ADDRESS-IN-REPLY.

Te Aroha News, Volume VIII, Issue 485, 2 July 1890, Page 3

ADDRESS-IN-REPLY.

DEBATE RESUMED. THE ADDRESS ADOPTED. Wellington, June 24. The debate on the Addresa-in-Reply was resumed yesterday afternoon by Major Steward, who described the Governors Speech as nothing but words, with the meaning of Ministers so clouded with the exuberance of their own verbosity _ that it was extremely difficult to decipher them as representing the feelings and wants of the people. Ho felt sure that the speech must have given the greatest dissatisfaction from one end of the colony to the other. He doubted that the Government had a surplus of £115,000, or any surplus, and said that even if there was a surplus, there was no indication that this was to be devoted to the lightening of feho burdens of the people. He complained that the speech contained not a single word about retrenchment, and expressed regret that no attempt was made to deal with exemptions under the property tax as promised last session. The so-called increase of settlement of the land might be shown on paper, but could not be "shown on land, and as a matter of fact there was a steady outflow of our population, and because the people could not get land to settle upon bona fide settlers were driven away. Major Steward also attacked the appointments made by the Government during the recess, and for the mismanagement of the railways. Referring to the rumoured resignation of the Premier, he caused a smile by remarking suggestively that there wa3 no Kaiser to take the helm in the event of that important post becoming vacant, and concluded by stating that his vote would depend on whether the Government showed any inclination to undertake some useful work. Mr Bryce, who followed, deprecated further waste of time, on the ground that the debate on the Address-in-Reply was worse than useless. He said Sir George Grey had an object in moving his amendment in order to emphasise the fact that he had obtained for the people what appears to be a great boon, and which had not been commented upon by the press of the colony as a reform of great importance. Ho did not think the Parliament was dead. If they were going to have the Financial debate in a few days the present discussion was worse than useless, because they could not go into the position of the colony satisfactorily until they had before them the Financial Statement. It was the duty of the Government to place before Parliament in the fullest manner, financially and generally, the position of the colony, and to invite the fullest discussion thereon, and the Opposition would fail in its duty unless it insisted upon the adoption of this course. In conclusion, he urged that the Public Works Statement should be brought down at the same time as the Financial Statement. Mr W. C. Smith thought now was the proper timo for the Government to take members into their confidence. The feeling throughout the country was that there should have been a dissolution before Parliament met, because the Government were not in a position to pass the laws that were absolutely required for the welfare of the colony. He characterised the land policy of the Government as a case of policy simply, and a great drawback to the small settlers, and urged that by an alteration in the incidence of taxation, the holders of large and unimproved estates should be made to contribute towards the taxation of the country. He believed the Government were not sincere in their promise to introduce a Civil Service Reform Bill, and denounced the continued mismanagement of the railways. The duty of Parliament now was to cause a dissolution at the earliest possible moment, and to grant supplies to enable fresh elections to take place. He urged upon the Government the advisability of facing the position at once. Mr Hutchison (Waitotara) remarked upon the remarkable omissions from the Governor’s Speech, notably the absence of everything in reference to the finances of the colony. He referred to the appointments made during the recess, and urged that the appointments of Supreme Court judges should be above any suggestion of favouritism. Not a single penny of public money would be paid to Judge Edwards as Judge of the Supreme Court, and whatever salary he received would be covered by fees which applicants had to pay in the Native Land Court for having their titles investigated. He also pointed out that Judge Edwards had now as a Commissioner to decide upon native land cases, which he had argued against ineffectually in the Court of Appeal, and described this position of affairs as a scandal. Mr Hutchison also stated that nominally a Mr Smith, but actually a crowd of native landholders, had been advanced £3OO by the Government to carry an appeal to London against the highest Court erected by Parliament in this colony. Mr John McKenzie (Otago) said if the Government had done their duty, the amendment moved by Sir G. Grey would not have been necessary. The Government ought to have known that during last session they were unable to carry any measures without the assistance of the Opposition, and that having that class .of support it was their duty to have advised His Excellency to dissolve Farliament, and have tho new House assembled now. Mr McKenzie spoke up till the evening adjournment, and when the House resumed at 7.30, he resumed the attack, characterising the retrenchment claimed by the Government as a sham, the officers dismissed having been replaced in some instances. One dismissed had been replaced by two. Mr Fish (Dunedin South), the next speaker, thought this discussion would have been more in place after the Financial Statement had been brought down. There was one member of the Government, the Hon. Captain Russell, whom he regarded as a very capable man, but, as a member of the Ministry, he was a danger to the community. He was an ultra-pro-tectionist, and the majority of the Government were really free traders. He was also an ultra-Conservative, and, as such, dangerous to the community. Mr Fisher followed with a severe attack on the Government. He said the country looked for some indications of the Government’s proposals as to the means to be adopted to bring about a remedy for the existing state of things, and went on to point out what he referred to as the maladministration of the Government. The Customs, he said, had been administered for the benefit of one class to the disadvantage of another. £3ooliad been accepted from one influential person, and £l5O from another for back duties, and there had been no prosecution. £3OO worth of goods had been returned to one firm, and £IOO worth of goods to another, after having been seized by the Customs authorities without any prosecutions being instituted. On the other hand, heavy fines were imposed in connection with certain beer duty prosecution. Passing on to the colonial exodus, Mr Fisher stated that the immigration returns for the last four months showed that no fewer than 2,244 persons left.the colony, He also charged the Government that the railways of the colony were apparently

worked for the benefit of tho Union Company, for while the trains travelled from one end of the colony to the other with a mere handful of passengers, the Company’s steamers were crowded to excess. Concerning the so - called surplus of £115,000, he said there was £27,000 taken over at the beginning of the year and £60,000 obtained from the primage duty which was set apart for definite purposes. The national system of education, he said, had boon endangered by an insinuation that the system was too costly, and he cautioned members that this was a device of the enemy. Mr Fisher also referred to the reported connection between this colony and the Bank of New Zealand, and said that this connection should be cut once and for ever. He also caused some sensation by quoting from an English paper a statement that one of the members of the existing Ministry owed the Bank of New Zealand £60,000 which had not been paid or any interest for four years. This if true should ensure the immediate resignation of the Minister in question. (Hear, hear). The Hon. Mr Fergus rose to make an explanation, prefacing his remarks with the statement that he would reserve any further observations he had to make until there was before the House the Financial Statement, which was now being blocked by certain members of the Opposition. (Cries of “ Oh.”) He challenged the leader of the Opposition to come down with a no-con-fidence motion when the financial proposals of the Government were before tho House, and went on to ridicule the present debate on the Address-in-Reply as being simply waste of time. He accepted the reference made by Mr Fisher to a member of the Government being indebted to the Bank of New Zealand, and challenged that hon. member to prove that he (Mr Fergus) ever owed the Bank of New Zealand or any person one single penny. Mr Fergus also stated that his relations with his colleagues had been of a most harmonious character, and that the assertions made to the contrary were unfounded. Tho two points on which his Queenstown speech was attacked was with reference to the consideration of loans to local bodies and large estates. He had no intention of saying that the Harbour Board and other local bodies’ loan 3 should be taken up, and did not say so. The reference made in his speech to largo estates had no reference to lands on the East Coast. Mr Fergus also referred to the action of Mr Fisher in reference to certain beer prosecutions, which he said caused so much disgust in the Cabinet that his colleagues insisted on him leaving the Government. Mr Seddon, who followed, thought it would have been well if Mr Fergus had taken the opportunity just afforded of explaining certain serious charges made against the Government, and of informing the House what the intentions of the Government actually were. He caused a general laugh by repeating the appeal made by the Government to wait till the Financial Statementcomes down, remarking, in tones of deep dL-gust, “ Wait till the clouds roll by.” He expressed pleasure at the statement made by the Hon. Mr Fergus with reference to the alleged indebtedness of one Minister to the Bank of New Zealand, and expressed a hope that a similar denial would be made by each one of his colleagues. He also condemned the purchase of Rotorua, stating that this purchase was made in face of the fact that the Government had ninety-nine years' lease of this property. Sydney Taiwhanga expressed his conviction that Parliament should dissolve on Saturday week. The Hon. Mr Mitchelson rose at 10.39 p.m. to reply to certain statements referring to tho dispute between Judge Barton and the Government. He said Judge Barton sent in his resignation without any cause, and simply out of pique. Before making the appointment of Judge Edwards as judge of the Supreme Court, he stated that the appointment was made after obtaining full information as to his abilities, and he believed that notwithstanding the fact that Judge Edwards had been previously interested in certain native prosecutions it would not inany way influenoehismind in these matters. Referring to the complaint made of the Government having appealed to the Privy Council against a decision of the Court of Appeal, he explained that the appeal was against a decision by Justice Richmond, and that when the matter came before the Court of Appeal there were two Supreme judges against two, and the Government were perfectly justified in depositing £3OO to carry the matter to a higher Court. The Rotorua land purchase, he said, wa3 a good one, and relieved the Government of a constant source of trouble. The price paid for the land was £B,IOO, and he was sure the Government could sell again for five times that sum. In the Legislative Council Dr. Grace, speaking to the motion for the adoption of the Address-in-Reply, remarked that New Zealand had lost much during the past few years because she had been too honest in her desire to cease borrowing, and because she had been unable to follow the example of the. sister colonies in bringing out immigrants. He favoured a system of Imperial federation. He believed that tho colony’s best efforts should be directed towards adopting England’s best customs, irrespective of the questions of federation and protection. He felt convinced that the colony should endeavour to do away with the complications of local government, and that the vote of the colony lay in its land. The demands made by labour so far as he could see were too exorbitant. The wages of the people at present were artifically kept up, and so long as this was so the effect would be to strike at the foundation of commerce and capital. It was a most extraordinary thing, he said, that in a young country like this the savings banks were well supported, and this would also be so if the labour organisations were not so despotic in their demands against capital. He considered protection a bad thing for the colony, and that until it was done away with the colony would not make progress. Hon. W. S. Peter seconded the motion. Hon. G. S. Whitmore deprecated the imposition of the present property tax, which he believed ere long would be abolished. He expressed a hope that before the session closed the country would be relieved from the crushing system of taxation from which the colony was suffering. The motion was then submitted and agreed to, and after the introduction of the Bill prevously noticed the Council adjourned till 2.30 p.m. to-day. The Hon. Mr Mitchelson spoke till 11 o’clock, when the House adjourned for half-an-hour.

On the House resuming, Mr .Grimmond took up the debate, expressing his opinion that the course proposed by Sir George Grey was the right one. Dr. Fitchett strongly objected to the action of the Government in supplying funds for private litigation, and said the Government had an unhappy reputation for interfering with justice. Mr Taipua regretted that so much time had been wasted in useless debate before the Government had stated what was their policy. The natives in his district were perfectly satisfied with tho administration of the Native Minister, particularly with the purchase of native; lands. He objected to an immediate dissolution, because there

were a large number of native matters before Parliament requiring his attention. Colonel Fraser said h© felt sure that if the Government succeeded in purchasing 3,000 acres at Rotorua andthe sanatorium at a cost of £20,000, they would have done the greatest servicß to the country. Mr Tanner, who moved the Address-in-Reply, then rose to close the debate. He thought that if the present Parliament was regarded as moribund it was because in that session it told greatly against the triennial Parliament. The Opposition said they would not allow the Government to pass any measures, and now complained that the Government had not done so. He thought party government was bad, and that a Coalition Ministry would be of the greatest value in the interests of the colony. He also expressed the conviction that nine-tenths of the colony was free trade at heart, and that a giaduated system of taxation should be adopted. He thought the proposal of the Government to use the North Island Trunk loan in purchase of native lands within a certain area was the best that could be adopted. He said the population of tho colony did not wish a dissolution, but a small proportion of politicians, and he urged that it was undesirable to have a new election until a new census was taken in 1891.

The Address-in-Reply was then read a second time, and Sir George Grey moved the amendment of which he had previously given notice calling upon the Governor to dissolve Parliament. On the third clause of tho address he expressed surprise at the assertion made by Mr Tanner that the people of tho colony did not desire a dissolution. The proposal he (Sir George Grey) brought forward had no reference to men, but to principles, and ho believed he had only done his duty by bringing his amendment forward. He did not think the Colonial Treasurer should be allowed to bring his Financial Statement into the Houee, and that he should ask the House for nothing but supplies to carry on until the new Parliament was formed. He also urged that from the moment this Parliament came to an end writs should be issued, and a new Parliament assemble with the least possible delay. Mr Moss seconded the amendment. He knew of only one real objection to be urged against the amendment, and that was that they would have two sessions instead of one, but that was not a question for the present Parliament to consider. Two parliaments could deal with the matter as they thought fit. As to the question of the cost, if that was of any weight, the responsibility would rest on the shoulders of the present Government. The amendment was put and negatived on division by 39 to 19. The division list was as follows : Ayes (19): Ballance, Feldwick, Fisher, Fitchett, Fitzherbert, Fraser, Goldie, Grey, Grimmond, Hutchison, Joyce, Lance, McKenzie (Waihemo), Moss, Reevee (R.l, Smith, Seddon, Steward, Walker. Noes (39): Allen, Anderson, Arthur, Beetham, Bruce, Buchanan, Cowan, Dodson, Fergus, Fisher, Fulton, Hall, Hamlin, Harkness, Hislop, Hobbs, Lawry, Macarthur, T. E. Mackenzie (Clutha), Marchant, McGregor, Mitchelson, Moat, Monk, Newman, O’Conor, Ormond, Peacock, G. F. Richardson (Mataura), Russell, Seymour, W. D. Stewart (Dunedin West), Taipua, Tanner, R. J. Thompson (Marsden),. T. Thompson (Auckland North), Valentine, Vearall, Withy. Pairs against the amendment: Hodgkinson, Scobie Mackenzie, Wilson, Menteath, Bryce, Atkinson, Izard, Ross, Rhodes. For: Cadman, Barron, W. P. Reeves, Kelly, Turnbull, Kerr, E. Richardson, Loughrey, Taiwhanga. The Address-in-Reply was then adopted and ordered to be presented in the usual manner. The House adjourned at 1.20 a.m.