PROVINCIAL COUNCIL

Hawke's Bay Times, Volume 13, Issue 691, 14 June 1869, Page 3

PROVINCIAL COUNCIL

II WEDNESDAY, MAY 26, 1869. * Mm Council met at 3 p.m. ■ PAPERS. I j£ r Ormond laid on tlie table a I eino randum of all monies issued Swing the financial year without I uthority of the Appropriation Act. P AMENDMENT. I jliia Act was introduced by Mr [giTTTON, read a firsc time, ordered to lu, printed, and the second reading Lgd for Thursday. LAND TAKING REGULATIONS. %x Ferard moved—- ! That the proposed standing rules and orders ) , f re gnlating bills authorizing the taking of land the " Proviucial Compulsory Land Taking u i 860," be referred to a select committee, flC ]i committee to consist of the Speaker, Messrs Ormoud, Carlyon, A'Deane, and the mover. had very little hope of the Committee doing anything in the limited time before them. Mr Buchanan seconded the molion, which was agreed to. Mr. KOCH'S PETITION. Mr Buchanan moved— That the petition of Mr A. Koch be considered. motion had reference to the, petition of an efficient Government officer, who had been recently dismissed from the service of the Government. He did. not consider harsh treatment of officials advantageous to the public service, and considered that in this case there was just grounds of complaint, in-: asiuuch as the petitioner had been dismissed without notice, and although he had repeatedly made application to know the cause, had never been able to obtain a reply. ■ This was a state of things that should be set at rest, for the Government: had no right to dismiss their servants hi such a manner. Tf there were ; any charges against him they should have been made through thehead of his department, but there was nothing ot the kind. On the contrary that officer did not approve of the dismissal, which he alleged was a loss to the public service. When it was considered that the petitioner had occupied his position from the first, and that all the traditions of the office were vested in him, the evil became more apparent. He had nothing to say against the efficiency of the officer now occupying that position, but it was impossible for him to have the knowledge of the tradition* of the office so possessed by Mr Koch. This had only recently led to an absolute waste of public money to a large extent —surveyors hating been employed for weeks in re-doing work which had already been done, and the field-books deposited in the Land Office. There was no one there who knew of this ; Mr Weber was going, and there was now now no chance of obtaining at the Survey Office rereliable information of transactions of any past date. The refusal of the Government to assign a cause was an aggrava + ion of the injury they had inllicted on Mr Koch. They informed him that if it would be anv advantage to him thev would supply him with the highest testimonials as to ability and efficiency, but his very simple request that they would give him a fair written reason for his dismssal had been denied. The Province had reaped no benefit by the change, for what they had saved in salary they had far more than lost in experience. He hoped the sense of the Council would induce them to agree to a resolution he would move, which would at any rate bring matters to an ii-sue. He then read the resolution. Mr Carlyon objected to the resolution, as bringing up new matter, and Mr Buchanan accordingly gave notice of it for next sitting day. HOSPITAL MANAGEMENT. Mr M'Lean moved—1. That it is expedient that the management of the Hospital for the period of one year be vested *n a Committe, to be composed of the following gentlemen, viz.: The Superintendent, Messrs H. S. Tiffen, J. Anderson, J. Wood, T. K. Newton. 2. That the duties of said Committee be to take the entire management of the said Hospital, to appoint and remove all necessary officers, and to make proper Rules and Regulations. 3. To raise the funds required for the maintenance of the Hospital, in addition to the sum voted, by the collection of voluntary subscriptions. 4. To make a report, to be presented at the next session of the Council, showing all that has beea doae under these resolutions.

After some discussion the motion was agreed to, the name of Mr Wood being omitted at his own request, and that of Mr Locke substituted. APPROPRIATION.. Mr Ormond moved— Por leave to bring in a Bill to appropriate the revenue of the year ending June 30, 1870. The bill was brought in, read a first time, ordered to be printed, and the second reading appointed for Thursday. IMMIGRATION BOARD. Mr Ormond moved— For leave to bring in a bill to institute a Board for the manngenuiut of funds appropriated to immigration purposes. The bill was brought in, read a

first time, ordered to be printed, and the second reading fixed for Thursday. WAIROA LEASES. Lieut.-Colonel Lambert moved— That his Honor the Superintendent will lay before the Council a return showing the average amount of rent paid annually, and whether such rent is subject to increase, and all and every sum or sums of money paid to any person or persons for effecting the lease of the block of land ov the left bank (proper) of the Wairoa river, and also any sum or sums paid to an}r persons who have been employed to purchase the said block of land since it has been under lease to the GovernmentMr M'Lean said that the infor mation would be laid on the table. TRANSFER OF £6OOO. Mr Ferard moved—

That the warrant of the Superintendent, dated ! August 28,1868, and numbered 150, whereby a sum of £6,000 was transferred from the Loan Account to the Ordinary Revenue Account be laid on the table. —On such an important matter as the unauthorized transfer of <£6ooo of the Loan to the ordinary revenues the Provincial Auditor should have sent a special report to the Council; but as yet they had been unable to get any account of the transaction.

Mr Ormond said that the warrant dated August 28, and niimbered s l5O was purely imaginary, no such warrant having been issued. The number given was that of the cheque in the Bank passbook by which the transfer was made. This was done by arrangement between the Super intendent and Bank manager with the cognisance of the Treasurer. The overdraft had become so conanxious to have it wiped out, and the Superintendent accordingly took the responsibility of this transaction, in the hope that the amount could have been replaced from the ordinary siderable that the Bank were very revenues. As the Council were aware, this anticipation could not be realized, and the amount was still outstanding. An act legalizing the transaction was now . before the Council. The reason the matter had not been reported by the Auditor was that it had not come under his cognisance, not having been done by warrant. Mr Ferard asked if he was to undei stand that the Government refused to lay their authority on the table.

Mr Ormond said if there had been such a warrant it would have been laid on the table. Lieut.-Col. Lambert said it was a most extraordinary thing for three gentlemen thus to dispose of £6,000 of the Loan without the warrant, or even the knowledge, of the Provincial Auditor. LIABILITY TO EDUCATION RATE. Mr Ferard moved — That the cases in which the liability of certain parties to the payment of Education Rate has been submitted for the opinion of the Provincial Solicitor, with his opinion thereon, be laid on the table. Agreed to. HALTING PLACES FOR STOCK. Mr Ferard moved — That it is undesirable that halting plaoes for bullock drays, cattle, sheep, &c, should be provided at the public expense. - -His sole reason for bringing this motion forward was that he had not been allowed to speak on the motion of the member for Waipukurau yesterday. He saw no more reason why sheep" should be provided with grass at the public expense than the people of Napier with water. To provide these places must be an important part of the business of owners of accommodation houses on the road. The memberfor Waipukurau grudged the people of Napier their water, but wished the Council to make provis ion for his eheep. Lieut.-Col. Lambert seconded the motion pro forma. He did not envy

. the member for the town his position. He should have been a little 'sharper in taking his opportunity to speak yesterday. • As for private individuals providing these palces, it need not be expected, for they had : never provided any yet. He (Col. L.) had not said anything about the artesian well. The memory of the member for the town must be bad after his dressing last night. This would not be an expense to the Government, on the contrary, it would be remunerative. Mr Ormond reminded the Council that before passing this resolution they must repeal the Loan Appro priation Amendment Act, which set apart money for this purpose. The motion was negatived. ARTESIAN WELL BILL. Mr Rhodes moved— For leave to bring in a Bill to enable the Superintendent to fence in the Artesian Well in Ed-wards-street, Napier. Agreed to, and the bill was brought in, a first time, ordered to be printed, and the second reading fixed for Friday. EDUCATIONAL RESERVES. Mr Locke moved— Eor a return showing the different factious of land in the Province of Hawke's Bay reserved for School and Educational purposes, number of section or block, area, annual rent, name of lessee, ! for what terra leased, periods (if any) fixed for increase of rent; and also a return of all reserves in the province, and the purposes to which they are put. He wished to obtain this informa- j fcion before next session. Lieut.-Col. Lambert seconded the ' motion. He hoped the Government would make some attempt to get ' funds from the Te Ar.te Reserve,

Tiie motion was agreed to. EXECUTIVE AMENDMENT. Mr Buchanan, in moving the second reading of this Act, said he had before sbated that he was willing to take the discussion on the fhst leading, but he had no anticipation of it I passing. If it was affirmed by the Council, it would at least place the gentlemen opposite in their fair and legitimate position, and deprive them of some of the overpowering influence they at present possessed. Mr Carlyon said that if the Superintendent was to have an Execu tive they should be elected by the Council. At present they simply gave the Superintendent power to tyrannise over the rest of the Council. [No.] They certainly did sometimesvote againstthe Superintendent on a division, but on such occasions he had observed that they always looked across the house to see how the numbers stood. He believed the Superintendent would consider it a blessing to get rid of the member for Clive, who believed there was no one in the house as well educated himself, or his equal in eloquence and oratory. He held the same influence over the Superintendent as a parrot over a mouse, and was the ruling power in the Executive. The member for Porangahau considered himself the principal member of the Executive, but he (Mr C.) believed that gentleman was under a mistake. When the Superintendent went to Wellington the member for Porangahau would go with him, but the member for Clive would remain, with ail the power in his hands. If the Superintendent were Chairman also he would receive the assistance of the whole Council, and not be hampered by the misconduct of the three gentlemen who acted as his advisers. Mr Ormond said that the member for tiie Country District had followed his usual style on the first reading of this bill. He had introduced the matter in a quiet and reasonable speed), and in his reply, when no one could answer him, had made a large number of insinuations and assertions. One of these he (Mi O.) could not allow to pass. It was that in his place in the House of Representatives be had made use of the hon, gentleman's brains, and more over said he would claim his vote on the ground of what he had then stated. He had held these ideas long before the gentleman opposite was in the Council, and could recollect almost the exact words he had used on the subject when Mr Fitz'gerald was Superintendent. He remembered stating then that the time would come when the ship ! would be worked by the captain and

• a boy. [Mr Carlyon :• Were you to •be the boy?] After this he did not. i think that the member for the Country District could accuse him of pii rating his idea*:. His reason for voting against this measure was that enormous benefits had arisen from his Honor holding the joint position of Superintendent and General Government agent, and in a few weeks we might certainly look forward to his again holding that position. If this act were passed he would not hold that joint position, for he would simply decline to be all but torn to pieces by a board of eighteen members, each scrambling for what they could get. His present position was very different. Mr Tanner had not heard any argument to convince him that this change would be for the better. If the Superintendent were Speaker also, who would bring forward Government business, and answer questions? He looked upon the Executive, as they were irresponsible, as being perfectly independent members, who might vote as they pleased. Mr Rhodes said they were only two minutes off the time of adjournment. There had been a tiresome amount of discussion, but he supposed that all Provincial Councils would do a certain amount of coffee-grind-ing daily, and that it must be put up with. He would content himself with stating that he would vote ; against the second reading of the bill, and moving that the Council adjourn to 7.30 p.m. < The motion wa? agreed to, and the < Council adjourned. ( The Council met at 7.30., and the i debate was resumed. I

Mr Ferard having made a few remarks in favor of the bill, the question was put, and negatived on a division (in the absence of the mover and Mr Carlyon) the only " aye" being Mr Ferard. RATIFICATION or LOAN APPROPRIATION Mr M'Lean moved the second reading of this bill. Mr Buchanan said that before this was put it was the duty of the Government to tell the Council the purpose for which these sums were originally appropriated, the gro::s amount abstracted from the loan, to what purposes it had been applied, and what services would have to be foregone. If this was not done, the Government did not comply "with the terms of the Constitution Act. Mr Ormond said the Council fully understood the necessity for the bill. In consequence of the strong action taken by the General Government against Provincial overdrafts, the Bank became pressing for it to be wiped out, which, as he before explained, was done by a cheque from the Superintendent without the Auditor's warrant. They had followed the recommendation of the Finance Committee in taking the amount named in the Act, £3,862, from the sum which had been appropriated for the purchase of native lands. He had hopes, however, that this would not interfere with the carrying out of the purchases which had jbeen contemplated. The lands were chiefly in the Forty-mile Bush, and the surveys were nowbeing executed. The plan of the Government was in the case of large blocks to pay the native owners a premium on the purchase of the land, and to reserve for them a future share out of the sales. Most of the purchases could no doubt be effected by adopting this system. Mr Ferard Avas glad that the Government had brought this forward in so barefaced a manner. He did not believe the Governor could assent to the act. The motion was then agreed to, on the following division : Ayes, 10—MessrsM'Lean,Rhodes, Kennedy, Ormond, A'Deane, Dolbel, Locke, Parsons, Sutton, and Tanner. Noes, 4—Messrs Buchanan, Carlyon, Lambert, and Weston. SUPPLY. The Council then went into committee of supply. Mr Rhodes moved that £lO should be placed on the estimates as refund of the license of Mr R. JefFares.

After much discussion the motion was negatived on a division, the ayes being Messrs Rhodes, Ormond, Wood, and Dolbel.

[ Mr Carlyon moved that the sum of £2OO should be placed on the estimates to make the Patangata bridge passable. The motion was agreed to on a division. SHEEP AND SCAB. The Council then went into commixtee on this bill, and adjourned at a late hour.