GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

Globe, Volume XXIV, Issue 2541, 31 May 1882, Page 3

GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL. Tuesday, May 30. TIBET HEADINGS. A Bill to Amend the Banks and Bankers Act, 1880 (Mr Whitaker), and a Bill to Amend the Vagrants Act, 1866 (Colonel Brett) were read a first time. REPLIES TO QUESTIONS. In reply to the Hon. Mr Chamberlain, The Hon. Mr Whitakbb said, if free or nominated immigration was resumed, fishermen would be as eligible as other people, but the Government would not make special provision for their introduction. RETURNS. On the Hon. Mr Hart’s motion a return was ordered, showing the number of names in which declarations of insolvencies were filed in the Supreme Court in each of the years 1878 and 1879 ; in how many cases an accountant in bankruptcy was nominated trustee ; and in how many cases the proceeds of the estate have been paid to the insolvent ; and in how many cases a certificate has been filed in the Court under clauses 179 and 180 of the Debtors and Creditors Act, 1876. ADDRESS TO THE QUEEN. Sir Q. Whitmore moved, and the Hon. Mr Whitaker seconded, an address to the Queen, congratulating her on her escape from assassination. It was carried unanimously without discussion. BANKEUPTOY. On the Hon. Ur Olivet’s motion, a joint bankruptcy law committee was appointed, the names being the Hons. Wilson, P. A, Buckley, Hart, Holmes, Miller, McLean, Stevens, Reynolds, Oliver. NEW MEMBERS. The Hon. Mr Stevens was introduced, and took the oath and his seat. ADDRESS IN REPLY. The Council presented the Address in Reply to the Governor’s speech, and at 2.30 adjourned till 2 30 on Thursday. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES. Tuesday, May 23. The House met at 2 30 p.m. THE NEW KNIGHT.

Mr Sheehan drew attention to tho fact that, while in the other Chamber hearty congratulations had been tended to Sir George Whitmore on the occasion of hia receiving the honor of Knighthood, no snob congratulations had been tended to Sir John Hall, a member of that Chamber, npon whom a similar honor had been conferred. He drew attention to the fact the more readily as he bad all along been a political opponent of Sir John Hall. At tho same time he heartily rejoiced at tho personal honor thus conferred on him. He bore ample testimony to the uniform courtesy with which Sir John Hall had discharged the duties of the important office he lately held, and his political services outside of the House were equally creditable. They had had their fights inside the House, but that did not blind him and the party sfith whom he voted to the many amiable characteristics of tho individual, or to his valuable public services. He moved—" That this House tenders its hearty congratulations to the hon, member for Selwyn, Sir John Hall, 0.M.G., and hopes he may be long spared to enjoy the distinguished honor so deservedly conferred upon him by his Sovereign in recognition of a long and honorable life in the public service of this colony.” Mr Macandbbw, as the father of the House, seconded the motion, entirely endorsing Mr Sheehan’s remarks. Mr Montgomery spoke in support of it, alluding to his twenty-two years’ personal knowledge of Sir John Hall. The Hon. Major Atkinson on behalf of the Government and members on his side of the House, spoke in support of the motion, which was put and carried with acclamation. In communicating the motion the Speaker joined with the House in hearty congratulations.

Sir John Hail acknowledged the compliment. He said satisfactory ai the honor was in itself his pleasure in receiving it had been greatly enhanced by the congratulations tendered to him by his fellow unionists. He concluded by expressing a hope that his public services to the colouy had been only interrupted and not ended. QUESTIONS, Replying to Mr Shrimski, The Hon. Mr Dick said it was not considered necessary to authorise the District Judge to act as Supreme Court Judge for Canterbury during the absence of Judge Johnston, as the Supreme Court Judges had made arrangements amongst themselves, so that no inconvenience would be experienced. Replying to Mr Daniel, Iho Hon. Mr Eolleston said the Government would not make provision in the way of a grant in aid for prospecting purposes, with the view of having the Fiord County explored, as these grants in the past had not proved a success, but they recognised the importance of obtaining more complete information of the country, and with that view a recognisance survey would bo provided for, as the Government believed that in that way the exploring party would have a greater degree of responsibility entailed upon them, and thereby a bettor guarantee of good faith would be secured. Replying to Mr Moss,

The Hon. Mr Dick said he was sorry to say the Government had received no communication with reference to a proposed transfer to the Grammar School of certain properties in Auckland and Parnell reserved for a Maori hostelry. Replying to Mr Fish, The Hon. Mr Eoixeston said the Government could not agree with the recommendation of the Select Committee to refer the claim of James Edward Fitzgerald Ooylo to arbitration. The contract provided that any dispute should be referred to the Surveyor • General, and they saw no reason why that proviso should be departed from. Replying to Mr Tomoana, The Hon. Mr Bbtce said that, land had been sold by certain Native chiefs to a European, named Tapsall, buforo the data of the foundation of the colony, and the heirs of the purchaser had got the land through the Court. The House then adjourned to enable the Address in Reply to bo presented to the Governor, On resuming, in reply to Mr Tawhai, The Hon. Mr Dick said ho would inquire into the necessity for withdrawing the restriction of clause 17 of tho Licensing Act, 1881, which brings the Bay of Islands, Mongonui, Hokianga, under the class of Native licensing districts. Replying to Mr Feldwick, The Hon, Mr Johksxon said the fines inflicted on railway employes were at tho dis posal of tho Governor, who had on only one occasion allocated a portion thereof to a railway benefit society. A sum of £4BO had accumulated, and a scheme for its allocation would be prepared. Replying to Mr Bracken, The Hon. Mr Dick said that the appointment of an officer to Mount Cock central prison did not give him a precedence over that of a chief warder. All he got was £lO extra to his former pay. He was a man who had made his mark in the service, and

his good conduct and qualifications had repeatedly been brought under the notice of tbo Government.

Replying to Mr DeLmtour, >• The Hon. Mr Rollestok said the Government had received no report during the last twelve months as to the repair of Mount Ida head race and chanrel. If it were considered necessary to have a professional report the Government would cause it to be prepared. Replying to Mr Hutchison, The Hon. Major Atkinson said the Government would refer to the standing orders committee the question of adopting means for preventing obstructive motions, and otherwise facilitating the business. Replying to Mr Hutchison, The Hon. Mr Johnston said that the reasons for the alteration in the line of railway, Wanganui to Waverley, were—l, it saved £18,000; 2, it saved twelve miles of line ; and 3, it saved the necessity for a branch line being made. NEW BILLS. The following Bills were introduced and read a first time—The Employment of Eemales Act, with a view to bringing shop women and boys and girls employed in the delivery of parcels and messages, under the operation of the eight hours clauses of that Act, and to give to the police the right to enter into factories during meal hours and after meal hours (Mr W. Green) ; to make other provision in the matter of the election of school committees (Mr Steward). the chairmanship. The Hon. Major Atkinson proposed Me Hurst as Chairman of Committees. His qualifications were generally admitted. Ha was well up in the forms of the House. Ho had been Chairman of Committees in an Auckland Provincial Council, and he had discharged the duties of the office with credit to himself and advantage to the House. His ability, experience and tact eminently fitted him for the position. Sir John Hall seconded. Hr Hurst had all the experience necessary for enabling him to discharge the duties efficiently, and would no doubt do it with dignity and credit to himself and the House.

Mr Htjbst said he was net by any mean insensible to the honor the Government proposed to bestow upon him. He knew of no compliment which oonld be paid to him which he would have prized more highly. The observations by which the motion was accompanied were likewisea source of great gratification to him as to his fitness for the position, and it would be altogether unbecoming to say a single word. The course he was now about to pursue he considered was absolutely necesaary for him to take in the interest of all all concerned, and that was to ask the Government to permit him to withdraw his name as a candidate. He wonld not say but that it was to some extent with a feeling of deep humiliation he felt himself called upon to adopt this course. Unhappily there was still abroad in the House a strong feeling of provincialism. At all events he was very sorry to observe that that feeling had not died out from amengst them or the jealousies and illfeeling arising from old occurrences. It would not become him to refer to that snbject at greater length. His candidature he knew would invite a great deal of division, and the friends of the Government he was afraid would even find themselves divided on the question. In these circumstances it was only fair to the Government that he should retire. He would therefore conclude his observations with a request that, while thanking them for the honor they sought to confer upon him, they would allow him to withdraw his name. the same time had he been privileged to have received the appointment it would, have been bis highest aim to have acted with impartiality, and otherwise have discharged the duties of the office to the best of his ability. The Hon. Major Atkinson said that it was with some regret he complied with the request, and he asked permission to insert in lieu of Mr Hurst's name the name of Mr Hamlin.

The permission was then granted, and Mr Hamlin’s name was inserted, Mr Fish moved an amendment. He was surprised at the turn events had taken. He understood the Government would have been careful to ascertain the acceptableness of their candidate before bringing him forward. He regretted the Government had inaugurated the session with such a bad precedent. He blamed the Government for the facility it showed in changing its opinions. After what they bad seen in the past, he hoped the Government would now have the courage of its opinions, and stick to its first propositions. Had he known what was to be done, ho might have seen his way to accept the nomination of Mr Hamlin, and made no amendment. It was unfair to the House this accommodating conduot on the part of Government. He was asked to move an amendment, not only by the Opposition, but also by members of the Government party. He dwelt at length on the necessity of a strictly impartial man being elected, and hoped they would approach the subject in a spirit apart from that of party considerations. He was not acting at, all as a partyman in what he was doing. In fact, he had not decided yet which party he would support. The member he was about to propose had acted with great acceptance as chairman of committees in the Provincial Council of Otago. He had been in the House for a period of twelve years, and such an one ought to have a preference to one recently returned to Parliament. One fault attributed to Mr Thomson, who he was about to nominate, was that he would be too slow. He did not think that this, unless very excessive, was a serious objection. On the contrary, he thought it was a recommendation, and one which would greatly facilitate business in the end to have reasonable time for deliberation in committee. In respect to impartiality, no one was better fitted to- occupy the position. He deprecated the remark made about a spirit of provincialism being abroad in the House. He hoped they would not forget tho districts from which they hailed, as also the duty they owed to such places. On the other hand, he denied that in this matter he was influenced by local feelings. He proposed the amendment in an entirely independent spirit. Ho moved that Mr Thomson’s name be inserted in place of that of Mr Hamlin.

Mr DeLautour seconded, and bore teetimony to Mr Thomson’s fitness for the position. Ha deprecated the idea that the election should be made a party question. He had not a word to say against Mr Hamlin, but thought years of experience and good public service otherwise should not bo overlooked by them. Mr W. O. Smith thought the Government had acted wrongly in the course taken. He would net give a party vote, as he did not look upon the question as a party one. He never looked upon Mr Hurst as a proper person, and had made up his mind to vote for Mr Thomsen. In the circumstances he regretted ho could not now vote for Mr Hamlin, however much ho might have wished, as he was bound to adhere to his original intention, and vote for Mr Thomson. Mr J. O. Brown spoke in favor of Mr Thom>on’s election, and blamed the Government for the course pursued. Captain McKenzie was inclined to support the Government so long as they acted as they had acted in the past, but the action of the Government on the present occasion relieved him from an awkward dilemma, and onabled him to vote for his old friend Mr Thomson. Mr Cabman said he was a member of the Opposition, and the action of the Government had relieved him of a difficulty, and enabled him to vote for Mr Hamlin. Mr George blamed the Government for the course taken, adding it as his belief that that the whole thing had been pre-arranged. It was nonsense to say this question was not a party one. It was co in every sense of the word. He believed the promise of the chairmanship was a part of the compact which some sessions ago had won Mr Hurst (o the Government side, and he supposed Ministers had now, in a slipshod sort of way, discharged its debt to Mr Hurst. The House divided—Ayes, 41; noes, 41. The amended motion that Mr Hamlin bo appointed was accordingly carried. Division List.—Ayes, 44—Messrs Allwright, Atkinson, Beetham, J. if. brown (3t. Albans), Bryce, W. O. Buchanan (Wairarapa South), Cadman, Conolly, Dick, Fitzgerald, Fulton, Hall, Hobbs, Hurst, Hursthonse, C. J. Johnston (Te Ato), W. W. Johnston (Manawatu). Kelly, Levin, McDonald, Moll wraith, McMillan, Mitchelson. Morris, O’Oallaghan, Peacock, Pearson, Postlethwaite, Eolleston, Rutherford, Stevens, Sutton, Swanson, Tawhai, H. Thomson (Christchurch North), Trimble, Watt, Weston, Whitaker, J. B. Whyte (Waikato), W'lliams, J. Wilson (Kaiapoi), J. G. Wilson (Foxton), Wright. Noes, 41 Messrs Barron, Bathgate, Bracken, J. C. Brown ( Puapeks), J. Buchanan (Napier), Daniel, Dargaville, DeLautonr (teller), Dodson, Duncan, Feldwick, Fergus,

Ksh (teller), George, J. Green (Waikouaiti), If W. Green (Dunedin East), Grey, Holmes, Hutchison, Joyce, Lsvestam, Macandtew, F. W. McKenzie (Mataura), J. McKenzie (Moeraki), Montgomery, Moss, Munro, Petrie, Seaton, Seddon, Sheehan, Shepherd, Shritnski, Smith, Stewart, Sutter, Taiaroa, Te Wh-oro, Tjmoana, Turnbull, W. White (Sydenham). Fairs —Ayer, Mr Mason. No"«, Mr Pyke. INSPECTOR OE PRISONS. On 'the motion of Mr Bracken, it was agreed that there bo laid before this House a return showing the amount of salary and expenses paid to the inspector of prisons from the date of his appointment in London up to present time, including passage money for his •wife and family ; all travelling expenses per steamer and railway during his inspection of gaols, and the number of days ho remained in each place inspecting such gaols. At 5 p, m. the House adjourned till 7.30. EVENING SITTING. The House resumed at 7.30. COMMITTEE OP SUPPLY. The Hon. Major Atkinson moved that the House go into committee of supply. In •the course of his remarks he said he hoped to be able to deliver the financial statement on Tuesday next, and to immediately after bring down the estimates. In reply to a ausstion put by Mr Moss, The Hon. Major Atkinson said that when the statement was brought down ho would be prepared to say how they intended to deal with the estimates. On taking the ohair in committee of supply, Mr Hamlin returned thanks for the honor conferred on him, and Jaisured them that it would be his endeavor to discharge his duties without fear or favor. An Imprest Supply Bill amounting to £300,000 was then introduced and passed through its stages. Mr Thompson drew attention to the fact that previous Imprest Supply Bills were for £20,000, a fact which proved to him that tb e expenses of the country had increased £50,000 a month.

Mr Bracken moved that there be added —“Provided always no part of the said imprest supply shall bo expended upon the erection of a new central prison in Wellington.” The Hon. Major Atkinson, in reply, stated that the House had often been asked for £50,000 as well as for £250,000 by way of imprest. This vote had nothing to do with increased expenditure of the country. It was only a temporary advance. What he now asked was a throe weeks’ supply, a little more or less. The sum asked for in no way •ffeoted the question of expenditure. Referring to the amendment he said its effect would not be to stop the work going on. If it was thought desirable the question of a central prison could be dealt with by special resolution. It was a most unusual thing to encumber a Bill of this kind with an amendment. Ha would advise its withdrawal. Mr Bracken asked leave to withdraw. Mr Huksthousb deprecated the system of making imprest supplies. The Estimates should have been ready the first week of their assembling, or if that was inconvenient why, be asked, was Parliament not called at an earlier period. Mr Sheehan supported the Bill. It was absurd to obstruct a Bill of this kind. Money had to be found, and as an Opposition they -ought to act graciously. The Bill was passed and reported without amendment. On the House resuming, it was sent through all its remaining stages and was passed. hiroki. Sir George Qrbt said it was understood that action was to be taken in the case of Hiroki, and he asked that the notes of the Judge and bis report be laid on the table. The Hon. Major Atkinson said he would consult his colleagues on the point and reply later on. THE WEST COAST PEACE PRESERVATION BILE, Mr Sheehan resumed the debate on the second reading of the West Coast Peace Preservation Bill. This was the first time after tha Grey Government had been three years out of office that the Government had confessed that they had adopted and carried out the policy of the Grey Government. Ho protested against the sentimentalism which the member for Dunedin had introduced into the debate about the Maoris, as also the speeches of Mr Bathgate and Mr Hutchison. He reminded South Island members that their vast estates in the South had been purchased at the rate of a farthing per ten acres, and he objected to the South Island members talking sentimentalism about the Maori lands in tho North Island. He objected to have it stated that in the North they were robbing the Natives, while the Southern members themselves got their lands for such a fraction of money. The Maori question was one which should not be made a party one. They were told the Government was suppressing trial by jury. Had the gentlemen who made use of that argument been in the one of a Native Minister, they would have been found bringing down far more stringent measures than those now proposed. The main question was, when was it right for tho House to step in and supersede the functions of law. He assumed that when they had a man like Te Whiti, a fanatic claiming supernatural powers, who was dangerous to the public peace, there was a justification of snob a mode of procedure on the part of tho House. He know of his own knowledge that Te Whiti was all in all in the estimation of the Maori people. The question whether To Whiti was a prophet or a fool he was not prepared to determine. Ho bad been no profit to the colony at all events, but Tather a loss, Ho enumerated the supernatural claims put forward by Te Whiti, and in proceeding he said he hoped they would give him what every man was entitled to, fair play. He went on to ask, how could they deal with a man like Te Whiti but to save him from his people, and save him from himself. As to who was responsible for this situation of affairs, the present Native Minister was certainly not responsible. It was not right to speak ill of the dead, but they knew on whose shoulders the blame rested, In 1869 the West Coast country was ours, and the Government could have taken every acre. That, however, was not done. Nine years were allowed to pass. He did not blame the present Government, but had Sir Donald McLean followed up the work done by Colonel Whitmore, they would not have had a Maori difficulty at all. Not only was that the case, but vague and indefinite promises were made, which no Government could possibly have carried out. There were Maoris on tho West Coast that were told the thing was all right, and they would get back their land. Te Whiti’s mission was to get back theee lands. After this a still further mistake was made by Sir Donald McLean in paying money to buy what was really our own. Anyone who mistook the services Ta Whiti had rendered to the public must be very blind indeed. He had got all the troublesome people around and ho had kept them quiet. It wis plain these troubles were not the consequence of any action on the part either of this or the Grey Government. When the present Government took office they found aver 1000 men on the ground ready for action. Further, tho Grey Government made efforts to get the Natives to consent to reserves being made for themselves. He went to Te Whiti’s camp and offered him these terms. It was true he had had a rough reply, but he had beard rougher ropliea made in that very House. He denied that he was treated with contempt. He had made overtures in regard to reserves to Te Whiti, not only once, but twice, and even three times. He mentioned that to show no effort had boon spared to bring To Whiti to a proper understanding. There were some on the West Coast who would obstruct every Government. These were the men with Native wives and half-caste children, and were the main source of tho trouble to the peace of the country. What he aaid was to hold Ta Whiti where he was at present. The public safety was the highest law, and it was in consulting that object that Te Whiti should be kept where he was. He know that there were Natives going back to Parihaka under the firm conviction that To Whiti would be restored to them by supernatural agency. It they wanted to foster that feeling, then allow Te Whiti to go back. Ho himself introduced tho first Peace Preseivation Bill, in 1879. Since then no change had been wrought in him, and he was still of the same opinion on this point. It had be;n stated that it would take five years i;o survey all the reserves on the West Coast. With a work of such magnitude it was necessary they should not judge too hardly of the action of tho Native Minister. The psace, order, and good government of the West Coast depended upon To Whiti being kept from Parihaka. It was a mercy to To Whiti himself and his people. ■The land had been taken and sold and re-

serves made sufficient to make the Natives a wealthy people. He might be asked why is all this for them ? He would answer that, despite all that had taken place, they wore s*ill a good people and merited protection. Twenty years ago they were a strictly honest people, although to some extent they hud since become demoralised. Still they were deserving of protection, if for no other reason, because they were by far the weaker power, and ns such they merited our protection. He would say indemnify the Native Minister, and as to giving him further powers, he was equally clear on the proprioty of doing so. It was a difficulty for which none of them were responsible, and as such ho said get rid of it on the best possible terms. Mr Moss said that the question at issue was one wbich affected the whole relati >ns with the Native race. Ho spoke in defence of the Maoris, and deprecated the policy of treating them as an inferior race. On this question he differed from Sir George Grey, whom he had always recognised as his leader. What was asked was that they should give over the whole of the Native race to the Native Minister, and it was a well-known fact that members of the present Government had a strong personal dislike to the Natives. He denied that the confiscation had not been abandoned, and in support of that view he referred to the report of the West Ooaot Commissioners. The war had commenced forty years ago, and at that time the Native race was strong and the European weak. At that time, when the war broke out and Russell was set on fire, the Natives apsisted the settlors in escaping. They said, “We are not at war with settlers, we are at war with soldiers.” In taking away To Whiii they left his followers to wander all over the colony, liable to fall into the hands of the first designing knave they might meet with. That was the danger they were preparing for themselves. It had been admitted in the Resident Magistrate’s Court of Taranaki when Te Whiti was arraigned that the reserves had not been pointed out to the Natives, Was it not, he asked, that they were afraid to btiig this man to trial ? Why not bring him up and hear what he had to say for himself ? He believed that after they had carried this measure they would be confronted with fresh troubles. They had for the last fdrty years been endeavouring to civilise these Natives, to teach them that the law would protect them in their rights, as well as avenge itself for their wrongs, and here they were undoing what they had been trying to do by bringing that very law into contempt. He knew from personal enquiries how unjustly Te Kooti had been treated, and driven to desperation. He feared they were doing the same with Te Whiti.

Mr Montgomery said that the House was assuming the functions of a jury, and trying this man To Whiti. Still he had heard enough to bo convinced that there was still a remnant of the House determined to see that he got justice. He looked upon Te Whiti ae a man possessed of great brain power, without a single flaw in his moral character and of poetie temperament. No matter whose case it was he (Mr Montgomery) was always on advocate for tho maintenance of law and order, and ho approved of;the arrest of any disturbers of the peace, but the culprits should bo brought to trial. The whole question was one whioh was of far too serious import for a party vote. It was a question for their consciences. In all probability many of the new members had never read the commissioners’ report, but he would seriously recommend it to their serious perusal. He admitted the Ministry of tho day had nothing to do with creating the difficulty, It was created by preceding Governments, and the present action was die entirely to the action of those Governments. It was not fair that Sir D. McLean should be wholly blamed. It was well known that the whole of the land was not confiscated. It did not apply to the loyal Natives. The confiscation was not acted upon for a period of ten years, and what was more, some of these lands were given back to the Native owners and bought back from them. He cited from the commissioners’ report to prove that the confiscation had been virtually abandoned by Sir Donald McLean. Alluding to the Native Minister, he said that • he had never doubted his motives. He was a man of courage, a man with a clear head, and a man with clean hands, but still he had erred in hi# dealing* with tho Natives. Te Whiti had all along advocated peace, and that was the secret of his success with tho Natives. The whole transaction showed that the Natives had hevof had any serious idea of fighting. He had been told that To Whiti had preached sedition. If that was the case, why was he not punished in tho ordinary way ? Why was the House asked to stop in between the alleged criminal and his trial by jury? He could only account for its doing so on the theory that they knew no jury would convict him, and was it fair to ask tha House to inflict punishment when they knew that a jury would not ? He argued from the teachings of To Whiti that ho held beliefs in common with their own. He was a man of strong faith, and a believer in a book whioh had taught that faith would remove mountains. His religious beliefs had not been tainted with the philosophies of tho day. Under these circumstances they were asked to do violence to their own religious beliefe, and ho hoped it would not bo allowed. He would oppose the Bill as being a blot which could not be erased from the history of the colony, and one whioh would hereafter be regarded with sorrow and shame. He called on tho House to reject tho Bill. Te WheorO contended that Te Whiti and Tohu had a right to be brought to trial. They had been arrested by law, and it was but right they should bo tried by tho law. The Indemnity Bill sought for would clear the Government, and say that they had done no wrong ; whereas the fact that such a Bill wao required showed that they had committed much wrong. When the troops want to Parihaka the Natives were doing no wrong, and they simply laughed at the troops. He comulained that the troops had pulled down the houses and set fire to them, and also destroyed the young crops. Te Whiti had all along preached peace, and when he was taken away he told them to continue peaceful, and leave the issue in tho hands of God. He knew Government was strong enough to carry tho measure, but he would vote against it, Mr J. Q. Stevens detailed the circumstances of a visit ho paid to Te Whiti, tho result being that he had come to the conclusion that Te Whiti was imbued with the belief that he possessed supernatural powers not only to control the Natives, but likewise the Europeans. Ho also gave evidence of the power exorcised over the minds of his followers. From this, he argued that it was necessary to separate To Whiti from his followers. lie was in tho district in 1873, and at that time there was a proclamation forbidding anyone treating with the Natives for the sale of this land, and it he were a Maori interpreter he would lose his license. Then again, a settler who entered into an agreement to depasture cattle on the land was prosecuted by tho Government, and, if he recollected right, a fine of £SO was imposed. Had a small chain of forts been erected in the district that would, in his opinion, have prevented all this difficulty. The confiscation had not been abandoned, but we had not retained possession. To Whiti did not imagine ha would got back the land. What he thought was that ho was endowed with similar powers to those of Jesus Christ. He had no claim, as he was born in tho neighbor hood of Wellington and could have no (real claim. Te Whiti should bo detained, so as to be kept from hie followers. He might bo sent away to see other parts of the world. In that case he believed ho would return a useful member of tho Maori race. Probably ho had not committed crimes deserving of imprisonment, but to allow him to return to Parihaka might cause a general war. The prohibition of Natives assembling in greater numbers than twenty was a mistake. There were blocks of land in whioh there were far more than twenty grantees, and it could hardly be expected that the persons so connected should not be allowed to gather together. He also advocated the necessity tor individualising the Maori title. It would stimulate agricultural and other pursuits amongst tho Natives themselves. Ample reserves should be made, with an individual right to each man. Mr Daniel stated that, as a Justice of the Peace, he could not consent to a Bill of this nature being passed. Mr Dodson said that he would support the Government in the passage of the Bill. Mr Hobbs gave the Bill his cordial support, and lauded tho policy pursued by the Government. Captain McKenzie spoke in support of the Bill. Mr Watts spoke in support of the Bill. Mr Holmes moved the adjournment of tho debate, whioh was carried. Tho House rose at 12 5,