DEBATE ON THE ADDRESS.

Southland Times, Volume I, Issue 84, 20 December 1864, Page 3

DEBATE ON THE ADDRESS.

.i (Fromthe 'WeVixngtoTt Independent.) Our previous summary of Parliamentary iv- ' telligcnce brought tlie news ■up to the adjournment of the debate in -reply, to. his Excellency's speech, on Monday, the 28th ult. It' was re- v fiiuned on the following day by Mr.' "Weld,; wlib made a statement of the Ministerial pbHoy. After referring to the reasons which had caused the Assembly to be called, tbgetheiv he • stated that in the event of'any difference^of/ opinion- 'arising be-; tureen his ExeeUehey^.aiidPthe on^ any material point, itrwas the intention of himself arid colleagues to resign at -'once. As long as the Ungh^h Government; were .sustaining-' this :coldny • -with large; supplies ■of men so" long" they would demand—^nd they 'had aright- to demand^—to liave a roice in the' management- of the country. But the colony ;also had v right to offer" its protest against any thing that; there were valid reasons for' objecting to. If/ men were to be found.who. would persist in sustaining ;tlie interests of the people and of the cpuntiy^ no; Governor would be strong enough to stand longhi' their way. 1 "The resignation of a; ministry" was a "tremendous check fcohis power,! and if they persisted hi resigning' when they could not conscientiously agree with the Grovernor, it"must end in the -people gaming ' their ends. Iri reference to tlio New-i Zealarid: Settlements-Apt/he .h a( j tnpt time to go fully over the correspondence on this subject, and he was. not therefore prepared to say" Avheth'er there was any difference in the way •which he and his collea" gues intended to carry out this Act/and the way ithad been intended to/be carried but by the hon., gentlemen opposite Trfioliad lately resigned. Tlie. land should not he confiscated in; different direc-\ tions all over the.,country^-in such a.manner that the settlers would be incapable of Whelping and protecting each other in.; any w.ay; ■ They should recommend; his. Excellency to .put; this: Act.rin operation at once.:. If there was• any ■ difference, with him on; this ppint,; there Tvas only one way, for them (the Ministry) to act! ? His predecessors had;put aj.stop to: the; introduction-' q£ military: settlers, and/had that not-been the case, he him-, self^oiiid have done so. ;He thought acomplete disarmament of the ; natives was impossible, though' he, could, understand that natives ■ were defeated,; their anns should be required of them as a token of submission, but the idea of disarming all the natives of New Zealand was'simply preposterous.' To come to another important paragraph of the address—the reinstatement of Taranaki, and the construction of roads through the rebel districts, 'he' remarked tliat his opinion on these subjects were well known. The state of the Province of Taranaki was a disgrace not only, to ; this"colony, but to the British possessions. .They proposed,to advise his Excellency to have this matter settled as soon as possible ; he did not wish to take the credit of doing this to himself, for he knew that such had been the intention of his predecessors. ■ The great secret in his opinion to quiet this district was to make roads through it in all directions^ He would tell the natives that they should have roads all over the country. It-was not necessary that these should be completed in a day, but they 1 should gradually be pushed to every'part of* the island. They had the right and the power-to' make them. If the natives offered resistance to their doing 1 so, force should be met with force, 1 but should the., natives show a disposition, to work,' the same encouragement should be given to them as to the English Jaborer.. Koads should, be forthwith commenced between Taranaki and Wanganui. It would be the place of the Province through which, these"roadsrpassed to pay for the expense incurred' in making them, but if-the roads were opposed by the natives, the lands which would be taken possession of '.when they -were' finished would prevent these expenses' from being heavy. The question.of whether the Colony should nowdepend on its own resources for its incernal defence, was so .important; that it should Jbe debatad, by itself. He had given notice of some resolutions that day, and a3 the discussion would come on aboufeit separately, on Wednesday, the members

would then hare an opportunity of stating _, their different opinions;^. The ran thus :— " We thank Your Excellency for the promptitude iwith which you propose to carry; ont the recommendation of Corninissipners appointed under res.olutions.jpf both Houses of the Legislature by atonce removing, the seat of Government' to Wellington." Now this is a question, which had been fully debated last - session. His opinion was that in carrying *oufc : iliis nJatfor' they were simply carrying out fhecxpressed wishes of- both -Houses." • He woiiid erifer'intd 'odo" argument upon the matter. ; His' hon. jifriejid ; (Mr. O'Neill) had^ complained that Auckland was hot represented in .the present Ministry;, "but .he would; appeal to the House, and to his hon.. friend, cp^d he ask an Auckland' r member to ■ join 'a ! Ministry ; - one" of Whose first actions "would be to- remove, the seat, of Government from Auckland" to the South. (A Voice;:- .Yes): : 'I Some horii -'member 7 had.lsuid "Yes." Of course he; didnot deny ;thatrhe might have asked but he would have been refused. He could have called/ spirits from the vasty deep;" but then there was no use in his doing ; so, .for the spirits would not come for, his calling. -Under the circumstances he should- not. have; felt .' justi-? fied in asking' any'- -Auckland 'member to stultify himself so , far- with his .^constituency, .as : to-, have taken part in the present Ministry. The political interests of the colony imperitively demand "the removal of the seat of Government. In a short time the Auckland men would [boast as the Canterbury men "now did of their internal resources and -of their independence of extraneous aid. i He hpped no one would think that he was in liny way actuated against Auckland? hel would -prove when the ! seat, of ..Government (fwas I'<1 '< removed; that \ interests of ,, .the; i^proyince. were : . as .well 'looked after at a distance as they were at home. When. >tlus -question, was once: and ..for ever settled, this, .splendid t .prpviuce\ would .again resume tiie'pi'o'ud' position' that she -had always heldin'this colony, and. be properly represented in ;the^hn»try^ -Then to pass to the next paragraph, which was, "It will be our duty and our object to uphold" the credit of the colony in -respect to the , contract .entered • into : j)y> an accredited agent* of" tlie 'colony with ah "English company -ibiv the 'es tablislimeri t'o'f "a ' postal /ser, vice by way, of^anama.';' .Her. stated,, on this "subject, that; it iWasthis-iritehtion .to -ibring down a bill, so as £o .enable^members ]to ■; express their /opinions'; rfully. It would Be open. to the members to. make what suggestions.tKeyi thought fit.' f He iconsidered that under the contract thgyihad : ,svieh .power, of .putting pressure on the. jjpnrpany that they certainly intended to remove skme obnoxious propositions,?. The. matter- conld,"^^ ]in detail when the bill' was i brought, down. r . lt was considered ' of the utmost importance to >maint"ain; the scryiceV-between Australia- and .jN,e,w ; . '•Zealand. As to the loan, it appeared to him impossible that they could accept it. They should state - t xtp •{ the • Home ~,Go vernmmt that they were .obliged to' refu'se.tliis lban % 6n tjieir .terms', ; as they could not accept it'mtli honor, ''_' They liad to pay a due regard to the interest of the public creditors.; Such a line would ; raise them v in. the opinion of the JffonSe .Government; ','? It' was not 1 intended to renew t^.e '.Suppression... pf .Rebellion Act .when it i expired^ an" Act.w|iichjhe ithought.wasfraught with horror. As 'to theMengtli 'of ' thWessibUj this wo uld rest with the_ House. If a number of private bills rvrere to be erery day crowded oriithenotice paper, he would filairn, as other. Ministers had dons, an adjournment, for spine time. If, however, 'they were determined tb^have a short session, he could promise, with' their 'assistance,' to get-the •Government-business over ■thcir-heads in about a fortnight ; his Excellency could then be asked to convene , another session, say in the month of May nest. They could not expect a short- session -if-members went -on as - tliey-iwere doing at the present time. Mr. Weld concluded by saying-: "When -we consider, andgnip.asure what we have to do, and then loot at our eapa- . city for doing it, we see difficulties which would almost, maks better men turn away disheartened. But if, after our "hard toning, we should fall, it will be seen that we toiled and full in the interests 'of tlie country."' " (jLoud /rheers). The Speaker put "the resolution; which was agreed to. . Mr. WeldVould move that a committee be appointed with instructions to prepare an humble address to His Excellency, the Governor, such committee to ' consist of Messrs. iPitzhcfbert, Atkinson, Richardson, Wayne, and Walker. He would propose that the House adjourn for half-an-liour, to enable the committee to prepare a report., -r . j >„..... , . - . • The House 1 then' adjourned for- half an hour. . Mr. Fitzherbert brought up the report to the address. The.Speaker moved that the address as reported be. read a second time. It would be competent for the Council to move an amendment as each paragraph was read, V • ' r ' '. ■ The Clerk then read the seventh paragraph of the address, referring to the removal of the seat of Government. Mr. John Williamson, in a ; lengthy speech, moved the following amendment in reference to the paragraph about the removal of the seat of Government: — _..... ." We beg that your Ercellency will not take any action upon the report of the Commissioners appointed to inquire, as to the most eligible - place in Cook's Straits for the seat' of Government, until provision has first been made for constituting tlie Province of Auckland into a separate colony, to be ruled by a Governor appointed oy Her Majesty and a Legislature to be chosen by the inhabitants inereof." -. . . , ■- ■ Mr. O'B.our'ke 'seconded it. Mr. Colenso briefly spoke in its support. Mr. Fitzherbert said if one question in NewZealand -might ■ be considered" settled, tliat question was the one, and he considered that the leader of the Government, had acted very discreetly, in declining to provoke any discussion. He was confirmed in his opinion by the extreme meagreness of the arguments adduced in support .of ;the amendment. What were the arguments used? Simply to a3k for. more time, winch was, in. fact granting that 1 the question had been settled. As a member of the Government he did that the transfer of the seat of Government to^tlie centralflocality of? Wellington would be advantageous. * The" formation of* a' Ministry would be mere easy, a more wholesome state of affairs would take place, and North and South .would be better satisfied. : He was: sure that every word used by the head of the Government : was dictated by the finest sense of the interests of the province of Auckland.' "The action of the Government was not.to be considered a vindictive 'one against the people of Auckland. It was con•templated on the part of the Government that a Lieutenant-Governor should be appointed for the province pfAuckland. The debate was continued by Messrs. Carlcton, Fitz Gerald, Gillies; J Wcld, Yogel, Graham, Crafort Wilson, and Mr. Reader wood, at the close of which jtho Speaker put Mr. Williamson's amendment 'and declared it negatived. A division was called for and taken with the following result: — Question. — "That the words proposed 1 to be omitted stand part of the question. Ayes, 29. — Atkinson, Bell, Brandon, Brown, ;Cox. Domett,' Eyes, FitzGerald, Fitzherbert, Fox, 'Jollic, Mantle, Patterson, Reynolds, ■ Rhodes, Richardson, A. Richmond, J. O. Richmond, W. Taylor, Thomson, Yogel, Walker, Ward, Wayne, Weld, Wells, Wilkin, Wilson, I. E. Featherston, teller. Noes, 17. — Brpdie, Butler, Carleton, Colenso, G. Graham, R. Graham, Col. Haiiltain, "Mason, Mcnroe, O'Neill, O'Rorkc,- Russell, Stafford, C. Taylor, Jas. Williamson, Wood. John* Williamson, teller. x--PANAMA EOTTTE. On the following clause' being put : — <■ " It will be our duty and our object to uphold the credit of the colony in -respect to the contract entered into by an accredited agent of the colony with an English company - for the establishment of a Postal Service by way of Panama." Mr. Richmond proposed as an amendment, " That, this clause should receive the.considerajfcion of the House." Mr. Weld said they intended to bring down a bill on the subject, and ho would therefore offer no objection to that amendment. ,

Mr. Crosbie Ward saul that lie had intended to take this matter up himself if it 'had not been taken up by the Government. He thought no modification could be made, and he himself thought them necessary, unless : the' ■ matter 'wer'd'" referred to a select committee. -'."••'■ Mr. Yogel thought this question was one which should not bo mixed; If that contract is not binding, and this colony's credit was damaged, he thought that the Colony owed that gentleman y,ery : little gratitude who entered into the; con-, tract; That lion, member went outside the Panama Act altogether.. He thought that he could take upon himself, under -instructions he had received to promise a monopoly of steam service, and a.ne w inter-p.rovincial.line , of steamers^ ' Had ' counsel ' been consulted on tliese'matters, he would have found that the opinion would " have; Been decidedly unfavorable. r He (Mr^ i vVogel) thought tl\e House should not take upon itself his (Mr. Crosbie Ward's) liabilities. :.. The amendment was carried. The remaining clauses were, then gassed, as they > stood hi tlie addressj i- ■ J H i] ] ':■ v! / : r' ' Mr. f FiTziiERBEBT moved that the address /which had been passed should be presented to His . Excellency. ( .) :>,.::■ ;, : . ,■.:, '...:• ■'.-,-. „:-'•,'-., .•■ ;^i ;■:■:';'; , . THE ADDBESS. ■ " On the following day the Speaker left the cliair at five minutes to one, and proceeded to Govern- , ihent House to present 'the address* to His Excellency. The Speaker returned at fifteen_mmutes . past one o'clock, and resumed ■ his 'seat.: : ' lie stated had the honor of waiting upon His Excel- : leney .the,- Q-qvernor, ..'• acepmpanied. by, a ;i large, number of the ' members' of the '- Housej and reported the address in reply to his Excellency's speech. His Excellency was pleaaed to return the following ] - L"['.;G'!iNSwEß :■'"■:';'--■ i. J" /■.-•!-'/ '' Mr. Speaker, " GrBNTLEMEK OP ' THE HOtTSB OP REPRESEN■.I \ ■' TATIVB3, "I receive with satisfaction your loyal address, -I have every hope' "that .yourl deliberations wili pronidte th"c welfare of New Zealand ) "and it will always be my earnest desire to co-operate eor--dially with you. -■:■,-.- : ■-■■ . , , .-,-, -, T : (Signed) - ' -«G-.aiffiY. -v ".'<■" G-overnment House, v ; .^'Auckland, 29th Nov., 186 i." S . '•-, 6n Tue3day,.'the'29th>inst;,;an;addre.ss in reply I to > his Excellency's speech, was moved in the Legislative Council by the Hon. Mr. Sewell, and carried. The terms of the~address, as well as of the mover's soeech, were nearly similar to those carried in the* Lower House. FINANCIAi CONDITION, OP THE ,CPJ,Ojrr. , - ,-Mr. Fitz- 'Gerald inoved-^" That -"a Select J Com- ; mittee be appomted- to inquire into and report to the House, on the .present financial condition- ; and- that such committee consist of Mi\ Carlotou, Dr. jFeatherston, Mr.-. J. . G. Richmond, Mr. Crosbie "Ward, and Mr. Dillon Bell; the committee to have the power to examine on oath, and to call for persons and.papers." r., , , , „- ■ - A long'debite ensued, and ultimately the motion was withdrawn. ; GOVERNMENT BUILDING-, FOB AUCKLAND. .Major Eiohardson's motion — " J?or a bill to : authorise the acquisition of land in Wellington, for 'G-overnin'ent house,' offices, &,c:," ' wad read the first time, ordered to bo. printed, and read a second tune on Friday next. SUSPENSION OF THE NBW PEOVINCR3 ACT. r Mr. Keynolds moved — " For leave to introduce .. .A.bill to suspend the operation of the New Provinces Act until the end of the next session of the Assembly." The motion was put and carried. ...-. The bill was read, ordered to.be printed, and the 1 second reading made an order of the day for Monday next. '; BE3X' ; ONSIIBII.tTT IN NATIVE AFFAIB3. Mr. Weld said — I rise in accordance with previous notice of motion, to move the following resolutions : — " That the joint responsibility of Governor and Ministers in the management of native affairs has resulted in divided counsels, and in a vacillating policy, which has been productive of great evil to both races of Her Majesty's subjects in this colony, while it lias entailed heavy and unnecessary expenditure both upon Great Britain and on New Zevii-.wid. " That this Houso, recognising the right of the Some Government to insist upon the maintenance of this system of double Government so long a3 the Colony is receiving the aid of British troops . for the suppression of internal disturbances, accepts the alternative, and requests the Home Government to withdraw the whole of its land force from the Colony, and to issue such instructions to his Excellency the Governor as may enable him to be guided entirely by the recommendations of his constitutional advisers in native as well as hi ■ ordinary affairs, excepting upon such matters as may directly concern Imperial interests and the prerogatives , of the Crown. " That this House takes this occasion of expressing its loyalty and devotion to the, Crown/ its deep gratitude for the generous assistance rendered by the mother country to this colony, and its cordial appreciation of the gallant services perfox-med hy her Majesty's land and naval forces in New Zealand. " That these resolutions be embodied in an humble address to, His Excellency the Governor, requesting him to transmit to Her Majesty' Principal Secretary of State for the colonies." Along debate ensued, which was ultimately adjourned till Friday, the 2nd inst. : Similar resolutions. were proposed by Mr. Sewell in the Upper House, but were for the time withdrawn.