Unity or Union.

Maoriland Worker, Volume 2, Issue 35, 3 November 1911, Page 13

Unity or Union.

Mills—Beftnett Debate.

A MEMORABLE CONTEST.

The Wellington Town Hall was about half full on Monday night of last week to hear the debate on "Do the Unity proposals embody all the necessary features for the sound, industrial and political organisation of tlie workingclass of New Zealand?'' The conditions of the debate were that each speaker should be one hour —that Mr. Bennett should lead off with ten minutes, followed by Prof. Mills Avith ten; then each speaker should have half an hour, and. then Mr. Bennett would speak for 15 minutes, •followed by Professor Mills with 20, and finally Mr. Bennett would have five minutes to conclude the debate. Mr. E. Tregear, who ably and impartially presided, said he had been nominated as chairman by both sides. Whatever faults or failings he had, he thought he was a straight man (Applause.) He described the tAYO antagonists as knoAvn not only to the audience', but to all Australasia. It Avould be no bout of amateurs; these Avere professional sAvordsmen they had tonight. (Applause.) . • The Chairman also mentioned that Mr. Bennett Avas ' laboring tinder a great disability in that he Avas suffering from severe sore throat, contracted through having to travel in suoav and storm to reach Wellington in time*. When Scott Bennett started, many wondered if his voice Avould stand the ordeal, but it really finished in better tone, improving all the time. In their opening bouts both speakers explained their respective positions. SCOTT BENNETT. declared that as a Socialist he must contend that the political part of Labor should be absolutely uncompromising. (Applause.) The political Aving of the Labor movomeot should have one objectiA r e, and one only—the socialisation of the means of production, distribution and exchange. (Applause.) As regarded the industrial side, he urged that the day of craft unionism had passed. Craft unionism must be replaced by industrial unionism. The Unity proposals Avere an attempt to bring in different people with varying material interests into the party. The Industrial Union must be essentially a union of Avage-earners. The proper place for those endorsing the Socialist policy, but not belonging to the ranks of the a. ageearners, Avas in tlie political Socialist party. (Hear, hear.) It Avas not merely a theoretical point, but a matter of the greatest practical importance in the straggle for the emancipation of Labor. They should not devote their attention to numbers, but to principles. The policy of the Unity proposals Avas "Rope-'em-all-in," not a matter of principle. For that reason it Avas a proposal to side-track the AAorkers of the Dominion (Hear, hear.) "You are not living in a country," said Mr. Bennett, "Avhcro the Avorkcrs are fighting for any particular reforms. You have a government that Avould give you practically anything.if you brought sufficient pressure to bear on them." (Hear--, hear.) On the other hand, the Unity proposals would only make confusion worse confounded. It would be impossible to get unity among the Socialists, unionists, single-taxers, barristers, teachers, and parsons Mr. Mills proposed to unite. (Applause.) Did Mr. Mills imagine that his Unity scheme Avas in- the interests of the Avorkers Avhen it had Liberal politicians behind it? For his part, > he Avould say a Way Avith such a .scheme; give him a straightout party on uncompromising' lines and principles. (Cheers and applause.) PROFESSOR MILLS contended that any scheme, of organisation must have a head —one head, not tAVo. Mr. Bennett had talked of the industrial Aving and the political Aving —Avhat Avas the name of Mr. Bennett's bird? (Laughter.) The "'speaker argued that a proper organisation must have one central bodj- to act in all matters ali'ectii.g the common interests of the Avorkers, but the organisation should be such that each individual group should be organised also in matters affecting .its oavii individual interests. The organisation must permit of expansion. If there Avere men Avho Aye re not available for membership in the Carpenters' Union or the Miners' Union or any other union, then some organisation- must be provided for them. The organisation' must be such that men Avere not called upon to vote on. things they knvAV nothing .about, nor be refused opportunities of voting on things they knew all about. (Hear, hear.) The Unity proposals provided means not only for dealing 'with questions immediately touching their interests, on which all Aye re. agreed, but also, for investigating questions on Avhich all Avere not .agreed. No., other party organisation existing in New Zealand did this. (Hear, hear.) "The Social st Party," said the Professor, "pretended to be nothing more than one wing of the bird; Aye Avant the Avhole bird. (Laughter.) The New Zealand Federation of Labor makes a boast it is one wing; we Avant to connect the wings. Those Avho .render service should be united against those who extort service without rendering service." (Loud and prolonged applause.) Tbe remainder of the debate was keenly contested, and applause Avas frequent and sustained on both sides. As a full report, of tlte debate is to' be issued in pamphlet form AAe trust our readers Avill see that they obtain copies, and in this hope rest content Avith the.'foregoing basis. ..>',.: Both contestants received . excellent hearings, throughout,..and were loudly, applauded.. • • '.; The.. Cha/irnian i declared . the debate, closed, and announced that the issuer would' not-Jb..putvto'the: vote. They had li6,tene4'V|ic..two fine spcakftrn m. *>&© 0 f

the best debates that had ever been heard in New Zealand. He 'would'ask them to _ thank both speakers heartily. A motion of thanks Avas carried Avith acclamation, and a similar compliment to the chairman, followed'by cheers and counter-cheers for the respective par. ties concluded the meeting.

On Saturday night last at Christchurch the principals again debated, and will meet for the third "go" about the middle of the mouth at Auckland.