DAIRY CONTROL.

Otaki Mail, 22 June 1923, Page 3

DAIRY CONTROL.

PALMERSTON CONFERENCE ENDORSES BILL. A TWO-TO-ONE MAJORITY. 11 v a two-to-one majority the National Dairy Association, yesterday, decided that Parliament 1)C urged to pass the Dairy Contrill Bill. The decision was arrived at alter exhaustive discussion in which Mr. W. Grounds (Hokinnga() was warmly complimented lor an excellent speech in favour of the Rill, and it is a significant fact that several present who had intended strenuously opposing the motion, withdrew their arguments after hearing Mr. Grounds’ remarks. Mr, Grounds gave an outline of the action which led to the establishment, of a special committee. That committee conferred with the Meat Roard and other organisations and recommended that a pool be asked for along the lines of the Meat Control Board. Eventually a Bill was drafted and brought before Parliament, but was set aside before dissolution with the intention of reviving it during a subsequent Parliament if the industry so desired. The Bill provided for a board of nine producers to be elected by the producers, six from the North island and three from the South Island, with two Government representatives and

two Government iepi*escuu.iiivea one from the proprietary interests. Provision was made for tile election ol a dairy council of 30. When the Meat Control Board was elected its council went out of existence, but the committee thought it would be better for the dairy council to remain in existence as a means of communication between the board and th e producers. That was a valuable point. The Bill provided for the establishment of a London agency with a representative who thoroughly understood the business and whose integrity was beyond question, and who would watch the producers' interests. Existing con. tracts were safeguarded, and it was proposed that the board should be responsible for sea carriage, and it was hoped that the Meat Control Board would pass a resolution under which neither boards would enter into a shipping contract except in conjunction with the other. This would enable them to obtain an infinitely better service than they had at the present time. The levy proposed to meet the expenses was Atl. per lb. on butter, and 1-16. per lb. on cheese, and it was suggested that this should be dealt with through the consolidated fund. Dairy produce would be used as security lor advances to make necessary monthly payments. The speaker then proceeded to deal with the prices of New Zealand and

with tlte prices ol New Zealand and Danish butter, and said that on the average Dominion prices were 20/per cwt. less than Danish, and on this basis it meant a loss of £2,500,000. The reason why Danish butter had tire pull over New Zealand butter was because of regular and uniform supply for 52 weeks in the year, while New Zealand supply* was irregular. Sir Thomas Clements had said that the best brands of New Zealand butter were equal to anything that Denmark could produce, so this was not the reason for the diflerence in price. There were other matters which required attention, and one of these was the cutting out of the speculative manipulator, who was no good to the dairy industry. Inquiries had led them to the conclusion that the satisfactory position of tlie Argentine was due to the excellence of the shipping contracts. Shipping interests were controlled by three firms in the Argentine, and they had been able to exercise complete control of the whole export. Special boats were provided with the necessary facilities for handling ana discharging, thus guaranteeing a regular weekly delivery, and they were able to deliver from the ship to shops without intermediate storage. This was tlie question which had resulted in the exclusion of New Zealand beet from the London market, and they would be able to do nothing until they were organised. - STORAGE, DISTRIBUTION, . . FINANCE. The speaker proceeded to deal with fhe questions ol' stoiage and distribution in England in order to avoid disturbing- the market and causing fluctuations in prices, and also the difficulties to be faced in getting New Zealand butter on the French market. Through having to get supplies from the London market Paris had to pay--10- to 20/- per cwt. more, and the consumption on the Paris market was 2000 boxes per week from December* to April. When it *was suggested that delivery at Dunkirk might be arranged, as the ships went through the Channel, it was stated that the ships would not call with less than 50,000

boxes, although Australian bouts called with 6000. This was another disability under which they laboured because they had no organisation capable of speaking on behalf of the whole industry. With regard to the question pf financial backing by the Government, it was stated that the proposals made would prejudice the passing of the Bill. The basis of the whole finances was the estimation of the realisable valu e of their products (applause), and’all talk of supplementary securities was all moonshine. Only by organisation could they reduce the margin of risk and secure greater advances against their products. The scheme proposed would ensure the small producer, if producing even quality, to get equally satisfactory returns as the big factories. Regarding the liberty of suppliers to deal with their produce independently, the Manchester economic school of thought, of 50 years ago, could not be applied to-day, and the individual could no' 71 to do as he liked. CO-OPERATION AND PROGRESS. New Zealand could get no further without the extension of the co-opera-tive system, and they must take the Short paths to progress along lines Which had been followed by many other countries of the world. Some confusion had been created by the talk of supply and demand, but'the eco* npmic argument of 60 years was dead and should have been buried long ago It was the lack of organisation that had led to the break down of supply and demand, and prices could only be determined by the general economic conditions prevailing. among which was the purchasing power of the people. They were working for efficiency, and it was felt that before coming to a final decision, the whole of the Interests concerned should be fully and freely consulted. They had seen a great consolidation of Interests in the big brewery combine recently, and they must protect their own position by controlling their industry. But when were they going to move ? For years producers had been visiting the Old Country and on returning said something must be done. OPPOSING INTERESTS. Ho knew there was a combination iDf Interests opposed to their proposals and that a fighting fund had beep sot up -to combat the principle* of the ca-

operative movement. Would they al- j low that to impede the progress of the co-operative movement ? (No, cer- | tainly not). When would they realise . the plans which they had in mind ? J (Now !) He moved that Parliament be urged to pass the Dairy Control Bill. (Applause.) Mr. J. Corrigan, M.P. (Patea) seconded, and in admitting the right oi opposition to be present, he provoked hearty laughter by sayin: " But do not

lICCU t.V lib Llf-J 11 LL L OU.J Ail . X-'MX v b 0 like Paddy and say, ‘ I’m agin the Government, whatever comes along.’ ” He urged them not to allow themselves to be frightened by some of the bogies which had been raised, but to realise that fire proposals were purely in the interests of the industry. Mr. E. W. McDonald (Te Horo) supported the principles of the Bill, but. urged that it required amendments, as in Us original form it did not offer the best means of realising Llieir aims. Ho had proposed to move: “ That, \v*c as dairymen, re-aflirm the need of hotter methods of control of the export, marketing and general handling of our dairy produce. We believe that the producers should exercise this control and should have statutory powers to enable t ,us to effectively do so, subjc-ct to national expediency and the Government veto. We endorse and approve the election of a council or board, if sucli eleclinn it? li'i 1 irwm D url

(ion is based upon sound and democratic methods, and such council or board is made a responsible and efficient body: the Crown to have one representative thereon, such council or board to co-operate as far as possible with other responsible bodic« having a similar aim. We endorse and approve, the principle of pooling, and of having the power of compulsion within equity and for the general good. But wc believe that the Bill before us does not offer the best means of realising these aims, and should, therefore, be referred back for further amendment, and the addition of full and complete machinery clauses in the al: ove direction." In view of tlio address by Mr. Grounds, he would now withdraw that notice of motion. Mr. F. W. I-lubbard (Palmerston North) asked if provision was made for cool store in London and regulation of supplies ? Mr. Grounds replied that it was thought this should not be provided for in the Bill, but should be dealt with in the regulations. In reply to Mr. Hansford, the chairman said the exact context of the Bill would not be known until the Minister handed it out in Parliament. Mr Hansford’s question was whether the Bill as amended, was meant, or did j the motion provide for suggested amendments proposed to be sent

round by the N.D.A., but not for publication ? BUSINESS MEN REQUIRED. Mr. O. W. Williams (Kairanga) asked if it, was contemplated that the board to be set up should take abso- ; lute control and possession of the 110,000,000 worth of dairy produce in the Dominion and ship its on its own account. He had been a strong supporter of tlie Bill, but if that was the intention he, and many others, would lie dead against it (applause). They had common sense enough to know that 11 men, and farmers at that, could not take possession of £16,000,000 worth of produce and deal with it more ably than those who had been 25 years building up the industry. Mr. Grounds was head of the committee, and lie would like his assurance that such a tiling was not intended. (Hear, hear.)" Mr. W. Perry (Masterton) remarked that compulsory grading was revolutionary, but it was a necessity. Tlie advantages gained by the establishment of the Meat Board were more than compensating for the cost of bringing it into being, and would ‘ be still greater in (lie future. Regarding shipping, tlicie was no possibility of getting proper allocation unless they had absolute control. COMMISSIO X SUG G ESTED. Mr. Maxwell (Kahui) said Ml. Gi minds speech was a very fine one, lait he had evaded tlie main points. He would like to disabuse their minds if t-liey thought he was ‘‘agin the Government,” but they should know ex- • intltf Nxrlitif tvac nrnnn KPrl Imfrwf* tIIPV

a-ctly what was proposed before they committed themselves. On the proposed board theoretically they would be represented, but not in practice. Once the board was formed they would find out how much they, as producers, would have to say in the matter. They should not give control over shipping , for if they did that the board would have the whole thing. (A voice: Another bogey)—and ■ a board of 11 men would have them al their own sweet will. The council had the idea of running a 5 2 weeks' service and regulating supplies, but the moment they attempted to regulate supplies it meant keeping back produce. It was not a eheesemaker's bill or a butter* producer’s bill. Holding over would have the inevitable effect of depreciating the value of their produce, for goods held over would not be as marketable as fresh produce. He submitted that the present financial arrangements were satisfactory, and they were getting advances from the banks. In other cases they could get advances from the merchants. It was said that goods were security, but perished goods were not security. It was ability to liquidate the goods that constituted the security. He submitted that they did not know enough about it, and he urged them not to commit themselves until they did. He moved: “ (a) The Dairy Produce Control Bill, which was submitted to the last Parliament, is entirely unacceptable and should be dropped: (b) the Government be urged to appoint a commission of, say, five persons, including an advocate and an opponent of the Control Bill and three independent businesg—men of recognised standing and ability to investigate shipping conditions and to report on what improvemputs nen li.. oflGr-t,.,! r,nnnfu,tm„

ments can be effected m connection therewith; (cj pending such report; no legislation be enacted.” Air. C. E. McMillan, AI.P., representing Ilawera, said he favoured the suggestion of the previous speaker ia regard to the election through the medium of the ballot box. Why not have the whole five members producers ? he asked amid applause. WHY COMPULSION ? Air. G. Gibson (Rahotu) took the vionr i- i ii. .

view that no body of men at the present time could suggest any definitecourse. but at the most, could only suggest a " probable ” course and this Tn^J 10t qnite enough. He „ „‘_ lried tllat asking for compulof faYir? 10 ,' vai ' in ilsc ' lf * a confession , s ’ because the end which it attain? f rUlain llad already been 1 m other countries without I compulsion. On th*. “ out ne-f-nts „ , ut question of the ing away “"a ”r “wWch keut customer and merchant in touch

rril _ wmii,. in touch Ikie essence of- successful business was the hearty co-operation of customer and merchant (applause). The speaker touched on the suggestion made at the morning session as to the existence of a fighting fund, and the suggestion that he (the speaker) had been .referred to indirectly. Cries of "No.""

it A Voice: " You don't call yourself ja fighter, do you ? " (Laughter.) I Air. Gibson: "If you come on to the ! platform, we might test the statement.” (Applause.) He would second the amendment. OTHER ©PPONENTS. Mr. Cook (Waipukurau) said, although he represented practically the "small end” of the district, he had been instructed to oppose the Bill. 7\ T»• V)e.o »• oino 1 fl Pfi 11 fit

Mr. Dear (Ivaipara) dealt at some length with the question of finances and the procedure prevailing at Diosent, and reminded those present that if the matter were left to (lie board, when sot up. they would have to ansvvt i* to the suppliers. Sir. F. IV. Hubbard (Palmerston North) said the mix of tile whole >osition was to get better marketing onditions in the Home land. Was the lominion butter sold in Great Britain aider its t'rue meult, he asked, and was it blended with ‘‘other stuff ?” A ' *■ : " Ask Noah.” H" eon.'lemd the time was ripe that tlie V*' ’.or of the Dominion was branded and sold true to label. PARENTS OF THE BILL. ! Air. Bond (Bainesse) voiced liis. strong condemnation of any sugges- | tion of compo'sion^iti anything con- , nectcd with farming. Be held that . the Government had blundered and j he could not .j -e his way to support ' idle Go\ ernm .it any longer. Toucli- : ing on the • .-cation of the Bill, the speaker dr< -.,* rounds of laughter by his statement that “if Mr. Grounds was the father of tlio Bill, Mr. Goodfellow was the mother.” (Laughter.) A Voice: " It is well the mother di<i not have twins." (Laughter.) All. Rolands (Alangorei) opposed the Bill. Air. Tosland (Taranaki) held that in adopting compulsion they would be taking a step too drastic. He suggested that it would be a wise step to j tak e the London agent into their con- j fidenee. Th o. Mmmi'Ji hln .T 11 v .if

, The Honorable J. B. Gow (Bay of Plenty) said it seemed that in this ■ matter a large number were labouring ; under a misapprension and had conjured up a picture of a monster that i did not exist. Tim only principal ob- . joction seemed to be that of compulsion, but it did not suggest that the powers given to the board would be 1 used in an arbitrary or unfair man- 1 tier. i “There Is the possibility, though," ! commented a voice. “ There is a possibility,” said Mr. Gow, "of my dropping dead on this platform now, and,” he added, " there is the possibility of some member going rapidly insane.” (Laughter.) Do held that the power of compulsion must of necessity. b e in th-- Bill to make it effective. Alt*. J. Ki,u tii (Omala) opposed the Bill. Air. A. F. Ifarding (Northern Wai--10a) said that lie had waited with expectation to hear something in the i v/ay of condemnation from the three, leading oppositonists to tin- Bill, hut after hearing them speak, he had come to the conclusion that they lian ‘‘all fired blank cart ridges.” There had been a “ goo«l deal of smoke and • not a little effluvia.” (Laughter.) Air. F. Ran I old (.Stratford) said be had been instructed to oppose the Bin and when tlie directors of the company lie represented were fully cog- , nisa.nl of the scope of tlio Bill, they believed in compulsion, and to a certain extent, control. THE PROPOSAL CARRIED. Alter further exhaustive discussion, the amendment was put. and on the individual vote, was lost by 107 votes to 40. At ibis stage it was decided to gi*?e Air. Grounds Hie right of reply, aim then take a straight out r ate on the original resolution. Air. Grounds said neither he no: j members or the council claimed an-.* authorship of the- Bill. While lie welcomed any interchange of ideas on Ibis important matter, he had spoken v,-ith the firm conviction that the ' scheme was one in the interests of the industry. On being put to the assembly, the original motion was carried by lot votes to 50, the amendment bei*g reeeived Trith applause. , A beany vot£ of thanks to Mr Grounds was carried by acclamation, and the meeting adjourned until 10 o'clock this morning.