DEPUTATION TO THE MINISTER FOR LANDS.

New Zealand Times, Volume XXXIII, Issue 5375, 19 June 1878, Page 2

DEPUTATION TO THE MINISTER FOR LANDS.

A deputation, consisting of Messrs. Coffey, Dixon, Meech, Berg, Daniels, and Woods, waited upon the Minister for Lands yesterday, by appointment, to represent matters which affected the shipbuilding and shipwright interest.

Mr. Coffey, : who acted as spokesman, said the members of the deputation had taken the ■ liberty of asking an interview respecting several matters connected with the trade. The slip which his firm (Coffey and Dixon) proposed to laydown at Oriental Bay had been stopped by the Government after they had asked and obtained permission to construct it. In view of the approaching filling up of the water at Coffey and Dixon's slip, also •at Meech’s slip and others along the Te, Aro beach, they desired to learn.where they could obtain other sites. It was. essential, to their trade that they should have a water frontage, and the proposed reclamation ..would -entirely shut them out.’ .His firin ’had applied to the Government for permission to lay down a small slip at Oriental-quay, and already they had gone to considerable expense, and incurred heavy liabilities in connection with it, acting upon the permission they had received. Now they had suspended operations. If they were not allowed to use the foreshore in Oriental-quay, they might not be allowed to use any part of it inside of Peucarrow Heads. If the Government could not grant 'permission for, land at Oriental Bay, they could not grant permission :for it anywhere else. The shipwrights of: Wellington formed a very numerous body, who really did not know what to do in the present, state of affairs, for in twelve months they would be shut out from all water frontage, and the trade weuld be stopped. They desired to know whether it was not possible for the Government to assist them in some way to get a water - frontage; and if that, could not be done, whether the Government wpuld.deal with the whole question. Mr. Maoandrew said. Oriental Bay was within the city boundary, but he did not think there would be any difficulty as to a site outside the city boundaries. He had given this matter a good deal of attention, and lie in fact sympathised very much With their view of the question; because he thought it would be a very ffiard case if this industry were to be banished from the place. There were of course public rights, and if the people who possessed them objected there could be no help for it. The first he heard of this matter was from a deputation who waited upon him with a petition signed by a considerable number of people who objected to the erection of a slip at Oriental Bay, and that led to an inquiry as to the legal position of the case. On the 27th April he wrote a memorandum to the Law Officers of the ' Crown, and it was found that the ' Government had no power to grant permission to construct the slip, and the Government would have no power to maintain them in possession as the law stood. Any of the petitioners could proceed against the owners of a slip for trespass, and if the case went to the Supreme Court there could only be one decision.! Under these circumstances he gave instructions that Messrs. Goffey and Dixon should be apprised of the state of the case. The Solicitor-General had gone into the subject very carefully, and he was of opinion “ that no legal permission could be given for even a temporary purpose. It was true that works of various kinds had been constructed on the shores of this and other harbors, but in most cases they were only permitted to exist on sufferance, the owners being doubtless aware that they had no legal rights. He did not know whether Messrs. Coffey and Dixon were prepared to erect their:proposed works upon these conditions, hut as the lawstood at present the Government could not extend to them any protection or guarantee any certainty of the continuance of the ‘ slip there. Any person occupying a portion, of the foreshore without legal authority would, be liable to be proceeded against by indictment as for a public nuisance.” That was in: effect the opinion of the Crown Law Officer, It only applied to land within the city boundaries. Judging by wbat had been dons elsewhere he thought they might get a three years’ lease of a part of the foreshore, under the Public Reserves Act; hut any term beyond that would require legislation. It would be absurd to suppose that shipbuilding was to be prohibited within the Heads. Mr. Coffey thought Mr. Maoandrew would be aware from his experience in tho South that the nearer slips and ship-yards were to the public wharves and the town the better it was for the commerce of the port.

Mr. Maoandrew said this had been a vexed question ever since the foundation of the colony. In the towns which were laid out by the New Zealand Company directions were given to reserve the 4 foreshore within the municipal boundaries.' He was at Home at the time, and he remembered that the idea was this : The Thames was built close up to in London, there was no roadway along its banks, and it was thought it would be better to preserve the new cities of this colony from such a state of things. ’ He did not doubt that applied to Wellington as it did to other places. As far as he could see nothing could be done without legislation, and he did not know how far the Legislature would bo warranted in granting such rights within the city boundaries. Mr. Coitey asked whether it would be possible, in the event of the Te Aro reclamation being carried out in its entirety, for the Government to hold a portion of the foreshore at the eastern end of the reclamation, at Olydequay for instance, and -to set it apart for the use of engineers, shipbuilders, boatbuilders &o.? ■ Mr, Macandrew thought it ought to be

done, and it would Be possible to do so by legislation. It: would be very reasonable to take steps to get it done, and he did not think; it would interfere with anybody. Mr. Coffey said, it would be a great thing to have it done. ~ . , Mr. Ma’oandrew asked whether it was intended to have on the land to be reclaimed a roadway along the water side ?.-■■■■ Mr. Coffey recollected that on _ Mr. O’Neill’s original plan of the reclamation a roadway was’ shown between the water and the building sites. Mr. Maoandrew said it would be quite competent for the Government in laying out the Thorndon reclaimed land to make provision that a part abutting on the water should be let for the purposes referred to by the deputation, and if that were: possible in the one case it would be in the other, Mr. Coffey : That is what we want.

Mr. Macandrew pointed out that the City Corporation were going to make the Te Aro reclamation, and they had a Crown grant for the land. It was clear that the Corporation were in favor of the industry, for one of the reasons which actuated the Government to agree to a slip being erected at Oriental Bay was that the Council recommended it.

Mr. Coffey pointed out that the. shipwrights formed a large and influential body, numbering 150 to 180 men, who would be thrown out of work if they were prohibited from getting a part of the foreshore. Mr. MaCASDREW, so far as his knowledge of the case went, believed that the Governor had power to deal temporarily with-the foreshore outside, the city boundaries, subject to legislation for anything permanent. The .same right that had enabled the Patent Slip to be erected would apply. The Government had no power to act inside the municipality, however desirous they might be of meeting the views of the deputation. Of course ho was not pronouncing any opinion as to the wisdom of the opposition to the erection of the slip or otherwise. He did not know that any great harm could result from these slips. They would not block up the quay, or at all events only when a vessel was being hauled up or launched. Mr. Coffey admitted that sometimes at their present slip they obstructed the roadway: a little, but at the proposed site it would be clear of the road altogether. . ‘ - Mr. Macandrew . thought the .Municipal Council should be communicated with in reference to laying aside a portion of the water frontage for such purposes, the land to be: either leased or sold.

Mr. Coffey said that; was the point they wished to dwell upon most. Could the Government bring pressure to bear, if only by advising the Corporation authorities to do something of that kind? Mr. Macahdkew did not know what plan they proposed to deal with it upon, but he would make it his business to inquire into the matter further.

Mr. Coffey said that by doing so Mr. Macandraw would be conferring a great benefit upon a number of tradesmen in the port, and would be making their actual position clearer..

Mr. Maoandrew pointed out that a report of the deputation would appear in the Press, and that would make the case of the deputation clear.

Mr. Coffey said it was a very hard case that such a prohibition should be placed upon their working in the' port. Mr. Macandrew could hot suppose that such was at all the intention of the authorities. Wellington would be cutting its own throat by acting in that spirit. Mr. Coffey referred to the. fact that in Dunedin steamers were built in back yards, and were taken across the streets to be launched. He supposed everybody: there was glad to help the shipbuilders.

Mr. 1 Macandbew said that was in the face of the same law being in force in Dunedin. He hoped that when the ground was reclaimed a portion would be available for industries like those of the members of thedeputation were interested in; he would endeavor to find out what the Corporation intended to do, with the view of bringing the necessity of doing.so forward.

Mr. Meeoh supported the views of Mr. Coffey, pointing out that the port would bo greatly injured if slips and boat-yards were not permitted tube op the foreshore in the city. Mr. Mac AST) re w said if legislation were necessary to enable the Corporation to carry out the Te Aro, reclamation,, he took it there would not be any difficulty, and he would promise on behalf of the Government to provide for it in any legislation that was needed. In Dunedin a Crown Grant for a portion of the water was vested in the Superintendent, and he reclaimed fit* with prison labor, without any Act at all. Very valuable it was now. Perhaps-a good site, in a place where the reclamation would be easy, would be along tho Hntt-road. The Government could grant a lease outside the city for three, years. He would make it his business to ascertain what the intentions of the Corporation were with respect to the Te Aro reclamation, and if legislation were necessary he would endeavor to have 1 a provision inserted to meet the case submitted by the deputation..; If that were not necessary he should think the Corporation would see the justice of doing it. The members of the deputation then thanked Mr. Macandrew for the attention he had given the matter, and withdrew.