CHARGES AGAINST THE POLICE.

New Zealand Times, Volume XXXIII, Issue 5504, 16 November 1878, Page 1 (Supplement)

CHARGES AGAINST THE POLICE.

The following extracts are the more striking portions of the evidence (,'iven by Mr. Shearman, superintendent of police, when before the Gauls Committee on the above matter : The Chairman] Do you remember the circumstances of Mr. Barton's complaint against the police in Wellington? Da you remember a complaint being made t»tho Goveruma it?—Yes. Was the matter referred to you ?—Yes. And you wrote a letter on the subject 7—l did. You had an enquiry made about those complaints? Yes: I made enquires to ascertain whether there was any ono to come forward to prefer a charge. And there whs not?—There was not. ifon ilfr Olsborne.] I un lerstind tiiere was no ono particularly charged?—No; nor could the person suppose I to bo 111-us.jd be found. This is tho e tor vnu sent to the Government on tho subject (read)?—Yos ; I sent that. Afr. Barton.] Did you learn that an offenco had been committed by anybody?—l did not. You say. in your letter, "Tho ■ ffenco is supposed to have bueu committed by some one who has now left the police force." What 'lid you mean ? Oil you hoar that this was tho c'so?—l meant that some ono who had left the police force was the porson accused —tho sergeant— who had loft tho Wellington force vrevio'is t/t my coming to Wellington. Sergeant Monaghan ?—Yes. How do you arrive at the conclusion that Monaghan was tho oliicer alluded to ? -I was told so by Inspector Atchison and the detective.

That Mr. Bar;on meant Monaghan ?—Yes. Ho was thon out of the police force ?—Ho was.

You had no reason to suppose that any officer now In the polico force was at all implicated ?—None whatever.

Hon. Mr. GiJborns.j When you wroto the words " supposed to have been committed," whom did you mean it was supposed by ?—" Supposed to have been committed."

Yes. Vou said the porson by whom it was supposed tho uffonce had been committed was not in the police force Why did you use tho word "suppose"? By whom was it supposed ?—By Mr. Barton. The Chairman.} How did Mr. Monaghan come to leave tho forco ?—I really do not know. X was not here then. It was before your time ?—Yes. ' Hon. Mr. Olsborne.] Did you commuulcato with Mr. Barton on tho subject ?—No : I instructed Mr. Atchison to make Inquiries to ascertain if* he could discover tho person said to have been ill-treated, or tho porson who had been guilty of tho ill-tre itmont. Mr- Bunny.] Mr. Barton had no notice from you that you were going 'to hold an inquiry?—l did not communlcato with Mr. Barton, as I said before. I reported so far to the Government, and I hoard nothing officially after that relative to tho inquiry. Mr. Swanson.] In a case like this I suppose it was desirable to get at tho truth?—Undoubtedly it was my duty to do so. Yot you did not communicate with Mr. Barton on tho matter, asking him to come and talk the matter over with you, and invite him to assist you to got at tho truth by giving you information, and being present at tho Inquiry?—No. I simply communicated with the Government, and awaitod further instructions.

Tho Government communicated with you and told yeu there was something wrong about the polico, and, X approheud, wished you to inquiro into tho wrongs ?—They sent me tho correspondence, and asked rae to make inquiries. Very well; what steps did you take to find out the truth ? How would you ordinarily go about the matter to find it out? Would you go to the accused, or to the accusers?—l should go to the acousers. In this case did you communicate with Mr. Barton and say, "Here, come up and tell me all about this, and let us find out the truth?"—f first made inquiries.

Of whom ?—Of Mr. Atchison and tlie detective. Were they not tho nccmed?—Thoy were the persons I 100 ed to to get evidence.

If a ro d>ery was committed, to whom would you go? To the person who committed the robbery, or the person wh>> had lost something?— fills was not a jobbery. It was something wrong though. If I understand it, It was some'hing worse than a robbery that was to bo Investigated. It was a charge of gross cruelty un tho part of the police to a membor of the community, and it appears to me you rushed off to the accused persons to get evidence. What I should cousldor tho proper mode of proceeding to get at the truth would havo been to have communicated with Mr. Barton, sh wii him your instructions, and asked hs assistance to sheet the thing home, if the accused men woro guilty, and not tu have gono to the*a others to havo put thom on their guard ?—That is what I .proposed doing ; but I was requested not to apply to Mr Barton.

Who requested that?—Tile Under Secretary for Defence.

Is:that lotter in the corrcspondenco?—lt was a verbal communication. Eon. Mr. Oiaborne J Could you tell us the cxaot words ho used ?- -No ; ho Intimated It was better not to communlcato with Mr. Barton on tho subject. Did he give you any reasons t—l do not remember that he dlil; Ido not think he did.

ilfr. Bunny.] Suppose there was a case of robbery, and it was placod In your hands as direotor of tho police, should you take the advice or direction of Colonel Keador if he said, " Oh, don't bother looking after the case ; It is all right." Should you bo d-dng* your duty if you did?—Yes, I should; became I must obey the orders of the head of tho department, and: the orders of the department on through Colonel Kcad»r.

Aro yon bound to oboyf Suppose a robbnry was committed, and it iyas committed by a Mend of the Government, and suppose that, when you. In tho

exorcise of vnttr du'.y. were taking steps to bring the "AT nder to justice, vou received a verbal cnmmunlca tin from the lie id of tlio •I-pirtme t, saying, "Oh. we know tint s B is gniltv e.'iou.jh ; but v< do n>t want tin thin? hrought home tihim. Do nothing more in themttter" Wool i you take such instriicrinn*?—[ do not think such i istructious would ba given

ik'f is an inqulrv into a case of gro s illusa.'e of a mm, and vou chose to take verbal I structions not. from the hea of tin department, bu'. fro'o an Un ler-Secretary. who avs.

" Don't cimmiriicate wi h the man who m akes the complaint: don't go near him : don't touch him " We want to look into the thins. Tt is a much worse cass than a robbery?—l think I should ba guided by tho law in such"a case.

Hon. Mr. QUbortu] Do you remember whether, when Colonel R-mder intimated this to you. it was as his own opinion, or as an Instruction from the Minister? -I do not.

JVfr £olc.] Was the impression left upon your mind that he meant you to get Information from independent sources from that of Mr. Barton ?—I do not know what his meaning was. Did you take his meaning to be that he wished to stifle the case by not setting information from Mr. Barton ?-I cannot say what his meaning was. I can say nothing but what he told me. . What his impress:on and intentions were are known to himself, and you nan get them from him. You mast have taken some meaning from what he said. What did you gather: that he wished hi to suppress information, or that you were to getinforma* tion from independent sources?—[ really hink he ms <nt that Mr. Bartoi was not a-t agreeable person to deal with, and that any other person would be prefer--able to get- information from. That was my liupres' sion at the time.

Mr. Swanson you a general question about going to accused persons. Ido not un lerstand that the Inspector of Police was accused ?—There was no one accused.

The policemen were accused ?—A person supposed to have 1-ift the service was the person accused. Tht' hairman.) Did you not .understand that the discipline of the W- llington police was on its trial ? No.

Son. Mr. Gisborne ] I suppose you went to Mr. Atchison as the head of the police? —Yes; as the person in charge ot the district. I cannot think that Mr. Atchison would hare any object in cloaking tho police, especially a nnrson who had left the force. I sliould thi-ik he was ths best person to go to for evidence. Mr. Tote Mr. Swanson seems to rogarl tho officers of the' police here as the ners ns accused, which Ido not take to bo the case at all ?-—No :it was Polic-man X against whom tho complaints wen made, and I asked Mr Atchison who Policeman X w.aa. jbTr. fviinson] I suppose you went to Mr Atchlsin to inquire who Policeman X was in conseqnene ■ o' instructions ; but. bad you been left to yourself to do what vou thought right, would you have gone slap to Mr. Barton to h ve seen what evidence could have been produce 1, in order to sheet the charges home ? I should have gone to Mr. Barton afterward', when I had found out tho person who had committed the offence, and then asked Mr. Barton to produce his evidence, and entered into a proper investigation : but I never could get at the fact that anybody in the service had committed tho off-nee.

Would not the proper course have be.°n to have I'One to Mr. Barton direct, instead of to the i eople who were charged ?—That was not my view of tho matt r. I thought Mr: U'hison and tho detective the oest pers-i-s to tell ms who Policeman X was.

Better than Mr. ISarton. with his witnesses, who had actually got the kicking, and kna » nil abiut It? Do you not think the evi ience of the persons assaulted better than mythlng Mr. Atchison co lil supply?—l stated I should have gone to Mr. Barton if 1 had been left to ray own discretion. Hon. Mr. Gisoome.] Also to Mr. Barton ?—Yes. Mr. Tole.] To whom first?—To tho head of the district, so as to ascertain who tho offender was.

Mr Swanson.] And by this me ms the po'ice would have been put on their guard ?—T'ipy would have bo n put on their guard by Mr. Barton's speech, previous to my taking any steps in the matter. Mr. Barton.] Yrni saw Farrell. Now, what did Inspector Atchison tell you that caused you to seoDe* tective Farrell?--He did not tell me anything to cause rao to see Farrell.

What inquiries did you make of Inspector Atchison? —I asked him who Policeman X was, and if ho knew anything abou tho charges which were preferred In Mr. Barton's speech. w What did ho say ?—Ho said that It was all nonsense —that Mr Barton was a crotchety sort of person. That was the substance of what he said ?—Thoro was some oflioial communication. I think I referred tho correspondence to him, but I am not sure. That was after the verbal communication, in whic'i ho said he was under the impression there was nothing In tho matter?—Yes ; ho -aid ho thought ther j wa< no truth in it. He paraded the men. and asked if there was any truth in tho matter, but discovered nothing. Yuu sent him an official communication, t J llmg him to make inquiry ?—Yes ; after I received the correspondence from tho Under Secretary I sent it to Inspector Atchison.

Now, tho inquiry ho made was to parade tho men ? —Ho made inquiries. Did ho parade the men?—T do not kno». He never told you ?—I do not think ho did; he might have done 80. Did you hear it from anybody else?—l saw it in the papa s. Did he never tell you what course he took ? —He was to take the be-.t cour3e he could.

Assuming the course ho took was toparads the man, (suppose when thoy came to parade ho would call thorn to attention J—You may suppose that It you please: I do not know. Woll, what course wou'd you have taken. Would you tiave paraded them all. and asked firat and tlien i lie ottier, or put the question to tho whor« of them together?—l do not think that is the course I should liavi taken had I made the inquiry.

Now, t want to get at this : Assuming th t was thcourse tak -n. do you think there would hive been tha least chanc of finding tho in itter out, sup losing Policeman X was in the ranks at tho timj ?—Policeman X could not bo in the ranks. If tho mm supposed to have committed the offence was an ei-pnliceman.

I did not say he was au ex-policeman ?—But you said it was Policeman X. You did not suppose because I said Policoman X that I meant an ex-policeman ?—Yes, I did. Do you not know that X is an unknown quantity ? —I took your meaning to be a nian wuo had left tho Jlfr. Swanson.] Polireman X mUht be past or pre-sent?-Tnat is according to the view au indivilual might take of the speech. I thought, when Mr. Barton spoke of Policeman Xin his speech, that h» referred to an ex-polico'iian. You do not road Punch ?—Yes. I do. lam very well acquainted with .Punca: nevertheless, in this case I thought an ex-po'iceman was meant. Mr. Swanson.] 1 am a good deal astonished at this sort of thing. I understand you received instructions to make inquiry, to examine witnesses, and that sort of tiling?—l received instructions from Colonel Reader to inquire into the matter : and I did so. You roceivo I Instructions from Colenel Reader to inquire into tho complaints r— The papers were forwar led for my attention. What did you do ?—I did make inquiries. I was a stranger in the placo : I knew no one ; and I went to the Inspector of Police, and tho detective, as the persons l thought best able to inform me who Policeman X was. Then, instead of inquiring yourself, you got these tiro men to make Inquiry ?—Tint is the proper course. I cannot do everything myself. I have a good many men under me—l einnot be everywhere at once ; and I took tho course I thought best to bo pursued. Then, so far as this wa» concerned* you were of no use at all. Do you think you went the right way about tho business. Instead »f you your olf parading the men, or sending for them individually and examining each of them separately, without le ting ihern know what you hoard of from the others, you go direct'to Atchison. It you had wanted to get at tho facts, would not tho other way have beau the best one?—No: it would have Interfered with the discipline of tho forco. I am not t lkng about discipline. I am talking about tho best w.y of getting at a crime. I ask whether that would not, at any rate, bo as go d a way as getting tho inspector to parade the force and a<k them all, in tiio presence of one another, "Do you kn-iw anything about this ?"—The parading of tho men was the courso d 'pted by Inspector Atohison. Mr. Barton] Havingf undthatlnspo tor Atchison could get no information of any valno at all, did you Rgaiu see Colonel Reader. ; nd report that to him ? The corrospondonco will show what I said to Colonel Reader.

ilfr. Barton.] You say In your lotter to the Commissioner of Armed Constabulary—that Is, Colonel Header?—No; that is Colonel Whitmore. Well you say (road). Now, whore did you get information that tho alleged offonco was supposed to havo been committed some time ago?—From the do. The detective told vou the alleged offence had taken place some time ago ?—Yes. Then you wero aware the offenco had been committed?— nil. no; I was not aware any offence had been oommltted. ~,.., , . You say the detectivo told you it had taken placo ? —That it wassupposed to havo tikon place. Well, what did the detectivo tell you ? You have told us what Inspector Atchison said?—l asked him if ho thought thoro was any truth in the report, and ho shook his head, and said ho did not think there was any truth in tho i enort. Therefore you concluded tho ofTenco took place some time ago?—From what I saw in the papers I supposed it . nil ta en pi ce some timongo, because Sergeant Monaghan was suspected. I did not say Sergeant Monaghan f—l cannot say what you said. . You had an extract handod to you which was sent to tho Government by the Mayor of Wellington?— That contained a charge that an.offence liad been committed, and you confirm that by adding the further fao-. th it tho offence it supposed to have taken place somo time ago 7 I had no reason for making that statement beyond what I gleaned from the inquiries I made, and from what I saw In tho publio prints. '