SPEECHES OF GOVERNOR SIR GEORGE GREY AND THE WAIKATO CHIEFS AT THE MEETING HELD AT KOHANGA, DECEMBER 1861.

Hawke's Bay Times, Volume II, Issue 42, 17 April 1862, Page 6 (Supplement)

SPEECHES OF GOVERNOR SIR GEORGE GREY AND THE WAIKATO CHIEFS AT THE MEETING HELD AT KOHANGA, DECEMBER 1861.

(Concluded f,om our last.) JvOUAMrA. December iVtli, 1861. His Excellency: I have come here to help you and I think the best thing is for you to ask me questions about any thing you do not understand. [Addressing W. Ivukutai: Do you what the duties of the runanga will be ? Waata ; Yes.] The work of the runanga, when it aits as such, will be different from that of the magistrates, it bo to make laws and regulations for the government of the district. When these rules have been made by the runanga and approved by the Governor, then the magistrates will have to enforce them as any others laws are enforced. Then there will be other work for the runanga to do : it will have to consider all things that are good for the district; e. g., if a ferry is wanted by any people, the runanga will have to consider if it is necessary, and report to mo before I do anything ; it will have to consider and recommend what the ferry-man will have to bo.paid, and what people should pay for crossing. In the same way if roads arc wanted, it will have to enquire if it is so, and what are the best lines, and when I have consented to their being made it will have to superintend them and the expenditure, and the secretary of the runanga will have to arrange, with the owner of the land over which the road will pass, if he is to bo paid anything. In the same way when the boundaries of a piece of land or the ownership is disputed, the runanga will appoint a commission to examine into the matter and report, and it will have to consider if the commission has reported correctly, and it will report in its turn to me as to what I ought to do. In the same way, if a hospital is wanted, the runanga will desido upon the site and what fees people should pay and who should be let in free without paying. Then if the the people want a school they will, in the first instance, have to apply to the runanga, and it will report to me if the school is necessary. For all these things it will arrange its own time of meeting, perhaps once a month, perhaps once in six weeks, and it will sit for live or six days if necessary, and will give public notice that all may know' of the sittings and attend them if they wish. This is all. I now think that you will understand about runanga. About magistrates I need say nothing, you all know what they have to do. If you want any more information upon any subject now you can ask me, and I shall be glad, if I can, to give it. Te Ao-o-te Eangi (Tainui) : My part of the talk will be on the same subject as yours, Waata. Vou spoke about pence, about an enlightened system, and about everything which is good. That side (ot the question) is correct, but, brother, you and 1 have never been found in fault up to this period. [To his Excellency] After you, the Governor, left us, there arrived another Governor, and when that Governor turned round, it was against me. That is the reason why I am dark. I am an orphan, O Governor, an orphan, all are orphans by accidents and by war, by your arrival in New Zealand, either we become possessed of parents, or we do not. Well, be kind to the children according to your word ; and let not the Maories say that you arc speaking deceit fully (or with flattery) ; do not curve your road, let it be straight that carts may travel on it. Our discourse will not be at an end, it will be mouth to mouth, we shall not be separated : at the present time, I am pleased with your korero, but if my reply is wrong do not be gloomy, nor find fault with it. Now this is what I say: I consent to the Governor's word. The Governor calls for the road and the runanga, and everything lias been mentioned by the Governor. My (present) road is the outside road, on the sea, and its opening (commencement) is at M haingaroa. A road is the thing which I approve of, on the Governor’s side, because of the mud and the mountain, and that our produce, that of the tribes, may be conveyed for sale. I speak thus to you, O Governor, because of the words which you spoke to me about the roads and the bye roads ; I consent to them. Tin’s is neutrality (or friendliness). O Waikato, lam much in want of my’ road. Look at my side (of the subject). Let tile kupapa (neutral native) defer his word (of censure). If you see the guns and soldiers travelling on the road, the error will be mine apprehend me, because I shall be in fault; judge me, convey me to prison, because the Governor and 1 shall have cleared the road, allowing tiie guns and soldiers to pass. If my road is formed 1 shall be much pleased at being able to take my potatoes, and wheat, and onions, and other produce to market. That is all about the road. Ido not agree to the (European) magistrates. We want no other magistrates than Waata and Wiremu te Awaitaia ; they can do (lie work. Our errors and out faults can bo talked over : if there is any great offence, I can write about it to you. I will not consent to adopt the runanga and the magisti ate. That side (system) is very good, but 1 have spoken to you about it in the town, telling you I was not agreeable to it. I will tell my errors by letter lest it be said that I have been flattering you. Ruihana (Ngatikarewa) : If I fall now, do not laugh at me. This is my patience and my kindness. It is for my eye to see good and evil. These are the things 1 am afraid of, guns and powder. Break them loose (release the restrictions on their sale), and I shall be satisfied : these, in my opinion, are the fearful things. My thoughts are, make an opening for the snake (allow the sale of arms and ammunition). O Governor cause the reptile to be driven forth: I have no fear connected with any other treasures, with money, or blankets, or other things ; it is all with guns and powder ( i. e., for you io possess them and the Maories not). His Excellency ; Who is the gunpowder for, and for what purpose P Ruihana; Either to keep, or to shoot birds with. His Excellency : I cannot let any one get guns, either European or Maori. Do you only want shot ? Ruihanna: Shot is good ; if in largo quantity’, it is good : it is for you to look at what I say. His Excellency : What arc you afraid of P Ruihann : I am afraid of von.

His Excellonoy : You need not fear mo ; I will take care of you. Ruihana: Very well you will take care of mo: but there is your dog (military force). His Excellency : 1 nm so determined to have good, that I will not put arms into people’s hands with which to kill each other. I am so fond of being safe, that I shall keep everything locked up. Hereafter, if I can find chiefs that I can trust, and they want gunpowder for shooting birds, wo will talk about it. I am a very cautious man; they might shoot other birds. Ruihana: That can bo thought about. This will be the cause of my death (my being deceived) ; it is said peace, peace ; but it rests only on the lips. Where does it reside ? Ilia Excellency: What I do for one, I shall have to do for others. Ruihana: Other men must speak for themselves, and you look at (judge) what they say. His Excellency: 1 don’t intend to keep anything back from you ; but this I will not promise. Ruihana : Hence the fear. Now am lin dread about that. I looked at the alienation of my land and hence I said, let not the land pass away without payment. His Excellency ; Do you ask who is to pay P Ruihana: You you must pay me. It (the land) is for the payment of powder ; of powder for me and for the purchase of guns for me, that the reptile may go forth, that fear may cease , and that I may know there is no evil. ■His Excellency : I cannot consent to arms being sold. Herowini Hunia (Ngatitabinga) : I formed my desire, and expressed it to the Pakebas. It was not long before the Governor’s letter arrived, containing his dissent, and preventing (the settling of) my minister; hence I was slow to survey the land. Now Governor Browne and I disputed on that subject. His Excellency : If u native desires to give land for the clergy, I shall always allow it. 1 should like to see the land filled with clergymen. Hercwiiii: Now this is my reply to that: if Governor Browne had said the same, it would had been well. I now say to you, give me a Bakeha (minister). llis Excellency : Y'ou must go to the Bishop. I will do my best with him, and I think you will soon get it done. Apera Kiwi (Ngatitabinga) : This is another subject, the ferrying of the Bakehus at my river, Whaingaroa. 1 cross the poor (class of) Europeans, who say they will pay, but don’t. They run away into the bush. His Excellency : As soon as we get the runanga it will settle on some animal payment for the ferryman at Raglan. Te Bou Totara (Ngatipa) : Welcome father. You come not hero of ymr own accord, but are brought by the providence of God. [Song.] My friend who loves us, welcome. Now 1 uhi a,-k you, what roads are they which you say are to bo provided by the runanga P His Excellency ; Any roads you like. Te Bou Totara: Listen ; all that 1 know about (will consent to), is the river, the Waikato, which is flowing by : that is the road in j our possession. The boat can come, the gig-boat can come, the whale-boat can come. That is all the road that I am light about (agree to). .Vs for a road over the laud, no. These are all the roads, the water. His Excellency : Mr Fenton lias been sent up to start all these things, and if you will work well and truly with me, 1 pledge myself to work with you, ami help vou to the utmost of my power.— Maori Mexxanger.