May 21. petitions.

Tuapeka Times, Volume V, Issue 226, 30 May 1872, Page 6

May 21. petitions.

A petition was presented from 41 miners n the Waikonaiti district praying for permission to purchase 2000 acres of land, or that the land be bought under the agricultural lease system. The petitien was referred to the Goldfields Committee. Mr Reynolds presented a petition from Mrs Muir, relative to certain matters connected with land at Bell Hill. MOTIONS. A great number of motions were given notice of, principally in reference to sums being placed on the estimates. PETITIONS. The repflrt of the Private Petitions Committee reported that Thomas White had no claim on the Govornment ; that L2OO should be paid to the family of the late James Reid for damage aud ill-health induced through the error in proclamation of the sale of Fulton's Run, and that in the case of John Campbell the Council should introduce a Bill to carry out the resolution of last session in his case. [ NEW BILL. The Municipal Corporations Ordinance Amendment Ordinance was read a first time. ANSWERS TO QUESTIONS. The Government, in reply to Mr Bastings, said : The Government expected to be in a position to threw open land for sale in the district of Tuapeka as soon as the d spute with the ruuholder was settled. It might be postponed by appeal to Wellington ; but if the new Bill became law, the difficulty would be obviated. Tp Mr P, F. C. Browne : The sum of L2OO0 1« placed on the Ertiawtea for form-

ing the road between Tokomairiro and Tuapeka To Mr M'Glashan :— The Government did not contemplate putting a sum on the Estimates for forming the road between Port Chalmers and Hayward's Point To Mr M'Glashan : Two or three months ago instructions were given to the factor to form the portion of the Great North Road, near the head of North •'ast Valley. To Mr Mervyn for Mr Macassey: The Government, in the event of the 40th section of the Education Ordinance not being repealed, instructions would be given to the Inspector and teachers of schools that the Bible shotfd be read in schools withoutinote or comment. MOTIONS. On the motion of the Provincial Secretary, the thanks of the Council were voted to the subscribers of the portrait of the late Captain Cargill, presented by them to the Council. EDUCATION. Mr M'Dermid, in a few appropriate remarks, moved "That this Council, while recognising it to be a duty of the Colonial Govenment to make provision for education in those Provinces in which it has been neglected, is of opinion that it is not advisable to interfere with those Provinces which have established a system of education satisfactory to the majority of the inhabitants." The motion was seconded by Mr Reynolds, opposed by Mr Macassey, and carried on a division of 18 to 11. PROVINCIAL ADMINISTRATION. Mr Tolmie moved — '• That in view of the radical changes about to be effected in the administration of the affairs of the Province by the introduction of such measures as the Counties and Road Districts Ordinances, this Council is of opinion — That the present system of responsible govern -nent should be abolished as cumbersome, and calculated to retard business. " That for the future the Government of the Province should be carried on by a Board, to consist of the Superintendent and members of the Council (to be nominated for that purposo by the Council : such Board to meet two days in the week (or ofteuer, if necessary) ; that the Superintendent act as chairman of such Board, or in his absence a chairman to be elected as hereafter provided. " That the proceedings of the Board be duly minuted and signed by the Superintendent, or in his absence by the chairman to be elected as provided in the following resolution." [The remainder of the resolutions had reference to matters of detail. The seventh provided that all money payments shall be made under the authority of the Superintendent, and countersigned by two members of the Board.] Speaking in support of his motion, the hon. member remarked that, as it was evident to all, Provincial institutions and resources were being curtailed from time to lime. It j would be well, therefore, to curtail iv time their various administrative machinery. He considered that the duties devolving on the Superintendent of this Province were not greater or more responsible than were those devolving upon the head of various banking I and mercantile firms. As to the various members of the Kxecutive, it led to much confusion. If a person wanted to see the Government about any particular matter, he had now to see the Superintendent, then [ one and another member of the Executive before ho had seen every link of the chain upon which the result he wished to bring about had been accomplished. Under the system he proposed, it would simply be necessary to see the Superintendent ; and one would know the opinions and intentions of the Government at once. The Hon. Mr Holmes seconded the motion. Mr Macassey moved as an amendment — "Ist. That this Council shall consist of not more than nineteen members, who shall be elected for, and returned by, the electoral districts created by the Representation Act, 1870, and Amendment Act, 1871. 2nd. That the Executive Conncil shall consist of not more than two members of this Council, in addition to his Honor the Superintendent." In speaking in support of his amendment, the hon. member pointed out that the original motion, while professing to upset one system of responsible government, in fast set up another, by retaining power in the Provincial Council to nominate certain members of the proposed Government ; and he presumed that the members thus nominated would be held responsible to the Council, so that it would be essentially the same system in another shape. Our Provincial institutions were too gigantic and too expensive, and he would like to see them- brought into reasonable extent, if they were not to be abolished altogether. He thought his amendment, if carried, would have this effect. Mr Lumsden would- oppose both motion and amendment ; and when the proper time came, he would himself move an amendment that he thought would better meet the requirements of the case. The Provincial Secretary concurred that the principles contained in the original motion were really such as were at present in operation, the only difference being that, under the pystem proposed, it was to be fixed by Ordinance how often the Executive should meet, and that when they did meet, his Honor the Superintendent was to take the chair. But it so happened, as a matter of fact, his Honor the Superintendent did take the chair, and the Executive never met until there were real necessity. The hon. member disputed the statement that there was any fair comparison between the duties devolving on the Executive and those discharged by banking and mercantile institutions. He would oppose any reduction of the present number of members of the Provincial Council, and also any interference with the present system of responsible government. The Hon. Mr M'Lean thought nothing could be likely to result from the passing of the original motion, but hardly thought cither of tbem was really necessary. Still, if the amendment were put as against the original motion, he would certainly vote for it. Mr M'Glashan was in favor of the amendment ; Mr Mervyn would oppose motion and amendment ; Air Bastings would support the amendment ; Mr Hutcheson would oppose motion and amendment ; Mr Bathgate also would oppose both! Mr Shepherd favored any arrangement by which local self-government could be given to outlying districts, and by which a large portion of tha legislative functions of the Council could be taken from il by the General Government. Mr Reynolds wo Id support the amendment, because he believed that with a Council of nineteen members the affairs of the Province would be much better conducted. A Council of nineteen membci'3 would give the elector a better opportunity of choosing representatives, and possibly three-fourths of the present members, himself included, would not find seats ; and he believed a much better clas3 of representatives would be returned.— (Laughter.) Throughout the Province there had been given expressions of opinion that the present system was too cumbersome and .expensive, and a general wish that the number of members should be reduced and the legislation of the Conncil simplified. Mr Tolmie, in replying, took exception to the remarks of some membere, and the hon. member for Waikari in particular, that it

was not intended by his resolutions to make the Board he proposed to form responsible to the Council. His intention was that they should be. The resolutions, crude a? they were, had had this advantage : they had elicited a certain amount of discussion which might go for nothing at the present time ; but there had been expressions of opinion from several hon. members which deserved great consideration, and those remarks would not be allowed to pass unnoticed by the outside public. When he brought down the resolutions, he had no idea that they would be passed ; at the same time they had served their purpose, and he was pleased that the question had received the attention it had. The question that the words proposed to be omitted stand part of the question, was negatived on the voices ; aud Mr Macassey's motion was put, with the following result : — Ayes, 13. — Messrs Basstian, Baitings, Bell, Clark, Holmes (teller), Macaseey (teller), M'Glashan, M'Lean, Reynolds, iShand, Shepherd, Tolmie, and Webster. Noes, 23. — Messrs Allan, Armstrong, Barr, Bathgate, Bradshaw, Browne, G. F. C , Daniel, Green, Henderson, Hickey, Hntcheson, Innes, Lumsden, Menzies, Mervyn (teller), Mollison, M 'Arthur, M'Dermid, M'Kenzie, Reid, Smith, Sumpter, Thomson (teller). THE CHINESE PETITION. The Speaker again brought under the notice of the Council the request of the Select Committee to whom the Chinese Petition, presented by Mr Macassey was referred, that it have leave to summon from Queenstown as witnesses Messrs Bectham, G. B. Barton, Hayes, and Alloo, at a probable cost of LIOO ; and asked for an expression of opinion by the Council in reference thereto. Mr Reynolds (who had just been prevented from giving a notice of motion by the Speaker rising) : Sir, I beg to call your attention to the state of the clock. — [It was just past the half hour.] The Speaker : When the Speaker stands up all members must occupy their seats. The honorable member will therefore be good enough to resume his seat. — (Laughter.) The Speaker being about to put the question. Mr Reynolds : I protest against the Council being called upon to vote an expenditure of LIOO without having sufficient time to discus? the que-jtion. Mr Shepherd : Can a motion be diseusted when it ia put by the Chair ? Mr Reynolds : Ceitainly it can. The Speaker : The matter has already been discussed, and was postponed to receive the decision of the Council when there was a fuller attendance of members. I think the Standing Orders simply say I am to get the opinion of the Council. lam simply asking for a direction. Mr Reynolds : The Standing Orders say that at half -past five the Speaker shall leave the chair. The Speaker : I wish to get at an expression of opiuion as to whether this expenditure shall be incurred. Those who are in favor Mr Bell : Ido not think, sir, you are bound to insist upon the question being decided before the members make up their minds upon it. I see no necessity why it sKoulcl be proceeded with immediately, and for one shall object to it. Mv Thomson also expressed his intention to vote against the proposition, if pressed. Ultimately it was agreed to adjourn the matter till seven o'clock, On the Council resuming at that hour, the Speaker brought the matter up again. After some discussion, the following resolution was passed :—": — " That in the opinion of this Council it is undesirable that the witnesses which it is proposed to summon from Queenstown, should be summoned; that the Committee be discharged ; and the allegations contained in the petit on be investigated by the Government during the recess." THE FINANCIAL STATEMENT. Mr Thomson, in criticising the statement, referred to the necessity that existed for devising a scheme by which the encroachments of the General Government could be prevented. The change in the policy of the Government in reference to the imposition of school taxes and the sale of land at 10s per acre was owing to the pressure on the Provincial revenues, in faot all owing to the great scheme of the General Government. Dr. Webater presumed that it was necessity that induced the Government to put it for sale at 10s an acre. The fact of the lands remaining unsold for seven years was proof they were not worth LI an acre. Mr M'Dermid regretted that the Government had not made an effort to find a remedy for the absorption of their revenues by the North Island. Mr Reid failed to understand what remedial measures could be devised. Did the member for Port Chalmers mean that the Province should rebel, for that was the only measure that would relieve them from their contribution to the revenues of the country ? He was not a party to the passing of the Payment to Provinces Act, and could not be charged with being one of those who had encouraged the General Government scheme. The proposal to levy school rates was not a matter of necessity. It was a measure which ought to have been in operation since he alteration was made in the Ordinance. The House then resolved itself into COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY, When considerable progress was made with the Estimates. On the item " Commissioner of Police, L 400," Mr Daniel moved its increase to L 50 0; but the Chairman pointed out that the item placed on the Estimates could only be reduced. In the course of the discussion that ensued several members urged the desirability of the pay of the police being restored to its former amount. Ultimately Mr Daniel agreed to bring on a motion that the items he referred to the previous evening should be increased by a sum to be placed on the Supplementary Estimates.