Debate on Socialist Manifesto.

Maoriland Worker, Volume 3, Issue 82, 4 October 1912, Page 6

Debate on Socialist Manifesto.

FREEMAN v. LOMAS

AN ENJOYABLE ENCOFNTER

The. Rev. Dr. Gibb began it. Tic is to blame. To preach sermons on the industrial unrest iind cxpci-p the matter to pud there was too much. I'rank Freeman approached the pastor. He presented his platform weight, and desired to know the parson's. The cables toll us .Tack Johnson is having no more. Dr. Gibb is more so. Mr. E. K. Lomas*. M.Sc., of the Training College, a lightweight, offered to lake on a rhmM-ound spar with Freeman- Tt crime off recently, with Dr. Gibb ably tilling ibc <-hnir. could net do otherwise. Them «na a big attendance. Frank in his 2(\ ,-]e|,ehf.-d n<,, rivHrd the nttmiinu of all. put up a strong en so and disappointed a lew llf the eiieniv. We wonder hnw T1 r. Gibb felt when the speaker surpassed himfHf by a tip-top rendering (if ill" following? "... and wb"ii th« final liiiht. dor, hike place the victory will assuredly be nurs. The old world will bo rutin,: attain, for that vidory will bo such as only Ibe world's best have dreamt of. We will take nothing for oursi'lven but what- tb» coiupiered shall lere.ive equally with us. \V<- will give no heavier burden for the beaten ones than what we ourselves are prepared to bear." Frank drove home splendidly that "social production involved social ownership of product, otherwise all the squealing about trusts nnd combines was just so much hypocritical humbug." At the close the burst of applause nil round was spontaneous and well-merit-ed. Then came Mr. Lonisis. wisely Wt his opponent's speech severely alone except to ask, ''What was surplus value? ,. Ho rang off a dozen old favorites : "Corruption of officials," "handin<: out jobs," ''army of book-keepers," "could riot get one's private brand of cigar or color of brown shoe," "tin? State, if Rationalists, might refuse to print the Bible/ "a worker would lose his liberty by being ordered to go and live at Auckland any moment -when his home was in Wellington," etc. Sorry we cannot give a. report of the economics indulged in, but this is a gem: ''Capital is something you do not want (someone shouted, Hear, hear), and lor which you have no use. and so you invest if After that the Deluge! Not ftll laughter came from comrades at the bogeys he raised and demolished.

Mr. Freeman started by asking the question, "What is surplus value ?"( He had cleared that up in his first speech. Out it rang, dear and defiant: It is the unpaid-for portion of Labor , ? product — scientific robbery legalised. , ' Frank lot the collegian down very lightly in his replies to the hoary chestnuts, and got agoing finely on the legalised robbery business. Tho quarter nf an hour was Jill inn short for an increasing number of thf> midi"iiro.

Then Lom»s floundered hopelessly in 'common sense economics," "Labor

was not robbed, ib got its wages,'' "the capitalist aided society by inventions," "ability was left out of. the question by the Socialist," "brains had to count" —and then brought roara cf laughter with "suppose a man found himself on a desert island and started gathering eggs. He then made a wheelbarrow to gather them moro quickly. Another man came and borrowed the wheelbarrow. Surely the owner was entitled to some of the eggs gathered by the borrower."

The Socialist did well in the last ten minutes. We like this: " The Socialist has always maintained that brains had to bo used in connection with manual labor. The capitalist knew that, otherwise instead of engaging the usual navvies to dig drains he would send to Porirua Mental Hospital for the workers. They had less brains and would be more easily exploited." The "wheelbarrow" was pushed around to the generil amusement of all and at the expense of the opponent.

A comrade capped it during question lime by asking: "What part did capital play iv producing the eggs before the man made the wheelbarrow?" At the close Frank pointed out that "social production involved social ownership," and for the third time he asked Lomas l-o deal with that proposition.

The last ten minutes cut no ice. No less than nine questions were asked by Mr. Lotnas concerning Socialism when established. His reply to the social ownership was that Massey was bringing in a Civil Service Reform Bill and a Railway Commissioner.

Then on rue questions. Lomas did his host with Socialist posors. The contrast mis (iuolv shown by Frromnn. This was good. "Would thfi Socialist, become a capitalist to-morrow it' ho could?" Frank said tlmt implied Uiat .1 rapitalist. could uot' be a. Socialist. "How will' my fnonr] square the fact Ih.it Rrifus AVFokos, n millionairf; Gaylnrd "Willspiio, dii.lo; nnri H.vnrimsn, a. wealthy stockbroker, I>:jvp the itH-plUx-tual concoptimi of SociaJisrn and work aB enthusiastically as the poorest Socialist for its realisation?"

The debate was splondrl propaganda. It was bettor than a comic opera at times. Freeman came armed to shoot bears and trend a 'possum. His efforts were worthy a much stronger opponTho chairman must have learnt a little more of what wo stand for. Tt was a glorious sight to watch the manmountain sway to and fro when Freeman F-aid: "Labor applied to natural objects produces all wealth. Boot 3 don't) grow on currant bushes. The primitive savage lad at least to stretch his arm to pick tho wild berries md even under Socialism, when the Socialist lies under the trees awaiting th? fruit to fall, ho will have to continu-3 the operation of opening his mouth to mako use of what Nature so liberally supplies and we waste ro much of our lives in fighting each other in the gathering thereof."

Wo had alinnst forgotten that the debate was on tho manifesto of tho N.Z. S.P. Mr. Lomas did entirely. He stowed it away very carefully in his brain and was unconscious of iti existence.