SAN FRANCISCO MAIL SERVICE. The Service to be Renewed for Three Years.

Te Aroha News, Volume III, Issue 113, 1 August 1885, Page 3

SAN FRANCISCO MAIL SERVICE. The Service to be Renewed for Three Years.

The House' of Representatives went into committee to consider the following resolutions :—" that 'the Government be authorised to negotiate for a fresh mail service between Auckland and San Francisco for five year 3 at a cost not exceeding £30,000 per annum. The Postm&ster-General said that before moving " this resolution, he wished, to make, sbme remarks on it ■ He should notf have thought it necessary to do so, but "he understood there would be •some -joppoieition to' it.- Wellington and '^apie,r-«;,Jj#d\i ; pronounced against .the' con&nuftion of the seryj^e, and therefore p&ssflbly'* there ; ' would |>c some .opposition td'fthe- proposals (Hear, hear.) He deemed,* that; a' more successful op less ppstly service, could pc conceived.- He contendefl'thUtf the l service had 1 been' 1 a remarkable, success. -/As regarded- the 'number of passengers availing, theioaselVes.of jt, and as showing to the colony the latest labour* saving' machines ' invented; /a great many .useful inventions had been' 5 brought down from. America by means; of these steamers,but apart from the usefulness and efficiency of 'the Be'f vice' fhe cdst wt va* a m"er& bagatelle. The "cost of the service,- a tfter thecolony had recouped itself by postage, was really not

worth' considering. He admitted' that the 'Frisco service had been speoially useful to Aubklarid'and Taranaki, and referred to the enormous , progrqss^ Auokland was making That point worth considering/ In reference to this service Auckland was the last' port of call for the 'Frisco service,' and the average time during the last twelve months 'for the passage from the 'through pojct to London was 3ft days. 20 hours, ,and the average passage.between the last port of departure from New Zealand and .Plymouth by the direct service was' 39 days 6 hours. From London to Auckland- by the 'Frisco service the average was 38 days 13 hours, as against 42 days 18 hours from Plymouth tfo the first port of arrival here: »Thus in point of time the 'Frisco service was incomparably the better. Now as regarded the cost of the 'Frisco service. The net cost to the colony for the year ending 31st May- last was £3,300, and during the three months ended June last the colony absolutely made a profit of £765' upon the service'; while the net cost of the direct service for the five months amountelto£2,6l9. Hehad no wish to disparage the direct service, which he looked upon as of immense value, but he questioned' whether it was desirable if the 'Frisco Service were continued they should make it a fortnightly one. The Government had an ofier, frond SHaw, Savill and Albion Co,, te run a jortnightly service alternately with the direct service. - Even without the 'Frisco service he could -not as Post-master-General recommend such a course because it would lead to this : a much slower direct service than now existed, and a combination between the two companies. Correspondence had already passed between these two companies and the AgentGeneral showing they were much averse to the high rate of speed at which their steamers were running, Messrs Shaw, Savill being especially adverse to it. The direct service now gave a great deal of satisfaction »nd people were naturally delighted with it ; but if the 'Frisco service were out of the way he ventured to say that they would lapse into a slow service, and we would be thrown back on the Brindisi service, which in the past had been the most costly to- the colony and the most unsatisfactory. The present groove of the mail service was a satisfactory one, and in his opinion it would be a great pity to throw up a service that worked so well. As to the cost of the 'Frisco service, they were paying annually to the contractors £31,250, while the New South Wales Government were paying them £7,000 annually. He explained how this subsidy was received. Atter the !New South Wales Government had formally withdrawn from the contract he had prevented the contractors from carrying the New South Wales mails, and then New South Wales agreed to pay us £7,000 ; this colony also getting the postages from other j colonies which had previously been divided between N.Z. and N.S.W. New Zealand was now actually making a profit out of the service. He had not much faith of getting a subsidy from the United State 3. If New | Zealand got anything it would bo very trifling. It was quite likely that the next ! contract would not fall into American hands. There wa3 an excellent service from 'Frisco to Honolulu, and the remainder might be tendered for by the Union Co., Shaw, SavilJ, or the N.Z. Shipping Co. He felt certain that no service like the 'Frisco service could suit so well the wants of the colony. If the misfortune of war overtook Britain, this service would be of immense advantage to N.Z. and the Australian Colonies. They would be doing the colony 'a 'great injury if they took the retrograde step of dispensing with the service, which had been highly successful as a mail eervice. Mr Levestam moved that the whole question of mail service be deferred to a Select Committee, to report in a weok, and to consist of Mes3ra Ballance, Atkinson, Conolly, Fisher, Peacock, and othors. The Chairman refused to accept the amendment, as irregular. Mr Sutton strongly opposed the 'Frisco service, on the ground that it was solely for the benefit of Auckland. While in America, he had been told by on American gentleman that if New Zealand stopped the sorvice, America would take it up. America was bound to maintain a mail service with Honolulu, one third of the distance. Ho then moved an amendment of which he had given previous notice, as follows :—": — " That the figures and words •' £30,000 " be struck out with a view of inserting the following :— " The Postmaster. General will pay the contracting party at the following rates : Letters, 12s per lb. ; packets, Is per Ib. ; newspapers, 6d per lb. Mr Holmes spoke against the motion, and thought that the whole matter should have gone to a committee. Mr Macandrkw did not believe in the principle of colonial subsidies, and suggested that a smaller sum would be sufficient. He argued that JSiew Zealand should [be the terminus of the line. He denied that with him it was a question of local feeling; but, was it worth the money? The Southern portion of the colony were paying for that which they received no value for. The direct service was the best for the colony, and if they could afford any money for subsidy they could spend it on that. He supported the referring of the matter to committee. A little bird bad whispered to him that this matter had j some connection with the East and West I Coast Railway. (Mr Hurst and others: It looks like it.) Major Atkinson hoped 1 the House would not consent to report progress. The House was in possession of sufficient information to dispose of the question at once. He deprecated the calling for a committee for the purpose of delay. The present proposal of the Government being to make New Zealand the last port of Call, the objections of the hon. member for Port Chalmers must disappear. He chaffingly accused Mr Macandrew of considering that Otago was New Zealand. The £30,000 subsidy would be recouped by postage. If the PostmasterGeneral's proposal were adopted, not only would New Zealand be the last port of departure, but the service would also result in an actual gain. Mr Moss said he had heard it rumoured with great regret that the Auckland members had made certain arrangements regarding the matter, and had held caucuses. This was perfectly untrue. He objected to the matter being treated merely as an Auckland matter. If this colony did not keep the service up, New South Wales would, and this would mean a very serious matter to the colony. Mr Downie Stewart looked on the question purely as one of economy and retrenchment. Economy was a matter of first importance >in the colony, and every pound goirg out of the "colony in an unnecessary Way should be stopped. There was> -'tendency on the part] of commercial men to avail themselves of the direct service, and this would soon be shown by diminished receipts from the ' San Francisco service. Several Chambers of Commerce had protested against the ' service,' I and the Treasurer should pay due attention to the wishes of' these disinterested bodies. America received more benefit fromttiis service than we did, and New Zealand got very -few corresponding advantaged;' He thought 4,hat i with a small Subsidy' or none* at 'all, 3 there was sufficient enterprise to maintain

a service. Me Btated that the colony was being pushed ahead at a high pressure, the colony would progress as- well' as everif hot. a single sixpence was voted. ! Mr Httbst, after taking oredit to himself as* being "a champion of- retrenchment, accused Captain Sutter of being illogical. JEIe stated positively that he believed there Was 'a compact between the" two direct steam, captains. He accused Mr Macandfew of ingratitude, as the Auckland member's last year had voted for the 'direct service.'" There had been' no log-rolling on the part 'of Auckland— not an Auckland member had been to the ' Government on the matter, , " Perish San Francisco rather than I should do anything contrary to the credit of a member of the House." He accused,Mr Holmes of desiring to postpone the San Francisco matter till the East and West Coast Railway was before- tbe'Hbusei He mentioned that probably two-thirds of the mail matter now went by San Francisco, (Sir J. Vogel : Five-fourths.) If the subsidy were refused, it would be taken up by New South Wales or the P. .apd 0. service with connection of New Zealand amongst the islands which would be quite as costly as the subsidy. ' . Mr Stout said the colony would demand 'something more if the San Francisco service, was dropped. He thought that the colony gained by, the San Francisco service, through the tourist ; traffic, which would be the means of distributing hundreds of thousands of pounds throughout the colony. Auckland was the centre of the tourist traffic, and now the railway was being made from there to the Hot Lakes. In considering the queation of mail service, they could not leave out the wealthy districts of the north of the colony, and if they abolished the San Francisco service, if would cost them as much to supply the wants of the North. { Mr Huksthouse admitted that the service had been a great success as a mail service, but called it a commercial failure. The direct steamers must be maintained, and if any subsidy should be given it should be given to them. He Bpoke up to the adjournment at 5.30. On the House resuming, the Minister fok Mines delivered his statement, and the House resumed in Committee to consider the San Francisco mail service subsidy. Mr Pyke stated that but slight advantages accrued from the San Francisco service, and the subsidy could be much more beneficially expended in encouraging the direct service. (Hear.) It was of vast importance tp this colony, and itopenedupcommunication with Brazil, and other parts of EastGoastof South America, which promised to furnish a very large market for every possible export in after years. As to the San Francisco service, no inducement was offered us. America was so built up with the wall of Protection that she would take nothing from thi3 colony. She would not admit wool or corn except under heavy duties, and sent nothing in the shape of exports except tinned salmon, a few brooms, and bananas from the Sandwich Islands. (Laughter.) That was about the extent of the imports to this colony from the United States of America. New South Wales refused to be longer a party to the mail service, if he were rightly informed, and the Government of the United .States had been in vain invited to assist in subsidising the San Francisco service. He proposed to submit an amendment which should meet with universal support. It was as follows : — " That after the words £30,000 per annum, there be added, conditional on the Government of the United States of America contributing •. ' not less • th«an one-third (or £10,000) to the obst." He should putHhafc amendment to the House, and press it to division. Mr Levestam again moved, " That the Chairman report progress, and ask leave to sitagain." (Several hon. members: '"No.") 1 His object was that the matter might be referred to a select committee. He should be sorry to see the San Francisco mail service lost, because he considered it very beneficial to the country, Sir George Grey said that the House should carefully considei thisquestion, which was of the utmost importance to the colony. He was satisfied that the use of the San Francisco mail service would increase, and that the increase of letters must continue, by which the Government would soon get a considerable surplus from postages. Then the number of tourists coming from the United States would grow larger, and they would certainly visit the Lakes, and inspect the beautiful scenery of the South Island. He appealed to those hpn. members who desired to see this country advance, and to gee their young people have their intellects developed by being brought into contact with men of the highest capacity from Europe (who under other circumstances they would possibly not see), to continue this service for another three years. The greatest loss from such a continuance would be £S,OOO or £9,000, but he believed that at the end of three years there would be a clear profit of many thousands of pounds. He asked was it worth while, for the sake of ! a trifling saving, to abandon the advantages ■ such as must accrue from this service. Mr Peacock invited members to support the Colonial Treasurer's resolution on the broad general ground that it was in the interests of the colony as a whole. The San Francisco service could be accelerated in point of time, and before long there would be a thirty days' service by that route. Under the proposed resolution Auckland would be the terminus of the service, and money hitherto spent in New South Wales would be spent in this colony. Mr Holmes thought that it was quite touching to find the Colonial Treasurer and hon. meoiber for Auckland City East in accord on one subject. The Colonial Treasurer was endeavouring to protect what he (the speaker) was told was his bantling, and Sir George Grey was endeavouring to do what he could for his darling city ot Auckland, and in their efforts both gentlemen had distinguished themselves for their fanciful and vivid imagination. Mr Holmes made a violent attack on the service, which he said would only bring the colony a few globe trotters, like Proctor, Froude, and Anthony Trollope. They did not want these men brought to the colony at an expense of £30,000 a year, while they had ( such men as Sir Julius Vogel and Sir Geo. Grey. He called the service "the darling bantling of the Colonial Treasurer." Mr Turnbull, while supporting the reporting of progress, urged the granting of the subsidy, saying that it was quite probable tho" direct service might fail, and where would they be then, if they had not the San Francisco service. When the real issue came before the House, he would support the granting ,of a subsidy. Sir Julius Vogel hoped that neither amendment would be adopted, and urged the immediate passing of his J motion, as it would take some time to complete negotiations, and the present contract had nearly expired. ' ' Mr O'Callaghan opposed the proposal for th,e .continuance of the service, as did Mr Buchahanj who pointed out i the large number ( of persons who " travelled to and from the colony by the direct service, compared with the San Frap- . Cisco 'route.. These direct^, , ej^afioiers^ j would also be . of,, immense , service^ in 1 case of the 1 resumption of nominated J immigration. Then a<3 to cargo^ he foiirici

3 that • while' - the< r&un ' Jffranci'sco -steamers"' , averaged 100 tons a Month, the'direct boats •• conveyed «&t teaats 40 times tbat qiikniiiy, -,-' f Capt. Russell advocated the continuance' : of the,'Sah Francisco service as a ; matter- of necessity in the eve»t,pf war with Russia. He had. it on exc'eljeni. authority that Mr Haslem had purchased 'Bell 1 and Colmans -patent " rights,? and.;tljafe"the.'Shaw''Savill Company and > the" Kofi- Zealand; ; Company were already negotiating with Mr Haslem for the sole rightftp'iuse his 4 freezing machines. ' . People who would 'do that would raise the rates on frozen meats, and once they got the power into their bands would no doubt increase postage charges. Mr Hurst said that he knew positively that suggestions for the combination of the two direct companies to "raise prices Had actually been niade. ' > ' Mr Fisher strongly 'opposed the continuance of the San Franciso service. The reason that it was not placed on a commercial footing was that it' was a commercial failure. Mr Guinness would support the motion for adjournment, with ' a view of the committee reporting as to the w,ay in which the service should be continued, He pointed out that through Sydney being the final port of .departure- the? fares were actually lower from San Francisco to Sydney than to Auckland, The Committee also considered the advisability of the steamers touching at the islands in place of at Honolulu. The balance ot opinion seeme<jL to be that it was absolutely necessary to' maintain the service, but it was desirable to Have fuller informa- | tion than they had at present before deciding as to the mode, terms, and conditions in which that contract; should be maintained in! future. ' Mr Montgomery said that if the member for Fort Chalmers had displayed local feeling in regard to, this question, that position was forced on him, by a remark of the Colonial Treasurer. He favoured the payment of something. out of the consolidated revenue towards the continuance of the San Francisco service, because it would be a misfortune to the colony if it were discontinued; that service done away with, would leave us at the mercy of those people who were at present contractors for the direct service. He hoped a greater rate of speed, would be maintained. He thought a 3 years service subsidised by a vote of £25,000 a year would be sufficient. He did not mean to say that the San Francisco service would be of most benefit to the colony, but he recognised that the North Island would be advantageously • served by it, and he thought ix> was their duty to consider New Zealand as a whole. For these reasons he hoped proposal to report progress would be negatived. Dr. Newman said that the New Zealand Shipping Company had already gained bonuses of £3,200, and the Shaw, Savill Company were going at as great a speed, He thought they had no bonus as the speed of steamers was increasing. They should not bind themselves for five years. Mr Hatch said he would support Capt. Sutter's amendment, or that moved by Mr Pyke. Mr Beetham said he would vote for a reduction of the subsidy to £20,000, and a reduction to three years. He suggested that in future New Zealand should be the terminus of the route, and would vote for a larger subsidy if it was necessary. He thought that the offer of Shaw, Savill and Company with the New Zealand Company for a fortnightly service should be carefully considered- If this were adopted, in the event of the San Francisco service failing the North Island would not be left out in the cold. Mr Barron supported the Treasurers motion, but thought that pressure should be brought to bear on America and New South' Wales to contribute. The San Francisco service would be a wise check on the direct service. If the postage was reduced to threepence— one penny for the ship, one penny for the colony, and one penny for Britain — he believed that the amount of correspondence would be increased. The amendment to report > progress was put, and division resulted : Ayes, 16 ; noes, 53. The amendment was Lost. Mr Montgomery moved that the words " five years " be altered to " three years," which the Treasure assented to, and it was carried on the voices. Mr Smith feared that immediately the San Francisco service was done away with, the direct service would draw back to 45 days. There had been objections on the East Coast of the delay in which the San Francisco mails had been delivered at Gisborne and Napier- He believed in one direct service and one by San Francisco. Mr Kerr would be sorry to see thegervice abolished, but asserted that they took advantage over persons who shipped goods by the steamers. He did not like the Yankees, and believed if there was a monopoly the direct steamers would fasten on us as bad as the Yankees. Mr Barron suggested that Captain Sutter should amend his resolution so that there should be payment by results. The House divided on the question that the figures £30,000 stand part of this question — Ayes, 43 ; noes, 31. Mr Fyke's amendment was then put with the following result :— Ayes, 24 ; noes, 50. Mr Seddon gave notice of a further amendment, "That before the contract is j made the Government communicate with , American Government at San Francisco, ! asking if they will contribute for the j service." Mr Richardson then pressed an addition of this amendment to the end of the resolution, Cl That the same be called by public tender." Mr Holmes recorded his protest. He protested against what had been done. The I San Francisco service had been placed on a pedestal above the direct service. Mr Downie Stewart also lodged his protest. The question of reporting progress was disposed of on the voices, and the House agreed to refuse the addition of the words, " That the same be called by public tender," also without division. Sir Julius Vogel trusted Mr Seddon would not push his amendment, as the American Government had unremittingly refused a subsidy. , Mr Seddon withdrew his amendment, but protested against what the Government had done. Mr Fulton said it was not necesssary for every member to get up and protest. The resolution as amended was then put and passed without division. ,The House resumed, and it was decided to consider the resolution on Friday, the 3lßt. The following is the division/list on Captain .Sutter's amendment to substitute a letter rate instead of * lump sum subsidy :—: — Against the- amendment, 43". Atkinson, Ballarice,' Bruce; Barron, Cadmari, Beetham, Beyan, JDargaville, ' i Fraser, -Grey, Hakuene, Harper,' Hirst, Hobbs, W., J. Hurst, Joyce, Kerr, -Lake, Xauqe,, Larnach, Levestam, < Lock^, J. MoKenzie, ' Mitchelson, Moaly Mdhtgomery, Moss, O'Rorke, Peacock, < Pfatt/ E, J Richardson, Russell,'- Seddon, Samuel, 1 Smith, J Stout, T. .Th'oiripson,-Tole, Turnbull, Vogel;- Walker, J. B.;Whyte, Wil- < son. Forthe.amendment, 31 : Allright, Brad-,«haigh-Bradßliaw, Buchanan, J. C, Buckland .(CohoUy, Qowah, Dunc&nV'Fergus,*' Fisher - [jfulton; Gore, Guinness: fHatcH^Hislo'p^J Hursthouse, 'Ivess, •JbhnsTOb^'Ml-J. <M&T-*-

Kenzie, Menteith, Newman, O'Caiiaghan, Pearson, Pyke, G. F. Richardson, Rolleston, Ross, W. D. Stewart, Sutter, G. W. Thomson, Trimble, W. White. The House rose at 1 a.m.