Provincial Council.

Lyttelton Times, Volume XII, Issue 722, 8 October 1859, Page 2

Provincial Council.

Tuesday, 0ct0beb,4,,1859.

The Council met at 5 p.m. '.:■'■■'] Present:—The Speaker, Messrs.f Alport, Bishop, Cass,Cookson, Davis, Dobbs; Duncan, Fooks,Fyfe, Hall, Harman, Miln, Ollivier.'Packer, Potts, Ternpier, Ward, and : Wyatt. ' The Provincial Secretary laid on the table the report of the Provincial Engineer on the Waitaki Road.: -..-;....' i

Correspondence between the Provincial Government and the owners of the steamer Queen, on the subject-of a bonus for calling at the port of Akaroa.

■ Report of the Provincial Engineer on the River Waiamakariri. ........

A letter of Mr. White on the subject of the Kaiapoi bridge. <■ .- < •■ An offer from Mr. White for the construction of a tramway from Christchurch to Sumner. A petition from, the inhabitants of Kaiapoi for the construction of a free bridge. The last report of the Inspector of Schools on the state of schools receiving Government aid. - Mr. Ollivieb moved ,the consideration of' a reply to.his Hbnor.'s address,which was read. He said the .address he proposed" for adoption by.the Council was of so, simple and.innocent a nature as to' require ' but little consideration ; he therefore hoped that the house .would' consider it to-night, thou gh, i f [preferred, he would postpone it. ' Mr: Packeb appro'ved;of the suggestion to postpone the consideration of .the. reply, and moved an amendment accordingly, which was,carried.

LOAN OBDINANCE AMENDMENT BILL. Mr. Ollivieb:asked leave to introduce.this: bill. It was a short one, and only needed to give practical effect to the statement made on the debentures issued under the Loan Ordinance, that the principal and interest thereon should be payable at the Union Bank of Australia, in London. The Pro- i vincial Government had only received information of the necessity for introducing the amendment in the ordinance on the last day. of last session—too late to comply with it. The agent had, therefore, been informed of the intention of the Government to introduce the present'bill at the earliest opportunity, which was accordingly done. ' Leave given. Bill read a first time and ordered to be printed. BIVEBSION OF BOADS BILL!' Mi*. Ollivieb rose to move for leave to introduce a bill under this title, the object of which was to remove the difficulties which had hitherto existed in laying put roads over private property. It was the second time that a bill of, this character had been under the consideration 5 of the Council, but the former, it would be recollected, had^ not received the assent of the Governor owing to a doubt as to the power of the Council' to enact "\t." Since that time, however, the 'Highways arid Watercourses Diversion Act' of the General Assembly had been passed, giving the Council the power required, and the Government therefore: introduced the bill the second time; it was identically the same;:bil'l,: and would be.found essentially necessary^iftjforw'arding several important works^amongwhicKhf^ieedohly mention the Governor's Bay road as-J^-hotorious example. The roading of the bays of the Peninsula required also a measure of this kind. Leave givem Bill read a first time and ordered ;to be printed. . - ■-..,.. ;: CATHEDEAL SQUARE ORDINANCE AMENDMENT -'""" , . ■ BILL. Mb Ollivieb also moved for leave to bring in a bill under this title to alter one of the provisions of the ordinance passed last session, wit" respect to Cathedral square. That ordinance had appropriated the eastern half of the reserve to public purpo*; ses and the western half to the Church of England as a Cathedral site. The Bishop of Christchurch had since.then expressed a wish,that the.a'ppro'pria-; tion should be reversed as;: the Eastern portion of the square presented a much preferable site for the Cathedraljthe western end of-which would then be properly placed for theentrance. • Mr.' Haeman remarked that it was possible that some, better site still might be found for the Cathedral, and it would be better, to defer the consideration of the-present measure. Leave was given to introduce the bill, on the; understanding that before committal the question of site should be settled. ; Bill read a first time and ordered to be printed. .'..,■ HAGLEY PABK MILL SITE BILL. Mr. Ollivieb rose to move for leave: to bring in this bill, and proceeded to describe its nature. .A measure of similar character had been introduced into the Council and thrown out, several sessions previously. He' thought, however, that the time was now,come when this subject should be again considered. It was proposed to make an addition to the old bill. By this first clause it was proposed to set apart a parcel of ground not exceeding one acre, in Hagley Park, as a "site for a mill; such site to be leased by the Superintendent; reserving also a strip of ground for,the construction of a .mill-race to be laid put by the Provincial Engineer, about 28 chains in length.' The lessee to pay a fair sum annually as rent, and to make a path along the mill-race for the public convenience and recreation, and- to, construct a dray bridge across the race. He need scarcely urge on the notice of the Council the demand which existed in the province for increased mill-power. : He believed he was warranted in stating that during last year no i less than 400 tons of flour, at a price of £35 per ton, had been imported; while, at the same time, 20,000 bushels of wheat had actually .been exported. Ths, if. converted into flour at home, should have saved the province all that large sum expended on flour imported—some £8000, not to speak of about 1000 bushels of offal. During the : last seabon, millers were throughout paying for wheat at the rate of Is. per bushel in advance of the price given by merchants, with a view to '' keeping the grain in the province, till they found their stock growing too large and their funds diminishing. Wheat had been exported and had come back again iv the shape of flour, burdened with all the charges of exportation, grinding, and re-importatioh. By clause 4 of the proposed bill, the lessee of the site, would be required to keep 3 pairs of stones to be at work for thVpublic -dunno" 12 hours on each of 3 days in each week; and it was further proposed to require that they should be four-feet stones. The rate to be charged for grinding was not to exceed Is. .per. bushel. Unless mill sites were reserved the province would be driven to employ steam power for mills, thereby increasing the expenses so much , that what was now proposed to be done at therate of Is..per bushel could 'not be done for less than 2s. The expense of fuel alono for steam mills was calculated as likely to be at least equal to 9d. for each bushel of corn ground. He hoped the present measure would prevent* at least -any successful combination between millers and bakers.. .Of thefivo millers at present to be found in the province, none were able I fairly to supply the demands of the public- He! believed thesitd now proposed was one of-the best In the district, combining ample water with con-; venience of location. . •>. : '

Mr. Hall rose to oppose the bill. It was not the first time snph a bill had been before the Coun- i oil and rejected, as in the case of Inwood's Mill Bill. The Council had always treated bills of this; character as matters requiring great care and deli- ] beration in the handling. He.was perfectly ready to admit the great value of mill sites j in fact they; were so very valuable that grants of them should only he given .with the very greatest circumspec- ;■ tion. He thought also -that very ample notice of ij

any such proposed measure should be given to all parties concerned; for instance, intimation should be conveyed to parties adjoining the proposed site In the case of •Inwqou> .Mill Ordinance notice had been widely given (by 1 advertisement. No such notice had been or was proposed to'be given in the present instance. yThes*Provincial! Secretary had said that the time had arrived'fortne consideration of this subject. Having been one of the opponents °L thlrVuP' bi! 1 I wl,en it was first introduced, he (Mr. Hall) would say that the objections to this measure were objections not of time but of principle and were as valid now as when the bill was first -introduced.. Another thing was that he saw no provision in the bill about terms; no intention was stated there of,obtaining conditions which would be at all advantageous to the public. The'lease of the site for instance was not to be submitted to auction In fact the Bill proposed to give the Superintendent authority to lease the site in whatever way his Honor'1 might^please.XThe' preamble" of the; bill itself stated that Hagley park shall be reserved for ever as a public park, as a place of recreation and enjoyment: and^ow the .Superintendent was to be authorised to 'put'up a greatr ugly clacking'mill right in the middle of it! The Provincial Secretary had told them a .great deal about the the pretty walk to be constructed along the mill race, and the embellishment wherewith it was to be garnished in the shape of trees arid shrubs,, &c. But he said nothing about all that in the bill. Everything was to be left to the Superintendent., He had no objection to the reserving of mill sites, but he thought they they should at-least be'defined/ <■ In"the" Ordinance granting the' site for. Peacock's wharf i tl Lyttelton there was nothing indefinite. Neither was therein the case of Woodford's mill, or other cases. He was of opinion that full opportunity of opposing any such as the proposed measure should be given to all interested; ' ■.

Mr. Packee thought that no objection could be taken to the principle'of the bill, and" hoped that the honourable gentleman would not object .to it if presented in another form. No mil! on the proposed "site- would be erected in less time than two years from the' present time. In that time the population would; largely-increase. Objections had been expressed to spoiling the beauty of Hagley Park, now he (Mr.; Packer) thought' that Christchurch was a-town which must.: stand rather on its utility'than its; beauty..:* ',! Mr. Thomson was one who generally preferred greatly the.useful to-:.the ornamental.,• Bufcin the case of-Hagley...Park, he would .not consent thai the latter should-be,lost sight.of;. he thought that as a.rule, mill,sitW'shpuld u find locality jn the agricultural or' producing '"districts; arid not in the towns or consuming districts. There were other mill sites, and sites better situated than that now proposed. There;: were, he^jknewj two or,;three sites on .'. the Purarekanul; :iri^:fh;e Amidst of au agricultural district.,:; M.the^Provincial Secretary cpuld.shpw.that there was : really ho;bther ayjailabhs mill site than that' to..'bel obtained by:^ttmg:up Hagley Park, he wpuld' be prepared' io support the bill, but not otherwise: •'.", ..';',',';•.,, :...::,- '"T^ 7

Mr. Cookson would .support the tiHrthrpugiia first reading. He had nuk,heard ; howevejypf jtlie large • importation of; flour (400 tons)' last -year, mention ed by the Provincial - Secretary.

• Mr.: Habman thought the bill should be a private one. It;was pretty well kriown who the lessee would be;; therewas : riot vmuch secrecy about the matter;;"- He; thought if - bill had';been called Wood's Hagley-Park Mill ;Bill, it Jwould not have been mis-named;: i ; - i r-: : ' -• „ \ ;

; Mr. Ollivieb admitted having in a former session opposed this.billj but; he had' done so on different .principles to, those now ; enunciated: The forriier bill had been rejected.because no intima.tion of its, introduction had been given till the bill was actually laid oh the table.' It was then in fact the .Hagley r Park Mill.Bill wrsws Inwood's Mill Bill. .■ It was'said [that" this shoukT/properly be.introduced as ,a -privatebill, and considered as such. If the site"had been Government in thesame senseias the lands of .the province, then he thought the bill should; have, been a private one. But the'case was different. The site was the property of-the province, andihe Government were the proper-persons-id ;aSk. leave to alienate it. Ah honourable iriem.ber had ;said that no' termsi ho restrictions were imposed:, by the bill as read: and that no intention; was .expressed of seeking the most advantageous terms.; Would not the carrying into effect of the .conditions. he had read to the Council ibe^a public gain ? Would it be no gain to the public toy have their corn ground with certainty as toj.tiriie, and with cheapness? He had no objection to,the introduction of a clause compelling tke lessee to .lay but with shrubs the walk along the mill race; but he sawnovery great necessity for such a clause. There, would be no very great difficulty in obtaining and planting some few dozen of willows, which in so suitable a soil would soon afford a pleasant shade. (Laughter). Another consideration of which honorable members seemed to have lost-sight was this:—Was Hagley Park now in, a fit condition to be laid out as a place of recreation? He; thought riot. Great part of it was an abominable swamp, and through this swamp it was proposed to cut the mill race, thereby most effectually draining it; and rendering the park-really available for the for which it was intended. Something also .had been said about notice to parties interested.;' - Who were they ? No one would be at all interfered< with. Objections of the kind offered should be left till the. bill was considered in committee. He felt assured that if this bill were passed the gain to the province would be great, It had been said that there were other mill sites. Where were they ? On the Purarekanui ? There were one ; or two there,.certainly, and there only; and they were all private property, and inconveniently situated. Their owners had tried long to dispose of these.very sites, but without success, partly on account of the inconvenient location, and partly also'because too high prices were asked. One hon. member bad said that mill sites should be in agricultural districts.: Why; .the Has]*)' Park site was in the very midst of the producing districts! •■ To it there were easy approaches from Riccaiton, the Lincoln Road, and from the Papanui district and Great North Road. He was qnite prepared to- shew maps and plans -which wonM prove fully all the advantages of position of this site. Question put and carried. Leave to introduce given. Bill read a first time and ordered to be printed. . ' ; CHUECH FROPEBTY TRUST AMENDMENT BIW--Mr. Thomson moved for leave to introduce abill authorising the Church Property Trustees to lease, let, sell, alienate, mortgage, change, or otherwise dispose of certain portions of special reserves vested in' them for ecclesiastical and educational purposes. Ho explained that in most casos such power was possessed by the Church Property Trustees. But there were certain properties fettered with-special trusts. These could not be disposed of except under authority of the Council. Hence jtho proposed bill. One of the, properties proposed to be dealt with was the old parsonage and grammar school-adjoining the present chunk. That was no longer used for its original purpost** and it was thought the ground would be adraiuW adapted for letting on building leases. Another was the old/proposed Heathcofo church site, Tha proceeds would be applied And treated in tho sawo manner a* the funds "now accruing to tho Church Property Trustees, mid in the hands of their treasurer. One special purpose (it was not mentioned in the bill) to which such funds would be appb6" would be the building of pareonage houses,

Leave given '. to introduce'; and bill read a first time. '-/'■' c '■■■' -. "-■'' ::-v-'" Mb. Wabd roso to move for copies of all correspondence with and reports from/the Harbor dppartineiit/to the Provincial Goy^^nmpnt during the past year;: referring, to ; the.pilot, service of. Port Lytteltpri;and, the, transiiotipns',of : the duties, of Harbor Master. In , hnngingfonvard thismption, he had no wish to give ; trouble,;asithere.could hardly have, been: any; larget amount, of, cbrrespondence. He thought it; desirable; thafr consideration should be given to this subject attliis early period of the session, and^befdreiy coihiiig'on of; the' estimates^ as he imagined'there cttWjl'bVmade; out a,good casefor'askinghisHbnortd'pjacebiitjie estimates a larger, sti,^ :thaiy : h^r«tb"jf(^;; ,£01:' tlid"' s^ice; of the Harbor; department;;and be,'thought that in the first place.'.ariyi^formation^o wasto; be based ;^ at the.-head of <ti\e department, whiohrinforination could; be supplemented-! from other: sources; In order toiexhibit how* necessary; were:;enquiries into aivd r-returns*'on'thissubjedtihe'Wphlt3l say that when some short time ago the Harbor master had occasion* to^atteiript to carry but the l£w he.found that he had no .Harbor 4regulattbns;tbJsjappbrt him1, they: haying^lapsed1 :solw£^ag&as-jObtober;lßs7. Sp: that;in facti'tlie Karbpr^of;Lyttelton had., been without; regulations^^ for two y pari past. Hethought the subject wanted Ventil.ation;.an.d that.a good, case could be;-madeo.utfor ; askirighisiHonorlto place on thetestimates a sum large enough, to put the: Harbor and Pilot service on a propeiffootirig. * ■ ■.' Mr. Ollivieb had no objection to the returns; he mentioned that, fresh'regulations warded to Aucklarid rf6r' proclamation by the^^ Governor. . - „,.. „,,-.' . ...... ..... Mr. Hall said that, some considerable, time back he had discovered .'the hbn-e?istence of any; harbour, regulations, arid had; poirited: out• the fact to the, General Goyernment, receivingfor answer-that it was no affair of theirs, but of the-, Provincial Go-; yemment. The regulations had; been proclaimed iv 1855 for 2 years, and, having consequently lapsed in 1857 and' not 'been since renewed, the harbor had been without any for two years. ' Question'put and.passedi, .-.-... peacock whabf. %tensioN; bill (private)., Mr. Hall moved for? leave'; to,introduce a."bill"to. amend the Peacock". Wharf"Ordinance, Session, yi.ii,, No. 9. That, Ordinance.: had) been':passed to:give, leave to;MiVi J. J.Peaco'ck> of .Sydrieyj to,'erect on a. certaini portion^/ 6£j Lyttelton! harbour- a wharf and jetty. This had been- done* arid had proved a mbst r"useful work." TheYproJectCriibw wished to extend'his jetty,:;and'[asked- fory more ground .in the ;harbbur. l';\ All fbis .was clearlyset out;uv the,, petition. •There., was-rid. such,urifpr,turiate want. of Idistirictnes^ Mill Bill rjust.discussed. '] _. The extension;' of/ihe viar£was-:l&e^ tlip'tpwrijofTr^ No Increase of toll was proposed. , >

IVO .;leaye 'given. Bill brought in and read a first fihie.' v ' "'■'''■ ■: -. -;; !-;-...'; ■ '; "

Mr. Hall then moved for copies of any corres-' pbjSence^be^een:" thp^^General; and; • Proviricial, Governments Ooo. of; office accommpdatwtf for :th^; Supreme trate's' Court} or" other"departriaent pf the ; General. Government in;this.-proyirice..;'H^ the preseriiLan3:office-w,as:giyen,up to the.Gene-, ral Gpvernirientrthe.;jQQundl knpw-on wbat terms it Was;:spught.i ;Granted;u; Also, ■ copies of". any correspondenceXbetweeri the Generakand-Prb-vincial Governments % mt-the subject of a -Lunatic Asylurir or Gapl for 5 this ;Prbyince,; or a General Convict Establishment for the ''Colony. Granted; Also, copies ,pf any.^coirresppndenfle betwpen the Provincial Government %t ] Canterbury "• .and, the :i Governments of the neighbouring provinces or the General^ Government on nthej subject fpfinter-pro-viricial-and ■ intercolonial', steam- communication* There'was; no subject;touching .which the public: were 'dark.- -Every.one^knewthaU :greatdissa:tikacti6h hadbeen given iii the carrying out of thV'staam'^ lie ■warifM^^nbw \ wjby^thafrhad^been the; .case. Some ;;'(rorres^nderice;; 'toh^f he£. subject," must,; he opiried;hlave-liakett ] place fhe General and , Provincial; Gpvernmerits,;wW^ lightbnthev<iuestion;: f ;;;,•■;; : ;^ '.•■■■■ Mr.OLLivisE sfcated.that no such, correspondence had taken place, -j The government had ; once or;twice'commuriicatedwith"Mir;iColeman^ori •■ the subject^andV-inWhded; lately to' address -themselves to^^the:GerierailGpverrihierit,; but had*:waitedtill'the last -mail due to-see;if causefor; complaint was'still'igiveh.^:^ had been made by the'r General Government which must hold/at Jleast' iilti' tM r.nexfc; seßnon, : -.df-;.'Uiß GeaeraL Assembly.;: In ; this-, last rcase : no rcircum-1 stance'had arisen justifying a remonstrance on this subject to the General Government: :'•-••; ; - Mr.; t^AED said - that-as' thb'motion '■■ was before the house/ and the'subject';wW otic; of -great1 importance, he would'say; a fewwbrds' as to his ;view of thefactsrit.was'riot:tb'be wondered^ at that there had notbe'eriinycorresporidericedf.'the nature asked for.-by J£r/.Hali. A contract, ,'which must -be; i considered on, the whole, a satisfactory," one, had | lately;beenentered into by ( the : company,- but had i been promised too soon, as the, arrival of one. of the ! company's steamers had been unexpectedly delayed. I Mr. Sewell bad made:a'temporary arrangement j which was nbt; satisfactory;' but'served to 'supply ; the deficiency for atiirie.l Since the; arriyal-:of' thedelayed' steamer the company hadbe^ari to proceed in exact, accordance with' the ; terms of their contract; .' "-V '.'._■ -,'.',. ■''■'■ # ;,;., „. :• ! i Mr.' Hall thought that at any rate information ;ef all" steam communication arrangehients should have been, supplied to the Provincial Government. Motion^ withdrawn;by leave. Mr. Hall also!moved'for a return showing in detail the several sums voted- for public works in the last session of the Cbuncilj.ahd:also,in-parallel columns, the sums' actually expended;to BOth September, 1859; Also, returns showing the' revenue I derived iirekch month during the two years ended j September, from -the .sale-of waste. lands, from 1 pasturage licenses or froni other branches of terriI torial revenue, distinguishing the sums' derived I from each of such?branches. ' ■;.'; _„' | Mr.'Ollivieb remarked that he conceived this I motion to be superfluous; : These-'returns-were I always furnished before the -introduction of the I estimates. Returns' siiiiilflr to those of last year would be furnished now. Questions put and agreed to. . ■ ■■■';:..• -.\:'' .. ■'/:'■ I In reply to a question froni Mr. H ABM AN as. to whether Mr. Bray was acting in England on the part of the Provincial Governriient as a paid officer, * Mri Ollivieb stated, that Mr. Bray was acting 39 solely in an honorary capacity; "He would^add Ithat he (Mr. Bray) according to the last: advices, was in communication with Mr. Stephenson. Mr. Wabd, as the subject was before the'Courifil, would ask who the English Commissioners ontlie railway question were. "'-"'' Mr. Ollivieb replied' that Mr. FitzGerald had I suggested that' a committee should be . appointed for the negotiation of matters touching the railway question. That committee bad been, formed of himself (Mr. FitzGerald), Mr. Cummins, the Chairman of the Union Banksof Au'straliain London, and Mr,'.Selfe, the agent of the province. One Meeting bad been held, Which had been adjourned till Mr* Bray's - arrival. : That • gentleman had leached England in the Regina; and the different specimens of rock sent; home by that'vessel''we're before'the committee. Those specimens with the; plans.prepared had been sent for by Mr. Stephenson ; and by the Mextntail the-"'Government '}}<sss to receive intimation of that gentleman's opinion.

.Mr. HabmAn asked- whether any-answer had been received' to the Superintendent's letter to Mr. Selfe P to which Mr. Ollivier replied in the negative.

Mr. Habman also asked the Provincial Secretary \vhether, tlie.Government could afford-any information as to the position of this pioyince in the quesr tion of the Otago boundary line P Mr. Ollivieb replied that the matter had been left to Colonel Mould, who had: been appointed special commissioner.:: He had been expected down for-some time past, but: had been prevented from coming by serious illriess; He would probably be down in a month or six weeks. No information had yet been received on the; subject. After notices of motion, tlie Council adjourned to Thursday, the sth instant.