THE DUTIES AND POWERS OF THE COLONIAL-OFFICE.

New Zealander, Volume 7, Issue 520, 9 April 1851, Page 3

THE DUTIES AND POWERS OF THE COLONIAL-OFFICE.

[Extracted from the Beport of the Official Salaries Committee.] [The Right Hon. the Earl Gret, examined.] Chairman : Will your lordship be kind enough to state to the committee the different offices which you have hold in the Government of this country t— I have held the offices of Under-Secretary of State for the Colonial and for the Home Departments, of Secretary at War, and of Secretary of 4 State for the Colonial Department. Since 1846 your lordship has held (he office of Secretary of State for the Colonies ?— Yes. Will you state to the committee whether, during the time that you have had experienced of the Colonial office, the business of that office has been on the increase or the decrease ?— That is a question which it it somewhat difficult to answer. When I was first in the Coloninl-office there was a great deal of correspondence on the controversy regarding the abolition of slavery* which was then pending, and there was also a great deal of correspondence with some of the North American, colonies, which has now been greatly diminished ; on Ihe other bant!, Ihere have been several additional colonies established since that time, and the more frequent steam communication, of course, addi very con* siderably to the correspondence ; I should say that, upon the whole, it has increased. Is the business of the office now such that it occupies the whole of your lordship's attention, and requires the assistance of two Under-Secretaries for the Colonios, which hate existed up to the preient time? — I should say most certainly; I should say that it leaves one little time to look after one's own private concerm ; and very little time indeed for those generel affairs of the Government of which one is expected to be cognizant and to be able to take one's share in defending in Parliament, and very little time indeed to look into questions of that kind while they are coming forward. lias the staff of the office diminished since the time that your lordship has been connected with the department ? — The staff of the office, properly so called, is very nearly about the same as when I first knew it; but there is a subsidiary department created.in the Colonial Land and Emigration Commissioners ; but within the walls of the office the staff ii very much the same as it wo'; because, tliough there was no Assistant Undersecretary of State at that time, there was a counsel to the department, who practically did the work of an additional Under-Secretary of State, Sir James Stephen, who was then calledcounsel to the department. The office of counsel to the Colonial -office no longer exists ?— The duties that were done by the counsel are chiefly done by two of tho emigration commissioners, who report upon colonial acts. Does the whole business of the Emigration Commission pass directly tluouijh your loidship's hands, aud under your notice ? — No, not by any means the whole of it ; the Emigration Commissioners, like the Board of Customs or the Board of Excise, dispo»e of all ordinary business on their own responsibility : and it is ouly upon more difficult and important mattes that they nsk for instruction from the Secretary of State. General directions as to the course they are to take are given by the Secretary of State, but the whole of the duties are conducted entnely on their own responsibility, without any interference whatever from the Secretary of State ; it would be totally impossible to give directions as to> the details. Chairman : arc your duties such that they enable you to enjoy any long recreation in the course of the year ii — I can only say, that I w as only able to be six or sevfln weeks at Howick in the course of last year and while I was there I wns for much the greater portion at my time occupied with papers that were sent down to me. Your lordship stated, that your duties are such that they prevent you from attending to the general concerns of the Government; have yoa had at any time to call far the assistance ot other members of the Government in colonial matters, or are you enabled to carry thjough all measuies connected with your department yourself in Parliament ?— Most certainly i whenever there is a committee of either house of Parliament \ipon colonial affairs, it is absolutely Decessary to get some other member of the Government to attend to it, because I cannot do so ; for instance, in the case of the committee of the House of Lords on transportation, two years ago, Lord ftlinto, and I think Lord Campbell, undertook to attend the committee; it was not in my power to do so, and it was absolutely necessary that it should be attended by some member of the Government. [Hera follow some questions and answers respecting Colonial appointments which appeared in the New Zeaianderot the sth of February, wheu we had received only that portion ot the evidence of Lord Grey.] Sir W. Molesworth : Are all colonial enactments brought under the consideiation ot your lordsh.p ?— They are. Do you carefully examine them all .'—There are two

of the Emigration Commiss'oners who arc lawyers, whose duty it is to examine every act, and report upon Does that occupy much time in the office ?—lt? — It occupies a great deal of their time, undoubtedly, in looking over all the acts. They examine them for the purpose of seeme 1 whether they ought to be allowed or disallowed ?— Yes, and calling attention to any defects in them. If the Colonial-office were deprived of the power of disallowing those acts, would not that considerably diminish the duties of the office ?— I do not know that it would very much diminish the duties of the Secre fary of State ; it would, to a certain degree un« douhtedly. When the Emigration Commissioners report to your lordship, you have to resd their report in order to know whether the act ou hi to be allowed or disallowed ?— Yes ; but a very great majority of the acti upon which thry report there ii no objection to, and they are allowed as a matter of course. Unless there is some "specinl reason to the contrary, nets relating only to the internal affairs of the colony are leldom or never disallowed ; there are, however, very often technical defects and errors in them, which I bring under the consideration of the governor, and they are enerally amended ; many colonial acts are amended at once by the local legislatures, upon the defects being pointed out, after the examination they undergo here. It is not your duty to disallow every colonial act which i8 repugnant to the law of England ?— Yes ;in every colonial charter there are the words, that every act which is repugnant to the law of England is to be void, but I think that you would have a great deal of difficulty in defining what is repugnant to the law of England. Chairman : In the case of a general war does not additional duty devolve upon the Colonial-office? — The Colonial Department is the War Department also, and there is a very considerable amount of duty arising out of that. Is that the case at the present time ?— Yes.? — Yes. Mr. Ellice : Do not you think that a great part of the duties which now devolve upon you as Secretary of the Colonies iv time of peace, might be transferred with advantage and convenience to the administration of the Secretary at War ?— I have always thought that the arrangement in this country for the transaction of military buiincss is exceedingly defective ; but the meant of improving it are perhaps very difficult. Do you prepare, for the consideration of the Queen, the scheme of the establishments of the military force of the country ? — That is not precisely the course ; the Commander in-Chief writes to the Secretary of State, and receives from the Secretary of State the decision of the Government as to what is to be the amount of the) military force for the year, and the Commander-in Chief submi's it to the Queen. Do not you think that if would be a more convenient mode of settling the establishment! of the military force for the year, that the officer of the Government responsible to Parliament for the military expenditure, should undertake that duty ? — I think that would be difficult, without having more extensive alterations, because it is necessary that the measures for military defence should be looked at as a whole, and the Secre-tary-at-War, us you are aware, has no control what-, ever over the Ordnance department ; unlesss he was given some control over the Ordnance department, it would hardly answer to make him responsible for the amount of the regular army. Mr. Henry Drummond : Was it not Mr. Canning's plan to connect the War department with the Foreignoffice ? — I never beard that it was ; it mij have been so, but I was not aware of it, When yoa were at the War-office, did you find inconvenience from the two departments being separated ?— The greatest possible inconvenir nee. What is the salary of the Secretary of the Colonies ? —It is the same as those of the other Secretaries of State, £5,000 a year. Has there been any alteration in the salary of Secretary fo r the Colonies within the lust few years ?— Not since 1831, when they were all reduced; I think £1,000 a year was token off each in 1831 by the committee of which Lord Ashburton was the chairman. You consider that at regards your own department you are the responsible minister, and that if any altera* tion or retrenchment U to be made in that department it must be made at the instance of yourself ?~Certamly. What I require is to see that certain things are done in proper time ; once a fortnight I have a regular return of the business in arrear, and I am able to jud»e from that whether anything is neglected; but ; the detail o\ distributing the labour among the differ* ent subordinate members of the office rests entirely with the permanent Under-Secretary of State. \ What interruptions would the head of a department be liab'e to, if he wished to be occupied upon the business of his own office at his office? — Continually persons calling and making inquiries upon various j matters; persons who come upon the business of the office, very often upon personal matters, and if the j chief of the department is at the office, the public ex- j pect to see him. Would it not be possible for him to delegate to his junior the answering of those inquiries if he was on the spot ?— I think that if the principal is on the spot, persons who ca'l are generally not satisfied if they do not tee him ; they expect to see him I know myself that I make a practire of doing all my most important bustnessat my ownhou«e> because I cannot secure niysel ffrom interruption otherwise. Sir W, Moleswonh: What is the description of public business which the heads of the departments perform at home? — The heads of the departments have to write the drafts of despatches. If a despatch arrives, referring to previous correspondence, they are expected to be able to make a careful examination of the previous correspondence, and to draw up a minute, pointing out what are the subjects particularly requiring attention, and suggesting the course to be taken. Mr. Bright: Is that then submitted to the Secretary of Siate ?— The business goes first to the permanent Under-Secretary of State, theu to the Parliamentary Under-Secretary, and then to the Secretary of State, j I receive it with the remarks and suggestions of Mr. Hawes and Mr. Merivale ; and all ordinary business is expected to be brought before me in such a form that it can be disposed of simply by adding my initials. As to all ordinary business, I consider that it is very im- = perfectly done it it does not come to me in th*t state. With regard to the governors of colonies, does it not appear to you that there in great inequality in their salaries, and tbat in some cases the salaries mi^ht with propriety be somewhat reduced ? — I should say, on the contrary, there are hardly any of them who are not more or less underpaid. TnUe the case of the bland of Trinidad ; what is the salary of thr governor there ? — £3,500 a year, as well aa I remember. The salary oi the Governor of Jamaica is much more than that?— lt is £5,000 a year, I believe. I may say, generally, that in all the colonies the governors are expected to maintain a certain amount of fctate, and to entertain a certain number of persons. I do not believe that in any of our colonies it is possible for the governor to save one shilling out of his salary ; he

may, possibly, in tome of them, save bis private fortune, but many of them could not live at the rate that they do without some assistance from their private fortunes. With regard to that, does not the rate of living remarkably accommodate i'self, and very easily, to the amount of the income, to that if the income rises, it it very easy to make the expenditure rise along with it ? — I very much doubt whether that is the case ; I think that where the governors' salaries have been reduced great dissatisfaction has been felt by the colonist* themselves at the discontinuance of the hospitalities to which they have been accustomed at the govenim»nt house. I believe it is a great advanta«e to colonial society that there should be a means of bringing persons of different views and opinions to meet at the govern-ment-house. If the colonies paid the salaries of their governors, they would have an opportunity of indulging their predilections in that respect r— But the colonies do pay the salaries of their go vernori, with a few exceptions. In the bill which has been recently lubmitfed to Parliament from your department with respect to the Australian colonies, have you not taken precaution* that they should not reduce the salaries of the governori ? — Certainly; I think it i* extremely important that the governor ibould be independent ot the Legislature, but if there were the power of reducing his salary at any moment, he would not have that independence. It is a very old rule of the Colonial-office, lhat no governor shall anent to an act raising his salary, and I think it 's a very good rule that the Legislature should not have the power of reducing it.