PROVINCIAL COUNCIL.

Southland Times, Volume I, Issue 25, 28 July 1864, Page 2

PROVINCIAL COUNCIL.

Mr, J^ABS6&%ought forward the Mowing memosi&l to Hi» Exo&Ueaoy tlw ":■ "*• ' » poj^a^rsepia^^ • I « Ist. That¥ &c Act Jntituisd 'Tho Southed , Assembly, it is provided, aaougat other th*ngt, that that Act; ' a^alltfot/ewae int<£o^B?*|lon \rntU Her Majefttytt-ple&sure liW^ts%sP*»n iliweon, and tHe fi&me aUjol^We|R ? :4<pKSe4 by i S;B» |Mftjosty,x "^^ tiho^W^f^P^firy vouffbiij and a psoclwatioii of iucb confiwaatioa hfttiagikan ;£**« abatf hove beetf l midß by tht ■fiwnmw* 1 ; :, , v^" '"'=■* .v s- a r «iad< !Hiiit4,t)i« Provincial' coumcu of Souta* lsmd ii st?ohgly of opinion that ttiat Act, if brought faqtto -operation,' 'will- prevent the said of iandi and^ vill taa finanoial difflquliliies'^aaer ' * Yrhioßttne* '-. pronawi il no^i^oxk^i{t r siM : €iiM> '■■':''/'. : . - * "' Brdr That t^idoj^al hiaa fjrtkswd; a;iWne* of rasolutions, of copy Is 'Heseto annexed. apoa-vWeh' : i»loiier^h^-:l^eTe,that.a,oonipl^"wa fetid? iKat^it 'itf' prdpdsoa to submit ■■..to tte-General Asßembly, -at- its-eariieat ' ! meeting, a bill framed in accordance _mth these ! *esolsiphsa t£ 'K. "f XI ■ ■; H 0 U. "4th. Thatthis Oouncilia stronglyimpressed -with ,^her. jundeßirableneßS change^,^ the law relatuig to 'the salei' letting, Jad^diefppsaV;©! tho wasterlandsr of Ac 'Grofn 5 aria.|it|ne^gwith alarm* the special'evils which TPiU"*a^e^©om-'even, a temporary ,operati6n ; ,o£.f The; Southland Waste Lands Act 1&63 V' 'anCtherefore pray that ypur fExeeUency .^ fith*e Tfproclamation' confirming that Act, until the view's of the General Assembly can. be taken,, upon the Budject." or V^^f^^^[ *r&;y* ;'-.' > ' \^^if^E^y^^^^Si&S^i3^S& eaid the ; memorial: cbntfLUied, in .clear land ..intelligent i language, the^pbiiiiqns giyen the other night on the Bubiectiof r th;e;^asteTMn^^ more clause "shpuld^be padded,' however,, and that i was, that thie Douneilr entreat Sir Greorge Grey to exert iHs>mfluence withH 1 prevent tlie'pa»smgj of f jifceh^c^as pa"sslgd*by the House of Bepresenta^vts/ seeing 'iSaat it would be detrimental to the -best -interests ef tke ProTince. Mr.^PE.ABSQBT. could, not se^ .^hat, ,ther ; a was any Section io/inoVirig $he adopfiqn.pf tHe'membml &s < ipßtoWdr i 'Hedid%dt^ tional clause woold-Se-of much use, nor was it scarcely necessary, as^ffi? .ExceUency has^already been^in^rmea'^f 3 the J views amd^feelMgsvof the Council on,&e subject: If th^Hq^fwißhed the -clauSe tput' ; m/^he^oiM^vit^p^s^ota^for the adoption of the-mempnal for^ the present. The SPEAKER.— Dp, you move the adoption ofthemeiriorMFXr- " ; t ,-«^^ ,'■ Mr. PEASSOK-^Well. yes*! dp. . .-■.. „,? / > -'-M^' : A^]^^ONa- J 'iefconde'd- the, addptidri of the memorial. ' \ jT^^.Mr. WII^ON f was' r pf r the idme opinion as Mr. Pearson on the subject of the proposed clause ypraying -for 'Sir : if ..the^GouncEr thinks^ it ,^ould?;ma^ doubly sure by^ again referring Itp it, he 1 'would support the, amendment, of, jthe, jmemprial to that .extent. - rr-d ,«(•(■.„,. ii:,..,,.,,,.-..! ■ )lio Mr:'CA^DEß;Kavmg^ addressed a few worda to -the House in Bupportof the membrialf— -^-"^* Mr. BOG-EES wished to know wkose memorial torjwhoiprepof ecbit P^Might hecaskj tp(>ee the Signatures? • ■„n , -.- #> .-.,.'•■■-' , • The SPEAXEE. iJ -it' isla memorial of thr Council itself. __^,- - ' \y Mr. PEA\RSON.— It is merely a^ draft copy of tie afembria¥anaiSSsignedlJ [^*1&&:ij&%;...y , Mr. BOGrERS.^I imderstood that it was to be a memorial got up by' a~Commißsion? Mr. PEARSON" .rose jto, read from the^resoluWns the * clause .tpuehingj on th%lprepar&tipn of the memorial. *~ r ' ,' '"'^ - J ,Mr. OBOGKBES 1 rose\to ordfe|Sejwouiajyttot have anything read unless it were in the minutes. The? .Clerfcf^eatiithe'i pPr^onn of othe minutes which passed the clause sanctioning- the p^reparalbndfto'mimoriaK $&■ ■** ■ b^mi^?. vi ' ' Mr. ROG-EES asked if.jthe^esplutionsititiemselves were engrossed in the minute Mooik. The PROVDfGIAD TREMTJ|IE|I.4-It is not necessary that W^he "transactions of^'tKe Council should be engrossed in the minute book. A re-ferenceois^mMe-lnr*t£eimin"tsies to all documente.. >not .engrossedrand these documents are initialed by the Speaker as relative thereto. . • - Mr. ROGERS^lpr^teit against any memorial prepared by. this House, unless it is sanctioned by the mimiteo themselves. '_i_ „ "" The" PROYINOIAX'TBEASIJRES ro«6 to set therhon. member f rights P (j^i^ 1v« v: - ■; y ' Seeing the-Speaker wa s getting impatient, Mr. R()G-ERS&gP:t/ up>agaiQ} v and appealed to him for patience. . . ... The SPEAKER -thought it was highly neceseary on hi^ part. . '„. ?I- v- '■ Cr.;Mr7^W[)^ON-ro r s'e:^'la;ssißt the' hon^memSer for .Oretipfyer his p.ons^sinqr^m.y 'j y >»,- Mr ROGERS' was more and more dissatisfied -ancLeiciteaJjKAK u^li >im"iA«'AT (The noise now was; very, unseemly.) . Mr. SPEAKER -called- ''the hon-. member to order, and told him h^.conductwa^al»omiEable ; ■and thal'if he di#npt^e|p quiet|he.^o r ul!igive him : in charge 'to r tKe "policeV' „ '/f |»H ; p2^;.?} r,r ]^sßiQG;Eß^>gam;^eV an^oppl^mepthat ''the'SpeakWs"^^ruhng"was very lSCr'sK'towartfi^Kiin, and that it seemed. to^him t that all the members as well as himself had' believed the • resolutions to be. recprdedrjmgthe o minutes. r ., i Jß[e, ..however, now wished .^ I t^'%»eai£, ;;very 'temperately. "^ He could, not, find the andhe Wund^thefcleftcould-not rfo" so either, 'so he-con-cluded that they were* not in at all. The SPEAKER 7 saidw(ve%ilogically) if they are not in. the minutes, of course they are not. 0 eMrji»ROG-ERS}i protested oagainßt7ithe:- Harsh ruling of the Houae; when : Mr. HARYEYrose, and saidhe wisK'eStio dohia share of the protesting. He protested against so much time of the^-House^.iging-^asted/, and; remarked that it' was" plain''£natf the lion. : member from flrsV Jto last, was; in .a.fog^bpu|_the resolutions, but ne must say-ihat"3ie-had ( been :r ßomewhat consistent as his voice had been the oialv one . raisea^aMsi-tneß*;^ - .>:to^a fiiv !oX baa &&.■ Mr. CALDER thought the matter had been !fuHyienough discussed, and it was not desirable thatany-moretime BhoTild.bewaßted.__The4uestion. was then put to the House and the adoption of the men>prialiwaß^asßente ( d3to7fwrhen,! ; : - against his name appearing tit the-foot of the memorial. The honrinember was informed, -that he nged not Idb^so unießs'h'e chcW^: .•^ il: '-| " : ' /sir^kX THE MOTISTEBIAI. DlfyipXJX^tfljfei-. ■ OMtT. P^ARSO]^* said ; that with the regular bjusiness before fc th^'House, lie -wislied. to --tiiat h.e_ liad- again. waited upon^ His Honor .the Superintendent ■?■ in consequence 1 'of the 5 ''TCsSlution^whlcH^liadbeen pasßed;the."previous,ey.ening m^ppuncil,^ andv,that he^haA informed L His Honor "of •■the "same'-t "After ! s¥m^^'Uttles oUs'cussion/^His^Hdn^ -that he;'^wouldyßubin^>>fnicmOTandum^^ which hßa^ordinglysoUd.LT^ ■cpn^ntßfqftit::~-yrhe gentlemen^^wHolarje-s^Ping to form : an Executive^ Ldeinaud thafe.,,the 4^*fe^ - cqptrol oi the G-oyernment should Be given ibver to the.Executif acceeded ■ to K a;radical change would^e efiectedm the;Goastitutibn of the ProTincial Government; • v In- sivp--17,,1864ir tpathe Council may be referred to, as piißMed mile Southland^ &a^fteo^24QrM^, *Noriir^here~the poin^ is conßiaereSr~aCplges ;^s3iJ4s4fand^sg:e Ti^'rein^smade^eihaye aotipeen controverted. thmks Ithat such an^erafi6n^ho.uldbe made tby legwlation. It is of a^^ dbamctejtstp-r.be concluded^aßsß

"^ w^tw^HxftoUwo * CMaMv'^»'hi6ft boi aooeßiarily biad'.-the' next'SUtttifmtendent, fta'an O*diaanod would. Judging frotq the oxpresaipna" ,Ifbf |u]a^intendpiitf ■ ri if^%^f^Uf|^Qbd 'to'"OT»frtf ' io ; 'clispoaso with an, .^xeo^ivfl 'D^ijnoJJ.,. -..guoh iPflig'idiw by the oobinoft of tho m^'p?ity v^ftt^#nwn^or^bi}tho^x«» -au R*attiß» in X#JUoK?legisiatiQtt^giwii'tH9m'a?ooaßutta' - - ■ ■ tid^-pQW«V'ftnd--h«-^|- q^Lf»;^S]ing'l«i ooniult wtli '* ' la'fty "poasbw auQifirlty to dobido withour .ißxjch qonjiiiltatioa. ; :20^U #$y,,;js^ u -nH r ■,«i \ri 1 i&V'HARTEY .M^Ead that tm« startUng do,<mi-. ja^nt dliQuld; jxrroad agaia.",=fiV' ! •: ' l ttadifem«ffk«| fttHher, '"' 'tM'it wai^niij?*^ awpapit^l&tion of his fowno*: jmompmda iubmittod to the HoubOi M& of the " " wStumoaW vrUiok they obatahed. Ho did not . tdvftirthw^iiouss matter -'with- Hifl Honor j but he had taken the, $ttttp»t\iajty ..te,-.«a0«t..-aie.-..geatl«aiiav^ho ha§; ftgwd'to aot-ia.the.Exocutit&rfftJTlW'SWSttlt v^> that th«y Rgrepd to adhors to thay? fopnier Jutioa, 'and a letter Jythioh t%* lioa. member roaS), „ ,^Mie?T6ate^edtp Sift Honp*, iioqviaitttingihimlof I tW ow'conaitibns' under iwnM; they, oould.^ ; W^ept; <)fflco, s »« yeply ? t% this ' "' note, c and, as we' may ■ pWiin^e ; Hi3 1^ list' »emorandum to, bo hi* Bn^l'tprmßi.Jt not *' ; - s :Uk'ely ; n'o ; Sh l ouia. j( "" ; Tliiiy*' < had'- ;^b^fVii;'iiliatthfcic; last note should be,a nnal,(>rieV'sb.that is^heVay : rest9;^ w sO Y ! *""■ > '- '"^^ \ " The PROVINCIAL. , TREASURER did.7 i}ot " • 'lai^^di»Mfiad s ,^'a|Baß^©wi- existing be-' % "tweSeii- -the ■ proposed J!iecuti ; ve 'and 'His'Hbnor j 0 4UM ;: he.tiiought'tfiey!were''Bo Blight-that- it # ito <.M-itft.:deplored thati.aniExe'eutiyei'had'not^ei'e this . been fßrn^d.;;Jl^onv.ithe^toemora^dum• of c ?His „H^nor,^t*»ppeai i ed- s £e •hia^sthat he was always . _.;'^jjgigfj^ tlie r '""*iSqOTly i ofrjt^V^^epTiST i a J inrail,inatterß of legis-, lation exfepci^ 1 Wconsultmg power.' ,_^-^jj-oj^y 1 : difference "Ke thougKt'existecrwas— that 1 ) the Superintendent rwap^-vyffing rto •. ; be^ guided on {^^mktters- on^which' the '•-Eiecutive Council could? legislate, whereas the Executive demanded absolute submission' by~His Honor in all things;-* ■ (Ifo I '^0 !) r WeU.|i I have done...j That is.how I " ! understand the matter. ' ' "'""" . t■< \ Mr. HARVEY now rose arid addressed' the House at great length,; but space.forbids^us giving but- a s very- brief ; epitome ! of hJB" : ' reriiarks. He attacked very strongly the Superintendent's state- ->' imerit-f-th'at' he-was always -willing to be : guidedby the »dvice of bis^Qouiicil,>; If fhe; could? iise unparh'amentary language, he would say it was p ; gross falsehood"; asi it was i.well? known to every one that every proposition of the Council's was vetoed by His Honor — was thrown to" the clogs by ( „r his^tijbbprnneßSiarid dogged obßtinacy— -while he did. according to Ms own, will or. fancy, as it pleased him. He defied .any pne'to'say that the - conduct- of His -Honor"(or—Drr"Menzies as he would , now ..style .him) .had hepa candid and 4"i BtKUghtforwar'd,' or bVen Honest. ; - To any of the propositions of r the : Council he would not give a plain "Yes,"' or " Kp." ""}. '~jpub .chose to back out: of the proper course by running into five hundred thousand old documents; to. qtt|nipt-to explain his position," and to evade an honest and straightforward answer. .The. fact. is.. he. has been toying with the powers df the Superintendent. It is ab- ■■- surd tor thint/as" he. does/ that his;-ppwer is su- ; ■*" preme." TDbes he think to have his members of Council sit as; dummies-rrasliriere puppets, sub-, servient to his own stubborn . will ? . He. (Mr,. £ucHarvey) thought the powers of the Superintendent must be jproperly- denriedj and' that if the-Exe-cutive (axjd it.is no sinecizre) was to- be held regponsiblej'they must stipulate" for absolute powers of action.- .ißufc, no 3 heitoys with: the question, and treats us to five hundred thousand references " -to old documents. -Th^re is not a 'bit of candor in biTn. It is contemptible. ; ; He , would urge that, • as" Mr. WilsOri "had suggested, the! previous evening, that he should have one chance more." (Mr. Rogebs " No " ) TVe will, say to him, I l ' Will you Halve an Executive on our terms? Give us. a plain .answer, ' Yes' or ' No.'; " • The hon. member .fhenlsaid "he would prepare a resolution on the subject, which submit to the ' meeting, inenioralisirig the G-eneral. Government for the removal of the Superintendent ,f f from.; Office and praying that the anairs of /the Province might be taken into their own hands. ; Mr. CHALMERS made aiew remarks expressing the' regret he .felt -that • .matters' -. should be assuming such a phase, and hoped, if possible, the . proposition rto memorialise the : General ■ ; Government should be averted if possible, Mr: ROGERS" was sorry to T>e of the same opinion-as those , members who had .just spoken ' on the' Bu'bject.' ' ; Mr. PEARSON rose, and said that whatever the opinion of the Provincial Treasurer might be as to the functions, of an Executive, he (Mr. Pearson) for one^ could not accept office unless „ ftrictly in accordance* with the will of the people, and of 'established" Ordinances. He should be glad to leave the matter now in the Provincial Treasurer's own hands,, as he, had done all he could in the matter; 1 As -to the differences which the Provincial. Treasurer thinks slight, he would only say that any one who accepted office on the -Superintendent's terms is a traitor. He then instariced^he^Executive Council's Ordinance which had been passed, but withheld from operatibrii by. the Superintendent, and maintained that the Executive, if they had a voice in thus withholding the matter, and had done so, were, traitors. The Provincial Treasurer would be a traitor if he had so advised His. Honor, r, •; ; ' '■' ]'■•-■ :; The PROVINCIAL TREASURER. — A traitor! That's your .definition of a traitor is it!" • ; Mr: PEARSON^Pdidn't say^he was a traitor. I don't believe he was consulted. >The PROVINCIAL TREASURER now rcadthe terms arranged with His His Honor on taking office, which .precluded ;his- being - consulted on such a matter. Mr. .PEARSON.-^This goes to show that the Executive must not be so formed., , ;". i. Th&'PROVESrCIAL'TREASURER.— It shows I'm no traitor. Mr. PEARSONi— I never said you were. The PROVINCIAL TREASURER. — Nor nobody else. ' „. , ■ Mr. PEARSON.— Quite so. " Nor nobody else.",Tir; ; ;L:V'; r V.i:-} 1 - The discussion was protracted ior some tune longed but : thV result arrived at was that Mr. -Harvey' s-proposed resolution gave way to one of a similar character, .which, wotuld ,be,br.ought,for-,ward-by :Mr. 'Galder 'at' next sittings ' -•- *- DEPASTXTBB XICBKBE PBB. . v -. Mr7PEARSON-moved— " That the'fee to be paid for license to depasture on the waste lands of the Crown, under the regulations , to. ; be based : ontne'"^r6pl>B^^iid-^^a^pris' < .paVßed-'iat this Session of the/Council; be, -jfbr r the; 'first yeaxßi<mp i "penny per ; acre; for the next ! five :: year|,, one , and a 'b.alfpenny"per acre ; ( and; afterwards^ • per •■acre"---' He Reckoned' ! 6riCa considerable; in-; crease to the revenue -the Provinfc'e'by;theadoptiqn jof, .this pystem^i tThe^toMoreYemie from the 1,225,000 acres - at^ present was only about £l,006, ; while" for the first' five years it would be -- £5;000 at one penny per acre," andrcorresporidingly increased at, the" expiration of that p«nod. | A -'- Mr. CHALMERS secbrided'the adbption of thfe resohxtion. ,T ■{'■'■ VTtSOZd " -IMr. ROGER wished, the hon.. the .mover would prove the accuracy J of "liis ""figure's.* • He would recollect that he confessed to a possibility of a. mistakofin^his first calculation, and'it*waß"jutt possible >that the others were similar. He should 1 wish the matter deferred, to give more time for tiie cafculations being tested. t - • '<>}<' Mr. PEARSON said he only doubted his calculation tv hen "such an authority questioned its accuracy • ,-,'., , ' . > Mr: ROGERS said ,the J compliment was, top great ior his own shoulders,' 1 and- coupled the name'of his colleague (Mr. Cowan) in the affair. , After some .further discussion the motion waj put and carried, an amendment of Mr. EogerB 1 having fallen to the ground. , >. , v tl „ . BDTOATIOKAi' i BEB-6BTEB. . , Mr. SWALE moved— "That _a_respectful ad"arSBB^BS- pieseKßd'- to=HM Honor the Supennteridenfc, requesting him to set-apart a portoon^or • , " 1 '" / ' \

23; 2_ra6rßlook,Vin,lttyewwgUl KwtoAtfot educatlohal 'jM-ses."-^* 1 *"" lfl - \ Mr. OALDBR seconded. jfc. EBIWWJOXf agreed tyt tt.eught.tOP <mu.oh •#aa asked, He would undertake to hare Spotion 10 or Sootfon $5 'set apart at n,o_t meeting of tbo Waste li&tyi $owd, if the. Hon- member thought 1 propw. , " , , „ * , The motion was ultimately amenaod— wl wo jstoctionß but "So, 26 being withdrawn. *$l\<3 motion was thon oawiedS „*< „ HB. CHAI^EB.* BISO-ttfJIOS, < Tl\o donate was acyourqed till thg next eitting,' '' ' " NOTICES OP .Hollos. , ' * Mr, --A-lIjTON.— To move a series of rosolU' tions on the .{financial State of the Province. Mr/ HARTBY— To ask leavo to bring ifl'aßill to repeal tho ' ( Licensing Ordinance, Session Ko. 12— the -Southland licensing Amendment Ordinance, 1883,'' ond to make fresh provisions in lieu thereof. " , > $ht House thon roao, W-BSBSIJAY 27tU. JtfLT. '_' J -lie Counoil met-this evening at tho usual hojtf, whon .thgicJlowing members wo»e r pi?«ent.----*hfl ■ Provincial ' Treas Wei?, Messrs, : Gaidar, Chobnojrß. | 'Pewfldn,_lo_6-s, ; NuMOi Hwv^i^SWftle^TOsoni : 'Awnstwrn^ * >;:V - : -' 7 7' : 7' n 7 "7 7 ; "''7 \ < The minutes of last- meetrag%e.w read, aa'*' 7 *: 7^Thb,PROVINCI__j -TRBASTJREB-askea that- ; part' of the minutes he read, which' ■ 'waß'dOhei- ThePEoyiNci-ii Trbastoeb objected to the remarks of ' >Ma. j Aßoqmus] beiiig'iiiserted jin • -tHe.xniiiu.es. -These .sho_ld : "cbhtaih' nothing ;of ■ the discussions, but of the; actual busmesshdoae. He moved that the Vobserva-ohs'-m-ide should be } expungedifrom <the minutes. i j ;:!! ;,I^, : RQO:EKS merely wished his protest to be aclmowleged'.;,,* _j •■]■?'.,-■■■,;'_ ' i i Mr. SPEAKER.-~ihen you should give that ; hi writing. „v v „.-,.,,.,... : , -,.r . .-. ;/ .. , ,< t ,< ■ '-' : ' '] '' ' ; After sp'irie' -iscussibh- the motion was'putj and ' rM&SPEAKEE declared, that the" noes"hadit. { Mr. CALDER; wished 'a division. Though un- , important in itself, it might t furnish'" an: i inj urious -.precedent- .x- 7 .?• -7.-. 7 '< • :.-. ..Mri SPEAE__R.gave it aa his' opinion; that the ;, House "should divide. ..-.'A. If \ ' ■ (House then .divided with, the following . result:— 7 ■••■-/-. _--- — I -: - i-'.VTAyes.rr-Messrs. the Provincial ..Treasurer,! TCal- ; dei*, Swale, Wilson, and Armstrong — 5. j .Npes.— Messrs. .Rogers, Pearson, Chalmers, ' NiirseVs'and.Harveyrr-57. ' ■■ '.> A. [.--.'A -.7 j Mr. SPEAKER gavo- his casting vote in favor • ofthe^ayes.": ■'..,. -.■■•/; t Mr. PEARSON corrected a verbal error, and the minutes were then, confirmed. „ , , > .! ''•'"' : ' ' '" "TJtE 'LICENSING- OEDINANCE. Mr. HARVEY asked leave to bring in a Bill to repeal the " Licensing Ordinance, Session No. '; 12— the "S6ii_-~ud'__ce_tsing i __mendment Ordi- , nance: 1863 /-'. and to- make fresh 'provision in lieu , thereof. He craved the indulgence of the House, .as theibill he proposed was -imperfectly •' prepared. • His original- intention had been merely to amend ,the ..existing Ordinances, but being advised other- ( wise, He had'prepared a new Bill, which he asked i leave to bring in. < The PROVINCIAL TREASURER, while ( agreeing with the principles of the Bill, depre- ; ,cated hasty . measures. ', He thought this Bill - could not be' '-got through during the present Session, with the justice that should be done to . it. v ,He suggested deferring, the matter on the , present occasion.. . >.. ' i M^. ROG-ERS'agreed with the hon- member's , remarks. ' . _ Mi*. HARVEY said thai if it was the opinion of the House, he would fall back on his original - intention, which was ,to introduce a clause jvhereby a ; beei- and bottle license weuld be'granted, and withdraw the Bill in its entire form till next ' Session. ( Mr. OALDER would prefer the Bill proposed to any/amendment, on ,the .present. Ordinances. , Although he agreed to the objections of the Pro-_ . vincial Treasurer, he could not se'e why it, shqid.d^ -- not pass, the first stages of being^gad-aiid printed.' ; There was no cei-tainty-; aB had been hinted, thht the Council .night be dissolved in two days, ;.ancl they might have ample time to. consider the' BiU. But, even if it was only printed, that would be an advantage, 'as those most interested in the matter would have tinie to consider it. 1 Mr. , WILSON supported the motion, to bring in the bill; when L^ave was. granted to bring in the Bill, which was- read a first time and ordered to be printed ; the second reading to be read to-morrow night. [ FINA-JCIA-.C-NDITION OP THB PBOVINCH. Mr. CALDER then read the following resolu- i tions on the financial condition of the Province :-r— "1. That in the •pinion of this House the interests of the whole colony are to a considerable extent bound- up '■ with, and may be seriously compromised by the continuance of the present financial condition of this province. .-.•'2.; That the management, of the .financial a_airs of this Province : , is ,., of so disastrous a character, that, an immediate , change of administration is, absolutely required: ; i ■'■ , : '"37 That, through such management,, the affairs, of this Province have become seriously .- "involved, and therefore this House views with j the utmost alarm' the position 1 bf antagonism to tlie .views of the Provincial Council, still- maintoined hy His Honor the Superintendent. - . '. ; I ; ''•' 47That; 'seeing' the Superintendent refuses to I ; act in accordance with the wishes oi* advice of the Provihciaf Coiuicil," this' '' Bouse" respectfiilly, but earnestly calls upon His Excellency ihe Governor to- dissolve the Council forthwith, or. to" take su ch steps as he shall think necasary to prevent the further ruin of the interests of the Province, as -well as for the protection -of the credit of the f Colony." ' ... Mr. CALDER simply rea_ 'the resolutions, and made ho remarks. 'Mr. WILSON seconded the motion. # | Mr. RO&EIIS wouldhbt support the motion. It was not in accordance with. the motion of tbje previous night. He had a copy which stated rThe PROVINCIAL TREASURER— That was withdrawn. ' __r: ROG-ERS— Oh, well, I will oppose this motion. (After' consulting with hon. members near him, he said) I ain mistaken in the motion, and propose that we go' into "committee. The PROVINCIAL TREASURER— No, no. A long discussion,- in which several members took part, followed '-'■'•' '■■'•' '--J Mr. PEARSON regretted that such strong language had been used the previous night. He hoped he i -would never -hear- such'tehiis 1 applied tp His Honor the Superintendent again. \ Mr. HABVEY, -asked, if any one imputed motives ? ' ;f Actions were diseusßed. not nfotives. ] Mr. CAI/DER.^thdugh out of order, wouia think itf-a i.shame -that .the .Council should meet •aM ■do 'nothing. There was absolutely nothing ibefore.thelCounc-l,: and piis Honor might! prorogue it at "any. moment. . 4 ■■ :A ; '-:U.' ■■■■:<■.<■■■■;■> ;" 1 Mir: C_L_LMERS.had,adifferent .- opinion'.' He did not think that,; ■thougfc they did not agree with Hjs. yHoiiorthe -be . would ' come down and prorogue the. House. Mr. HA_iVEY.reminded;thei'hon. members that His Honor prproguedjthe Council just after he disallowed. ani OrdJn-.nce,yand the House had^ no further opportunity of .discussing the matter. ; ' . . Afterra(long ; debate,n-,dr-.v. ; -.i'-^'T .;)q-;?0 ; , "Mr. CALBER-laskedi:leayei,to,r.posi|»one his' resolutions' till after- one, which he understood* would be proposed byl Mr. Pearson, was dia-,; . fussed. fjoi-'.tfT.-t rri&l. "*?J rxni -lyier-y^i >*);tmi;°.t!>.. | , C-Jioavefirant^dj and;7 vt- o^-:H7> >uyy^)^h ' ' .;;^he^BROVINCIAL : TREASURER , : mpyea : hia" resolutions! «-, (which;-- ■,f-w^>" ,»haye> .j.recently published)' on ' the— financial" "-'condition of' the Province.- K He; a tfeought it would 4iave, 3)ee_n ifeetter, if .ftll^t^esey.resotelaonßjhadj " been brought in together,? because f.aJlj.ref^edjtp the same. subject; ..■ (Cries of^^o,^^) frc He;;co^rsidere^it/was^eyondtheiPQwerj.pfa^upernte^ ont"o-6Executiveto redeem the posifapnvofthe ?rq-. vince.rT^yneitheifhadttoepp^er.nprjth^abi^ .If j " ; tliey 'had, why was the last Council cnlled together ? , .As ..they I ha4,been. lal?e^tp]#.;bycHi9)rJ_oppriin 1 al?e^tp]#.;bycHi9)rJ_oppriin ■"j-'h^^^sj-.t^npreseht^Yfe^^ e%

there was no,#w?lriatt.|^|^ obviow thatwhon. the Ministr^of' thlTQ-overnment refused to give ' *emy aanotion to radw-money^^whentheydc^lttred it wfta ; a.pr.noip|e.they, would not ,u«woticin— it wolb' tho duty #the Counoil Vo*&ud§esB His Excellency, to do Bornethjag in tho njatfey, and stvehgthen the hands of every ono who wished tho General Assembly called tbgethei*. 3_e previous ministry ■, wofo pt-epaved to sanction loans to any extent,; asfOJf instttnocj what w&* do^o i)iiho t ot.so v of, Otago, 'andiiiiany -of 'them '"had >b&en cOn-omhod.^ tho praßent Bdminiafci'tttion. He considered that two" things must bo dono. There was ti'ttth in tho first resolution submitted by hia friend on tlty , right, (Mr. Galcle*), Thoif ctyty, therefore, was to address His 'Exc_.lle.ioy on tho matter, in order that? tho. (cbnoral As3e_*ijblyj73h'ou'ldfbefo.^ed 1 togethoA 4 reason, he ueferred- to' otho^Pro* vinces whoso Debentures were not negotiable on tho Stock Exchange of Ijondpu. Ho would thci?eforo call ou 'His- Kkoellen^ to consolidate the loans required by tho different Provlnoos. 2nd. That thoMnisfcry In o_lstei.ee might receive from tho Assembly powers to do, wh&b thoy had ]no authority and were aot prepared to do. Thoy might yofieofc on a man on whom there was much to reflect, .But the ooureo ho (Mr. Carlton) had] pointed out was the proper ono to follow, Tlioy must havo tho money 5 debts must bo paid . ahd ueithor a new Superintendent nor a new Council could do that. Tho only way was that proposed 'in tho resolutions. .After some further remarks,.; ho mofsd'i the' resolutions, seriatim, briefly; explaining the objeot of each. ! The motion was put hy Mr, SPEAKER, but there being no seconder, it was declared fallen, when Mr. PEARSON, who had been absent for; a short time, entered, and seconded the motion p,ro ■fortpai ...... - . .. -„.,.: _ : , ...;...;,>.■.-■-.. >7f < Mi*. CHALMERS objected to the resolutions altogether. He did not consider they were drawn „upjb_ ( a .proper-tone, Ho differed ; entirely --from 'hoii. nieinber when it was stated that it' was beyond the power and ability of the Council jto take measures to retrieve the _crcditiof the;Province. Besides, the resolutions "opened up . the whole land quostion in New Zealand — which,! if settled in the way proposed, would give Auckland ■ Hpri's share of Southland ground, andlleave ' "very Tittle for this Province. He denied that the affairs of the Province wero hopelessly involved. Regarding the debentures being not negotiated, he knew that the chief- reason was, what is called in Britain, "a tightness of the money market." To 6uch an extent had large speculations been gone -into there, each with an enormous amount of capital— on paper— and -' all 5 - requiring large advances from the hauls, that tho Bank of New Zealand raised its rato .of interest to the alarming figure of eight and nine per ceut, and so it was not likely that our debentures would sell at six per,. cent. He proceeded to ..■ comment on the elausesjof resolutions, and gave it as h ; s opinion! that the General Government would rather assent . fo' a'loari thaii grant the propositions. ' He then went at length into what he estimated as the probable income and expenditrre of the Province, supposing a loan to. be granted. If the place remained stationary 1 in ' its present position he maintained that they could get a loan of £150,000, which, -with principal and interest, cou^d be paid off in seven yeara. In th's calculation he did not include such sources of income i.-om . works, &c.,. that were not yet in ope^'.on. A loan then, he thought the best plan for retrieving the financial position of the Province. In making these remarks he intended them as partly in support of, the resolution which Mr. Pearson would -niove,- as it would save bi<n (M\*. Chalmers) from speakiug further on the subject. 'Mr. WILSO-T considered . that . the. re.vouue estimated by the hon. member would not meet the liabilities when the salaries of officials alone amounted to £40,000. If they could clo without these gentlemen altogether, there might bo some chance of revenue and expenditure meeting. Mi*. CALDER was' not so sanguine as to expect that the estimated revenue of the Hon. member ■ (Mr.' Chalmers)' of : -.8100,000 was correct.;- . "hut it seemed to bun they were d'scu.ssiwg-ia' -subject' which did not belong, to. them— discussing what the General Assembly nr'ght do — tbe state of the money market, and why the Debentures had not been sold. He had reason to know, regardi-ig the latter, that "tightness of the money market." was not the reason why the Debentures were n-;p sold. It lay deeper, and was a resolr.don of the. Stock Exchange Committee ' u that ro Provincial Loans should be admitted.- -Colonial ones only. - That wa's the tr iie cause why Ihe Debentures were not sold. If this was the "case, why buU_l a series of theories on any £10,000. loan they -might, chose to pass u""iess the G-enerol G-over anient gave j a grant, which would amouut to almost a consociation of tho Provincial Loang ? He had some hope of the General Government, being almost forced in to such a plan. The tenor of the resolutions he agreed with, but thought the Council was not in a position to dictate, he might a l - most say,- have the impudence to. come forward with 6nch resolutions. It was sufficiant to ttate our position, and leave the Geneial Assembly or the Msnistrj to act. He believed the viewed . our . position with great interest, because iy was a disgrace :to the -whole Colony. He could not believe in waiting till the complex machinery proposed was brought to work. Before that was done our Bluff railway' and other works wold be rotting and wasting. The Peoa-;- nciax Teeasureb. — It could bo done , in a memorial. Mr. Caldee thought it could not be done by anything passed in tho Council. He did not . oppose the resolutions — except that they were out of place— uncalled for, - and did not meet our present wants. ,_:,. Other hon. members having spoken on the subject* - i "The Provincial Tbeasitber. asked any gentleman present who. could not agree to., these resolutions, to propose, something better ? It was the dxity of j any man who thought he had the power, to clo so. He rep' jed at length' to the opponents of the resolution', and, concluded by moving them. : The motion was then put, .when the Provincial Treasurer- only said "Aye," and 'cveiy other member was silent. Mr. Speakeb accordingly declared in the usual manner " ayes have it." Mr. Chaimers asked with surprise, "TV nat. is : 'the-motion?'" : ; ' ■ ' ; _ ; Mr. Speakeb said it was that' the motion be adopted. \ Mr. OnALJfEBS thought it was only, that thfe motion should be read. ! j Mr. Wixson asked if the resolutions were adopted by the House ? . .. . „ . -, ; Mr. Speakeb. — Yes. ; After some discussion, ■■■'"■ Mr. Tarlton moved that the resolution be again put. Mr. Speakeb accordingly. put tlie motion, when • Mr. Tarlton said .".aye," .and Mr. Harvey " no ;" ; all tho other members being silent. r/ Mr. Speakeb intimated that the' House must " "decide.' „..,..,. „-■■- ■ - . > Mr{- Chaimers said it 'would • would hai-dly bo l doing justice the hon-.- member the PRovincial J Treasurer, to; -ahclvo'th? resolutions' the had propared bo carefully v;; He, (Mr.. jChaiicebs,) only ' objcctel to them. - - ' • ; * Mr. Harvey moved .that.the debate, be. adj ourni7_a?-,; ■ 477 5 77',:>:7" (-;. ,! ' The Provincial Treasurer Bpcpndea.the inotiou, which was agree! to. , ( .., • . .-.„■ ..,.:-,-; 1 i' ! ' Y'^'; '^Mr.;CHALMEB'3'RE^tUTIONS. .\, .^..;! 1 1* "'; Mr. Peabsoii; . asked 'for , aiiptlwr, a^ournmeEjt -;"of tliis debate; ' ; '",!(,. 7,~ .-,"',."","•. ■,i-.-<. ! -.N i-v.-.....= ! ; v ' ;! TnEpiqyiKciAtTE-SA^ 1 '7 Mr/PEAi^o^.^^ey^aTOj-not^jye't prihto"cl, v ancl l' : 'it i_' ; desirable^that tlie'i^ol^ions^^.Mi^-Gaider r 'Be^'takeii iiito. cOnsicteration |sr§t7 ..''.'. 7 ; -. 1 --.-! ; ; j ,£- : ' i: --*fhe' ii P'c_bviNcVAi_ Tpjeasureb", c.6nsidcredr.,it ) a 1 most unsatisfactory.-jreaspn. \: o '*7 7V !0 ,;;;;.. /p i 1 r r y %lx: piijiiwEsls, " peconcled -the motipuavfliich r waa : o" : > agreea. :, to'"' '"'"'"'.;.'.,"■ .„rv" ff ; >^s /--ST ?'''i\'\' { 'i' '■ i- " ANOTHER iDCBESS TO' HI& HftXOß.' j ,- Mr. Peabson move dtho suspension of standmg !-•.- oo'rdei£N'd.i2 , 7, in order that ho 'might bring forward b if j yrioti6n owithout- 'notice 1 ibeeh: given'. n-)Leave" was } granted, and he moved— "That a respectful h addresSltboAprefehtedf W Hisf Honoi* the Super:- -(• .mtendent;'.' requesting him to inform the Council ii i t aJ«_- y£ '--'? t y>a-,i™Mte»siQl Wno^->soB | j* .aisKtrt^i - 1

*m mam m^^^t^^r^ *■ r-liQttj ; aH^#^^ t ?ph^?i:hJ'lwhJ,oht^ : tjjftjP: %9_ f«?iw?at!#d "from iia .pyeaont^embftrraa'Bod • position." '.. , ■-',•, '/.:, .-\ '.-- .... >: a^3^oi\i»Bß-Bo66h'ddd ih^ motionV 1 <; * /i ,| j p' jTh^PaoTiKOUiiV^BßAßtrinm istßtodi |haY tho ; rosolutionf rea4 by him had beon '»ubiriitted to ■ HiflH6ao^r^nd they tftdt with !Ub approyalr : : was tho. : 3aly jfjonor wa?' prepared ; to Bubmit^ov^-,oounoil^8 i thf, solution of their, ■"" Tffi l %%G%i§buii TsfiAstrnsn was 'tot awafa of &ny otho^thi«g,;;;lt^a^ .bdyond. ; .tho power of tho . OOUttOil. <-• ■,-'.. -.. „.r,.,vi|iiy; ; .- j V»* && ©aisbs' &*s oonaidteWKT the pMsoat j«- . ;=j eoiutiona utterly- nnn^eessa'py. . ' '"" l Mr HAllf EY -tH6u|ht -:-lt^vdu\d have boon mora candid, and more; oeqoming on the pari o,f r ,, the Broviaoial Treasurer,, if ha., had,atthß first < : came forwarded Btated \o th^Hojife that tho ; ; roaoltttions >h6 f broti'glit 'iorwWvd 1 wero actually;, ; those of His Honoxvthe Supernatendent. " , i) ,..M?, v WlLSON>pfferfld^-fe'jT.yea>ftrka. „..-.. >■ . r *' : ' rf -^K^jß"ASßON>ftid'ljfß-\r^olUfi6lftß wob npv ,',] not of(&i!^liUiht^Bfri u'^ -the resolutionß; brought forward bythe^roTincial 'IVoasuror aro ;! feaU^ithoj&e .of M& j^EKT : theroforowithdrftsv m3,rQS_olution9,.aß tho Super-" ) iatendontaas how ! plainly "in timafcid his intontipn ? to rule aa he h6s done, andtho Provincial Ooua^il ) of Southland was now. virtually out of power, j '' ;! |. ;The>Eß.pyi^giA^a'WAS^Ell'.attenipi:od i »] to>indipate,htf,cpnductintho^^ I? | ■><< A . ' ' Mptio,n;'fpr theiwifeadrawal of the : . resolutions = r was caJfriod. , ,- , ..'.\ , „..'■.,-.<,;.■,■ ■- ? o '.;■ ;••.- -. i ■ '. '>■■ "'MB.' OAI-DER'S HESOItrXip.K9. ;- .;..., ; ■-, I /; ■•: Mr. CAiiDEa moved, and 2s, ..Armstbono- ;-. seconded, that the House go into 'committee on hi 3-1 yesolutiona. '::';. v:^ ' '"' ' Mr. Taeltox moved, and Mr. SjrjdJß seconded, < that Mr. Pearson be chairman of committee. ; ; Mr. Chalmers, njp'tbd i as : an amendment, and' ;'l Mr. AEHSTEOif&^ecbnded/'that Mr? Tarlton be; ■■■ chairman. '' ■"';.'. ;.." '. , ' i ■ ■ '■' On tho motion and the airiendment ; -being put, 1 the amendment was declared carried.' ' i Mr. TARLTON took the chair. >■ ■"■ :j Mr. CHALMERS now suggested that as Mr. • a - Tarlton would probably have a: goodi'dealLto say. ■! on -.these resolutions* that Mr. Pearson lact as J chairman. . - . ;'-*.; '. j This being seconded, the House reported p^oH- :. gressi;-' asked leave to sit again, and Mr. 1 Pearson; ; : 3 was installed into the chair. . ■ ■;; ' < The first resolution was carried without discus- i sion.: ;•■' ■ : . . ■■:.;•■ C , ; The second resolution was th en moved. ' i The Peovixcial Teeasurer took exception ,to 1 tho word " management," if it meant to include 1 him ; all. that had been done sm 9 e no 9 a^ c office hkd been "retrenchment."' _ \ Mr. Aemsteong- was of the same opinion as . regards the present Council. 1 ; ; Mr. HARErrjdidnot think that there' was any < cause, for. Provincial Treasurer "putting the cap < on" so quickly, as lie did not think auy one of i them were, fr&jfroiii sblaind. ::'•'■ ( After a. few words from Mr. Chalmers and Mr. < .Wilson,, the clause. was adopted. -■ -- ■—„.... . ■ 1 .Mr. Qaldek moved the 3rd resolution. In 1 doing so he greatly regi-ettcd the rumous conee- i quences which the conduct oi' the Superintendent 1 entailed,, and thought the affairs of the Province i ■were in a most deplorable condition- ' The clause was amended with a verbal altera- i tion, rwhich appears iv the clause aa above : printed. Mr J Calder moved the fourth resolution. Ho ; candidly confessed that it was one which had '. given him considerable cliTiculty, especially as regards the dissolution of the Counci! and fresh : elections, He had also presumed to state, that ; His Honor had refused to act in hai .nony with i the .Provincial Council. If not, why had we not not an Executive ? ' Mr. Taelton offered a few remarks on the resolutions, and commented on a resolution of Mr. Chalmers, which, had been forwarded to Auckland on the Ordinance. ' Mr. Cjialmejjs said not one of the members /would regret a "! Ittle trouble in the matter of new . elections, but thought that it could be sce-cely accomplished before December. Mr. Welson thought lliey could be got ovorby October. The clause was adopted. .Mr. Calder- moved that- the following be added to the resolution ••— ''That tlie Hon. the Speaker be requested to forward, a copy of the above resolutions to the Governor." ; Tlvs motion was carried d : ?seut. The Chairman then reported progress. The Speaker having resumed the chair, Mr. Calder moved, and My. Sw^tu seconded the adoption of the resolutions. Carried. LEAVE OF -ABSENCE. Mr. Ha RVET moved, and Mr. Chaljiers seconded that leave of absence be given to Mr. Scott, for the rest of the'eesßiOn, on account of ill health. Carried. The House thereafter adjourned at half-past ten o'clock.