PARLIAMENT DIVIDES ON NATIONAL SERVICE QUESTION

Grey River Argus, 6 October 1948, Page 5

PARLIAMENT DIVIDES ON NATIONAL SERVICE QUESTION

Nationalist Proposal Defeated P.A. ” WELLINGTON, Oct. 5 Consideration of various classes of estimates engaged the attention of numbers when the House of Representatives resumed to-day. When the Navy Department vote on the estimates was under discussion, the Minister of Defence, Hon. F. Jones, said that one of the difficulties so far as New Zealanders in the New Zealand Navy were concerned was that men with the higher technical .knowledge to operate the various ships employed were unobtainable. He agreed that the more New Zealanders there were in the navy, the better. Mi Jones said that there was a better opportunity in the New Zealand Navy to-day to qualify for officer’s rank than ever before. He was pleased that recruiting for the Navy had

shown such excellent figures. NAVAL EFFICIENCY Mr T. P. Shand (Nat., Marlborough) said it was time someone got busy and ferretted out those who were empire building within the service. He considered that there was not the efficiency in the Navy Department to which the country was entitled to expect. There were far too many senior officers, with cushy jobs, particularly in the navy, and those were the type of jobs which, in terms of work, did not exist at all. The number of sen-

ior officers was too great in relation to the number of other ranks in the navy. RESEARCH RESULTS Mr R. M. Algie (Nat. Remuera), asked if the Minister would take the precaution of seeing that the results obtained by those engaged on Defence Scientific Research were made available to and kept safely earmarked for the Crown. Were those who conducted researches thoroughly trustworthy and propertly selected? NOT OUT OF PROPORTION Mr Jones, in reply, said tnat he did not think the numoer of senior otiicers in the navy was out oi proportion to the number of other ranks, rhe senior officers had carried out their tasks very well indeed. They were Royal Navy officers, and received salaries on that scale. There was a good representation of New Zealand-oorn officers among tne

higner ranking officers. Mr Jones said that £25,000 had been set aside for Defence Science, ana mat money would be split up between me three services. The work, however, would be done, in the main, oy the Scientific and Industrial Research Department, while, working in with the services, there was a consultative committee comprising leading university professors, who would consider propositions of a nature for improving the defence services. He knew the gentlemen concerned and could not imagine that they felt they ’nad a right to go outside and give information which was not in the best interests of the country to have reveaied.

Mr Jones said that there would be young university men coming into the defence forces, and doing scientific work as part of their training, and thev would be vetted to see that they could be trusted, were reliable, and competent for that particular work. The vote for the Navy Department £2,474,455 (£1,736,627 was expended last year) was passed. ARMY VOTE Mr T. L. MacDonald (Nat. Wallace) discussing the vote for the Army Department said that the international ammunition dump might be blown up at any minute. The Minister of Detence had made a statement in April, which had been described then as too nebulous to go on, and there had been little progress since. Where was the Territorial Force? Mr MacDonald then moved that the vote of the Army Departinent be reduced by £5 as an indication that the House disapproved of the delays in introducing universal military training. OBVIOUS THING Mr A. C. Baxter (Govt., Raglan), saia that tne obvious thing to do was to wait and see what the Prime Minister would say on nis return irom uonuon. Mr Baxter said that Mr Fraser would undoubtedly discuss in London the role which New Zealand could play in the defence of the British commonwealth and of her own shores. He did not think there would be any difficulty in recruiting, provided the strength of the Regular Force was Kept at a maximum standard, consistent with efficiency and modern methods. „ , . Mr K. J. Holyoake (Nat., Pahiatua), said the Prime Minister had already clearly stated what was in his mind. He thought he knew what was in the mind oi tne Minister of Defence. He was concerned that, when the question of military training was involved, the Acting Prime Minister and Minister of Defence, should delegate their right and obligation to speak to tne member lor Raglan. A division was taken on the amendment that the vote should be reduced by £5 and was defeated by 34 votes to 30. Mr W. H. Fortune (Nat Eden) said the vote of £2OOO for the Territorial Forces was just ludicrous and insutricient to complement the Government’s policy for the Territorial Force. Mr T. L. MacDonald said £2OOO was not in line with the statement the Minister of Defence had made in the House earlier in the session. What sort of a Territorial Force would the country get for an expenditure of that amount? It took time to mould and train the force into anything worthwhile. Mr J. R. Marshall (Nat., Mount Victoria) said it was confidently expected that the Government would make a decision when the Prime Minister returned from overseas, but there was ho vote to implement any such decision. PRESENT STRENGTH Mr Jones, replying said the army was at present recruiting for the Regular 1-orce. Tney nad 2300 of all ranks, excluding the J Force,-and had made provision this year for 2600. ft ,vas hoped to build tne force eventually' up to 3(00. No one imagined mat a vote of £2OOO for the Territorial Force was enough, it was simply a token vote, and sufficient money would be available when it was decided how and when the Territorial Force should be established. Mr A. S. Sutherland (Nat. Haurakf) said he disagreed that the House should wait until the Prime Minister returned from overseas before deciding what should be done. Resolutions were being passed by Communists and others that were detrimental to the defence forces, but if the Government announced its policy, they would probably cease. . Mr T L. MacDonald said that for the Minister to say the vote was a token item was to say that nothing much was to be done- this year. He suggested that the Minister make an adequate and full statement to reassure these ex-officers who had been circularised that something worthwhile was envisaged by the Govern ment ‘ RAPID CHANGES Mr Jones, replying, said that even though Field Marshal Viscount Monteomerv had visited this country about a vear ago, the circumstances had changed since then. So far as the Territorial Force was concerned, he did not know at present how many replies had been received in response to the circular, but he was anxious to

get the scheme under way as soon as possioie. 'me Minister said he knew that many people we.e impatient for an announcement oi the training scheme, but he thought the mam questions coula oe safely leu to the Prime Minister. it wouid oe west to wait until tne Prime Minister returned to tne country, and tnen hear his view. Mr s. G. Holland: “And then have a referendum.” Mr Jones said the Labour Government had never failed in its responsibility towards providing defences for the country, and never would fail in tnat direction. Mr Shand considered that the Minister had not made the right approach in appealing to ex-oincers oy means or a circular. An oner should nave peen made, to those approached, oi definite jobs. “The people won’t volunteer for some vague service at some vague date," he said, adding that, what was wanted, was a definite plan. Mr G. F. Sim (Nat., Waikato) said he hoped the Minister would say if he was in favour of compulsory military training. Mr C. G. Harker (Nat., Hawke’s Bay) said there were in the country highly qualified and competent staff capable of training an efficient force. The amount on the estimates for the territorial forces were not' calculated io give any uneasiness to New Zealand branches of the Communist Party. Mi- G. H. Mackley (Nat., Wairarapa) said the vote of £2OOO for the Territorial Force was totally inadequate, paltry, and of no ■ significance at all. To respond to the feelings of the country and not trifle with the people, would the Minister indicate that a greater amount would be placed on the Supplementary Estimates for territorial training. The discussion was interrupted by the tea adjournment at 5.30 p.m.

Comment By Acting Prime Minister P.A. WELLINGTON, Oct. 5 It was not the type of debate in which the question of compulsory military service could be discussed. The determination of that question should be left until the return of the Prime Minister from overseas, said the Acting Prime Minister, Rt. Hon. W. Nash, in the House of Representatives to-night, when the votes on the estimates for the Army Department were considered. Mr Nash was replying to a summary of the afternoon’s discussion on the defence votes, which the Leader of the Opposition. Mr S. G. Holland, made when the House resumed this evening. „ , The Acting Prime Minister said that his own view of the position was that there should be some system of compulsory national service. But the Government policy was clear, and the Government would back up its statement and its policy as enunciated bv the Prime Minister last Tuesday night. x x . There was no further discussion 0" the vote for the Army Department of £3,092,550) (£3,470,245) expended last 'year), which was passed.