HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

New Zealand Times, Volume XLII, Issue 9789, 12 October 1917, Page 3

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

ELECTORAL BOUNDARIES BILL DEBATED AT CONSIDERABLE LENGTH. THE POSITION - OF HOTELS. Tho House of Representatives met at 8.30 p.m. yesterday, the Speaker. (Sir F. AY. Lang) in the chair, Mr J. T. M. Hornsby (Wairarapa) introducod his Electoral Boundaries' Commission Bill. The object of the mea-i sure, he stated, was to ensure; as far as .possible, continuity of service,- and, more especially, community of interJ est. The manner in which the constituencies were carved up every five years! was niost anomalous, and ha thought) that tho time had come when the boundaries should be fixed, for at all events a much longer period. One member he knew of had to travel for two days through another man's electorate to get at a 'small part of lids own which wias separated from the balance of his com stituency by a- mountain range. Mr H. G. Ell (Christchurch South) said that by permanently fixing the boundaries they would be going back! to the conditions complained of by Sir George Grey, when some members represented 250 electors and some 5000.’ lie thought that the time had come to increase the number of scats by five, because through the drift of popular lion many members in the South Island bad been . put in charge of unwieldy districts. . To base representation on area , would bo entirely wrong and retrbgrpde. VARIOUS PROTESTS. ; Mr. J. Anstey (AYaitaki) . protested/ against the present system, of electoral; representation, the abuses of which; were the slavishly sticking to inert) numbers. AVellingtou, for instance, was; grossly over-represented. In his own; electorate the boundaries wore full oti anomalies. Mr R. P. Hudson (Alotueka) expressed his dissatisfaction at the boundaries; fixed in and around bis district. Mr Veitci (Wanganui) said the present electoral boundaries in his district fixed the lowest minimum of electoral power. Ho was not supporting! the principle of the bill now before tho House. Anyone who took an unbiased view of tho position, would admit that the adjustment of the electoral boundaries made Wanganui a lot worse off than any other part of the, Dominion. Air J. Colvin (Duller) also made a, strong protest against tho boundariesof his electorate. Mr McCombs (Lyttelton) said the way out of the difficulty was to have proportional representation. Air G. AV. Forbes (Hurunui) said the, time had arrived when the electoralsystem should be placed on a better, basis. It was not fair to ask a member to represent a district 200 miles in. length and another to represent another district which ho could travel over in a day. There should bo a reorganisation of the whole electoral system. UNFAIRNESS TO HOTELS. Air AlcCallum (AVairan) said the outstanding point of the new electoral boundaries was the unfairness to hotels. Air Massey: "Have you any suggestion to maker” Mr AlcCallum said there must be some way out of the difficulty even to the extent of running two electorates into one. Tho Government should be really hornet and straightforward in this matter. “DID THEIR BEST.’’ ✓ Air Alaissey thought that the Commissioners had done their best with regard to a. very, very difficult matter. As to tho injustice sometimes done to hotels by the“changes of electoral boundaries, he had asked Parliament three years ago to put the matter right so far as possible to do it. A section was placed in the Act, providing that where practicable to keep an hotel in a “wet" district that should be done. But, apparently, it had not been possible in every case to do that, so far as the present proposed alterations were concerned. He did not know what more could be done in that respect. Of course, if local option was knocked out, as some people proposed, now that they had got Dominion option, they would get over tho difficulty, but ho did not think that Parliament was likely to do th'at. There was no question that, there was an anomaly, so far as Alaor: representation was concerned. In the southern district there were only some COO- or 700 voters, while in the Western District there were IOCO or IjfVW. Thera were also many more in the Northern and Eastern Maori Districts. The difficulty might be met by adding a part ox the North Island to

tbo Southern District. The matter hud rot vet been taken into account by Cabinet, but they wpuld probably consider it "hen The Electoral Bill was brought in nest session. He thought (hero would have to be a bill, because there were a number of anomalies to bo dealt; with, lie might add that obieciions to the present boundaries would be received by tho Commissioners up to November 6th. MR WILFORD SAYS GOOD-BYE. Mr T. M. Wiii’ord said he would take this opportunely of saying good-bye to thoso portions of his electorate that would be lost to him by tho new baun- , daries. He was to lose tbs residents of Mnngaroa and Upper Hutt and he trusted that tho good feelings that had always existed between them and himself would be continued even though he would not have iho honour to represent them in Parliament. MV W. J. Dickie (Sehvyn) said from avhat ha could see of the new map of the boundaries Selwyn had absorbed Ashburton. iLaughter.) He had lost his electorate and could only express hi s regret at the fact. He would not ;nv whether ho would go for another electorate; he would see. A IVIN FOR THE MONEYED MEMBER. Mr P. C. TTobb (Grey) said nothing had demonstrated more clearly the need for proportional representation than the present position. It was absolutely impossible for some members to cover all their electorates. It meant really that the man with money would win every time. A member must keep in touch with his electorate and how was a member with limited means to get on where ho had a very large district to travel over?, The present was ye'allv a golden opportunity to do away with the present bungling n nd discontent and introduce proportional representation. DRIVEN NORTHWARDS. Dr. Thacker said the cause of the big change in the South Island was tho fact, that the eons and daughters of the residents there were being driven northward. The whole trouble was that thero were large areas of land in the South Island that the holders would not break up. / A solution to tho present difficulty in regard to tho boundaries would bo overcome by proportional representation. The Bill was read a first time and tho second ,reading set down for nest sitting day. SOLDIER SETTLEMENT SECOND READING OF AMENDMENT BILL. 511 SOLDIERS ALREADY' SETTLED. On tho House resuming after tho dinner hour adjournment the Prime Minister moved the second reading of tho Discharged Soldiers’ Settlement Amendment Bill. 'i'ho measure, he stated, consisted simply otf a scries of six amendments winch tho experience of tho last _ two years in connection with the Soldiers’ Settlement Act of • 1915 and shown to bo necessary. Giving a summary of the number of returned soldiers who had been placed on tho land, Mr Massey said that 4-19 had been settled under the Soldiers’ Settlement Act, and tho total number settled to dale was 541. Of those 478 had applied for financial assistance. He thought that that was not a bad record in. tha circumstances. (Hear, hear.) A few of tbo.m who had taken up laud had been discouraged and did not stay there. They possibly did not consider themselves physically fit. But the 511 were the men on tha land to-day. He did not expect every man who went on to tho land to bo successful. Not every man was cut out for a farmer; but the proportion of failures up to tho present was very small indeed. (Hear, hear.) That said a good deal, not only for tho men. themselves, but also for tile land boards throughout the country whose business it was to select the now settlers. (Hear, hear.) mow ACRES AVAILABLE. The total area of hand now available for soldiers in all parts of the country was 19G.685 acres; in addition, two blocks of native land in tho Auckland district of ■abouti 4500 acres had been acquired, making an approximate total of 200,0(X) acres available at once for soldier settlement. Besides, there were two blocks pf good land, totalling 10,533 acres, in tho North Auckland district being held for soldiers. LANDS TO BE IMPROVED. Some of the blocks, he explained) were to bo improved by putting soldiers on to fell bush and prepare the land for cultivation on day labour; and those soldiers, when the land had been improved, would be given the first chance of taking it up. Altogether 41 private estates bad been purchased for the discharged soldiers to date, and of these 29 had been subdivided into 267 holdings, of which 181 ha.d been self died. Most of these estates, declared tho Premier. had been obtained at what were considered reasonable prices, though ho attempt® had been made to drive hard bargains. Fifty-nine of the farms had been taken up jn the Auckland district. 8 in Hawke’s Bay, 8 in Taranaki. 78 in Wellington, 7 in Marlborough, 16 in Canterbury, 11 to Otago, and 2 to Southland. Tho remaining 12 estates were being surveyed for subdivision, and avonld be made available as soon as possible. -CGI AN ACRE! Tho dearest land the Government purchased for the purpose was a farm of 25 acres near Palmerston North, for which .£65 an acre had been paid; but bp understood that, those who knew -the land stated that it was worth ,£BO an acre. In regard to the financial Assistance Department, the Prime Minister stated that up to date .£141,775 had been advanced to soldier settlers for improvement purposes, while the balance available was .£361,089. As stated, 475 had applied for advances, and advances had been authorised to -372. In the Fine Country, in 1902. some .£IO,OOO had been advanced to settlers, and of that sum .£BOOO had been paid back. That, he thought, was a good augury for the success of soldier settlement. They were bound to lose a little by soldier settlement, but be did not expect to lose much; and it would bo well worth it if they could settle successfully a large number of men on the land throughout the country. (Hear, hear.) PATRIOTIC SETTLERS. Ho was glad to notice tfc.e interest taken in the operation of the Act by members and by the people generally, and he greatly appreciated the assistance given to soldier settlors by patriotic settlors in different parts of New Zealand. Among these be might mention the late Mr G. P. Donnelly, who had been very enthusiastic in regard to the matter and had contributed liberally to assist soldier settlers. (Hear, hear.) Others ho might name were the Messrs Williams, upon the East Coast; Mr Perry, in the Wairarapa, who had presented 350 acres, valued at .£2O an acre, for a training farm; and Mr Whatman; and there wore many others. (Hear, hear.) The cost of building and fencing materials was one. of the difficulties that had to be met. There had been an advance of more than 50 per cent, on nominal prices; but he was, very glad to say that the Government had been able to pick up large quantities of fencing mate, rial at what were nowj, considered low prices. They bad. for instance, bought 130 tons of wire at .£l2 a ton below ruling market prices, and tho soldiers would get the benefit of that .£l2 a ton. A NOTE OF WARNING.

Mr G. Witty (Riccarton) urged that the Government should purchase land near the cities for soldier settlement and encourage intensive cultivation. He uttered a warning against sending soldiers into isolated districts where they might become depressed if they were left too much alone. . ~ , , Mr E. Newman (Rangitikei) said that the report read by the I'rimc Minister was a very pleasing one. But the Government would have to make up their minds to hold back ior soldier

spftleEirnt a largo amount of' land for the 70,000 or blK'tOO men who mignt he cominb back within the neat cigatcen moEths ov t-o. ALIENS AND SHIRKERS SROCLD DISGOKUL. A considerable amount of land suitable for close settlement was held ov aliens and by military shirkers, and it did not seem fair that these men should benefit by tho protection afforded by the men fighting at the front, and at the same time returned soldiers should have difficulty in getting good land. ! Hear, hear.) lie urged that the land should be taken at Government valuation and held for the returned soldiers. (Rear, hear.) They should have the pick of the land —the best Jand available. (Roar, hoar.) Tho Hon. A. L. Rerdman (Minister in charge of the Discharged Soldiers’ Information Department) said that the latest progress statement issued by tho department showed that there were now 11.191 soldiers on tho register*'* 1 Of these Saba had been disposed of ns follows : Men who have work to return to or have re-enlisted or returned to military duty, 3GS3; placed in employment. 1897; men who have signed “assistance not required/’ 2001; and of the remainder there were only 163 men looking for work. (Rear, hear.) The most gratifying feature was that the majoritv of the returned soldiers gave no trouble to the community. They did not bother about the State. They did not require the assistance of the Government; but immediately, through the influence of friends or through other channels, found work for themselves and settled themselves. (Hear, hear.) There seemed to be an impression abroad that a certain percentage of the returned soldiers were not much good—that they gave trouble to people—but. he was very glad to be able to say that the o.vnerieneo of his. department was to the contrary. (Hear, hear.) The men were evincing a desire to settle down to employment as speedily as possible: and it thjxt'Tpirit continued when the 80,009 men came back after tho war. it would make i(he work of his department very easy, and he, very gratifying to the people of Now Zealand. WHAT IS BEING DONE. Mr Rerdman stated that ho had boen in communication with various trade organisations with the idea of haying returned soldiers taken into trades right away, doing away with the necessity of their receiving instruction in technical schools. This ho considered would be infinitely better than technical schools. The problem of employing returned men after the war would be a big one. The Government had a scheme in hand and had outlined their proposals. Lists would bo prepared by the Defence authorities of the men arriving. It would be impossible to visit, each man, and it was proposed to send them letters plainly setting out what the department proposed to do for them. Disabled men would be visited and informed of the help that would be given them. Cabinet had been asked for -CI.OCO.OCO to provide for work for these men. A conference had been held with the heads oi Government Departments, and the scheme enthusiastically taken up. The Railway Department had informed him (hat they would absorb 5009 or 6000 of their employees .already at the front, also 780 other returned men. In addition 1000 would ho employed at other works. Mr Jennings (Taumarunni) said if the Government proposed to place men on the land at Afij per acre he would not like to be placed on the land in such a position. More notion was wanted from the Government and more practical methods. The Hon. D. Buddo said that at the prices at which the ■ land had been obtained. tho soldiers should be 'able to do well. The Government, however, must beware, of giving high prices for land for soldier settlement, because with tho land, at high prices and the prices cf produce decreasing after the war it would bo a very hard pro peso ticn for the men, and tho State could not allow them to go down. Ho urged the Minister in charge to add to his advisory boards a number of practical farmers who would be able to give very valuable advice and assistance in regard to soldier settlement.

Mr D. TL Guthrie (Orua) strongly supported the BUI. "MERELY TINKERING.”

Mr P. C. Webb (Grey) said that up to the present the Government had merely tinkered with the land question. Thcv had made, no serious attempt to bring about settlement. The purchase scheme was a, mere farce. It helped to fill the pockets of men who had purchased land for a mere song and were now demanding exorbitant prices for land whose value had born created by the community. Ko would like to see the Government deal with the question by means of taxation. It was nothing short of a national calamity {<> allow the unimproved value of the laud to increase at the rate of 10 to 10 millions sterling per year; and it was nothing short of robbery to allow men to pile up wealth because of Government expenditure on railways and roads—nothing short of robbery to expect the soldiers to pay big prices for such hand. The only way to settle the question was to make it impossible for men to hold thousands and thousands of acres out of use. The iinro inust come when the country would insist upon' the Government dealing thoroughly with the land question. They had got to say to the big landholders of tho country that their speculation and robbery inns'; cease, that the ooldiers and tlio people generally must have tho land and havo it at a- reasonable price; and tho way to secure that was not by land purchase, but by taxation. Mr C. J. Parr (Bden) said lie was disappointed that the officials who advised tho Government had failed t» provide suburban properties for the soldiers. Many soldiers would be anxious to tako up farming near the town. It would be inadvisable to ask soldiers coming back from the front to go and take up farming in tho solitude of the backblocks.

Mr C. A. Wilkinson (Egmont) spoke of good land in the Taranaki district which, he urged, would prove much more suitable for soldier settlement than tho back blocks and the land near the cities. One block of 1000 acres in particular, now held by one man. if cut up would afford fine holdings for 20 returned soldiers, and the settling of those men on tho land would greatly add to tho productivity of the district. (Hear, hear.)

Mr J. Anstcy (Waitski) suggested that it might be necessary to take comnulsory powers (o deal with on Privately-owned land to enable lortions of large farm* to b? secured for settlement. y Mr G. R. Sykes (Mastcrtcn) said tliat it was apparent that tome drastic yet equitable method would have to 'be adopted to obtain adequate land at a reasonable price fop .soldier settlement. It should be acquired at not more than the value obtaining before the war. They had no hesitation in conscripting young men of suitable age for military service; and it was only reasonable to suppose that, if land was required for those young men on their return to the coqntry, a compulsory system would be adopted to secure it for them. (Hear, hear.) Mr T. A. 11. Field (Nelson) held that the Government should offer special facilities for settling soldibr settlers on fruit farms -in Nelson and other districts. Community settlements would bo the best method of settling inexperienced farmers on fruit farms. lie understood that the Minister for Agriculture had a well thought out scheme for the purpose, but nothing had been done in regard to it.

Mr A. Harris (Waitcmata) supported the suggestion. There was abundance of very suitable Crown land in the north that should be made available for the purpose.

Mr W. H. Field (Oteki) supported the measure.

At J 2.10 p.m. the second reading wa« carried, and the House went into committee’ cn the bill. It was repented out c: committee at 12.15. and the House then adjourned till 2.-SO this afternoon.