HOUSE OP REPRESENTATIVES.

Globe, Volume XXII, Issue 2005, 28 July 1880, Page 3

HOUSE OP REPRESENTATIVES.

Tuesday, Judy 27. j The House met at 2 30 p.m. Replying to Mr Rain, The Hon. R. Oliver stated that no fencing had been erected on the Bluff-Winton railway since January Ist. Replying to Mr Bain, The Hon. R. ©diver said that the contract for supplying the Invercargill railway with Newcastle coal expired on December 31st, and that the price was £1 7s 9d per ton. Replying to Mr Seddon, The Hon. T. Dice said that Government sympathised with the orphans and widows of the men killed in the Government sludge channel, Kumara, but did not propose making provision for them, believing that public benevolence would meet all the requirements of the case. Replying to Mr Finn, The Hon. W. Rollbston said that the erection of a courthouse at Arrow was under the consideration of the Government, and some steps would be taken to provide better accommodation than at present existed. Replying to Mr J. B. Fisher, The Hon. J. Ebycb said that Alexander McDonald, who has lately been appointed Native land purchase agent at Otaki, is the same who was some time since convicted and sentenced at the Supreme Court, Wellington, for stopping tho mail coach and shooting a horse. Ho was a man capable of rendering good service in the position to which he had been appointed. Mr J. B. Fisher asked whether Edward Francis Harris, who is 'gazetted Native interpreter under tho Native Land Act in the New Zealand “Gazette,” of January 29th last, is the same Edward Francis Harris who in 1879 was sentenced to six years’ imprisonment for forgery. The Hon. J. Bryce replied in the affirmative, adding that when the appointment was made, the fact of Harris’s conviction was not known. He (Mr Bryce) read a letter of recommendation which accompanied his application, signed by a Judge of the Native Land Court, a Resident Magistrate, one or two J.P.s, and others, supposed to be respectable persons, residing in the district where Harris lived. Replying to Mr Lundon, The Hon. Major Atkinson said that the use of colonial coal was so rapidly superseding that of tho imported article that Government did not think it necessary to impose ft tax on the iatter. Replying to Mr Reeves, The Hon. T. Dick said that the new Licensing Act, clause 171, made provision for the appointment of inspectors in various districts, with power to enter on premises used for the sale of beer or spirits and to obtain samples of the liquors vended for the purpose of analysis, and Government intended to enforce that provision strictly. Replying to Mr Sheehan, The Hon. J. Hall said that Government recognised tho necessity for a Bill to repeal the Sharebrokers Acts, or to amend them to the extent of relieving brokers from payment of the present licenses, but said that there was no probability of getting such a measure passed this session. Replying to Mr Sheehan, The Hon. J. Hall said that Government would endeavor to arrange in the Public Works Statement to give effect to the agreement made some years ago between the Provincial Government of Auckland and the local authorities at the Thames in reference to the Grahamstown and Tararua tramway. Replying to Mr Sheehan, The Hon. J. Bryce said that there was no foundation for the statement in the Hawera “ Star,” published in the “Evening Chronicle” i of July 22nd, bearing upon the recent action of the Natives in erecting fences across the line of road near Pari h aka. Replying to Mr George, The Hon. J. Hail said that instructions had been given to the Agent- General to secure the services of Messrs Baillie and Harvey, actuaries, to investigate the insurance department affairs, and if their services could not be had, then some other firm of equal standing. Replying to Sir G. Grey, The Hon. J. Bbyob said that he thought the telegram from the Attorney-General to ( the Native Minister, published in the Patetere , correspondence, arose out of correspondence which appeared in the Auckland papers. | Replying to Mr Seddon, The Hon. J. Bryce said that when the West Coast Commissioners’ report came down, • Government would submit a proposal for dealing with the whole question about suppressing the Natives from fencing on colonial roads and ploughing the land of the settlers on the west coast of the North Island. Replying to Mr Murray, The Hon. R. Oliver said that the earnings of the Greytown branch line were very , small indeed, and when the main through line was completed Government proposed to invite tenders from persons willing to work it by means of horse power. Mr Barron asked whether the Govern- ( ment intend to reserve Crown lands, in ao- , oordance with sections 350 and 351 of the Municipal Corporations Act, 1876, for the , more adequate endowment of those boroughs which have been unfairly treated in that respect hitherto. The Hon, W. Rollkston replied that there could be no doubt but that the Legislature intended that no more endowments should be granted, and Government did not think it desirable to re-open the question. THE PATETERE BLOCK. On a motion for going into Committee e£ Supply, Sir G. Grey moved that a Select-. Committee be appointed to consider and report on the Patetere correspondence, or any circumstance connected with the contemplated acquisition of the Patetere lands by Europeans, with power to call for persons and papers therein, and to report in a fortnight, such committee to consist of Mr Bryce, Sir W. Fox, Messrs Kenny, Thomson, Stevens, Stewart, and the mover. Mr Bryce and Sir W. Fox desired that their names should not be placed on the committee, both claiming that their time was fully occupied with the work of other committees. Mr Stevens also claimed exemption for similar reasons. On the recommendation of Mr Bryoe, Sir Q. Grey consented to allow the names of the committee to stand over until to-morrow, and the motion was put and carried for the committee without the names. committee op supply. The motion for going into Committee of Supply was put and carried. The debate on the question that tho education vote ba reduced £50,000 was resumed. Mr Macandbbw was disposed to agree with those who believed that the system devolved far too much upon the Government, and too little upon general authority, but the Government having made it a cardinal feature of their policy that the vote this year should not be interfered with, he said that there was no good in discussing it further. He did not agree with the reductions proposed by the member for Riverton, but at the same time he might have been disposed to countenance a smaller reduction. As it was, he would support the proposal for the reduction made by the Minister. Mr Kelly thought it might be wise to do away with Education Boards, and extend the powers and functions of tho committees, to enable them to do all the requisite work. Mr Moss hoped that there would be no attempt to cut the vote down one farthing below that proposed by the Government. Mr Swanson took exception to the class of books used in the schools. They were in a great many instances calculated to hewiide [the pupils. Lessons taught on the subject of the seasons’ influences, for example, spoke of May flowers and summer associations at a period of the year when everything was dead in this part of the world. He thought that an effort should be made to get a class of books better suited to the circumstances of the case. _ Sir G. Grey contended that the circumstances of the colony were not of such a gloomy character as to warrant the large reduction proposed by tho member for Riverton. They bad an educated nation. Mr Fulton supported the system of school fees, and pointed out that the Otago Board at least was not extravagant. Mr Shbimski and Mr Pykb complained that the Otago Board did not do justice to the outlying districts. Tho debate was interrupted by the 5.30 adjournment. EVENING BITTING. The House resumed at 7.30. COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY. Sir O. Grey continued the debate on the Education vote. He contended that the system was not in any respect a pauper system. Tho parents of the children had to mate certain sacrifices in* contributing towards the education vote, and in that way the child had to forego comfort it might otherwise have.

Then again, it brought the children of the rich and poor in close contact with each other, and by that means class -distinctions would, in coarse of time, disappear. He; would be in favour of handing -over;

the schools in part to municipalities and other local bodies, but ho would look mainly to the school committees. It had been asserted that these committees were not really fitted for the trust. That difficulty, however, was gradually disappearing. The duties of these committees were of a nature calculated to educate the committees themselves. For the teachers pensions should be Eroyided, the same being available for both usband and wife. The education system had opened up a new path in life for young women, and in that respect it was one of the greatest blessings conferred upon Now Zealand. The higher systems of education were beneficial, inasmuch as they raised the whole tone of society in the colony. It was tho towns that enjoyed the advantage in tbe first instance, but gradually these influences extended beyond the towns to the most remote parts of the colony. Ho thought that their endowments were, perhaps, too high, but he would not be disposed to interfere on that point at present. He contended that our system of education was fair and beneficial, and one to which tho people were attached. It was the only way in which they could teach all classes. They had boon told that some of their text books were not fitted for New Zealand. Their hooka taught them to look for tho sun in tho wrong direction, and flowers and plants in the wrong season of the year. That of itself, however, wss instructive. It taught the child to familiarise itself with the difference of seasons in this country and in England, It likewise taught the child to trace the course of the sun. Still ho expected that tho time would come when it would be wiie to provide school books of their own. If they stopped their operations they would cause a gap that never could be filled up. He trusted that that course would never be followed.

' The Hon. Major Atkinson said Sir G. Grey was endeavoring to take credit for the establishment of a system which he had done his utmost to prevent being established. Mr Sheehan said that there could be no doubt but that the Act owed its success and popularity to the fact that it was free, secular, and compulsory. Its features in that respect were dus to tho action of the Opposition, who forced their cardinal points into the measure. They could not retrace their steps. He felt that, and consequently he would vote for the amount being passed as proposed. The public would never consent to go back again to tho school fees cr consent to a denominational system. The Hon. W. Rollestok said it would be a great mistake to abolish the Education Boards. They had administered their functions well, and were doing excellent work. They were not extravagant, but they might fairly be asked to reduce their expenditure like the other branches of tho public service. Mr Hhesthouse spoke in favour of primary education, but thought that the duty of the State stopped short there. After further discussion, Mr McOaughan withdrew the original motion, and proposed a reduction by £64,000. On this the committee divided—Ayes, 15 ; noes, 58. The motion for a reduction by £30,000 was then put and carried on tbe voices. Vote —Native schools, £14,949. Agreed to. Vote—lndustrial schools, £5045. The Hon. W. Rollbston said that it was intended that these schools should be taken over by the Education Department. The vote was agreed to. Deaf and Dumb Institution, £1793. Agreed to. Miscellaneous service, £4550, Mr Shbimski moved that the following items be struck out:—Auckland Girls’ High School, £I2OO ; Thames High School, £4OQ ; Wellington College, £I2OO ; Otago Boys and Girls’ High Schools, £SOO. The Hon. W. Rollbston explained the necessity for these items being retained. Mr Sheehan pointed out that there were no endowments for higher education in the North Island, and if these items were objected to the time would come when a common endowment fund would be insisted upon, as well as a common land fund. After considerable discussion, the motion to strike out the item was lost on a division by 42 to 11. The total vote, Miscellaneous services £4550, was then agreed to. Department of justice, £1335. Agreed to. Crown law office, £2llO, Agreed to. Laud claims office, £2OO. Agreed to. Supreme court, £7246, Agreed to. District courts, £BOBS. The Hoh. W. Rollbston said that this was a vote that Government thought would admit of very considerable reduction. He proposed a reduction of £IBOO. Mr Kelly said that the question was whether the reduction should be made on this vote or on the vote asked for resident magistrates. Before dealing with the matter he asked Government to consider that point. The Hon. W. Rollbston said that he was quite satisfied that this department was overweighted altogether. These courts had not been a success in tho colony, and the question was, should tbe jurisdiction of the Supreme Court not be so regulated as to overtake much of this work. Cheap justice had not proved a success in the colony. The vote as reduced was carried. Resident Magistrates’ and Wardens’ Courts, £48,216 4s. Tho Hon. W. Rollbston said that this was a department in which Government proposed considerable saving. He suggested that it be reduced £IOOO. Sir William Fox pointed out that a large number of clerks and bailiffs were employed by this department, who might be dispensed with. Then again, in small conterminous townships each had its constable, who had literally nothing to do. It would be well to investigate this matter by a commission, and ho believed if it was properly gone about a vast saving might be effected. With a complete through system of railway lines one officer could move about from place to place without much trouble or inconvenience.

The vote as reduced was agreed to. Petty Sessions, £IOO. Agreed to. Criminal prosecution, £IO9O. Agreed to. Coroners Act, £2500. Agreed to. Prisons, £39,529. The Hon. Mr Rollbston proposed a reduction of £2OOO.

The vote as reduced was agreed to. Contingencies, £4500, and the Native Land Court, £10,267, was agreed to. Native Lands Frauds Prevention Act, £643. Mr Macdonald thought this a waste of money, and moved its omission. The vote was agreed to. Miscellaneous, £1506. The vote was agreed to.

Progress was reported, and the House rose at 12.30.