CHAMBER OF COMMERCE.

New Zealand Times, Volume XXXIII, Issue 5377, 21 June 1878, Page 7

CHAMBER OF COMMERCE.

Aspeoial meeting of the Chamber of Commerce was held on June 14th, to consider the kerosene question, which has agitated the public mind so much of late. There were present— Mr. Krull, president (in the chair), and Messrs. George, Thomas, Hunter, G. Crawford, 0. O'Neill, Deacon, Port, Tolhurst, Nathan, Capper, Dransfield (Mayor), Mills, Levin, Mountain, Campbell, L, Levy, Bethune, T. K. Macdonald, Harcourt, and Captain Mclntyre. Mr. Kemsley, of Benwick, Kemsley, and Co., of London, was present by invitation.

The President said he thought the action the City Council had taken with repect to kerosene, by enforcing the provisions of the Dangerous Goods Act, was very right, as far' as the protection of the public was concerned. Unintentionally, a .great deal of kerosene had been imported which would not stand the test provided by law of not flashing at a lower temperature than 110 degrees. Formerly all the kerosene stood that test, hut its quality appeared to have been gradually lowered, and the Government had taken a very proper step in putting a veto upon its importation. He had been thinking over the matter a good deal, and would give his ideas upon it. It was he thought the duty of the Chamber to ask tho Government to take action throughout New Zealand, so that Wellington should not be treated exceptionally. It appeared to him absolutely necessary that a telegram should be despatched, either through the Chamber or the Government, to the representative of England in America, stating that the New Zealand Government refused to accept as kerosene any oil which did not stand the test of 110 degrees, so as to prevent further shipments to New Zealand of any inferior oil. It was clear that the kerosene in stock would entail a very heavy loss upon the importers. He had some on the way out by which ho would lose, hut still he thought the action of the Government had been proper. The importers would have just to grin and bear the loss as they had borne many others. The Chamber should try to get some redress from America. He did not think that any firm dealt directly with Devoe, hut bought through agents, and he thought if joint action were taken by the merchants some redress might be secured. He was not aware what the law iu America was as to the exportation of kerosene, but he believed it was provided that the oil exported must be of a certain specific gravity, and there was no test as to the flashing point. If that was the case some precaution ought to be taken to have the, oil tested. Mr. Kemsley, who represented B. W. Forbes, of New York, thought joint action might enable the importers to recover from Devoe and Co. any claim they might have; but that of course would depend upon the law in America. In such a case as this it was only the duty of the Government to take the matter up to protect merchants from heavy loss, and they should call in the diplomatic service to help them. In fact, England should make a claim upon America for the loss the merchants had suffered. It would be right that the Government should communicate with Australia, so that similar action might be taken there. If it was discovered that the Americans had tl done” the merchants, it would only be fair that the Government should assist the mercantile community, and he had no doubt that they would do so. Such things were done in Germany, and similar claims had been enforced very successfully. Where merchants had suffered it had been made a Government question, and the demand had been enforced even by sending men-of-war. (Laughter.) In every instanee justice had been secured. Members might laugh at what he said, but it was ’ only right that the English Government should protect their subjects from a heavy loss. He believed that Devoe exported the Nonpareil oil, which stood a flashing test of 150 degrees. They ought to prefer to import an article for which they paid a little dearer, hut which was good and genuine. Mr. Tolhurst asked whether importers, when ordering kerosene, stipulated that it would stand the teat required by the Government of New Zealand ? If that was not stipulated he did not see what recourse could be had against the exporters or vendors. The President said that when giving an order he only stated so many oases of Devoe’s, without any further particulars. Mr. Nathan thought they must look upon their loss as having been made, and write it off. He imagined that the American exporters would not admit any claim, and the only protection importers would have in future would be to order kerosene that would stand the required test. Kerosene had been used for many years, and it was only lately that any accidents had taken’ place. Ne doubt danger was mainly caused through carelessness. It seemed an injustice to importers for the Government to send notice to those who were in possession of kerosene that it would not be allowed to remain iu store, and it was not to be sold. What he was to do with his kerosene ho did not know. Personally he felt interested in making his loss as little as possible. It would he more to the purpose to get the Government to remove the restriction until the holders had time to obtain other kerosene. That would be more practical, and he would like that the kerosene now afloat might he used. Mr. C. O’Neill urged that scientific opinion should be taken: to ascertain whether something might not be introduced into the kerosene which would prevent it flashing at as low a, temperature as 80, 00, or 100 degrees. Mr. Dransfield thought the previous speakers were under a misapprehension as to tho action the Government had taken in this matter. Every Englishman was supposed to know tho law, and all tho Government had done was to suggest to tho city authorities that it was their duty to see the existing lawproporly carried out. Tho municipal authorities had be believed been lax in this respect. Merchants had no doubt made a mistake In not enquiring as to tho quality of the kerosene they imported. They simply sent an order to get Devoe’s kerosene at the lowest price, and they could havo no claim against tho exporters. Mr. E. W. Mills had always ordered Devoe's kerosene, naming the number of cases, without saying anything as to the quality. The name Devoe stood well in ■ the market, and no one would think of ordering tho “ best.” It was quite sufficient to say you required so many cases of Devoe. No man worthy of the name of a merchant would think of ordering an inferior quality so os to got it cheap, and Devoe having a namo to keep up would not export two qualities under the same hand. It was necessary to uso care in burning kerosene, and if that were done he did not think there would be danger. Mr. Dransfield did not intend to reflect in any way upon the integrity of the importers. He had been given to understand that Devoe shipped two qualities of kerosene. Mr. Baker said in all tho circulars Devoe’s oil was only quoted as of one quality. Mr. Levin thought importers, did not allow such an idea to exist as that there were two qualities of Devoe's kerosene. He had imported Devoe’s for many years, and had never heard a rumor of such a thing. Captain Thomas could not endorse tho approval expressed at tho action of tho Govern-

nient., The Act had been passed as far back as 1860, and had laid dormant until now. The least the Government might have done was to give six months’ notice, in, order .to prepare holders and importers for this action. He had paid duty on some of this oil, and had applied for a refund. .

Mr. Geobqb said some of the speakers seemed to imagine that kerosene which would not stand the test was unsaleable ; but that was not the case. It could be sold if marked “Dangerous.—No light to be brought near.” That warned consumers to bo careful. Mr. Travers referred at length to the legal bearing of the question as between exporters and importers. He was clearly of opinion, that there was an implied contract that oil which would bear the legal test should be supplied. There was a good deal of scare about the danger of kerosene, but if lamps were well cleaned and properly used there was but little risk. Unfortunately it was not the intelligent portion of the community that had to be considered, but the ignorant and careless had to be protected against themselves. Mr. Bannatvnb thought the merchants were under the impression that they had lately received an article equal to that imported some years ago. He had taken that for granted, and it had never occurred to him to ask that the kerosene to be shipped should stand the test. He had never heard that a commission agent had been ordered to send an article as cheap as he could get it. Mr. Gaiter said it was quite a mistake; to suppose that there were two qualities sold as Dovoe’s. The Nonpareil, which did not flash under 150 degrees, was a different brand. His firm had always purchased Devoe’a ordinary brand at as low a price as they could get itp because it was all the same brand. Mr. Hunter pointed out that Devoe's kerosene, when tested, proved to vary very much in quality. There would be three or four qualities in one shipment, and in some tested there was as great a difference as 9 deg. With respect to what had been said as to the action of the Government, he would say he would be very sorry to admit that any Government had the right to suspend the action of a law. That would be a very dangerous principle to admit. The Act had been passed many years ago, and all were more or less acquainted with it. The Government had their duty to do, and the city authorities had theirs. It appeared to him that the hardship to importers would not be very great, because they would be allowed to sell the oil if they marked it dangerous, so that people might be careful when using it. He had been given to understand that the quality of the oil in stock could be improved by simple means, and a scientific opinion should be taken upon it. Mr. Kemslev could not understand how it was that Devoe’s kerosene would not stand the test, for it ought to stand it at 115 or 118 degrees. The Nonpariel, a special oil, stood the test at 150 degrees. As to the oil being dangerous, he would be perfectly willing to burn oil that flashed at 85 degrees if care were used. HebelievedthatDevoe andCo.would makegood any loss sustained in consequence of inferior oil being sold under their brand. They were not refiners, but merely packers. It was possible that having to contend against great competition, which cut down the prices, they had bought some oil that would not stand the test. No commission agent in New York or Wellington would be held liable for that, and any action would be against Devoe and Co. After this a very long discussion ensued, it being generally of a conversational character. Various suggestions were made as to telegraphing to the representative of the British Government at New York, or to the American exporters of kerosene, to prevent the export of any more oil that would not stand the test at 110 degrees. It was forcibly pointed out that action should be taken to provide a proper store for the petroleum now in the city and for cargoes afloat. Finally, on the motion of Mr. Travers, seconded by Mr. Nathan, it was agreed,— That it is expedient that the committee of this Chamber do place themselves in communication with the City Council and the Government, with the view of discovering means for meeting the difficulty arising out of the presence in the city of considerable stocks of kerosene oil which has been reported to be dangerous, and to report to the Chamber as soon as possible. The meeting then adjourned.