When is a meeting not a meeting?

Ruapehu Bulletin, Volume 11, Issue 490, 15 June 1993, Page 4

When is a meeting not a meeting?

In resporAe to your article of 8 June 1993 regarding the last meeting of the Waimarino Community Board entitled 'Closed Meeting Continues': The reality of the situation was that the meeting of the Community Board closed after discussion of the last item on the agenda. The Mayor indicated that he wished to discuss in private some issues with Community Board members but this process did not form part of the meeting and it is significant that no decisions were made nor record kept of the discussions. Thus the discussions were clearly not part of the Community Board meeting and were merely between a group of individuals. Cliff Houston Chief Executive, RDC See right for more on this matter

Killing training

• Thank you for introducing Colonel Roger Mortlock to your readers. From the quotes in your article he seems to be the perfect person to be a commander of army training. Confusing people by the double speak like, the best training for war is training for peace. I interpret training for war as training to kill people. I don't see the reasoning in killing people to show that killing people is wrong. It is like using corporal punishment in schools to prevent violence in the playground. Violence in a violent society perpetuates that violence. Examples abound in New Zealand and other places where people trained to kill do

not differentiate between 'legal' violence, war, and abusing or killing an estranged partner. There is no difference. If peace keeping is what our services are doing then training for war seems to be a strange way of learning to mediate and facilitate peace. Substituting a violent weapon with a more powerful weapon is not peace keeping. Peace keeping in this form involves the killing of thousands of innocent people, whether it be in Northern Ireland or Iraq or elsewhere. Aotearoa/New Zealand could do better than playing war games with the big boys.

Evin

Wood

Glass milk bottles back

How many locals realise that milk in glass bottles is again available in the Waimarino for all home deliveries from our friendly milk vendor, John Triggell? As plastic is not recyclable from this area yet and the price of timber is going up and up (and cardboard too eventually), it is environmentally sensible to use reusable glass. Help cut down household rubbish and return to glass milk bottles - many other s have; see John today. Evelyn Cooper (Mrs)

Cold election

• I am writing expressing my concem at the disappointing support (three locals) to our first political meeting held for this years very

important election. While I do appreciate that a meeting held at 8pm on a cold winter night would not attract many to leave the comfort of a warm house, perhaps the organisers could put a little more thought into the timing of meetings. May I suggest that the many elderly living in the Waimarino are reluctant to attend an evening meeting during winter. Therefore perhaps an afternoon meeting would be more appropriate. I also wish to say that this was the first political meeting I have attended and perhaps had I attended more along with the thousands of other ' New Zealanders like me maybe our votes in the past would have been made on a more positive note. Finally I will try to attend all meetings held by all our candidates so that on election day I can cast a more positive vote.

Ngaire

Stewart

Professional renlv

Interesting letter last week in the Bulletin from Messrs Harris, Tansey, Harvey, Peach, Cornwall and Partners. _ You really would think such a high-pow-ered group, their office or officers should have a dictionary; perhaps they might have a look through their accounts manuals and law books and in chorus advise me what the following words mean: question; answer; assertion; implied. If they have any trouble with that I am quite willing to provide them with some advice, at a moderate fee of course. Incidentally, I have not received any answers to my questions yet, I still have some money to invest safely and a vote to spend wisely.

The Clyde Olsen

Ohura jubilee

• We, the Ohura Cosmopolitan Club, are eXcited about our forthcoming 50th Jubilee and would like to inform exmembers and interested

people that we intend to hold this on Labour Weekend 1994. If memories of a good time arose when you think about Ohura, drop us a line with your name and address so we can send you more information. Please write, The Secretary, Jubilee Committee, Ngarimu Street, Ohura, North Island.

Following is an article previously prepared by Mr Houston on the subject of council meetings and workshops:

Public access to decision making

It is of paramount importance that councils make their decisions in public except where there are compelling circumstances requiring confidentiality. Keeping the decisionmaking process in the public arena ensures that any dissenting views can be noted by the public and the reasons for taking a certain course of action evaluated. The formal decisionmaking process prescribed by the Standing Orders makes it very difficult for a fluid exchange of ideas on complex policy issues. A 'workshop' is the ideal forum for dealing with complex policy issues prior to the deci-sion-making process. Exclusion of the media and public makes for a frank exchange of views and information which may not occur in a more formal setting. 'Brainstorming' is often part of the process in deciding upon policy options. People present at the workshop may throw ideas into the ring which appear way-out or controversial but which have to be considered in a constructive way. Often these ideas lead to worthwhile initiatives but people may be inhibited from bringing them up if they feel they are exposing themselves to ridicule. Likewise members may be reluctant to ask questions about issues if they feel that doing so may expose their ignorance or lack of basic un-

derstanding to the public. It is true that some members may grandstand at workshops but behaviour of this kind is minimal and is of no importance because it is not reported. Workshops are used to crystalise ideas and establish a general direction for future formal action. There is still more than adequate opportunities to assess members' performance in public meetings where policy issues are finally debated and resolved. The Local Government Official Informations and Meetings Act specifically contemplates nonpublic meetings where no decisions are made. This clarification to existing law was made in 1991. It is unrealistic to expect Council members to hold all their discussions in public and members will always discuss issues between themselves in private whether a framework is provided for doing so or not. The workshop has an advantage over more informal options as it at least ensures that all members are involved rather than just select cliques. A working party reported to the Minister of Local Government in 1990 on the workings of the LGOIAM Act 1987. It

commented in that report on the content of an English report on the conduct of local authority business. This comment is reproduced here: "It is a simple reality, which no legislation can alter, that politicians will develop policy options in confidence before presenting the final choice for public decision. We do not think this unreasonable." "If the law prevents them from conducting such discussions in private in formal committees, then they will conduct them less formally elsewhere. It is unsatisfactory to ; force policy deliberation out of the formal committee system into groupings of indeterminate status. It is also unnecessary." "No decision can be taken by a local authority without it eventually being referred to a deci-sion-taking committee or the council, where there will be a full public access to the meeting and the documentation. Given this basic safeguard, we can see no benefit in applying the Act (Local Government (Access to Information) Act 1985 UK) also to deliberative committees." Ruapehu District Council Annual plan submissions close 25June