THE ELECTIONS.

Temuka Leader, Issue 1616, 4 August 1887, Page 2

THE ELECTIONS.

Mil A. E. G. RHODES AT TEMUKA.

On Tuesday evening Inst, Mr A. E. G. Rhodes, odo of the candidates for the Gladstone seat, addressed a meeting in the Volunteer Hall. The Hall was crowded, and the chair was occupied by Mr K. F. Gray, Chairman of the Town Hoard, who, in a few words introduced the candidate, requesting a fair and impartial hearing for him.

INTRODUCTION. Mr Rhodes, who was greeted with much applause, said, before addressing himself to politics, he would liko to make some •light personal reference to himself. Of course, owing; to the liberty allowed to the Press, which he had no desire to curtail, a candidate on these occasions had to put up with a good deal of good natured chaff, and even some malicious misrepresentations in the newspapers. He was not in any degree hurt at anything which had been said about him. But there wis one point on which he had been totally misrepresented, und it was nscessary that be should clear himself on this subject. It bad been eaid of him that he was the nominee of the Bmks, the Loan Companies, and the squatting interests, and it had been inferred that his intereets were so Interwoven with the interests of those classes or institutions that it was impossible he could represent a constituency

ike this with the independence which

they had a right to expect f>om their repreßODtativ*. Now, he wished to tell them in all sincerity, that he whs not either directly or indirectly connected with the squatting interests, n«r was he as a shareholder, or, he was thankful to say, ai a debtor, or in any capacity interested in the smallest degree in any Bank or Loan Company, except, in order to be stricbly correct, that he was a shareholder to the extend of some £2OO worth of shares in some of the recently formed companies, from which he drew each year the' oaagnificent income of £B. (Laughter). It may pobsibly be true that many of ourpoliti? cians ara so uuder the thumb of the financial institutions that they may be compelled aa politicians to act sometimes mote in the interests of those institutions than in the interests of the colony. But at any rate he was the nominee of no interests. He bad no private ends to serve, j Bnd in attempting to enter Parliament he was only actuated by a real and sincere to do Borne good for the colooy to which

he owed so much, and an ambition of which he was not ashamed, though it may

be some timo before he could gratify it, to win a little distinction himself in the public life of. the colony. (Heir, hear).

riNANOIAL CONDIWON 0* THE COLONY.

Having said this much about himself he should now pass on and try to explain to them the present, financial condition of the colony, which, blame whom they might, was certainly critical. Undoubtedly the main work of the next Parliament will be to restore our finances to a wealthy condition. Now, first of all, what is the debt which a population of about 600,000, of which only about 150,000 are adult males, owe. It is about £89,000,000. The General Government owes £32,000,000, the Local Bodies about £5,600,000, and the private indebtedness was £52,000,000, of which part was no doubt owing to persons in the colony, many of whom however were only agents, or had borrowed it themselves from foreign capitalists. "Ho thought he was making a very low estimate when he said that £4,500,000 were sent away every year to pay interest to foreign creditors. Our exports last year only amounted to £6,672,000, so they would see what n large part of our exports go to pay for interest before there wua anything left to pay for over imports.

BETENfE. Now, as to the revenue of the Government of the colony and the deficit which necessitates the severe retrenchment we have heard so much about lately, and which may possibly render further taxation necessary in the near future. He could not help making the remark that he found much difficulty in miking out the Government accounts. He thought he had proved himself capable of grasping and understanding the balance-sheets of private perions and of companies when prepared by intelligent accountants, but the accounts of the Government, thought they were supposed to be prepared by the beat accountants in the colony, seem to be unintelligible to all but a few members of the House, and even those members givo very different interpretations to tlie accounts. The deficit had been variously estimated by various speakers as reported in Hansard ot from £92,000 up to as high as £350,000. [t was very extraordinary that, so much difference could possibly be made in the interpretation of the public accounts. However, he would taken hat the Treasurer himself either directly or indirectly admitted. In the first place he admitted that there was an additional deficit on the ordinary revenue, of the past financial year of about £92,300, which, item would have beenincreißed.by £105,000, but for a windfall which he got in the shape of certain payments of the trustees of the sinking fund of an old loan of 1863, which the law enabled him to claim for the Consolidated revenue, but which payment would not occur again. There was a'so a large deficiency in the land fund, which ws concealed in the Financial Statement, but which was afterwards admitted to be £60,000. Therefore, to start the present yetr, if the expenditure whs not reduced and the revenue does not increase, there was a deficit of £250,000. These figures were large enough for him. He would not go into the question of whether the deficit could be made larger or not; it ft tiS large enough in all conscience. The question was, How was (he deficit to be mett Was it to be met by increan»d taxation, as proponed by the present Govornment, or wis il capable of being met by a searching and rigid economy t (Applause.) Ho b i iv-'d it could be met by retrenchment if the w.iole House would work as one man for th«t objoot, and he should oppose all attempts at further taxation until ho felt fully satisfied that a really earnest attempt hud been made to meat it by retrenchment. (Ap-

plauae.) KBTRINCHMENT. Seeing that be w«b auch a strong advocate for' retrenchment some indication would beexpicied from hixi as to how ho co r >»9ived it could be effcted, la the fi Ht plaoo t'iO'o was an Act called the Crown and .Native Lands Ac', under

which large subsidies wore paid by the Treasury principally to Road Boards in the North Island in respect of certaia unoccupied Crown and Native Lands. Sixty-one thousand pounds were paid under thistAct last; year—(Hear, hear)—and he thought it time this Act was repealed. (Applause.) Then as regarded the large vote for defence, some £186,000, he thought, last year. This included the ordinary police force, in which no retrenchment could be made, but he thought a reduction could bo made in the cost of the Permament Militi*. He believed in the Volunteer Force. He was a trooper in i that force himself, though not a very

ligh officer, and he should oppose any eduction in the capitation allowanoe of he Volunteers, and if the revenue only mproved a little ho should wish to see urther encouragement given to them. ;Applause.) He had no doubt a great ■>*rt of the money expended on defence iurisg the Russian war scare was wasted, ind for this the Government were not wholly to blame, bnt the expenses of maintenance of the fortifications must be kept down as low as possible. Regarding the Legislative expenditure he thought the number of members of the Lower House might be reduced by one half, »nd he certainly should Bnpport any reasonable reduction in their number. The honorariums paid to members of the Upper House, so long as it was constituted as at present, should be entirely swept away, r . and he thought under the present circumstances of the colony memberß of the Lower House must in common decency set an example of retrenchment, and consent to a reduction in the honorarium of £6B, leaving it at £l6O, quite sufficient to allow a poor man to.enter the House. Ho would not wish to lower it so as ,to debar a poor man from getting into the Houro. Next, he thought Hansard might be done away with, thus saving directly £SIOO, besides the indirect economy effected by the saving of time of the House, as many of the longest ind most worthless speeches delivered in the House were delivered for the sake of appearing in Hansard. He thought the cost of the Government Printing Press should be reduced. At present tons "of returns were issu«d at great expense to the. country, which were of no use. He instanced the famous return obtained oo the motion of Mr E. G, Wright which coat the country about £6OO, and was of no use when obtained. (Hear, hear.) The salaries of the Speakers and Chairmen of Committee! might be reduced as they were only engaged for three months" in the, y«»r. Another item which was often mentioned as where retrenchment could be made was the San Francisco Mail Service. He waa not very hopeful of a great saving on this,

as the present contract would continue foi one or two years 1 longer, and nothing could be done till the end of that time. He thought it worthy of consideration whether the money now given for it could not be better given to local lines of steamers, thereby possibly reducing the freights bow paid oh our exports. Turning from the Legislative expenditnre to that of the Civil Service generally they might begin with the Governor and reduce his salary and allowances to £SOOO a year, considering the purely formal services which for the most part he renders. As to the Civil Service generally do on* without full access to the official information could attempt a plan for its.reorganisation. Ho thought it should be the first duty of the new Parliament to irisißt upon a searching and open enquiry into the Civil Service genertlly— hear)— which ho felt sure would result in savings. He did not wish them to think that 'ha believed that every man in the feefrvifce-of the State should be paid less thfc'n fair value for his services whether"he be a high official or a day laborer, having regard to the circumstances pf the colony. It might be advisable to put the service under a Board as in Victoria. There was nodoubt that great waste was now incurred in dealing with the service, and some machinery should be produced for its reor-.< ganication which would put it on : a firm ; : footing. The number of Ministers might well be roduced by two, but he thought Ministers should be paid fair value for their services. He thought reductions should be made ia fhe travelling, allowances anil house expenses of Ministers. There was no doubt that there had been a great waste in the Mines Department. { EDUOAWOIT. ; '•■

He wished to make his views on education plain. He was in favor of the preBenfc National free system of Primary Education (applause) and he would oppose an economies, or changes—call them what they might—which would impair the efficiency or ohange its character. It had been said that some £30,000 or £40,000 could be saved without injuring the system, and, if so, by all means let them save it. But he would certainly oppose any attack onth« system, evenil it were mi do under the alluring name of economy, which would impair its efficiency. (Hear, hear.) He was also oj|r posed to any reduction in the number of the standards. ! IKEETRADE AND IBOTHCMON.

As to the great question of Freetrade and Protection, be had already announeed that he was a Freetrader. It was not, - possible to do away with the present duties, nor, perhaps, was it desirable to do so, but he would oppose any increase in the present duties, or any fresh duties, eflpecially those affectiog tho agricultural and pastoral interest, except for revenue purposes. He could not go into the matter fully, but there was one aspocfc in which ho would ask them to.regard this They were? doirigt alarge and increasing; trade with, New South ■, Wales, and other Australian Colonies. , Ljist year their exports to Australia amounted to not less than £1,600,000 he thought*. If they protected ourselves with duties would not the Australians retaliate, and then what would become of the'trade with Australia with its vast posßibitite3 of incre»*i» t A Urge proportion of the exports to Australia consist of agricultural produce, most of which is shipped from Canterbury, and • a good deal of that from- Soifth Cut- ■- bury. Any diminution in the export trule »ich Australia wsuld be a serious thing for this district. /("» DIRECT TAXATION. * As ti direct taxation, ho was in favor of the present Property Tax—h the first placo becau e it had biti in »xi"iitpnoe for wiine time and wnrkN easily, and, it had be :ii admitted by the Colonial Treasurer himself that uo change should bo made in the form of t xation without gr ire reason, Jn the next place it a fair> t»Xw it lax.'d a man according to the amount he his—whether lie holds it ufiproduo lively, and therefore injures the Stale, or

whstber it is well inve»ted,and lie is making a good return from it himself, and can therefore afford to pay for it. It also affects the foreign capitalists as well as the local capitalist, but does not frighten the foreign capitalist because he knows he is only agisting to pay for the maintenance 'of the Government, which protects hie interests and enables him to maka a return. The Property Tax at Id in tho £ is equal to an Income Tax of Is 8d in the £, calculating all the property Bubjeot to the tax as returning 5 per cpnt, which he thought a Mr average. He was opposed to a Graduated Property Tax .-a tax which means a larger tax on large sums than on small sums. This would tend to keep out foreign capital. There might be something said for a tax of this kind in England, but in a country like this, where 99-100 tbs of the business of the country was done with borrowed money, it would be madness. He saw Mr McLaughlan, at Leeston, suggested thai a man with £IOO,OOO should pay one. third of his income in" taxation, and some one had said the other night that he presumed a man with £150,000 should go to prison. (Laughter). The Graduated Property Tax was probably the thin end of the wedge, and that was what it would probably end in hereafter. LANDS*

Our main object in dealing with the Waste Lands sbou'd be to get the people settled on the land on aufficient areas to make a living and thrive. (Applause). He was in favor of village settlements where land could be got and there was work to do. But he would oppose settlers being put on bad land where there was no work to de» (Applause). BORBOWING.

Aa to tbe question of borrowing, he was opposed to any increase in tbe National Debt. Every million borrowed means £30,§00 or £40,000 of fresh taxation. It was all very well to talk of bcr« rowing for reproductive works, but they had been bofrowing for 17 years for reproductive works without result. Sir Robert Stout, at Dunedin, proposed to borrow for the Qfcago Central railway. Sir Julius Vbgel, in his Ashburton speech three years ago, said he would Bhow how they could finish works and increase the revenue without increasing, taxation, and held out some grand schemes. The re-sult-was a miserable failure. He was •gainst all further borrowing except for the purpose of carrying out engagements entered into at present. MR TWOMET'S SI'EECH.

With their permission ho would now make a short reference to bis friend and their feliowtownsmrn, MrTwomey. (Applause). Mr Twomey was treating him in tbe most courteous and friendly manner during the contest, and no doubt this good feeling would last to the end of the •lection. Any criticisms he might make that evening he hoped they would believe applied to his speech as delivered in that hall, and not to Mr Twomey personally. (Applause). He would commence v»ith tbe subject of Major Atkinson's speech at JBawera. [He then read that part of Mr Twomey's speech, in which that gentle* man quoted Major Atkinson's remarks at Hawera a few days before the session, to the effect that he did not think that retrenchment would wholly meet the present difficulty, but that further taxation would be necessary, if, as some contended, the charges now placed upon loan are to be met by the consolidated revenue.] Well ifc was evident his friend, Mr Twomey, did not kDow what he was talking about. (Mr Twomey : Let them know that is not my language ; it is tbe language of Major Atkinson.) Mr F bodes continued: Mr that " it was time they were ,fone with paying interest out of loan, for it' was that which had pretty well ruined the colony." It was quite evident, Mr Twomey did not understand what he wau talking about. We don't pay interest out of loan. We construct all our roads and bridges, our schools and other buildings, our railways and telegraphs, etc., out of loan. It would he impossible to place them on the revenue .of this country without such, taxation bs they could not bear. With present deficiency it would require far short of a million. He did not '•'/■ , wish it to be understood that in thus re.» " ferring to Maior Atkinson he would follow him. [MrEbodea then read Mr Twomey's iemarfcs re the retrenchment effected by Sir John Hall, when be stated that he thought all the retrenchment effected by Sir John Hall on the recommendation of the Royal Commission had been swal- ,,. lowed up in tbe costs of the Commissioners]. He (Mr Rhodes) thought the , lesi said about private secretaries and ' ixpenseß the better. The present Government had out-Heroded'Herod in that respect as in every other. The Hall Govern- - meat took 20 per cent, off their own salaries, and the present Government pro- : ceeded to take'off 7| per cent, though there was now greater need for economy. [Mr Bhodes then quoted Mr Twomey's statement that Mr Montgomery bad admitted that " the present Government had saved £BO,OOO and if the troth were known , the Broount might be £85,000 or £90,000 "] Well-: the sayings were nor, savings effecbd! but savings to be effected if the Governmeot remained in office. The Government had increased the expendi-

ture in tbree year* by £331,000 besides not having to pay several hundreds of > thousands of pounds as sinking fund, and Jutting charitable aid on local rates, aod they were in earnest about the graduated property tax and Land Acquisition Bill, . wby did they not propose them till the general election nut at hand I Why ■ should a farmer whose farm stock and buildings was worth £2600 pay one peony property tax,' while another with property - with £2499 paid only 1316ihe of a penny ? It was a poor wiy of encouraging the farming industry, fhen with regard to the Land Acquisition Bill, why did they not bring it iu till the general election was hear. It was monstrous to propose that taxpayers should have to buy private estates wh«>n there wc*e millions of acres ..... of Grown ißOds aw'iting settlement, (A voice: Wbere is itt Another voice : Up at Mount Cook 1) He held that a roan's j farm should be as secure as the clotheß on his back, or his money in the Bank. [Mr RhorJes next quoted Mr W'' remarks r# the time the Continnr.ua Ministry held < ffice from 1170 to 1884 aod ihnt Sir Julius Vcgel was not responsible for all tie borrowing, Major . Alkii.soo havi. g borrowed £14,000,000 •during the time Sir Julius Vogel whh abr pent from thf colony fn m 1876 till J884.] Mr Rhodes eaid fciir Julius went Heme to England, hating appointed himself to a bet er billet, as Aeem-General, aod when he came oat in 1884 it wsi to claim an

extra £6OOO from the taxpayers for work done while he waa Agent-General. (Interruption.) [llr Rhodes then rend Mr Twomey's remarks re Sir John Hall resigning hi.-s seat in the Upper House, getting elected to the Lower House, and passing Bills introduced by Sir George Grey previously.] Mr Rhodes continued that there was no greater opponent of tho Government than Sir George Grey, and if they wanted to see the Government condemned they should read his speeches. [Mr Rhodes then read Mr Twomey's remarks that he recognised the Liberal party, would «mpport it if elected, and would live and die a Liberal.] Mr Rhodes said either Mr Twomey would i never live nor die a Liberal, or the Grand Old Man of New Zealand never was one. Regarding the unauthorised expenditure on village settlement referred to by Mr Twomey, he would read what Sir George Grey had said on the subject, [He then read a statement by Sir George Grey that he believed the expenditure on Village settlements was for electioneering purposes.] Speaking to farmers he (Mr Rhodes) said, was it not monßtrous that the taxpayers should have to pay £70,000 to get 9000 men on bush land. (A voice : One thousand.) And now it was said that the men were starving.

THB NATIONAL BANK. Mr Rhodes then read a fow remarks from Mr Twomey's utterances re his National Bank Scheme and continued : The currency question was the most difficult within the range of political economy. He would like to read to them what Sir Robert Stout had said atlnvercargill last year : " All the State could do would be to forbid the Banks to issue the notes and to do it themselves. Only a certain amount was required for circulation, and the State could only issue that amount. It was the most absurd thing he ever heard of to think we could be aided in our depression by a printing press and a bale of paper." And Sir Julius Vogel showed the absurdity of the ' whole thing in the Financial Statement of 1886. The only function of money is to enable people to exchange their goods. The thing produced or manufactured is the wealth. Money enables it to be exchanged. Mr fFwomey's scheme for having a Bank dealing wih nothing but gold to the extent of 8 millions wan im. practicable. Where was it to come from ? 1 Gold locked up in the Bank was simply wasted. All that was required to be kept in the Bank was enough to meet the note circulation; the rest was reprasented by property held by the Bank, and by bills and other securities. We have the advantage of good sound money worth what is on the face of it. Let them tamper with tho currency and we would soon have the same trouble that the Americans had with their greenbacks, and had so much trouble to get rid of. (A voice: Time rolls on). How would they like to be paid with money that purported to be worth £1 sterling, and which was so depreciated in value that they could only get . 153 worth of goods for it I The farmer may depend th»l money is like everything else. When it is plentiful it is cheap, and when it is scarce it is dear. The whole arguments in favor of a State Bank appeared to him from a careful study of his speech to be—(l) the liabilities 'of the Bank doing business in the colony were extremely large in proportion to the actual amount of gold held by them, and, therefore, that the notes they issue are not as safe as they should be ; (2) that the profit on the note issue should swell the public revenue, and not go into the coffe'B of the Binks. In order to make the notes absolutely safe, he believed Mr Dargaville, an expert in banking, had introduced a Bill for several sessions by which tho note issue of the Banks was madea first charge on their assets. Although they had given the Banks the privilege of.isßuing notes, they made them pay for it by rendering them liable to an annual duty of 2 per cent, on the average of their notes in circulation. The amount of bank-notes tt present in circulation is ab0ut.£925,000, meaning an an annual income to the Government of about £20,000. If that payment was not large enough, and he, not being an expert, could not say that it was, then in his opinion the proper remedy was to increase the duty paid by the Banks rather than to plunge the colony into all the risk of loss which he thought would be attendant on the business of banking if managed as a Government department. The profits of banking were not so enormous at present. The older institutions with the aid of large reserve funds are able to pay large dividends, but of the more recently formed local banks neither pays more than 7 per cent., and one has had to write £IOO,OOO off its capital and has only paid 5 per cent, in two years, He was against the Government taking charge of J anything that could be done by private j enterprise. He then read a rather long extract from a speech delivered by Sir Robert Stout at Invercirgill in which the opinion was expressed thit the issuing of paper money by the State would not relieve the depression, and that there waa too great a tendency on the part of the people to go to the Government for everything. PERSONAL. From what he had said it could bo seen that he was opposed to the present Ministry, fle might lack experience, but he claimed to have the courage of his opinions—(Hear, hear, and applause)— and was not afraid to expresa the same on all ovcasions. They must not think he took a gloomy view of the prospects of the country. Under the guidance of honest and independent men, working upon sound principles, its future prosperity was assured. (Hear, hear.) H 9 thanked them for the patient hearing they had given him, and he might tell them it was the first time he had had the honor of addressing a public meeting of any description. (Great applause.) Mr Rhodes th*n sat down, but rose immediately after and said he would be g'ad to answer any questiors on subjects which he might not have made himself clear upon.

QUESTIONS. A number of questions w»re then put to the candidate ;

Mr lnwood ; Are you in favor of simplifying the Land Laws, witb a view of facilitating settlement on the land f—Mr Rhodes said tI)H Land La*s were contained in about 90 pug'sof Statute books, He bad beeu through them once or but was not prepared .to go ii'to the question that evening. He might say that he was prepar* d to reform it In any my to promote settlement on the J*nd.

Are you in favor of Non-political Railway Boards being appointed I— Mr Rhodes thought they should consider how Such Boards were working in Victoria. It might be advisable to introduce them here, but until he knew how they were working he would not pledge himself. Are you in favor of the West Coast ! railway'?—Mr Rhodes was glad the question had been asked. He was one of the original guarantors of the railway, and had done all he could since to get the railway constructed with foreign capital. But ha was opposed to the Government constructing it* as he did not think it good enough. Are you in favor of members of the Upper House being elected for <* term of 7 years ?—Mr Rhodes said he was in favor of an Upper House, and did not think they should abolish it. The present system of nomination was the worst- they could imagine. He would be only too glad to aee the constitution of the House altered, but as a bill for that purpose must be brought forward in the Upper House, he did nut think he cou'd do much.

Are you in favor of members' passes being only available during the session ? —Mr Rhodes said he was.

Will you vole for a repeal of the Local Bodies Roads and Bridges Construction Act ?—Mr Rhodes said he was against all borrowing, and ns he presumed that the Govwrnnieot could not lend without first borrowing, he was in favor of the repeal of the Act.

Do you approve of the present dutieß on corncrunhers, chnffcutterß, horse-rakes, etc. t—Mr Rhodes said ho did not.

Are you in favor of the tax proposed to be put on calicoes, Hollands, shirtings, and tapioca |~Mr Rhodes said he was not. He thosght taxes should as much as possible be on luxuries, and instanced champagne and silks. Articles that poor people used should not bo more heavily taxed than necessary.

Are you in favor of Sir Robt. Stout's scheme for the Otago Central railway, which would coat the country from £BO,OOO to £IOO,OOO annually for interest f —Mr Rhodes would be opposed to borrowing money for the work. If the squatters import Kaffir shearers, would you be in favor of framing them and sending them home again f (Great laughter).—Mr Rhodes said he did not know whether the squatters or Kaffirs were meant. As far aa he had any influence he would use it to prevent the importation of Kaffirs.

Will you support in Parliament the introduction of the Bible into the public schools, subject to a time-table and conscience clause !—Mr Rhodes said he would, provided the parents of children wished it.

Would you maintain the present Education system without any change!—Mr Rhodes said with regard to the Secondary Schools he thought they should have no further grants from the revenue. He would not be in favor of votes for fresh Universities. He thought part of the cost of scholarships shoiild be paid from the secondary endowments.

If elected will you be in favor of equalising the salaries of school teachers more than at present ?—Mr Rhodes said if he found it necessary in justice to the teachers to equalise the salaries he would do 80.

Would you vote against, and use your influence against, any proposal to grant any money to any denomination on any account!—Mr Rhodes said he would oppose any alteration of the present system of primary Education. Would you be in favor of having the tax on sheep and cattle dogs abolished, and making up the deficiency in the revenue by a double tax on sporting dogst —Mr Rhodes said he was not very well up in some matters of local government, but he thought all the dog tax went to local bodies, and if so they could deal with the subject as they liked. Sir John Hall said the country had to pay £3,000,000 or £4,009,000 a year in interest, that we import goods to the ▼alue of £7,000,000 and export £7,000,000 worth of goods; will you explain how you propose to avert bankruptcy J—Mr Rhodes said it was a large question to go into. If they sent him to Wellington he would spend the next three jears trying to solve it. (Voices : " You ought to have answered it to-night," and " That is no answer to the question.") How much do hotelkeepers contribute to the revenue in the course of the year in license fees !Mr Rhodes said he really didn't know. He had the Government returns at Christchurch, and after the election he would go into the subject and find out for them. A voice: " You should have gone into it before.) By what sum did the Public Works policy increase the value of the property of your family, and don't you think it is fair to ask yon to pay on the increased value ?-—Mr Rhodes said ho denied it had increased the value of their property. (Interruption, and suppressed cries of " Oh.") He thought their property would have been better without th» Public Works policy, (Cries of "Oh," and In regard., to the second question be knew well what he had to pay on it. He was quite willing to pay the same as other people j all he wanted was fair taxation.

Do you know that the leases of the Canterbury squatters fall in in 1890; that they have 27,000,000 of acres between 92 of them, or an average of 300,000 acres at less than £d per acres—how would you deal with them Rhodes said he was prepared to support settlement on any of the runs which were fit for settlement, but some it would be ridiculous to cut up. They would be relet, he supposed, by auction. He thought the rent generally came to 8d or 9d per acre, and he knew squatters were cot making fortunes. Would you be in favor of giving capitation, grant to Roman Catholic Schools! —Mr Rhodes said lie would not.

Are you in favor of Technical Educa» tion I— Mr Rhodes said he. was.

Have you any objection to cutting up the estates of large Companies into small holdings t—Mr Khodes said be waa certainly against taking the large estates from the Companies and the Land Acquisition Bill. It wpald lead to endless jobbery. Many of the large Companies would be only too glad to sell their land at hir prices. A question wus here handed up which the Chairman deemed not fit to be discussed an it &fiect*d a relig ous body.— Mr Rhodes t>nil lie would bo glad to uieer. the questioner aftor the meutiug and discuss it.

In answer to b question Mr Rhodes said he had heard it reported that £IBO had

been paid for curlaiDß or something of 'hat sort for one of the Ministers' houses. Mr Goodey said Mr Rhodes stated he believed in Village Settlements where there was good land and plenty of work for people, would he tell them where the ■work was ]—Mr Rhodes said he might have been misunderstood, but he did not mention good land for village settlements. He said where there wbb plenty of work. —Mr Goodey said he did not consider that s fair answer. (Loud cries.)—Mr Rhodes Baid he was not a member of the Labor Bureau. If he was appointed to that posi- | tion he would do his best to find where i work was to be found. At present he 'did not know. (A voice: Nor anybody else.)—Mr Goodey said he believed Mr Rhodes had been round the neighborhood where he lived, and enquiring whtt their *ants were. Would he be in favor of purchasing a block of land in the neighborhood to settle the working men upon aa he would not touch the education reserves.—Mr Rhodes said when he stated he would not be in favor of confiscating the education reserves he did not say he would not be in favor of cutting them up into small holdings, if necessary.—Mr Goodey said the small holdings were out of the reach of poor men as an application fee of 30s was necessary and 6 months', rent had to be paid in advance. A eood deal of the was in the reserves, and if elected would Mr Rhodes be in favor of making the Boardß controlling them elective"!—Mr Rhodes said he would.

Mr Rhodes said he was opposed to giving the franchise to the ladies. (Hear, hear, and great laughter.)

After all the retrenchment Mr Postlethwaite and others were talking about, would Mr Rhodes be prepared to give some of the money saved to reduce the freights on farmers' grain ! (Tumultuous applause and loud laughter.)—Mr Rhodes said he would favor keeping the railway freights as low as possible. Would yon compel the Government to clear the rabbits from Government land and river-beds under their control ? He had thought much about the question, and had been down to the Lake District to look up the rabbitß. When he had read Mr Lance's report he would be better able to say what he should advise. Would you be in favor of a tax on bachelors I—Mr Rhodes said he would not mind paying, but it would be hard to make some pay who could not get wives. (Laughter.) He supposed if they taxed the bachelors they should also tax widows.

in reply to two questions Mr Rhodes said be thought there vera already lots of laws dealing with landlord and tenant. He thought it impossible to make arbitrary rules as to rent. He thought very few got 5 per cent. He did not think a fairer property tax valuation could be devised. If anyone were dissatisfied with tho valuation be could appeal. Mr Leach : Will you be in favor of restricting . banking companies charging more than five per cent, interest I—Mr Rhodes said he thought it impossible to fix the rate of interest. It must be a matter of agreement between borrower and lender.

Do you think it right for the Bank of New Zealand to bring pressure to bear on Education Boards to secure the reserves t Mr Rhodes said no bigbrhinded person would thifek it right. Have you any interest in any sheep station 1 (Applause, laughter, cries of ««Don't answer it," and " Baa, baa.")—Mr Rhodes said he had not.

Have jou lent money on any sheep Btation, or large estates J (A voice : That is too personal.)—Mr Rhodes said he once had some money on a leasehold, buthe got it in as soon as possible. He had money on freeholds, but not on Government leaseholds.

Have any of your relatives any sheep stations 1 (Great uproar, and "Don't answer.")—Mr Rhodes said one of his brothers had an interest in a leasehold but he had not. (A voice t What abaut Chatraoas ?) Chaimoss was not a leasehold, and did not belong to the Geo. Rhodes family. One of his brothers had an interest in some leasehold at Bluecliffs. but he was quite willing to part with it. Would you be in favor of doing away with the totalisator P —Mr Rhodes thought some small amount might be charged by the Government, bnt he" would not be in favor of doing away with it. He waa not a great racing nan.

Mr Job Brown $ Will you be in favor of placing all matters regarding licensing under the control of the people instead of the Committees P —Mr Rhodes said the people elected the Committees, and tbey ought to be able to put men on who would carry out their wishes. He thought the present system best. Mr Brown» Would you be in favor of taking away some of the High Schools' revenue and giving it to Primary Schools for scholarships P—Mr Rhodes said he thought in some instances amounts now charged to Primary Education might be charged to Secondary. Mr Rhodes said with referenoe to free passes on the railways to lords and ladies who visited New Zealand, and to, members of the Press, he thought the former could very well pay for the use of the railways. He thought it might be advisable ■ to' give passes to newspaper men. If it was doDe.in other countries they should do it here. Would you withdraw your support from any Minister who exceeded authorised expenditure, as lately had been" done by the Minister of Lands P—Mr Rhodes said he bad spoken very freely on that subject. He thought Ministers should be allowed 15 per cent., but it should only be on very urgent expenditure. If elected would you be in favor of pulling down the Oxford railway bridge and giving the timber to the poor P—Mr Rhodes said if a mistake had been made in building it he)did not think tbey should spend more monay on pulling it down. This concluded the questions. BXILANATIOK.

The Rev. Jasper-9mylhe explained that his presence on the placform that evening must not be taken to mean that he was a supporter of Mr Ehodes. He had been to Winchester to see about tha school there, and hearing that Mr Rhodes was to speak be had stopped to hear him. He might s»y he would not support anyone who was not in favor of the present system of primary education. He had gone into the subjeot carefully and methodically and was sure not more than £12,000 could be eared on education. At present he was not pledged to any candidate, and he would not pledge his support to any until he had heard all. TOTiIB 01 THAHKB. Mr Talbot in a short speech proposed a vote of thanks to Mr lihodee for bis uddress. Mr Inwood eeconded the motion, which was carried by Hcclamt.taon. Mr Rhodes said he would simply thank them for the numerous questions, by wbioh

they had gained information that he should have imparted in his speech. Another time he would do better. He had mueh pleasure in proposing a vote of thanks to the Chairman.

The vote was passed and the meeting ter< ruinated.

MR W. PALMER AT GERALDINE.

Mr W. Palmer addressed the electors of the Rangitata district in the Oddfellows Hall, Geraldine, on Tuesday evening last. Long before the time appointed for the meeting (7.30) a considerable crowd had gathered round the door, and soon after its being opened the room was packed full. Mr R. H. Pearpoint, Chairman of the Town Board, not being ab'e to take the position ol Chairman Mr Palmer, who csme on the platform about 7.30, asked the meeting to elect a Chairman. Mr N. Dunlop was voted to the chair but declined the honor, and Mr Badbam was finally elected Chairman. This gentleman said they bad met there that evening to hear the views of one of themselves. A great many of them differed with Mr Rolles'on—some thought he was an aristocrat—but they had now a gentleman coming forwari who was one of themselves— his feelings were theirs. lie (Mr Palmer) was there to explain>those views that evening and if those views agreed with their own he was quite willing to represent them in Parliament, (Cheers.) He (Mr Badham) had been blamed for inducing Mr Palmer to come forward, but he thought that on the contrary he should be honored for so doing. (Hear, hear.) He then bespoke a fair and impartial hearing, (Loud applause.) Mr Palmer then came forward and was greeted with cheers. Be stated that he Lad come forward to offer himself as a candidate, as he considered there should be some opposition to Mr Rolleston, and if his (Mr Palmer's) views met theirs he would be very happy to represent them in Parliament, and they mightrest assured,if he was returned, be would do his best for their interests and those of the country at large. He hoped they would excuse him reading his speech, as it was the first time he had ever stood before an audience, and he felt'rather diffident in that position. He would not go into estimates that evening, but if they approved of his views he would go into figures at other times and places where he would address them. (Loud applause.) He might tell them in the first place he was a supporter of the Stout-Vogel Ministry. BORROWING. He was, however, quite against borrowing. They all knew that to borrow to opm up a new country was of great advantage. It gave access to the products and helped to settle the people in the country. But excessive borrowing was a great evil, for whenever a depression came they found themselves struggling under a burden. Tbefore tbey ehould try and avoid too much borrowing. (Hear, hear.) LAND SETTLEMENT. . What he was going to say now, he believed had been tried, but he could not think it had been tried judiciously, although there had been progress towards settlement in 1886-7. (A voice:, Hallelujah). His view was to set apart suitable blocks of Crown Lands on the Perpetual Lease System, such as a farmer could make a good living off, then send circulars to the Old Country, Btating what a man could make by good farming, and showing the access to the land, advising the amount of capital required to stock a good-s'zed farm, aud and also showing the possible cost per head to land on it from England. These circulars should be sent to the rectors of inland parishes, and he felt certain if this were carried out they would have plenty of men come out to New Zealand with capital. There were plenty of men in England struggling to make a living. They were frightened to sell put and leave the Old Country for fear of spending what they had before getting settled, again. THE (JUBTt'XS DUTIES. He was not going to say much about the Customs duties. It would require a great deal of study and information. (Interruption). He saw by the Colonial Treasurer's report, that there had been a great falling off on spirits in the Customs. He thought they could all account for that. His view was that the market had been so depressed the last two years that there had been a grout falling off in agricultural pursuits, which had kepi a lot of drinking men out of work, and it bad taxed all their resources to make food and clothes. He would now speak upon the NATIONAL BANK SCHEME. (Uries of that's more like it; Hear, hear, hear, eic. [Mr Kalaugher to the obstructionists : •• I Bbould like to see so>"e of you gentlemen, who are so fond of interrupting, up in his (Mr Palmer's) place, aud see what a show you would make of it.] Signs of approval and dear, hear). There was a great burden on the people of New Zealand at the present time, and that was the high rate of interest. For instance, take a man wwh a 200-acre farm, and say he had borrowed £BOO at 9 per cent, that would be sS72 per annum, r<-n'. Suppose that man could have got that amount at 6 per cent, that would be £4B per anDum rent. Then that man wquid have £34 to lay out in labor, which would employ a mso for nearly six months, and the fruit of that man's labor might brin# in 50 p»T cent profit. That would make it £36 per annum, and the man would get six months' tabor. It •'Very farmer could give a man six more months' labor per year than hi doea'at present, wi>ulu it not be better for all. And if a storekeeper could

borrow at one third less than he hud *« pay now, look what a reduction the consumers would get in the price of their goods, whereas they were now struggling to fill the pockets of a few bank sharpholders, because they have the majority in the House ot Parliament. The public would still have the same market to sell in as they had now. For instance, let them look at Australia. They.got their capital at 5 and 6 per cent, and the New Zealanders bad to sell in the same market as tbem. Why, he ask'd, would the public consent to be so handicapped when they had in their hands the power of redress. His idea of carrying' but the State Bank was for the Government to borrow say one or two millions sterlißg, then to float paper money pay to eight millions if required, but the Government to have nothing whatever to do with the management of the Rank. The profits, however, should be paid to the Government evpry year, which would help to pay the interest on the National Debt. The Bank uhould be managed by" a Board of Directors, say nine, elected by the public, three from different parts, falling out each year for re-elfc-tion. By this means the scheme could be carried out in safety, so that the Government could not make use of the reserve fund, lie believed by soiiie Act it would interfere with the present paper currency, but that difficulty could be got over by repealing that Act, and the privileges of the. present banks would also require to be lowered, (Applause). VILLAGE SETTLEMENTS. He was alsD in favor of setting apart ! Tillage settlements in different parts on good land on the perpetual lease system. (Applause). EDUCATIONAL. He would suggest doing away with Government High Schools altogether and making over their reserves to the primary schools (applause). Now the poor men had to pay for the education of the rich as there were very few poor men able to send their children to .the high schools. (Applause.) There would be plenty of private schools to take the, place of the high schools if they were done away with. (Hear, hear, and ap- > plause.) RETRENCHMENT. He would suggest doing away with the honorarium paid to members of the Legislative Council, as there would be plenty of gentlemen willing to fill the seats, and the country would have better legislation. He was of opinion that there could be a great reduction made, on Ministers' salaries, and also in the House ef Representatives. (Hear, hear.) THE PROPERTY TAX. If it was necessary for the support of the revenue 1 to increase taxation bwould suggest lowering the exemption ' to £3OO, and where there were bjoeks of unimproved land, say to the extent of four or five hundred Bcres, there should be no exemption allowed whatever, on account of the valuation being low as compared with cultivated lands of the same class. LEASING RESERVES AND OROWN LANDS. He considered the manner in which th* Government leased the reserves and sold land on deferred payment to l» a great mistake, He was of opinion that all lands on deferred payment shou'd be let by ballot at an upset price, as also should the reserves. For instance, he knew of men that were paying 18s per acre for laad that was not worth more than 12s per acre per annum, and he knew of others who were about to throw ,up their leasei on account of the rentbeing so high. What was the good, be asked; in allowing men to run one another in such, a way, and aways.be struggling to pay their debts, He considered any man renting land from the Government ought to be able to make a comfortablo living, or rather make such lands pay their way instead of men having to go outside for work to make something to pay the rent, (Hear, hear.) LAND NATIONALISATION. He considered that half of New Zealand should have been nationalised from the beginning, and the other half sold to capitalists and farmers,, For instance, if the interest farmers were now paying to mortgagees was beinar paid to Government as rent the farmers would be in a better position, the revenue would be supported wMiout taxes at all, and tbpre would have been enough to carry on public works with the capital that was now being sent to other countries as interest, [ ' OCR RAILWAYS. If borrowing was to be stopped, which it must be, our railway Work* must, lo a certain extent, cease. Therefore he would suggest that Government vote. from a quarier to half \ million to carry on public works every year to prevent the unemployed crying to Government tor work. (Hear, bear,) The unemployed cry was 'one of the greatest drawbacks to populating the country. They could never expect people to come to New Zealand to settle so long as the unemployed were constantly crying to Government for work. (Hear, hear.) There was nothing would give a country a bad name *o quickly as the .unemployed cry—(hear, hear)—ind theqoicker they got that cry stopped the better. (Applause.) « skM ion**. He saw by statements made that the Ministers hate gone so far as to spend £261,000 wi'hout acquainting the Assembly. No one should be allowed to spend such a large amount of public money without a meeting of the House. He would go further and state that. n<> Government should be allowed to spend over £50,000 wi'hout a meeting of InHouse He w< uld suggest that to b' ( iue limit, (Hear, hear,)

TIIRKTIIADB AND PItOTKCTION. (A voice; I httt i« rn..<re. iik-ii, and ap-o;au-e). No rioiilv Ri'ino of ibem would disagree with his vi-ws upon this print, biit he would explain th<m 10 them. For instance; look at England. When they had Protection the farmers got good prices for their produce.and stock.—(A voice : So they did) : —and were not overburdened with taxation, because their revenue whs partly supported by the Customs from Pro ection. llwn there wasa cry among the people for FreetrtinV, «nd cheap living. W hat w»b the resuh 1 Why, produce was'poured in from all parts of the world, the price of produce and stock came down, there was a fal ing off in the..revenue, and direct taxation had to be enforced, and after a few years had elapsed the farmers began to fuel the burden so that high rents, heavy taxes, and low prices of produce and stock had driven many farmers out of the country. A farmer in Eng'and had to make, three rents —-one for his own living, one for rent, and one for taxes. The people of New Zealand should encourage Protection to avoid direct taxation, otherwise they might find themselves ia the same position. (Loud applause). THE RAILWAYS. He had mentioned the railways before, but he wished,to state that in his topinion theraiiways hai been carried on at too fas! an extent, far faster than the public were able to support at present, and still they cried for more. (Hear, hear). THE SHEEP'RUNS. There was no doubt that oh the expiration of the leases of these runs, there wouid be great opposition in tha House of Parliament as to bow tbey shou'd be dealt with. (A voice : Where's tb« Kaffirs. Musical solo, combe and tissue paper). He would suggest that the rui.s be divided, or cut up in blocks, say from one thousand to eight thousand acres. (Hear, hear). That would give every person an opportunity ot acquiring what would suit,him, at .the upset price. The. term of ihe leaee .to.be irom fifteen (o twenty-one years, CONCLUSION. Mr Palmer theu thanked them for the cordial reception and patient hearing they had given him. He had not-, gone into figures, as he wished to,sea what support he was likely to get before going deeply into the matter. (A voice, you have done very well). If he was fairly supported he would then explain his views on the working as he had told them before. (Comb and paper musical solo, and cries of Order). QUESTION'S. The Chairman said Mr Pa'mer did not want to keep them loDg that night. His speech was a short resume ot wh is he intended giving them. He would now be glad to answer any qnestions. Mr Quirt-would like Mr Palmer to explain his views upon the Upper House. Mr Palmer said he had stated in his speech that the paid members of the Upper House should be done away with altogether. (Heir, hear) He would alsol)e in favor of reducing the number of members in the Lower House if found necessary. (Hear, hear). A voice : Would you be in favor of putting a poll tax on all married men without" families ? (Laughter, and a voice: Are you a member of the Shearers' ttnion?) Mr Palmer: No, I am not.

A voice: Would you be in favor of importing Kaffirs into the country ? Certainly not. Instrumental solo, " He's a Jolly Good FelL>w," foot accompaniment by the audience. A voice: Would you be in favor of doing away with voting and call ten* ders for representatives ?—Mr Palmer would certainly be in favor of the vote. :

A voice: Would you be in favor of giving your Chairman a billet as Her Majesty's hangman f —Mr Pa mer hoped New Zealand would not want a hangman, but if the time came and the Chairman cared for. the billet he was welcome to it. (Applause, and instrumental solo, " He's a Jolly Good Fellow.")

A voice: If you'll give us a step I will play. Strikes up a jig on the comb and paper. Mr Logan J Would you be in favor of doing away with auctioneer's licenses and allowing them to sell without licenses'? No, certainly not, the licenses add to the revenue. (Musical solo) : -: .. , '

After a few minutes' silence the Chairman asked if any gentleman had any more questions to "ax" the ■candidate. (Loud cries of "ax " from all parts of the house, and a voice: " A.x them agin.") This was too much for the Chairman, wuo dropped into his chair, seizing the two sides for a suppor as he cleverly dodged a'right and left hander of h n fruit and flour ball respectively, at the same time glaring 'at his tormentors Ike a caged lion. This was the signal for attack, pnd eggs, of ancient date varied with balls of flour began to .rain in thick and fast Amid a shower of such missiles Mr Palmer proposed a vote of thanks to the Chairman, and then all in the vicinity of the platform made a precipitate retreat through the open doors of the ante-room. The rest of the crowd passed out i-ito the street where for about a quarter of an hour eggs and flour flew like hail. Mr Palmer is to be congratulated upon having received such a really fair hearing, and it was evident that though the younger portion of the audience had come p epared for some fun they did not deny him his right o£ iree speech.