THE IRISH PROBLEM.

Hokitika Guardian, 20 December 1921, Page 4

THE IRISH PROBLEM.

MEETING OPPOSITION. PRIME MINISTER’S SPEECH. In the Commons on Xovemlier Ist., the “Diehards” brought- forward n motion intended to traverse the polity of the Government in conferring with the Irish delegates regarding terms of settlement. The motion was heavily defeated after a day’s discussion, during which some notable speeches were delivered. 'Hie most important was that of tho Prime Minister (R-t. Hon David Lloyd George), and as tho eonditionH to-day are akin to those of six or seven weeks ago. it will he fnstructive as well as interesting t-o reprint the speech as culled from a London Daily. Opening with a humorous remark following the speaker who had just preceded him, the Prime Minister of Great Britain went on to sav:—A grave issue had arisen, it was clear that a- section of their supporters were full of misgiving and it was “essential that the situation should he cleared up as soon as possible and that we should know th«i view of the House of Commons. The criticism had been courteous and “on the whole skilful,” he remarked, and in allusion to a- Biblical reference jnado by one of the speakers, said it appeared that David was not to build tho Temple of Peace, but who was the Solomon they had in mind? (Laughter and cheers). There had been breaches of the peace, ho admitted. “They had been investigated and in so far as they could be put right they had been put right. We have received distinct guarantees. We had evidence no that arms were being landed in Ireland, but that preparations were to be made for landing armssome of that evidence is attributable to the action of the German Government, and it. is right that that should be stated in the House. We have receded a distinct guarantee that during tho truce no arms would he land ed in Ireland at all.” Touching on the Ulster complaint Mr Lloyd George spoke of the difficulties of putting the Act fully in'tri operation in tho present circtimstances and then remarked: “I think the present position is unfair and intolerable. Therefore unless something happens in the course of the next few days, one way or the other, that puts the position right from the point of view of the Act, we shall either under the powers we have got confer the necessary powers upon the Northern Parliament or we shall a.sk the present House of Commons during the present session, to pass an Act to enable it to Ik- done.” (Cheers.) Coining the terms of the resolution lie- declared that no compact, would be entered into during the negotiations that mold come ini • effect without the lull authority of Parliament. Every de t-iil v.-ould have to be voted upon. The agreement, if t-lmre were an agreement would have to tie nbui'd in the f- rm u r an A'-t. of Parliament. Declaring that no-rotuitions could not. bo conducted with Parliament intervening. Mr Lloyd George said the Government had already informed the House and the country of the basic principles they bad laid down before entering int-i l hi- Conference, mid those they stood iv. (Cheers and erics of “What are The Government, he lOinind--1 the House, had always said that they were willing to negotiate with any member of t-lie Irish people who old “deliver the goods.” PREMIER’S DENIAL.

Mr Rupert Gwvnne: But. you said i! would be with oilier than the murder gang. Mr IJoyd George: My lion, friend is absolutely wrong. 1 never used that phrase. ■Mr Rupert Gwynm- pressed his point ■uid insisted on reading a uu-inLen in which M,r Lloyd George had said that they could not. comm union to with individuals who had bee'll guilty of brutal murders. Mr Lloyd George: Those were men who had boon convicted lof murder. Under British law every man is held to b t . innocent until he is convicted of crime. Leaving this point Mr Lloyd George dealt with the invitation to a conference contained in the letter of duly which followed his Majesty’s Speech from the Throne in Belfast. Ibis Iloilo- sat lor weeks after that. said Mr Lloyd Goorge. “Way was there not a. challenge then? The Hum to make the challeng;. was when L‘i- h'lter was published.” (Sever IK'inbers: “Wo aid protest.”) if there bail been 40 or 50 members oxpressiiw disagreement with the action of go" veriiuient, the Loader ol the House would have wasted no time in gjviu,. tliq necessary opportunity for a discos” .sion.

■ I here was no challenge until afi ter the Conference had begun. Now | mi tho middle ol the Conference 1 am us,ted to stale what is the position of the Government.” CONFIDENCE RLE A. "ONE GLAD MAN.” In a humorous vein. Air idoyd George ran over the various types of confer cure, some sitting in public and others With closed doors, and some which combined the vices of the two, xml summed up with this observation : ’“Th t . House of Commons must cither trust its negotiators „r replace them. This is not a business that any man would .'■are to stick to if he lias not the confidence of the people of the country. ”1 want to know, and my colleagues want to know, whether the House of Commons wants us to try to make peace. If it does not there will he at any rate one glad man who will go to lu's Sovereign and say ‘T wish to hand in my resignation.’ (Some cheers). Ibai .IS tlm position. Start, discussing each individual item here and there will be no Conference. ”l-ct Ijul House of Commons realise that nothing can he done by that Conference until they (the House of, Commons) hare been told. That is the power lof the House. If they do not like any of those terms they are not committed to them, I say so now. We shall recommend them. That is our business. It is the business of the House of Commons to reject them if they do not like them, and they have full power to do so. THE SOUTHERN UNIONISTS. “The gravamen of the charge tonight is that we ore negotiating with men who have repudiated the authority of the Crown and who have been associated with deeds which we abhor. “Let me ask my friends one or two questions. With whom would they confer? Would they confer with the Southern Unionists? The Southern Unionists were the first to press nw to go into conference:-men who were as loyal to the Crown as any man in this House; men who had stood by the Crovm in the dark and difficult days in Ireland. They would be the last people to tell the House of Commons or the country that St would be the slightest ' used to come to terms with themselves They said. ‘You must make vour terms with Mr de Valera and his asso- ’ eiates.’ ,

“You might havo met hon. members below the gangway (7rish Nationalists), but thley would havo been the very first to say tliatLthey cannot speak on l>ehalf of the majority of Southern Ireland,

“Vo.ii, might have met Sir Horace Plunked, who would not carry anyone in Southern Ireland with him. IVe are, negotiating with the representatives elected by the people of Ireland. IRISH DELEGATES. “NO ONE TO DEAL WITH IF NOT THE STNN FEINERS.” “It is said they only speak tor the Irish people because they have secured their present position by intimidation and threats. If you say you will not. treat the members as elected rcptescutatives because of the methods by wliien tbev have been been elected —(irontcai cheers) then there is an end of the British Constitution. “T have never seen a party obtain a majority in this House without the other side declaring that they were elected by methods discreditable to the very last degree. (Laughter and lh “Eor the moment the sympathies of Ireland arc behind these people, and the only thing wo could do when men have been elected under the Act ol Parliament passed by his House was to take them as representatives of the people. Who else is there? We know that the Sinn Foiners have repudiated the authority of tho Crown ; hut if; for that reason you are not going to deal with them there is no one in Ireland to deal with (“Hear, hear.”). “Is is not the first time Britain has rented with rebels with goktd effect for the Empire. After the annexation of the Transvaal and the Orange 1-ree State every man who fought was a rebel to the authority of the Crown. Therefore, the only point to decide is this—not whether you are going to treat, with rebels, not whether you arc going to treat with men organised in a eonsuiraev against- the Crown, hut whether ,-au enter into a- conference at- all. THE ONLY ISSUE“Here T face an issue which my lion, friends do no face. The question is whether you are going to enter into negotiations with these men who have re-l-udiated the authority of the Crown, or whether you are going to say that lirst of all. and whatever the cost you must crush the rebellion and only tlion deal with Ireland. That is the only iss*e.

“Tt is a question of the cost. Let us count the cost-. If this Conference is broken off, the first thing any Government would have to do would he to ask is House to strengthen considerably the forces of the Crown in Ireland. The task in front of the forces would not lie that of facing organised armies in the field. It is the experience of ourselves in every country that in dealing with guerilla warfare the numbers liaT-e to be entirely out of proportion to the numbers of vour foes in order to achieve success. You have to surround mid hunt down small elusive bands oyer considerable tracts of territory, in difhonlt, mountniifous country, with a population entirely in sympathy with vour guerillas. “We all know how gigantic were the femes that had to lie nut into the field in Africa t-o act-ompli-h the task there. H that Inis to he done, and if the people of this country are convinced Dial it must lie done, it can tie done mid it will he done, i Subdued clu-rs'L There will be unpleasant incidents. O"" „f the evils of guerilla warfare is that yonr forces are dispersed, they are not under the same control and disciplines as when they move in masses under their officers, and that is not a fact to he overlooked.

“Unless it is absolutely necessary for the honour and security of this country. is this a time to come to the House of Commons asking it to impose great additional burdens on the tax-payers of ibis country and to invite tbe young men of the Country once more t-o risk tboir lives? (“Hear. hear.”!. You must conn nee tbe people of this country if there is mo other alternative, and you must convince the Empire also.

THE REACE ISSUE. MR LLOYD GEORGE ON A GRTM ROSS! HII.LTV. “There is no peace yet. The iiegotia- -.- ;m e ding, I should he happy if I were in a p sition to stand at this table and aiinomne that tbe great parent races which had ’"-'undid this Empire had decided to put n end to this filed of centuries and substitute imu rude.'-hip. but i cannot conceal from the lieuse the possibility that T may have Lo make a glim aniioiim -cuu-iit that ii is impossible to set tie .it bout danger or dishonour. “But if that terrible hour r ui, s and someone standing at this box lias to ask tbe House of Commons and the <Ollll- - t<> make greater sacrifices, Britain's conscience must lie lice. We must feel that everything has been done, that every member of the House can go to his eonstit: cuts, to bis burdened enlist ituents staggering under the heavy load of Ibe war, and with hundreds of thousands of men already sacrificed and mutilated, and say, ‘We are lighting for the security of Britain, we are fighting lor tile honour of Britain, we are lighting for the freedom and right we have done everything in our power t-o make peace, ami it is no fault of ours that, it has not Keen done.' ‘‘lt is because ! want t.o put every man in this House in that position that we are doing our best to 'seeiire pence (Cheers). THE CASE FUR SACRIFICE. Fir gi'iii. issues of principle this country is prepared to take great risks, bill ii must be ennvinred that tin re is no other means of achieving Hie end. “If the security of this countre i; mma-ed. if the Throlii' is repudiated, if this Empire is In be mutilated and 1 rein ml established as an alii n louiilr-y on our most vulnerably, flank, ire,, to make war on oar commerco; if Bril is!' eo.'iiiui.'M T! is t - lie left, liable to ittuck on the Irish coast, witlmii! any right for Britain lo use (l-o shores of (p'lanu lor ils defence; 9 Ireland walks oil' with her freedom, leaving Britain staggering under burdens in which Ireland now joins, and which every Irishman throughout the world is sharing to-dav, whether in this country or in the Dominions, nr in the United States that is a |V»Mtion in which I fool confide

that Brflain will makei tho necessary sacrifice and taie the necessary risk to avert sneli an issue, and it will soon bo found that the island which raised six or seven millions of men to light for the liberties of Europe is still quite equal to defending- its own safety and maintaining its own honour. (Cheers).

“We shall examine every path that loads to an honourable pence, and we want to b e able honestly and sincerely to tell our countrymen that we have done so. Our responsibilites a.s negotiators and ns a Government, are enormous. We have to offer the best advice t<> the Sovereign and the I test advice to Ea.rliamont. and great issues are dcliendent on this Conference. The fjjte of the Empire .or, rather, tho strength of the Empire is involved. FATEFUL DECISION.

“l do not mind admitting that the war was to me a revelation of the enormous hidden strength of this Empire and its importance to the cause of humanity. The Government will never overlook that fact in these negotiations If concession is pre&sed of a character to weaken the Empire, then the Govern will take all hazards to defend it,

but if concessions! can be made which will bring an lyomouruble peace that will strengthen the Empire we will hazard all on the possilility of achieving that.

“I have talked about the responsibility of the Government. The responsibility of Parliament is greater. Wo can negotiate, we can advise, but Parliament must sanction. If it- sc» wills, i’arliaufent can protract this dangerous and deadly tupl until an uncertain future. Thpt is the responsibility that rests upon Parliament. Neither Parliament nor the Government can ensure a settlement. That depends not merely upon us, but also upon the representatives of Ireland. But Parliament can do its share., and the decision may be the decision of this House now, tonight.

“This decision to-night may be a fateful one in the history of the Empire. It may he written in the annals of this Parliament that this House equipped the Government with a new authority to enter upon a peace which brought an accession of strength to this great Empire, by bringing to its side a gifted and gallant- people who for centuries have been at feud with it; by removing from the path of Empire a peril that always besets it in the hour of its deepest need, and by adding a brilliant chapter to the renown which this Empire has won throughout the world as the one Empire which found tho way and to wisdom of transforming freedom into power.” (Loud cheers.)