Provincial Council.
WASTE lANDS' BILL,
Tuesday, October 9th
Mr. Brittan desired to submit to the House the proposed alterations to'the Waste Land Regulations. They had been returned to them disallowed, for reasons which were made known to them in the correspondence upon the table. It was amauerof so much importance to them, that it could not be passed over without notice ; and although the Council had been called together for an especial purpose, they had felt that the puhlie would have reason to complain if some measures were not adopted in reference to the matter at once. The clauses ohjected to were the 19th, which had reference to reserves for military defences, and the clauses which had 'reference to the Local Improvement Fund. The first was easily remedied by its omission ; the next, however, was somewhat more important. They had proposed to fix the price of the land at 10s. per acre, and to attach a condition of the payment of 30s. per acre for local revenue. But the Colonial Secretary had advised them that this was contrary to the principles of the Constitution Act and could not be allowed. They intended, therefore, to meet tbe objection by expunging tbe final clauses 84, 85, and 86, and altering the words 10s. per acre in clause 35, to 40s. per acre. The price of the land would then be 40s. per acre, to be paid down at once. The only alteration beyond was one in the pasturage clauses, which was occasioned by this also. He thought there was really no occasion to revive a discussion upon the subject, now they had gone over the whole subject, and had discussed the merits of all schemes and of all prices ; but upon one idea the public mind seemed now to dwell, and that was the desirability of a uniform price for land, and they had resolved upon its being £2 per acre rather than £3. There was another feature in these regulations which the people generally would deeply regret to see abandoned : it was the size of the blocks. They were now of 50 acres under the Association's regulations, but were to be 20 acres under the proposed system ; and it was most material that the men who had saved their _£40 might have a means of converting it into a freehold estate, rather than be compelled to await the accumulation of £100. Then there was the stockowning interest. The Council had resolved upon the reduction of these rents, and in justice to these gentlemen they were, he thought, called upon to deal with tbe matter now, rather than interpose delay, which would probably postpone tbe consideration of the suhject for twelve months longer. His duty then was simply to ask the assent of the Council to tbe following resolution :— "That the Council having before them the letter of the Colonial Secretary, dated the 15th Sept. to the Superintendent, stating that His Excellency'the Governor is advised that the Land Regulations recommended by the Superintendent and the Provincial Council cannot be put in force consistently with the law, and further stating the particular clauses which appear objectionahle; resolve that the Land Regulations be amended by the omission and alteration of the clauses objected to, and be again recommended to be issued by the Governor." If they agreed to that, be should then movethe House into committee to reconsider the clauses he bad mentioned. Mr. Tancred seconded the motion. Mr. FoOKSsaid he did not rise to oppose the resolution, but be did desire that a silent acquiescence should not be misconstrued. He thought it would be an impolitic and an unnecessary waste of time. He contended that the Provincial Waste Lands' Act virtually superseded the Waste Lands Act passed by tbe General Assembly. That act was only a temporary measure, and gave to the Governor the power to issue any regulations recommended by the Councils. Its very wording seemed to prove that it was not intended to have permanency. Tiie last act of the General Assembly bad received ihe.sanction of the Home authorities ; by it the power of control is no longer vested in tbe Governor but in the General Assembly. Their regulations would be returned to them on this ground. It was doubtless intended by tbe act and by the General Assembly that the Provincial Councils should have the power delegated to them of dealing with their own lands, but the conditions were to be determined by the Assembly ; any regulations they might make would now necessarily be imperfect, hasty, and premature.
Mr. Ollivier said he fully concurred in the observations which had fallen from his hon. friend. He believed that it would be useless to return these regulations to the Governor for his assent to them under the authority of the act of the General Assemhly of Sept. 14. It was highly important that they should look clearly at their position, if they desired that out of doors they should not be charged with hasty legislation. The Constitution Act by the 19th .clause had clearly restricted the Provinces from legislating upon the subject of the Waste Lands. That power is given to tbe General Assembly, and to the General Assembly alone. The 72nd clause is clear and explicit. Us final paragraph provides that until the General Assembly shall otherwise enact —shall make a law of its own upon the subject—Her Majesty only shall regulate the sale and letting of the Waste Lands of the Crown under the royal sign manual. That power has been exercised, therefore, by the Governor as the representative of the Crown under instructions. But what had the General Assembly done ? Had it passed a law to regulate the sale of these lands ? No. On the 14th of Sept. last it had passed a bill, authorising (until it shall be otherwise enacted by the General Assembly) the Governor to issue and to put in force regulations approved hy the Provincial Councils, and it confirmed and made valid all regulations to that time existing. Under this act our regulations had been framed. Upon the 16th Sept., only two days later, another bill was passed by the General Assembly, entituled an act to authorise the General Assembly to empower the Provinces to enact laws for regulating the sale, &c, of the Waste Lands, but as this was a power they could not delegate of themselves under the Constitution Act, they sent the bill to England for tbe sanction of Her Majesty in council. It recites that the act shall come into force so soon as the royal assent has been signified to it. Well, the royal assent has been signified to it; it was said His Excellency the Governor had brought it with him. If so, he contended that the period had arrived when the delegated authority of the Governor under the act of tbe 14th Sept. ceased, and the power reverted again to the General Assembly. It had been said that tbe sanction of tbe Queen in council was not sufficient to enable this fundamental alteration in the powers of the Provincial Councils as defined iv the Constitution Act. —that it required the sanction of the Houses of Parliament. He might be in error, but he thought there was in this respect a clear distinction made between the Provincial Councils and the House of Representatives. No alterations could be made in the constitution of the House of Representatives, except by a bill which should receive the sanction of the Crown, after having been laid before both Houses of Parliament for 30 days. But by the next clause in the act, the 69th, it was lawful for the General Assembly to alter the provisions of tbe act as related to the powers of the Provincial Council, as well as in other things, provided always, that such bill shall be reserved for Her Majesty's pleasure. The position they were in, then, he thought, was this. That the power to make regulations had to be deputed to them under tbis act bj the General Assembly. The Assembly had to meet to define the conditions, the restrictions and the limitations, and any attempt of theirs to reenact, or assent to regulations which should be sent to the Governor for his approval, would be frustrated by being again returned to them disallowed. Mr. Hall said that this proposal simply to postpone the settlement of this question was the last which they had a right to expect. If there was one course more than another which was fraught with injury to the Province, and excite just dissatisfaction in the public mind, it was that of further delay in the settlement of the Land Regulations. People bad been waiting now for two years to know what the regulations were to be, and the suspense had seriously interfered with all the enterprise and industry in the Province ; it had also prevented valuable settlers coming hither from Australia. What reason had been assigned for this proposal involving at least another year's delay ? It was asserted that the Provincial Waste Lands' Act, which had now received the Queen's assent, superseded ihe former act which gave to the Governor the power to issue Land Regulations recommended by the Provinces. Mr. H. then read portions of both these acts, with a view of shewing- that they would not bear this construction. In [any case it was not the duty of the Council to put into the Governor's head doubts
as to his own power ; if his authority was at an end, he would be the first to know it. What, however, was bis language in the despatch respecting these regulations? He did not disallow ihem because his power was at an end, but because he objected to certain particulars of the regulations. The fair inference was, that if these objections were removed, the Regulations would at once be sanctioned. Mr. D ampler saw no objection in point of law. The hon. gentleman had no locus standi whatever. The resolution of the hon. gentleman asked them to give effect to their labours of last session. He was sure the house would not willingly declare, by the rejection of the resolution, that they had laboured so long and so diligently over these regulations through a protracted session, and that for no practical utility. Mr. Packer could not agree with either of the hon gentleman who had last spoken. The hon. member (Mr. Hall) bad made a great point of.the delay, a*.d its consequences upon the interest of the people, if these regulations were not sent up again. He believed that there was a great desire somewhere that they should pass, but it was not among the working men, it might be among the stockowners, and there was a satisfactory reason for. it. There was the reduction of their rents. The hon. gentleman made a point of these two reasons civilly assigned for the rejection of the regulations, but there was something strongly akin to evasion in the reluctance of the hon. gentleman to touch upon the final reason assigned by his Excellency. Why that final clause was tantamount to saying I have really nothing to do with the matter, it must be left to the proper tribunal. As for the false alarm they were raising about delay, it was nonsense to suppose they were thinking of postponing the matter for an indefinite period. They all knew when the General Assembly would meet, and their great care was therefore to select good men to represent them there. The business could soon be set at rest, and theie was no earthly objection to the postponement of the subject until then, either as regarded the sales of the land, or for the pastoral purposes. Not one acre less would be sold, nor one run tbeles3 be taken up. It had been said that tbe General Assembly might postpone the subject. He did not think so, they had a right to expect they would not. He attached very little importance to what people said. They had heard it said, that only wait awhile, and our accounts would, all be arranged in the most satisfactory terms ; there would be a liberality of spirit and a fair measure of justice. But what was the practical result 1 Why simply that they were all just where they were. Pass these regulations again, you may, but the Governor will ignore them, He will tell you again as he has told you now^ the power is not in me, it is in the General Assembly, and again urge you to take his advice, and wait a little longer. The hon gentleman then moved the adjournment of the debate until that day 3 months. Mr. Thomson seconded the motion. Mr. Sewkll said he was greatly surprised at the turn the discussion was taking. He could not see how they were going to advance the matter one moment hy adjournment. Suppose all they had heard advanced was true,-—what then?— Had hon. gentlemen forgotten one little clause in the act which require a provision to be made for the New Zealand Company and the General Government. The General Assembly of course would have to see that there was uo contravention of the Constitution Act. But then they seem to want the power under this law rather than under the other. Well it was really immaterial, because they in fact possessed the power before ; it was in fact only a quibble for delay. But was it not desirable, apart from the question of the pastoral interest, even for their own sakes as well as theirs ; was it not desirable for the peace of the land that the whole question should be settled ? Was it fair to compel a man buying land to pay £\ per acre more than they intended him to pay ? It was taking advantage of necessity. Again, was there no fear that the price might yet be fixed at lOs. and then they may have large and monopolising sales ? When the Council passed regulations last session, they did it with the risk that they would be rejected, they were not without apprehension, but they believed at the same time, as he did, that they were if faulty, at least as legal as any other which had been' adopted in the colony. He thought the same law which disallowed these, ought also to disallow theirs.
Mr. Barker objected to the alteration which government had proposed. It would have the effect of stopping all sales to the North and Soutb. So far from large sales at lOs. being injurious, it was really the means by which their operations were effectually carried on. He knew land was readily bought at £3, and he felt sure that fixing the price arbitrarily at £2 would soon lead to taxation. Mr. Hamilton said, looking back to the operations of last session, the course of the debate had altogether surprised him. The subject had been determined upon to the great j»y and the satisfaction of all parties; and the people looked to them to carry ont these regulations as a means of reviving that enterprize which had so long been arrested. It had been agreed upon by all, and hebeli-ved by the hon. member for Christchurch Country District (Mr. Ollivier) also, that the course they were adopting was a speculative one, but that if the regulations were sent back,—then they could but fall back to tbe fixed price of £2 per acre. It was well to speculate upon what were the intentions of tlie Governor, or what were the intentions of the General Assembly. They knew only that at present there was no General Assembly. The hon. gentleman argues that it would be a waste of time to pass these regulations now, but he does "'-"not consider the time of the people that would be wasted by tbe adoption of his course or the time that is being wasted in this bouse now. He desired to make one or two remarks upon the point now touched upon. It bad been said that the last act having received the Royal assent, repealed tbe former act under which we were acting. If it did, it repealed also all existing acts under which powers are held in other provinces; but if it did so, or was intended to do so, it would have repealing clauses. They were told they were to wait for the General Asiemhly to pass a law on the subject, if they were to do so, he feared they might wait 3 years longer. If tbe hon. gentlemen had objections to the regulations, let them bring them forward; if they were satisfied we should continue them as they are, why not say so at once. He entirely dissented from the interpretation they had put upon the Governor's letter. After some further discussion in which Messrs. Ollivier, Hall, Fooks, and Brittan took part, the amendment was put and lost. The Nos. being 5 for it, and 11 against. The original motion was then put and carried. The house then went into Committee upon the clauses. Clause 19 was omitted, and 35 amended. The words forty shillings substituted for ten shillings. The clause 61 amended. Clauses 84;, 5, and 6, omitted. The house resumed, and the regulations reported as amended agreed to. The house theD adjourned, after several notices of motion. Friday, October 13. Present—The Speaker, Messrs. Tancred, Brittan, Hamilton, Hall, Moore, Barker, Ollivier. Ward, Dampier, Bray, Blakiston, J'and S. Beaky, and Westenra. On the motion of Mr. Tancred the House resolved itself into a Committee of Supply to consider a vote of money to His Honor for tbe entertainment of His Excellency tbe Governor in a graceful and becoming* manner. Mr. Tancred said the Council would not expect him to enumerate in detail the items which he had marked down as probacy regu * re(i for tili _ u rpose# i here would arise many small expenses which „ n nl °f course be foreseen. He had estimated £130 as theminimum amount; that sum would certainly be necessary. He believed he exp.-essed the opinion of the whole Council, and indeed of the Province, in saying that it would not he fair to cast upon His Honor the \veight of this expenditure. His Excellency would probably be lodged with His Honor. He would of course, require additional at-endants. If, as of course there would be, a series of enter.ainments given-he could hardly reckon less than *s. or i,70 for the purpose. _t was intended to give a pubhc breakfast at Lyttelton, and a ball at Ohrwtchureh. The rooms for these purposes would have to be prepared. There would be several incidental expenses arising out of these, and he had estimated the cost at another £60 • t --ether, these would monopolize the £130 The present was not an occasion to act with a niggard band. He thought it would be better to ask for a vote at once ol £200. The whole sum need not be expended. That would enable His Honor to act with becoming hospitality upon so
unusual an occasion Mr. Tancred then moved a resolution to that effect. Mr. Buittan* seconded the motion. He bad no doubt UsiU oilis-i' Provinces would he expressing a similar hospitable course, and they ought not to he behind them. He trusted that whatever ihe amount voted there would at least be a perfect unanimity of opinion on the subj ct. The vole was agreed to mem. con. The House having resumed, — Mr. "Hamilton moved the second reading of the Census Bill. The bill was subsequently passed through committee, and was reported lo the House. On the motion of Mr. Brittan, the amended Land Reirulations w >re transmitted to His Honor, prayinsr that he would forward them without delay to His Excellency, and request his approval of tbe same. The Canterbury Association Reserves Bill was then read a second time, aud passed into committee. Mr. Brittan moved the adoption of clause T, and in a few words explained the power sought for by tbe Government under tbe clause, viz., authority to lease or sell the Reserves, or to lease upon a term of years with a purchasing clause; the payment of tbe purchase money to be made by instalments of 10 per cent, tbe Ist year, 30 percent, the 3rd year, and the remainder at the expiration of the lease, which would average 7 years, ihe Council limiting them io a minimum price of £50 per acre. Mr. Dampier objected to the clause because it omitted a power to mortgage. Mr. Hall entertained great doubts of the propriety of placing in the hands of the Superintendent and the Executive so large a power as was given in this clause. It would furnish temptation to jobbing, which might be used in a very dangerous way. Laud adjoining these Town reserves had already realised £70 an acre. The power to sell these Town reserves, otherwise than as Town Land, was virtually enabling the Government to make a great breach of faith with the public. These reserves had been set apart for the enlargement of the town, and should be sold hereafter as Town laud, in half acre sections, and by auction. If brought into the market judiciously, it would realise very large sums, in the meantime it could be let on lease. He thought they were about to give too great power to the 'Government. There might be no fear with the present Superintendent, but they did not know who might be called upon to fill that office. If so disposed, the Superintendent could for £,0 an acre make a conveyance, unassailable hereafter, of land worth ten times that sum. He concluded by moving the following amendment. " Provided that any such sale shall be subject to the regulations for the time being in force for tbe sale of Town land, and that no such lease shall be for a longer period than ten years." Dr. Barker seconded the amendment. Mr. Brittan said tbe proposition of the hon. gentleman was really a matter of detail, which might be safely left to the Government. They had it in contemplation to sell this property by auction. As'regarded the price at wbioli the Council would fix their limit, viz., £50 per acre, it was, as they were aware, £2 per acre more than the upset price of the Association for town laud. The council would be secure in this that no less a sum could be obtained. The size of the blocks was again a subject for them to consider iii detail. He thought there ought not to be that limitation of power to the act of the Superintendent; he was not likely to abuse it, the elected of the people, removable too by a vote of the majority of that council, at best secure only in his position for four years. It was .not likely that such an officer would dare to do any great violence to public opinion. If he did, they had the best guarantee that he could not long do so. He was compelled to say that it was dangerous for hon. gentlemen to extemporise resolutions which would, if successful, have ihe force of law, and yet might not heieafter be found to work well. A. very tedious discussion followed, which occupied the whole of the foreuo- n, in which Messrs. Hall and Baiker repeatedly took part. Mr. Dampier desired to propose another amendment, which he prefaced by alengthened speech hill of professional suggestions and advice to the Government, which was replied to by Mr. Hamilton. The clause was ultimately put by the chairman, and adopted hy the Committee hv a majority of 3. The numbers were 9 for and 6 against it.
Clause 2 was then read, and Mr. Brixtah moved its adoption. The clause had reference to the wharves at Lyttelton, and forbids the erection of any buildings upon them greater in height than tbe level of the pavement on the north side of the Quay. A long discussion arose out of this clause also, in reference to the bonded stores erected by Mr. Alport. The clause was postponed for the production of the "lease under which Mr. Alport claims to hold the property. All the other clauses of the bill were agreed to. Clause 3 proposed a free grant of land to Christchurch College, Canterbury, on the Government domain, for the erection of the college and schools, tbe land so granted to be occupied within 3 years or abandoned. Mr. Hall objected to the clause. Mr. Dampier and Dr. Barker supported it. Clause 9 convey.*-, by way of free grant also, a portion of laud to the Church of Scotland, for schools and church. This clause passed without objection. On the introduction of clause 11, Mr. Ollivier made a fruitless attempt to depute the management of tbe estate to tbe Superintendent, and a body of five trustees, to consist of two members of the Executive Council, and 3 members of the- Provincial Council elected by a vote of the Council. Tbe house then resumed. Several notices were given for Tuesday, when tbe Council adjourned.
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Lyttelton Times, Volume V, Issue 309, 17 October 1855, Page 3
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4,194Provincial Council. Lyttelton Times, Volume V, Issue 309, 17 October 1855, Page 3
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