GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

Globe, Volume VIII, Issue 1017, 28 September 1877, Page 3

GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

[By Telegraph.] [per press agency. 1 LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL. Thursday, September 27. deceased wife’s sister bill. The Deceased Wife’s Sister Marriage Bill was thrown out by a majority of nine— Ayes, 8 ; noes, 17. The Hon, Dr Pollen, and the Hon. Messrs Robinson, Fraser, Bonar, and Sir F. D. Bell spoke against the Bill; the Hon. Mr Chamberlain and the Hon. Mr Mantell, in reply, spoke in favor of the Bill. FRIENDLY AND PROVIDENT SOCIETIES BILL. Amendments by the House of Representatives on the Friendly Societies and Industrial Provident Societies Bill were agreed to. ' CANTERBURY RIVERS BILL, i The Canterbury Rivers Act Amendment Act was received by Council from the House ' to-day, and was read a first time, the Standing * Orders having been suspended to allow the i Bill to pass through all stages to-night. * HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES. * Thursday, September 27. '• The House met at 2.30 p.m. DISQUALIFICATION, > The Canterbury Rivers Act Amendment 1 Bill No. 2, the object of which is to declare that no one shall be deemed to be or have ■ been disqualified as a member of cither House by having been a member of a River Board, I was passed through all its stages. * NO-CONFIDENCE MOTION. 1 Mr Larnach moved his “ Waka Maori” f amendment on the motion for going into t Committee of Supply, He felt the responsibility thrown on him by the Government ) accepting the motion as a no• confidence one,

but was prepared to accept it. The “ Waka Maori ” was first started ten or twelve years ago, and up to 1872 nothing objectionable appeared in it, but then Mr Stafford had reason to complain ot‘ its contents. He read Mr Stafford’s letter to Mr Waterhouse, dated 28th December, 1872, making complaint of the “ Waka Maori” being prostituted to party and personal purposes. He also read Mr Waterhouse’s reply, promising that such should not occur again. How far that promise had been kept this debate would show. The system then commenced had been carried on to the present time. Up to the last session this had created so strong a feeling of disgust, that the vote for the “Waka Maori” was struck out; yet the paper was kept on, and a writ was issued for libel by Mr Henry Russell. The Government took three months to consider, and then pleaded justification. The Government was a continuous one, and as a body could not escape responsibility. The Premier had last year accepted the vote, and promised that the colony should never more be required to contribute to the paper. The fact, however, was plain that, no matter at whose expense the paper was published, the country would be called to pay no less than £6OOO costs and damages in Russell’s case. The responsibility rested with the present Ministers, who in the face of an express vote of the House, had involved the country in enormous legal expenses. Of course the printer could not be left to pay, but it was a monstrous thing that the country should be placed in such a position. If the present Government were not responsible for the Russell libel, certainly they were for a more recent one published within the last year. He would simply move the motion. Mr Whitaker congratulated Mr Larnach on his new character as leader of the Opposition. The Government were very glad of the opportunity of determining whether they had a majority in the House or not. If they had not, they had no right to be on those benches, and had no desire to be there unless they had the confidence of the House. Ho only regretted the question had not been tested long before. Public business would have been advanced if the Opposition had clone as they might have done, brought this matter forward a month ago. He quoted Todd’s “ Parliamentary Practice ” to show that the motion was a vote of want of confidence, and that, if carried, Mr Larnach was bound to take the responsibility as to advising the Governor in his choice of new advisers. The Government adopted full responsibility of the publication of the “ Waka-Maori,” and if the motion were earned, Ministers would resign and recommend the Governor to send for Mr Larnach. He denied that the Ministry was a continuous one. How could lie be the successor of Sir Julius Yogcl, whom, on the most important question, he had opposed. He had been laughed about requiring precedence, but he had insisted on it to show how completely lie reserved himself from the former Administration. Mr Ormond and Mr Reid had joined the Ministry after he did. He did not think the cost in the “Waka Maori” case would exceed £3500; but of course the printer could not be left to pay it. He quoted “Hansard” to show exactly what took place last session. On the 17th October the “Waka Maori” vote was struck out. The “Waka Maori” of the 7th November contained an article announcing its discontinuance in consequence of that vote. Letters and telegrams poured in from all quarters from Natives complaining of its discontinuance. Read several of these. The Natives were dissatisfied at its discontinuance, and the Government felt in a difficulty. In order to sec what could be done, the Government issued a circular, signed by the Native Under-Secretary to officers in Native districts. He read this. Its object was to ascertain the amount of support the Natives would give if its publication were continued. A large number of subscriptions were promised. A petition to continue the paper was also received from influential Natives, amongst others from four out of six Native members of the Legislature. After all this, the Government came to the conclusion that it was necessary to re-establish the paper, believing it specially dangerous to leave Natives without proper information on important matters. Several gentlemen offered to guarantee the expenses, and it was resolved to carry it on without expense to the colony. Sir Donald McLean guaranteed £SO, and others did the same, and not only guaranteed the publication, but took the responsibility of all consequences. Had lie been in the Ministry he would have acted as members did. The first number under the new arrangement was in December, and up to J uly it was continued, when, in consequence of some question in the House, the Government decided to stop it. As to the cost, he believed the subscriptions would more than cover the cost of publication, and half the salary of the officer of the department who edited it in one-fourth of his time. The accounts were not quite made up, but ho believed there would be no necessity even to ask tho guarantors for anything Since its resuscitation subscriptions, he believed, had more than paid the full costs, but if when the account was made up a deficiency was found, it would not fall on the colony. No vote appeared on the Estimates this year for the paper, and it was never intended it should be. Tho libels alluded to were published in July and August, 1870, before he joined the Ministry. Although their publication was urged by Sir Donald McLean he felt bound to say he believed Sir Donald never received any of them in which the libel appeared. Under the new arrangement the guarantors were liable, and they were quite willing to bear the responsibility. Tho first Maori newspaper was published in 1818, being established by Sir George Grey as Governor. He entirely approved of that action, as establishing a medium of communication between tho Government and the Maori people. With occasional intermission the publication of a Maori newspaper continued until July last, the “Waka Maori” taking place of the original “ Maori Mesjsengey.” He quoted from Gorst’a book, “The Maori King,” to show the history of the Maori papers. The comparison of. dates he had given would show that the assertions of Mr Larnach’s motion were unfounded. Mr Montgomery asked for a list of the guarantors’ names, Mr Whitaker said that was a private matter and he would pot give it. Had Mr Larnach asked for correct information as to the facts of the case, the Government would have given them ; but he had chosen to proceed in the dark. If [anything, the Government had the profit of publishing the paper since December, and no libel appeared during that time, or if there had neither the Government nor the colony were liable, but the guarantors. The paper had been conducted under the direction of Dr Pollen, as Native Minister. He asked Mr Larnach as an honorable man if, in face of tho facts slated, ho vfaa prepared to abk any honorable men to

vote for a resolution the statements in which were absolutely untrue. Mr Larnach had been singularly unfortunate in his first appearance as leader of the Opposition, basing his attack on purely imaginary facts. Mr Lusk was astonished at the audacity of Mr Whitaker’s winding up such a speech by giving a Ivice. The statements of that speech aid not hang together. Apparently Mr Whitaker forgot that the matter was before the House a month ago, when Government had objected to its discussion because the matter was sub jad ice. He was glad the Government had at last taken a stand and did not view the question as merely a social one, or promise not to do it again, or promise to consider it during the recess. There were other more important questions affecting their existence yet in the background. The Government could not have been influenced in continuing the paper by the letter received from Maori members, because this letter was received while the House was sitting, and a mouth later the Government issued circular stating they had resolved to discontinue the paper. Evidently, therefore, this letter had not influenced tho [decision, lie denied that the Natives whose letters had been read as justifying the action of the Government in defying the House were influential, or their representations entitled to weight. With one exception these representations were all dated Wellington, emanating from men here in

the Native Office, and under its influence. “ Hansard” only very imperfectly represented debates in committee, and that relating to the “Waka Maori” vote was very briefly reported. Many members complained of the use of the paper for improper purposes, and not only objected to the £4OO vote, but objected to the Government maintaining a paper to malign its opponents. Major Atkinson bad been asked if he would accept the refusal of the vote as an indication of the wisfi of the House that the paper should not be published, and the Premier had replied that he would. It was not a mere question of £4-00 but of the principle of maintaining such a publication. It was a most extraordinary doctrine that the Government were not responsible for a paper published in the Government printing office, headed by the Royal arms, and with the Government printer’s name in the imprint. If they wished to carry it on individually, they should have had it printed at some other office ; but they wanted it to go forth with authority as an official organ. He doubted whether the

gentlemen who guaranteed the costs really meant it. A libel was published in September last. The member libelled had asked for an apology or £IOO for some charity. The law officers of the Crown had replied, offering an apology, but said it would be very hard to cull on the Government printer and editor to pay £IOO. It was nonsense to say the Government had made profit out of the paper, or that its publication had cost nothing. No men acquainted with newspapers believed it. He did not believe there wore 1000 Maoris in the colony who would read the “ Waka Maori” even if given them, much less pay 10s a year for it. Ho would like to see a list of the subscribers, even those who had paid the £2lB received. As to the other £2OO due it never would be received. The whole thing about its being self-supporting was an utter farce. The paper had been discontinued only two days before the House met, after being continued in defiance of its vote for seven months. It had evidently been discontinued then to avoid consequences in the House. If the matter were now passed over he believed the “ Waka Maori ” would speedily re-

appear, probably under a joint stock company composed of the seven members of the Ministry. As a matter of fact he believed a number was ready for publication to-day, but tho Ministers were afraid to issue it. The receipts from the paper had not paid current expenses, and if the guarantors had not paid anything then evidently the paper would have been carried on at the public expense —an expense, ho believed, of thousands of pounds. He believed the costs and damages in Russell’s case would be at least £6OOO. Russell’s aloue were £2400. If the present Government were not parties to that libel when it was committed, they were parties to it afterwards by having used means to search for evidence to blacken and damage Mr Russell’s character, and justify the libel which Mr "Whitaker now expressed regret had ever been published. This responsibility they could not escape. Nothing Mr Whitaker had said showed that the words of the motion in effect were not strictly accurate. On the contrary, his admissions showed the statements of the motion to be strictly accurate. The paper was published and written by Government officers, with Government money, on Government paper, with Government ink, and was sent free through the post by Government authority. He did not believe in confidential guarantees from gentlemen whose names could not he divulged. Major Atkinson : I’m one. Mr Lusk : Yes, the head and front of the

offending. Eor the last year the Premier had fully understood tho import of tho vote, and promised that the paper should Ik; discontinued. The Government had, with public funds, carried on tho paper for per - sonal and party purposes, and now said they had not, as a Government, any responsibility. Ministers could not draw distinctions such as they wished between their private position and their public one, Mr Whitaker’s speech might bp taken as the case for the defendant, and, if so, it was a very poor defence. 'The debate was interrupted at 5.30 p.m. PARLIAMENTARY INCIDENTS. [I’KOAT THE CORRESPONDENT OF THE IrKESS.] Wellington, September 27, 8 p.m. On the House meeting to-day all business was set aside to give precedence to Mr Larn?,;;hT motion, except the Canterbury Rivers Amendment Act, which was passed without remark through all its stages. The Act is for purposes of relieving Mr Fisher and the Hon. Mr Peacock from a breach of the Disqualification Act. The House then proceeded to hear Mr Larnach ’3 motion, but he commenced by showing that the Opposition rather shirked tho responsibility of tho motion by saying that he hoped the debate would be compressed strictly to the point in issue, and he was supported by Mr Sheehan, who said the party were not bound by this question, as there were many more they intended to raise. The Premier declined to accept this, and said the Government treated the motion as one of no confidence, and would allow themselves the utmost latitude, and this view was supported by the Speaker. Mr Larnach’a speech was weak, and Mr Whitaker, who replied, spoke extremely well, and shook the position of the other side terribly. He said the “WakaMaori ” hod not been paid fo;> by the Governmeat Biace tho ditlueioa of tho vote of last

year, and that the libels on -which tho late action was based were published during the term of a- former Ministry before the vote for the newspaper was rejected. This 1 know was the case, as the “ Waka Maori ” has been published at the office of the “New Zealand Times,” and the expenses have been paid by several well known men who take an interest in the Natives, and by Natives themselves. Government have merely put their name to its continuance. Even before Mr Whitaker’s speech'to-day the Opposition admitted that the Government would have a majority of six, but I expect to see a majority of at least ten when tho motion gees to a division.

The committee appointed to inquire bnvei declared Mr Kennedy disqualified, and will probably make their report to the House to-! morrow.

Major Atkinson returned for the first time to the House to-day, looking very ill. Since the resumption of the House, Mr Button spoke strongly in favour of the Government, and now Mr J. E. Brown is speaking in favour of the motion. I hear that the Opposition, in case of defeating the Government on this or any other motion, have persuaded Mr Eitzherbcrt to take office as Premier.

The debate is causing much talk in town, and the galleries to-night are all full.