LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL.

Lyttelton Times, Volume I, Issue 28, 19 July 1851, Page 6

LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL.

Tuesday, June 17.—After committee on the Land Claimauts Bill, in which some discussion took place respecting the determination of appeals in disputed cases, the Census Bill, in its amended form, was considered in committee. A question being raised as to the expediency of the religious denomination forming part of the information returned: Sir George Grey was in favour of seeing this question stand for these specific reasons. A new system of taxation was, it appeared, about to be introduced into certain districts of New Zealand, by which a person was to be compelled to pay £1. for each acre of land he purchased, to a church he might disapprove of. It was a very hard position for a settler to be placed in, who perhaps had established himself in the district before the settlement had been formed, that he must either ruin himself by not extending his property, or pay a tax in support of a church which he disliked. The argument used with reference to this system was, that it interfered with no other faith, and injured no other interests; but he (Sir George) considered it a very hard condition that the wild lands of New Zealand should be subject to such regulations : it appeared now that an attempt was being made to include part of the Nelson district in the Canterbury settlement, and to bring it under the same regulations as to the sale of lands. The New Zealand Company had commenced operations by claiming certain districts as their private property, and they had therefore an undoubted right to do what they liked with their own estate, and if any Association should buy a million of acres, they clearly would have a right to do what they liked with their own ; but in this case it was stated they wished to obtain possession of a certain tract of country without ' advancing any money for it, and then to prevent all other persons, even those already there, from occupying any further portion of that country, unless they paid large sums towards objects of ■which they might not approve. Hon. C. Dillon withdrew his objection, and a strong feeling was expressed by members with regard to this question. My. Cautley gave notice of his intention to move For any documentary information which may !bein the possession of the Government on the subject of any proposal to unite the whole or any part of the Nelson settlement to that of the Canterbury block, or any other information on the subject in the possession of die Executive Government which they may be able to afford. Wednesday, June 18.—The Attorn ey-Gene-ial,in a long and able speech, moved the second reading of the Provincial Councils BihL. His Excellency the ■•Lieutenant-Governor, (whose speech, with that of Sir G. Grey, we consider of sufficient importance to be given at length,) said, . ■ " I rise for the purpose of seconding the motion made by the hon. the Attorney-General for New Zealand, that the Provincial Councils Bill be read a second time. I do so because I believe it to be the duty of every officer acting under any government, to give his full support to whatever measures, affecting the policy of the administration, the head of such government may deem-essential, either for the proper conduct of the administration, or for promoting the general interests and welfare of the community. But at the same time I deem it not unbecoming my position to express some of the views which suggest themselves to me in reference to the particular measure now before the Council, and I also would not willingly give a silent vote upon a question of so much importance, and one involving as this does the groundwork of the future political institutions of the country. The chief feeling which I entertain in reference to this bill, is one of regret that it was not enacted in 1848, in the place of the Provincial Councils Ordinance, No. 1, Session 9. I believe that had such been the case, it would then have given general, and I think I may say, as far as New Minister is concerned, universal satisfaction to aj.l classes and to all parties. And it would then, too, have afforded in its working, ji fair test of the value and suitability to New Zealand, or otherwise, of the system (if Provincial Councils—which test certainly cannot be said to be given by the operation of Ordinance No. 1, Session 9, as during the 2)4 years that Ordinance luis been in existence, a Provincial Legislature has only once met for the dispatch of business in New Munster, and not at all in

the Province of New Ulster. I wish I could feel that the same universal satisfaction, which I believe would have been given by the enactment of this measure in 1848, would yet be expevienced by its enactment now, but I cannot realize this to myself. It appears to me that the lapse of nearly three years, and the changed circumstances of the Province, have created a different feeling in the public mind, and one which I fear will render the measure before the Council less palatable to them now, than it would have been in 1848. This,,change of feeling may, I think, be traced to two causes ; first —the lapse of time, which has brought the period when the act suspending the Constitution of 1846 will expire, so very near, that an impression naturally prevails that if that Constitution j>is remodelled, it will not be in a less popular form than that ancient constitution — prevalent, prior to the commencement of the 19th century, which has been recommended by a Committee of Her Majesty's Privy Council, and which, in point of fact, was adopted by the Crown and sanctioned by Parliament in the case of New Zealand in the Constitution of 1546. The other cause operating to produce the change of feeling which I have alluded to, is found in the progress of the province itself, and in the establishment in it of the new and important settlements of Otago and Canterbury—circumstances which have brought more home to the colonists of the various settlements the conviction, that isolated as these settlements are from each other, and disunited as they are in matters of local interest, Provincial Councils do not afford that medium of local administration which they are so anxious to obtain. I believe therefore, that the colonists of New Minister generally, would rather have only one General Legislature for the whole of New Zealand, than in addition to it a Provincial Council, which, meeting at one settlement only, would not afford a large measure of local self-management to each settlement of importance. They appear to me to be rather anxious for Municipal Institutions, with extended powers and privileges, than for the creation of subordinate Legislatures; and I cannot better express the opinion which I believe extensively prevails on this subject, than by quoting a short extract from an Address which was presented to your Excellency by a portion of the Nelson settlers, and which, with the permission of the Council, I will read—

For a country like New Zealand, offering here and there upon its coast, tracts available for settlements, separated by physical barriers, it seems to us that a form of. government which would confer upon the several districts large powers of dealing with all local questions, would be most satisfactory and efficient. The Municipal, using the word in its widest and most ancient sense, appears to us the form best adapted to the requirements of this country. Provincial Councils do not fulfil the desired end, and are cumbrous, expensive, and ostentatious. For unless the Provinces of New Zealand were multiplied to an amount which would entail upon the colony a ruinous Government expenditure, it would be impossible to divide it in such a manner as not to include within the same limits districts of dissimilar interests.

Looking to the very great differ ence, physical as well as social, which distinguish the Northern from the Middle Island, to the great extent of natural pastures in the latter, and the nearly total absence of native inhabitants, it would almost appear as if they were intended by nature for two separate colonies. But, abstaining from pressing this point further upon your Excellency's consideration at present, and looking upon New Zealand as at present constituted in one colony, we would suggest that one central Legislature and Executive would be quite sufficient for., every purpose of good government. Local peculiarities might be met atid satisfied by the municipalities of the districts, the consideration of all subjects of a general nature, and affecting the colony as a whole, being reserved for the General Legislature. The employment of steam vessels upon the coast would remove all the obstacles which at present exist to this form of government, and entirely supersede the necessity of Provincial Councils.

These sentiments I believe to be fully shared in by the settlers of Otago and Canterbury, and to the general principles enunciated I cannot but cordially assent. I should have been glad, therefore, if any measure could have been brought forward during the present session for creating such municipal institutions, and for placing at their disposal a certain proportion of the revenue of each settlement for local purposes. For the reasons, then, which I have mentioned, I believe that the state of feeling in this province has so far changed from what it was in LB4B, on

the subject of Provincial Councils, that the bill now under discussion will not, 1 fear, be so favourably received (if passed) as it would have been in that year. I fear, too, that this will be still more the case than I had even previously supposed, since I learnt from your Excellency's opening address that it was the intention of Her Majesty's Government to pass an act during the present session of Parliament, creating a General Legislative Council for the whole of New Zealand, but, as I gathered inferentially/'J not regulating or defining the nature or character of the Provincial Councils, but giving ' full powers to the General Legislature to modify or alter the subordinate Legislatures to any form they may think fit. It is therefore^ possible, that as the new Act of Parliament may;, be received by the end of the present year, any" General Legislature which may be called together under it, might alter or modify the form of Provincial Councils which this bill would create, even before any one Provincial Council should have been assembled under it. On the grounds, then, which I have stated, I cannot but express my regret that the present measure was not enacted in 1848, or that it is not now postponed for the consideration and decision of the General Legislative Council, which may be called together under the new Act of Parliament, which it is understood will be passed during the present session. I regret it also, because, when I remember the feeling which exists in the Province in reference to what is called Nomineeism, or the nomination of members of the Legislature by the Crown, and that this feeling has been so general and so strong as latterly altogether to prevent the Local Government from getting together a Provincial Council, under Ordinance No. 1, Session 9,1 am unable to satisfy myself that there may not be some room to doubt, whether the same occurence may not take place in reference to the measure before Council, and thus the object of that measure be defeated, though the bill itself be passed and become law. With these general observations, and expressing my cordial concurrence in the liberal provisions contained in the bill before the Council on the subject of the franchise—the system of direct representation, and the duration of the Council, I beg to second the motion thatthe Provincial Councils Bill be now read a second time."

The Hon. Mr. Dillon was opposed to the division of the colony, into provinces, as cumbrous and expensive. He would accept the Bill with all its imperfections, as by it the opinions of the people might be got at, which was not the ease now.

Mr. Cautley thought that none but those who lived in the towns where they were held, would support provincial councils. He knew that the people of Nelson were almost unanimous in favour of Municipal Institutions. Mr. Bell urged the most careful consideration of the measure. He considered the plan of Provincial Councils expensive. He entered his decided protest against nomineeism, but he had no objection to one third of the members being nominees of the crown, provided the power was accompanied with official responsibility. The power of the Governor he thought sufficient to protect the native race. He was in favour of universal suffrage, but had no hope of carrying an amendment to that effect. He thought the measure, on the whole, liberal. Sir George Grey then rose and said, that lie did not intend to have offered auy remarks at that stage of the Bill, as he conceived that his reasons for postponing the introduction of the present measure, had been sufficiently explained in his various despatches on the subject to the Home Government, which had been published ; but that after the grave censure p&sseil,. upon him by the Lieutenant-Governor, lie could"not^ remain silent. And he would first; beg to deny that it was necessary for the Lieutenant-Goyeh<- . nor to second the present motion from a sense I of duty ; for he (Sir George) could conscienti-/ ously assert that he had never in any council, over which he had had the hyonouc-to preside, solicited the support of a single member to the measures he had thought lit to introduce, but that on the contrary, he had left members' entirely free, and at liberty to ;fct according to,(heir own views and feelings, and he confidently appealed to the members of the council, whether such was not the case. /It had'bee/i his good fortune to exist in private frieridship with many who had opposed him;' and/he had never harboured a single unfriendly feeling towards his opponents, nor allowed their opposition to influence him in his relation's, with them. He must

however, at the same time say, that in his opinion, it was highly unbecoming in one occupying such an elevated position as the LieutenantGovernor, to pfiss such a grave censure upon his (Sir George's) administration ; and he therefore felt bound to defend himself, and to set himself right with the public. With regard to the Lieutenant-Governor's expression of regret that this measure had not been introduced two and and a half years ago, he would call upon that to remember'the heavy responsibility J'whleh attached to him as "a great public officer of England's Empire." Great convulsions had taken place in almost every kingdom of Europe, he was uncertain as to the amount of the military and naval force which England could spare him, and he was therefore bound to aat cautiously, and to maintain at all events the peace of this part of her Majesty's dominions. And he would appeal to England and the whole world, whether he had not succeeded in accomplishing this great object. He might have erred in the course he had pursued in reference to the present measure, but he felt in his own conscience, that he had acted from the best of motives, and he would ask the Council, whether, when they looked back to the financial and other difficulties, of no ordinary magnitude, in which he found the colony on his arrival, his policy had not been successful; whether peace had not been preserved with the natives, and whether the settlers could say they had been impoverished. He wished not to claim the exclusive merit of this to himself, for none but himself knew how ably and zealously he had been assisted and supported by those under him. The present measure had been prepared by himself and the Attorney-General, and he considered it as extremely liberal. If he had consulted his own ease, he would, knowing that it was the intention of her Majesty's Government to propose a Constitution for this Colony to Parliament in the present Session, have done nothing. He well knew that in proposing such a measure, he ran the risk of offending influential parties at home, but he took the present responsibility upon himself, because he felt that her Majesty's Government was not sufficiently acquainted with the circumstances of New Zealand to legislate for it in such matters. He had sent a copy of the Bill to the Home Government, so that it would be received before the opening" of Parliament, and if he was deserving of censure for what he had done, he could only say he had acted from a sincere desire to promote the welfare of the country. He was also desirous of correcting one or two errors which some of the members who had sffoken had fallen into, in stating that large municipalities were desired, which, they asserted, were not expensive, and maybe made numerous: they had also stated that great dislike was entertained to Provincial Councils, but he believed if the provisions of this measure were properly understood, it would not be disliked. If it were understood that these Provincial Councils would eventually lapse into municipalities with extensive powers over the revenue, he thought these Councils would become highly popular, especially when it was known that there was no necessity in the different Provinces for an officer of higher rank than that of Superintendent. He (Sir George) would further remark on the censure which had been cast upon him for not introducing municipalities, that there did not appear the least desire for them; and so strongly was this indifference shewn, that when on a former occasion he had thought of doing so, and had mentioned his intention in this Province, he had been strongly desired not to do so. He might at least claim this merit, he had been the first Governor of a colony who had proposed the division of the country into hundreds, and the appointment of wardens, to be elected by the inhabitants, for the management of the affairs of those hundreds ; he might claim the merit of being the author and introducer of the system by which all the rents, and one-third of the land fund, were placed at the disposal of these wardens for the purpose of local improvements. In contemplating these great changes, when he had found the colonists indifferent or indisposed to their introduction, he had nevertheless gone on accumulating funds for large public charities, i« that Corporations, instead of being a mere 'uchiiiery for taxing the inhabitants for improvements, might start with funds at their disposal, and that these Institutions might be placed on such a footing, as to call out the sympathies of the highest and noblest minds in the land. He could conscientiously assert he had done his utmost to introduce these Institutions

into the country; lie had that very morning; put the last touches to a measure for introducing' a municipality at Auckland, which had been prepared with the assistance of his friend the At-torney-General of New Zealand. In referring to the past, he could unhesitatingly say he had done his utmost to get municipalities introduced into this province. He had been very anxious to constitute a municipality at the Hutt, but owing to the want of information which prevailed, he had experienced the greatest difficulty in inducing the inhabitants of that fertile district to accept it. Taking himself to task on this subject, therefore, and submitting his conduct to the severest self-scrutiny, he (Sir George) did not think he was deserving of censure for the course he had pursued. The Lieutenant-Governor in reply to Sir George, disclaimed any intention of passing a censure upon his Excellency: he had not given his own opinion on the bill, further than expressing his regret that it had not been introduced some years since. He had simply confined himself to stating what he felt assured was and would be the general opinion of the settlers in regard to the proposed measure, and he repeated his conviction, that he had fairly represented the feelings of the settlers in the southern province; he was quite ready to bear testimony to the truth of Sir George's statement that he had never requested his support to the measure, but still he must say, that practically speaking, the Officers of the Executive were both bound and expected to support the measures and policy of the head of the Government. The Colonial Secretary disclaimed in the strongest manner any interference on the part of Sir George Grey, as to the course pursued by the members of Government. He expressed himself opposed to universal suffrage, and would support the adoption of the principles embodied in the bill. Mr. Petre denied the doctrine that every member of the Executive Government was bound to support the Government. For his own part he would every where give his unbiassed opinion. He would defer his remarks upon this Bill until it was discussed in committee, but would observe that he was strongly opposed to the introduction of any nominees into the council. The second reading of the bill was then carried unanimously. Canterbury Pasturage Regulations.— Mr. Oautley moved that any documents relative to a proposal for uniting the Nelson settlement, or any portion of it, to that of Canterbury, should be laid before the Council. Seconded by Mr. Hickson. Sir George Grey said that any information on this subject, in the possession of the government, rested, he believed, solely on his own personal knowledge. All he knew regarding it was, that the Agent of the Canterbury Association had read to him the draft of a letter, in which, as far as he remembered, was a recommendation that an application should be made for an extension of the block of land which was to be subject to disposal under the peculiar rules of that settlement. He had, however, heard rumours on the same subject from other sources. As far as he was informed of the intentions of the Home Government and of Parliament, he believed that they were in no way desirous that this particular mode of disposing of lands should be forced upon the inhabitants of this country. In fact they were solely desirous of promoting the welfare of the inhabitants of New Zealand, and of consulting, in as far as practicable, their wishes. It therefore was the duty of those persons, who disliked the portion of the Islands they lived near being subjected to such regulations, to state their objections to them. The points which appeared to require attention were these : a district containing nearly three millions of acres, including within its' boundaries Banks' Peninsula, and embracing one of the most fertile districts in New Zealand, which contained also—before the present regulations were established—many persons of a different faith from that of the Church of England, was placed under the control of the Canterbury Association, and then regulations were made, an important feature of which was, that until three millions of pounds were paid for the purposes of the Church of England, the whole of that district could not be used, as their necessities required, by civilized man ; nor could any part of it be used for these purposes, until the proportionate part of the three millions of pounds, which was due under these regulations upon that part, was paid over

for the purposes of the Church of England; even for depasturing purposes the land could not be used, under the present regulations, except at a rate which, calculating that a hundred acres would feed thirty sheep, required a payment of nearly 2c?. per head per annum for the same purposes. Now, as he understood from rumours, it was intended to ask that a further block of perhaps 3,000,000 or 4,000,000 of acres should be placed under the same regulations, so that the case would then be that before the whole of this block could be used, seven millions of pounds must be paid for the purposes of the Church of England—and no part of it could he used until the proportionate amount due on that portion had been so paid. This appeared to involve questions worthy the consideration of all classes in New Zealand, as the power of the humbler classes to acquire properties for their families was involved in it, and the extent and value of its commerce greatly depended on it. The only argument he had ever heard used in defence of this arrangement was, that Great Britain had done much for New Zealand, and therefore had a right to make such regulations for the disposal of its lands as were for the benefit of the population of the whole Empire. This argument he admitted in its fullest extent ; but he could not consider it for the benefit of the mother country that one of the most fertile portions of the empire should be closed by such restrictions, which, in as far as he understood them, placed obstacles in the way of industrious men raising themselves from a state of want, by the use of lands which, in their wild state, were useless to mankind. As a Churchman he viewed this attempt with the utmost alarm, although on this subject he spoke with great diffidence, as he had the highest reliance upon the judgment of many members of the Association, indeed two Right Reverend Prelates belonging to that Association were his intimate friends ; yet it did not appear to him, at the time that so large a portion of the population of Great Britain were in such distress, to be in accordance with any rule of Christianity, that the poor of the earth should have closed against them, by such restrictions, so large a tract of fertile country, which a bounteous Providence had placed at the disposal of the human race. It did not appear to him to be in accordance with the principle that those who preach the Gospel should live by the Gospel, because it wrung contributions to a Church from those who were not friendly to that Church, but whose absolute necessities compelled them to buy land necessary for their operations; and because it made the clergy, in the early stages of the scheme, dependent for their support, not upon' their flocks, not upon the members of the Church, but solely upon the amount of land to be sold ; so that, almost involuntarily, many might be led to aid in the sale of lands—a duty foreign to their calling. He thought, therefore, that this system of obtaining1 an endowment was objectionable, whilst he thought the endowment itself far too large, and likely ultimately to introduce habits of sloth and* negligence into the Church, and thus to be injurious to its own welfare. He would far rather have seen the virtuous and industrious, who could find no place at home, encouraged to occupy such a country, upon terms which would have enabled them easily to acquire homes for themselves and their families, and readily to develope the resources of the country, and" to have seen a busy, active clergy, by acts of kindness and Christian virtue, gaining from the members of their own Church, in that fertile district, a love and gratitude which would readily have yielded ample endowments for all their wants. He feared the present system would injure the Church ; it led men incautiously, even in the publications issued under the authority of the Association, to hold out the clergy as a feature of attractiveness, and even to use such language in support of what is termed the religious principle, as that " the merest land speculator has an interest in the Canterbury Bishopric." He thought that such arguments, while they might gain endowments for the Church, must injure the very religion they were meant to support. It therefore behoved those who objected to having the lands in their vicinity placed under such regulations, to state their views upon the subject. Mr. Cautley fully coincided with his Excellency on this question. He thought it Mas not desirable that the land in the Nelson settlement should be subjected to the land purchasing clauses of the Canterbury Association. The Council then adjourned.

Thursday, June 19. —The Colonial Secretary of New Minister presented a petition from the Licenced Victuallers' Society in Wellington, complaining of the increase of the duty on spirits, and of the defective state of the Licencing Ordinance. Customs Bill.—The Council went into Committee on this bill, when the additions to the schedule proposed by the Collector of Customs were considered. On a duty of 7s. per cwt. on printing paper being proposed, Sir George Grey stated that an application had been made to the Govevnmentby the missionary bodies for the admission of printing paper duty free. He thought that every encouragement should be given to them. A discussion arose on a motion made by Mr. Hickson that flour, wheat, meal, and bread stuffs be admitted duty free. Mr. Cautley proposed as an amendment that the duty be remitted for one year. The amendment was carried. In Committee on the New Zealand Company's Land Claimants Bill, the chief discussion arose on the amendment of Mr. Cautley, that the surplus, if any, of the fee of £l for each title to land be spent in immigration. Nothing decisive was arrived at. Friday, June 20.—The consideration of the Land Claimants Bill was resumed in Committee. Amendments were proposed, providing for a reference in disputed cases to a Judge of the Supreme Court. A discussion took place on the clause providing that the lands might be exchanged for scrip if not approved of. The Lieut. Governor suggested that the lands thrown up might prove of little value, and if the exchange were made to any extent, it would materially affect the population of the smaller settlements, and also future sales of- land. Sir George Grey advocated the provision, on the ground of its equity, and deprecated the idea of separate interests among the settlements of New Zealand. Mr. Hickson said that absentees ought not to receive scrip at £1 an acre, seeing that many of the resident owners bad been compelled by their necessities to sell theirs at ss. and 9s. an acre. He concluded by moving an amendment to the 14th clause, to the effect that if the Company had contracted with any purchaser for a particular section of land, and it should not be in the power of the Government to give possession thereof, it should be lawful for the purchaser to select, within six months from the passing of the Ordinance, au equal quantity of land in lieu thereof. After debate on this amendment, Sir George Grey observed that the government, in undertaking the liabilities of the New Zealand Company, owed a certain quantity of land, which must be paid in one condition or other; that the payment in land would cause heavy exexpenses, if the Government were obliged now to survey the valueless districts in which many persons had selected lands. He believed the country would flourish without new settlements. Even if Christchurch had not been formed, he believed the settlers in that district would eventually have realized wealth, and that the settlement would have grown in the manner South Australia and Port Philip had done, while fresh settlers would flock here as to a field to reward their exertions, instead of trusting to a system which discouraged exertion. He felt certain that the colony would prosper, and he would rather see the settlers rely on their own exertion, than on the extvaneous assistance of persons at home, and of the temporary excitement occasioned by the formation of a sew settlement.

Tuesday, June 24.—Provincial Councils Bill. On the stli clause being read, Mr. Bell advocated the extension of the franchise to all persons occupying a " tenement" of the annual value of £5., on the plea that the £10. qualification would exclude many of the most industrious and worthy settlers, and if the qualification were restricted to" dwelling-houses," many who were owners of cultivated land, hut whose .buildings thereon were of little worth, would be excluded from voting. Mr. Bell, however* found that he stood- alone in the suffrage question, and did not divide the council. The substitution of " tenement" for " dwelling-house" was carrie'.'. The Land Fund Appropriation Bill, was read a third time. Wednesday, June 25. —The adjourned committee met on the Provincial Councils Bill. All the clauses were disposed of. The alterations

made were as follows. In the 12th clause, the power of refilling vacancies, &c, was extended to "the speaker"as well as to the Governor An amendment was made in Clause 35* to the effect that the Governor or Speaker* after having approved of the standing orders of the Council, should not interfere with its internal management. One or two other alterations were made, of little moment.

The Language Ordinance, with a few amendments by Mr. Domett, passed the Committee.

Thuksdait, June 26.—The Municipal Elective Franchise Bill, and the Building Societies Bill, were read a second time respectively. The first of these was stated by the Attorney General to have been introduced to extend the power of voting in the election of Municipal Corporations to persons not able to read and write the English language, who were formerly restricted from voting. The Regulations for depasturing cattle in outside hundreds were then read and considered. _In considering the Provincial Councils Bill, Sir George Grey laid before the Council a letter he had received from the Resident Agent of the Canterbury Association, applying to. have that settlement proclaimed a separate province, and stated the purport of his answer thereto. (We give both these documents in our ninth page.) Sir George Grey then referred to a kind of complaint made against him that he had not done anything for the cause of representative institutions, and pleaded his limited powers as the reason. He should feel sorrow if this bill were not to pass, as he believed it would be a great benefit to the country.

Fbiday, June 27. The Marriage Amendment Ordinance, granting certain privileges to the various dissenting bodies, went through the committee.

Sir George Grey laid on the table, among other documents, a copy of a correspondence between the British government arid the East India Company, on the subject of Steam communication with the Australian colonies.

Tuesday, July I.—After an uninteresting discussion on the scrip clause of the Landclaimants Bill, the council went into committee on the depasturing regulations. The Colonial Secretary of New Munster moved:—

That this Council recommend that the following clause do form part of the rules and regulations for depasturing cattle on waste lands;— Provided always, that in estimating the sufficiency of stock for any sheep-run applied for, the Commissioner shall make allowance for natural increase according to the following scale :—

For any No. up to 1,000 increase, to be allowed for 5 year*, from 1,000 to 5.000 i . . .. .. .. from 5,000 to 10,000 .. ... . 3 . . 10,000 and' upwards 2 . .

Canterbury Association— Mr. Cautley gave notice he would move for the appointment of a Committee to prepare an address to the Crown on the proposed extension of their district by the Canterbury Association. From previous discussions he thought it evident the Canterbury Association had attempted an encroachment on another settlement; he should prefer seeing the address prepared by the united wisdom and judgment of three or four members than that so delicate a matter should be undertaken by himself.

Sir George Grey considered the best plan would be to agree to an address in general terms, praying that no privileges should be granted to', Associations which were not equally granted to all classes of her Majesty's subjects. As an illustration of the principle which was at present in operation in the Canterbury settlement, if it were supposed that the block of land of that Association was to be extended in such a way as to embrace two hundred who had been previously settled in the district, then, as it must be admitted that it was not an extravagant supposition that a hard working industrious man should wish to increase his property to the extent of lifty acres, if the whole number were to purchase 10,000 acres they would have to pay a tax of £10,000., for the endowment of a church to which they might not belong It appeared very hard that a law should be suddenly made to this effect, that a settler could not increase his property without being subject to the operation of an indirect tax of this kind. If something were demanded in the Erst instance, if an Association were required first to pay for its land, in the same manner as the rest of her Majesty's subjects, a guarantee would be given that they would not ask for more than they could use. It appeared a hard case, because a

body of men possessed powerful influence, that they should be able to impose restrictions on the rest of her Majesty's subjects^ to obtain advantages which were not accorded to them* Or to place the argument in another shape, if it were supposed a working man could lay by 201. a year for the purchase of land, the effect of the regulation complained of was to say, you shall not become a proprietor of such a property as every man might fairly look to acquire, until you have worked two years and a half for ,a> church to which you may not belong. It would ? be necessary that one uniform principle should be adopted, to enable persons with confidence and certainty to embark capital in New Zealand. /'._,

After some remarks from the Colonial Trea-' surer and others, Sir George Grey said, lie' agreed with a previous speaker that they should do every thing in their power to promote the interest of the Canterbury settlers, but this council might think it incumbent on them to address the Crown, praying that land should, for the future, be disposed of on one uniform system, to make it perfectly certain that no indirect tax should be imposed on any classes of Her Majesty's subjects, that no large districts should be closed against their enterprise, and to secure to all an equal right in the purchase of land. He was afraid, unless a stop were put to persons in England acquiring tracts of land to try experiments on, without being required in the first instance to purchase such lands, there would be no land to try a uniform system upon. Her Majesty had formerly used most gracious and touching expressions on the subject, and wished to assist these colonies in every way. Only yesterday he (Sir George) had accidentally heard of a new Association to be formed, and that application had been made to the Secretary of State for a tract of land as compensation to certain absentees. There was already a debt of £268,000 owing from the colony to the New Zealand Company, 360,000 acres were admitted to be due to their land purchasers, and this additional compensation was proposed to certain absentees. It was desirable to revert to the former plan, which would be acting in conformity with the Royal pleasure. No argument was necessary in England to establish this, as the whole principle was long since admitted by the most eminent men of all parties.

In answer to a few observations by the Attorney General of New Zealand,

Sir George Grey said, at the present moment this feeling, which had never existed before, had grown to this height, that an Agent of a private Association should have the power to send home a recommendation that a large tract of land should be taken from Her Majesty's subjects, instead of sending it through the Governor, who could then have laid it before this Council for their information, and have taken the opinion of the colonists upon it. The first time he received officially a copy of the act, giving the Canterbury Association the entire control over their present large block of land, was in the Statutes at large. He had received a copy privately from an hon. member.

We have before us the reports of the proceedings of Council to July 9, but are only able to give thus much by way of digest of them—the remainder we are compelled to postpone to another paper. We may just add that the resignation of Mr. Hickson is reported, on account of the precipitate manner in which the Customs Bill was passed on the 3rd of July. An amendwas on that day proposed in Council, extending the increased duty to spirits already in bond. This amendment was earned. The Collector* of Customs then moved the suspension of the standing orders, and the third reading of^the bill. Mi*. Hickson moved the adjournment of the Council, and Sir George Grey opposed the unusual haste, as it would be stealing a march upon the holders of spirits, who expected that a month would, elapse before the Ordinance came into operation. The motion however, was adopted. Mr. Hickson then declined to talf charge of the bill, which was read a third tiiat^ and passed. These are the reasons which are stated by the Independent (to which, with the Spectator, we are indebted for most of this report) to have induced Mr. Hickson's resign* > tion.