LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL.

New Zealand Times, Volume XXXIII, Issue 5467, 4 October 1878, Page 2

LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL.

Thursday, October 3. The Hon. the Acting-Speaker took the chair at the usual hour. REPORTS* ETC. The Hou. Mr. WATERHOUSE brought up the reports of the Waste Lauds Committee on the Bluff Harbor Bill and on the Ormond Military Grants Bill.—Reports read. The Hon. Sir F. BILLON BELL asked for a copy of the papers laid on the table of the other House relating to the meetings between Rewi and the Premier. The Hon. Colonel WHITMORE promised that the papers should be presented as soon as possible. The Hon. Sir F. BILLON BELL asked for a return showing the area of the native lands for which claims were made and were under investigation at the Native Lauds Court, The Hou. Colonel WHITMORE explained that although they would order-this return to be prepared, it would have to be made in Auckland,. and would tako a considerable time. On the motion of the Hon. Captain Baillie, it was resolved that the petition of the ratepayers of the Ellesmere, South Rakaia, and Ashburton districts should be referred to Government for their consideration. MR. ROBINSON’S CONTEMPT. The Hon. Mr. ROBINSON desired to intimate that he was prepared lo pay his £SO fine forthwith. As he wished to exonerate himself as far as possible from the charge of h wing treated the Council with contempt, he .called upon Sir Billon Bell to relate* the matter as it had occurred. The Hou. Sir DILLON BELL explained that he was certain that Mr. Robinson had never contemplated any contempt in absenting, himself from the Council. He regretted that he was not in his place yesterday, when, with the information he was able to give, he might have proved a better advocate of Mr, Robinson’s cause. His own absence from the Council yesterday was owing to his having made a previous engagement to be present at a trial of a new engine for the Featherston line, a subject that had long engaged his attention and in which he was much interested. The Hon. Mr. CAMPBELL gave notice that he would move next day that the resolution of the Council in respect to the absence of Mr, Robinson be rescinded. BILLS READ A TH’RD TIME. The Rating Act Amendment Bill and the Patumahoe Site Bill were read a third time and passed. THE TEMPORARY POWERS BILL. The Hon. Colonel. WHIT MOR Hi explained that this Bill was only rendered necessary by the fact that certain measures dealing more fully with defects in the Counties Act might. not pass through both Houses this session, A more extended experience of the working of the Counties’ Act was required before that system could be said to have had a fair trial. This Bill was only intended to deal with certain technical defects. The Hon. Dr. POLLEN thought it was unadvisable to press for the second reading of this or of any Bill until it had first been circulated. He had no objection to the Bill itself.

The debate was adjourned until next day. THE ELECTORAL BILL..

The Hon. Colonel WHITMORE said that this was a very impoitant measure, and was intended to simplify and to widen the franchise. Having explained the objects of the various qualifications for Europeans, he _ said that the Maori franchises as proposed in the Bill were not in any respect novel. They were only intended to retain the present rights existing. He thought that the most desirable course to adopt would be to abolish the special representation and to treat both races upon an equality. At present this was impossible, and this Bill was only brought forward as a reasonable compromise. There was no likelihood of a general election this year. Next year a Bill for the redistribution of seats would probably be brought forward,' and the Maori representation would then be dealt with more fully. The block vote of the Maoris was certainly no more likely to be injuriously exercised than was the block vote of religious bodies, of licensed victuallers, or even of Freemasons. He explained the provisions of the Bill for registration, for keeping the roll clear of dummy votes. For his own part he would far rather see a vote given to every male person in the colony than allowed to remain in the hands of the so-called middle class. A little knowledge was such a dangerous thing that ho believed a greater sense of justice existed in the higher and lower classes than was to be found among the middle classes, He was not in the least afraid of manhood suffrage. Up to the present the experiment of the introduction of Maori members had proved most satisfactory, so that there was a great reason for giving them further privileges. The Hon. Mr. N6ATATA said _ he only rose to apeak about the Maori franchise. The Maoris did not want to vote for European members. Let them vote only for their own. Maoris, under this clause, would vote for elections of which they knew nothing. He objected to the clause, as likely to cause a feeling of irritation between the two races. When the Bill went into committee ihe would move for the erasure of this clause. The Hon. Mr. WATERHOUSE considered this by far the most imoortant measure which had come before the Council since he had sat within it. The Bill was neither more nor less than the introduction of manhood suffrage. The honest and expressed object of the Bill was to double the number of voters. He had in his early political life been a warm advocate of universal suffrage. His vote in Australia had been recorded in favor of manhood suffrage. He had gone over to America many years ago with the object of seeing how universal suffrage worked, and he loft it with the firm conviction that it had proved a great boon and a great success. But he had overlooked many important considerations in common with many others at the time. He had since found reason to modify his views very much, and instanced the change in the spirit of the laboring classes that had taken place in America. The lamentable state of American society, and the corruption of the Government, were generally attributed to the evils of universal suffrage, to the fact of having committed the power of choosing the Legislature into the hands of the class least fitted to exercise it wisely. He referred to Victoria as a further illustration of the danger of giving the power of government into the hands of any one class. Ho knew that true liberalism consisted in the advancement of measures for material, moral, and social progress. Theoretically, he was still an advocate of every man uqder the law having a voice in framing the law; but in practice ho recognised a very great many objections to extending the franchise. He was satisfied that this Bill would not introduce a better form of government into the colony. He would therefore oppose the .Bill. It was dangerous to put largo political power into the hands of men with no political convictions. No reason had been shown for the introduction of this measure ; what class could be said to exist that was unrepresented, or that was oppressed under the existing franchise ? The effect of this measure would be to upset the present balance of political power, aud to create a dominating class. It such power were-given to any one claes, it would end by exercising that power.

The country at large had expressed no desire for the change introduced. No petition had been presented in favor of such a measure. The introducer of the Bill,(Oolonel Whitmore) wa* recognised as a conservative among con-, servatives; he himself (Mr. Warehouse) was a lib ral among liberals. All over the world now. in Italy, America, Belgium, and England, the conservatives were advocating the extension of the franchise, because they thought they could manipulate the voces. Ho hoped to see every voter having only one vote and only allowed to vote for one candidate. It was certainly wrong to allow any one branch of the Legislature to absorb the legislative functions in the State, Now more especially it was desirable to avoid hasty legislation, which might seriously affect the welfare of future generations.

The Horn. Dr. GRACE thought it was very desirable to encourage the cultivation of an inte'ligent interest in political affairs. Hitherto the country had been to a great extent governed in the interests of the wealthier classes. The interests of the poorer classes had not been sufficiently considered in the legislation of the colony connected with the administration of the land: they had not had the opportunity they desired of obtaining small blocks of laud. In the past a large number of persons capable of exercising an intelligent vote in electing representatives had been debarred from doing so. In other countries the large cities were the hotbeds of iniquity, and went far to produce the evils that he must admit had followed the introduction of manhood suffrage. In New Zealand this danger could hardly be said to exist. In America respectable men would not soil their hands with the amount of corruption necessarily connected with political life there. If the whole measure was to be judged by the crude nature of the proposal contained in clause 18 the Bill deserved the strongest possible condemnation. He spoke very strongly against the injustice of allowing- a number of natives to exercise a vote they neither wished for nor understood. It was giving the natives what they did not want, and refusing them what they desired. He had great faith in the genius, logic, and wisdom of the Maori chiefs, but he thought this measure would tend te weaken their power. The alteration in the position of native affairs was due to the fact that the Maoii chiefs appreciated the changes going on around them. The Hon. Dr. POLLEN moved the adjournment of the debate until next day. FIRST READINGS. The Bank Holidays Act and the Oamaru Athenaum and Mechanics’ Institute BUI were read a first time. At the evening sitting an invitation of members to a ball in honor of the opening of the Wairarapa railway was read. BILLS. The Tlmaru High School Act was read a first time. The Road Board Bill was discharged from the Order Paper. The Mount Ida Waterrace Trust Bill.— The Hon. Colonel Whitmore stated that ha had made enquiries and next day proposed to withdraw his opposition to the Bill, The Bill was read a second time, and ordered to be committed next day. THE MUNICIPAL CORPORATIONS ACT AMENDMENT. This Bill was further considered in committee.—An amendment was inserted requiring all streets to be at least fid feet in width. On the quest! >n of exempting wharves, waterworks, and Crown property from paying rates, the Hon. Mr. Hall wished that some definite principle could be laid down under which these exemptions should be made. He did uot believe in the exemption of Crown property from liability for rates, and would gladly see it done away with.

The Hon. Colonel WHITMORE was not inclined to admit that this was the right place or time to open so large a question. The clause was postponed.

A considerable discussion arose on the clause permitting the corporation of any municipality under certain circumstances to erect gasworks of their own. The Hon Colonel WHITMORE thought that this was only a safeguard in the interests of the to prevent a company holding a monopoly from supplying bad gas at a high figure. He was inclined U favor the proposal, although no doubt the power might be abused in some cases in the hands of an unscrupulous corporation. The Hon. Me. WATERHOUSE thought • this was really a proposal to place private companies entirely at the mercy of the corporation. ’ A great many members thought it would bo very unjust to allow a corporation to enter into competition with a private company, that was obliged to earn a profit, whereas a corporation could carry on the business at a loss. The amendment was struck out on the voices.

On clause 15, which proposed the repeal of sections 350 and 351 of the Act of 1876, which made provision for an endowment of 2000 acres of land to he made to any municipality,—the Hon. Colonel Whitmore ex? plained that it had become necessary to put a stop to the numerous applications from every petty borough for an endowment in land. The land of the colony could not stand the drain upon it. After considerable debate the clause was retained by 19 against 3. Clauses 18 and 20 were postponed. The consideration of the postponed clauses was then proceeded with. Clause 10 was amended so as to exempt all wharves, river protection or harbor works, under any harbor board or local body, from the payment of rates. The provision rendering such works liable for rates up to the unimproved value of the land was struck out. The other clauses were passed with minor amendments. Progress was reported, and leave given to sit % agaiu. . The Council adjourned at 10.25 p.m.