial guarantee; we consider that if that guarantee can be now obtained upon the terms upou which it was offei'ed to Mr. .Ward it should be accepted? and that loan would then remain as .it is. If on the other hand, we find that guarantee cannot be so obtained, we then propose to absorb that loan in this amount, thus making a total of 3,000,000/; and we

propose also that, as this large sum a* 1 money is required, not only for the pacification and colonization of the country but also will have, as I believe, if the plan is successful, the most beneficial effects as regards the civilization and genei-al welfare of the natives, we should apply to the Imperial Government:—for so much assistance, if they will give it, as their guai'antee to this three millions will affoi’d to us. In that case, six*, the intei’est, of course, will be 4/ per cent. But if we ai’e unable to obtain this assistance from the Impei’ial Government—and we have some hopes, at any rate, of obtaining it —then, we propose that the colony should negotiate the loan upon its own account at 51 per cent, interest, and 1/ per cent, sinking fund-—making a total, charge of 6/ per cent. The interest anti sinking fund of this loan will be* in the fii'st instance of course, charged upon, the general revenue of the whole colony ; but when the lands in rebel districts, ai’e taken and sold, the loan itself will be a fix\st charge u.pqn the proceeds of the sale thereof. Exactly what amount of land will be available it is difficult to say : but if we take all the land that belongs to the rebel natives in the Thames and Waikato, at Taranaki aiid at Y/anganui; I think there will be neai’ly—after locating - the settlers upon it-—a balance of something closely approaching to two millions of aoxes. And we consider that although it will be impossible to realise upon that all at once, yet before vei’y long the proceeds of those sales will repay the whole of this expenditui’e that we now ask the House to grant. Sir, I will n,ot occupy the attention of the committee any longer. I feel that the details which I have- been obliged to enter into have been excessively dry and uninteresting ; and I have to thank the House for the very patient attention it has afforded me., I will now place in the hands of the chairman of the committee the following resolution : “ That in the opinion of this committee the expence of repi'essing the present insui'rection in the Northern Island, and colonising the. l’ebellious districts- should be provided for by loan.”—(applause.) A few questions having been-put by Mr. Fitzgerald, Mr. Bell, and Mi*. Richmond, and answered by Mr. Wood, he likewise stated it was the opinion of Government the discussion on the subject would be better taken when the Loan Bill came before the House, and he would give notice on Wednesday of his intention to. bring in such a bill. The l'esolution, having been put and agi’eed to was l’epoi'ted to the House, and leave was gi'anted to the committee to sit again on Thursday. November 11th.

The act for raising a loan of three millions for the public service of the colony was read a first time. Mr. Stafford asked leave to lay on the table a Maori document forwarded to him by a Mr. Jackson, and of .which he was not Maori scholar enough to understand the purport. The Speaker ruled that it could not be received on that footing. Mr. Stafford must get some one to interpret it to him.

Mr. Stafford called the attention of the house to several important omissions in the l’etui'n moved for by the house relative to the pui'chase of land at Waitotara. Several very necessai’y documents were -wanting. Mr. Wood promised that he wonM endervour to have the omissions l’ectified.

Mr. Staffoi'd moved for a correspondence in the year 1848 inspecting the return of Wiremu Kingi and his people to Waitara. The motion was agreed to after a sharp debate, in which Messrs. Bell, Fitzgerald, Fox, Richmond,Richardson, J. C. Richmond, Jollie, and Colenso took part, and which indicated an entire re-opening of the whole Waitara question. November 12th. In reply to Mr. Cracroft Wilson’s question, whether the Government intended to amend the law relating to elections, Mr. Fox said the Government would look into the matter as early as possible, and if necessary take steps to have the act amended. j\!r. Colenso moved, that when a translation of any Maori paper or document is laid on the table, a ’certified copy of the original be also printed along with it. Mr. E. Graham moved for a number of returns relative to the Otawhao and Kohekohe establishments. Capt. E. G. Campbell’s petition respecting compensation for his property given up to the natives at the time of the shipwreck of the Lord Wursley was referred to the Private Grievance Committee. Mr. Vogel moved for information respecting gold deposits believed to exist in the Waikato and Thames districts. Loan Bill. Mr. Wood i'ose and said : In accordance with the resolution come to in committee of ways and means, and adopted by the house, namely, that the expense of suppressing the native insurrection, and the expense to. be incurred in colonising the rebel districts, should be pro vided for by loan, I have now to move the second reading of the Loan Bill, which was sent down yesterday by message from the Governor. In doing this I will proceed to state somewhat more in detail than I have been able, to do yet, what the Government hope to be able to carry out, should the house place the funds air its disposal asked for by this bill. My hon. friend, the Colonial Secretary, stated on a former occasion that the object of the Government was to introduce into this country from 15,000 to 20,000 people. We propose to locate them in the following manner. In the Waikato district say about 10,000 men ; in the Taranaki and Wanganui districts about 5000 ; and wo propose also to set apart,

for the provinces of Wellington and Hawke’s Bay. about 5000 more men, to be introduced into this proviuce when there is sufficient land for occupation by them. In introducing settlers of this description, it is our intention to introduce with them a moderate proportion of their wives and families. (Laughter.) We don’t propose to limit them (more laughter) to the families of simply one or two ; but we propose to introduce with them a number of women and children. We take the average of families as they may happen to be ; but it is, of course, impossible for me to state the number of children! eaeh family should have. (A laugh.) But in doing so we shall introduce a fair proportion, so that there shall be no great inequality of the sexes., V. ith reference to the introduction of these people, we propose that the course of settlement shall as much as possible follow the course of the troops ; that is to say, that as. the land is taken up by military occupation and secured, settlement shall follow as. soon as possible upon the land, so secured. Perhaps the best way in which I can illustrate this is by taking a particular instance. In case the plan and details in the papers presented to the House should be carried out—-namely, that a line of posts should be extended, from the Thames to Waikato—then I apprehend that all the country within that line will be as. safe for occupation, as. the country within the line of the Wairoa posts. (Hear.) And I can see no reason, why settlement should not be formed at an early period within that line. It is also a part of the policy of the Government that as these settlements are established, and: the land; is.given to the people occupying them, farms shall be laid out in the neighbourhood of the settlements for sale, and in that way we shall be introducing labour into, the districts,, and capital will follow there too ; so that the settlers will not be dependent upon the Government for employment. We consider that a moderate sum should be set apart for public works, for their employ-, ment. It is not my object nor the ob ject of any of the Government, to introduce pauper settlements into the country. (Hear.) It is not our object by the too rapid influx of population, to render it dependent upon charitable aid from the Government ; but it is our object that the territory which will be taken in these rebel districts shall be occupied, or in other words, that labour shall follow conquest in such proportion as shall be mutually beneficial to the state and the people. Sir, I have taken an opportunity of stating before, that the mere voting of money for the purpose of suppressing, as it is called, the present rebellion, that the voting of money for the mere purpose of enabling the General to obtain a victory over the rebels, will not definitively and finally settle this question. It is a distinct characteristic of the policy of the present Government that, to prevent •all future rebellion, and the possibility of a further insurrection, not only should the present rebellion be put down, but that the country should be colonised at the same time. In the first instance we propose to complete the number of 5,000 men for the Waikato regiment, which number will be its full complement. At present upwards of 2,000 men have been introduced from New South Wales and Australia generally, and some others have been; obtained in this colony ; so that a further immigration of some 2,300 men will be required. These men will be fwlly-armed and equipped, and will occupy the frontier line, and by that means secure the peace of the district between this and the frontier. The other districts will be of a semi-military character. The people will be armed, and will have to be disciplined and go, through a certain amount of training. There will be stockades built, but we do not propose that these people shall- be so fully organised as those in the Waikato. Not only is it our intention to fill up the districts with a European population, but one of our main objects is to set apart a certain, portion of land for all decently disposed natives. •It is not part of our policy to drive the natives into the hills and woods—to drive them in fact iuto brigandage and murder; but we desire to. give them a specific pro,prietorsliip of a particular part of the country, which they will hold under, crown grant. With reference to the quantity of land that will be required for these various purposes, we estimate it as follows :—For the location of 10,000 men in Waikato, at 50 acres each, 500,000 acres. In the Waikato district we reckon there are 4000 adult natives, and. by giving them twice the quantity of land we propose to give the Waikato settlers, it will require 400,000 acres for the natives there, that is, if all come in and consent to live in peace and order. The 5000 men which we propose to locate in Taranaki will require 250,000 acres. In this district there is an adult native population of say 1,000, and 100,000 acres will be required for them. Therefore 1,250,000 acres will altogether be required. If we take the total area of land in rebel districts, it will be found that it amounts to 8| million acres, and we have obtained information from persons well acquainted with the districts and the quality of the land, that one-half of it will be available for settlement ; therefore we have for settlement mil lion acres. If we deduct from that the quantity required for the location of European settlers, and the natives, there will be a balance of three millions for sale, reserves, and for the preservation of the territory of those loyal natives who may not be desirous of disposing,of their lands. I said there was a balance of 3 million acres, and supposing we set aside half a million acres for roads and reserves, and one million acres for land that may be retained by the loyal natives, it will still leave one and a half million, acres foi; sale. Of course it would not be desirable, if it

were even possible, to dispose of ibis land at once ; but by bringing it into the market judiciously, it appears to us that a million and a half acres economically dealt with and properly sold will realise at the very least 21 per acre, and that 3,000,000/ will be obtained by the time these arrangements are completed. I should be sorry that the house should suppose that the Government looked upon this as a commercial undertaking. It is in our opinion absolutely necessary for the security and safety of the country ; but at the same time it is not only necessary, but perfectly right, that we should give you an estimate of the probable cost of all these operations, and the return that is. expected from them. It will be clear, I think, from this statement, that there is every reasonable prospect of the 2,500,000/ which we now ask you to vote being repaid without any difficulty whatever by the sale of the land. Sir, I stated to, the house the other evening the various purposes to which we proposed to apply the loan. There have been certain slight modifications made in the schedule to the loan since. It now stands as follows : Cost of suppressing the rebellion, etc., 100,000/ ; introduction of population to the Northern Island, 300,000/; cost of survey and other expenses, 900,000/ * for the construction of telegraphs, 150,000/ ; lighthouses, 50,000/; for purposes specified in the Loan Act, 500,000/ ; leaving a balance for future appropriation of 100,000/, and making a total of 3,000,000/. I now beg to move the second reading of the Loan, Bilk Mr. Fitz Gerald moved' the adjournment. of the debate. A scheme of this kind, involving such large figures, and financial arrangements which were by no means very -obvious, was not one which should; be hastily discussed, The financial' statement haefc only been made a short time; since then they had bad,no opportunity of studying it, and he must say it would show most indecent haste to proceed, with this, discussion, at once. As the representative of a large part, of the Middle Island he should feel that, if his constituency should learn that they had prooceded to discuss this grave question within a few hours, they would consider that bon. members had. failed in the trust reposed- in them. The motion for the. adjournment of the debate to Monday was then put and carried after a sharp, debate.