KAIAPOI PARISH MEETING.

Globe, Volume IV, Issue 451, 24 November 1875, Page 2

KAIAPOI PARISH MEETING.

A special meeting of the parishioners of Kaiapoi, at which between fifty and sixty were present, was held in the Episcopalian Sunday-school on Monday evening at seven o'clock, to discuss Church matters. The Rev H. E. Carlyon, curate, occupied the chair.

The chairman repeated a collect, and then called on Mr Birch (minister's churchwarden) to read the minutes of the last

meeting

Mr E. Revell raised a point of order that the notice convening the meeting should be read as usually done. After a pause, Mr C. Whitefoord (parishioners' churchwarden) said the minutes would probably supply the information as to the calling of this meeting. Mr Birch found from the minutes that the notices of meetings Lad been sometimes read before and at other times after the minutes were confirmed.

Mr J. Beswick thought the notice ought to be read now ; surely there need be no objection.

The chairman said he had not a copy of the notice, but would give the purport of it.

Mr Revell only drew attention to this, BO that the business might be carried on in proper order. The question dropped. Mr Birch read the minutes, which were then confirmed and signed. The chairman then stated the meeting was called to discuss general Church matters. In reference to which he would like to say a word, viz, that he hoped these matters would be fully and fairly discussed, and the meeting conducted in a Christian spirit ; that they would not get into a rage, but at the enquiry which was to be held hand in their objections in writing like Christians and not like heathens. He called on Mr Whitefoord to read the Bishop's letter. Mr Whitefoord was proceeding to read, when

Mr Beswick pointed out that, at the expense of being styled a " heathen," he did not think the parishioners would allow themselves to be interfered with; they had met to settle their affairs first, and then might consider the Bishop. Mr Whitefoord moved—" That the Bishop's letter be read," to which Mr Beswick, if he liked, could move an amendment. Mr Beswick had said his say.

Mr R. Woodford seconded the motion, which was carried, and the following letter read

" Bishop's Court, Christchurch, " November 17th, 1875.

" Gentlemen, —I see by this morning's paper that there has been a meeting of the parishioners of Kaiapoi, in which the following resolution was carried:—'That the parishioners present at this meeting decline to elect a vestryman until an opportunity has been afforded them of discussing the affairs of the parish and inquiring into the general conduct of the incumbent.' Subsequently it was decided that a meeting, property convened, I conclude, by the clergyman (see page 40, clause 29, of Synod report, 1874), should be held on Monday evening next to discuss the affairs of the parish prior to the election of a vestryman. 1 thiuk lam justified in assuming that the object of the second meeting, though the resolution referring to it does not distinctly say so, among other matters, is • to inquire into the general conduct of the incumbent.' Whatever may have been the conduct of the incumbent during his charge of the cure of Eaiapoi (his zeal and activity in the discharge of his duty were not, if I may judge from the reports of the meeting, called in question), a meeting of the parishioners, at which some may be present who are not communicants, can scarcely be considered a proper courtf or such enquiry. I would express a hope therefore that the proposed meeting of Monday next will not take place, or its business be limited to the election of a vestryman or matters of parochial finance, and I shall request the Dean to make arrangements with you for holding a court of enquiry, in your presence, at which any duly registered parishioner may prefer charges against the incumbent, such charges with, the incumbent's reply to the same, or his refutations or explanations, to be taken down in writing, signed by the Dean and yourselves, and forwarded to me for my consideration and judgment. I need hardly add that I rely upon your co-operation with the Dean in maintaining order during the enquiry. I shall enclose a copy of this letter to the incumbent, and I must request you if you wish to communicate with me on the subject of it, to let me hear from y»u before Friday next, on which day I leave Christchurch for the South, or to communicate with the Dean, who has been authorised by me to act in this behalf. " I am, Gentlemen, " Yours very faithfully, "H. J. C. Christchurch. " To J. Birch, Esq, and C. Whitefoord, Esq, " Churchwardens of Kaiapoi."

Mr Whitefoord said he was requested by the Dean (who was present) to state he (the Dean) would be glad to explain the nature of the enquiry and how it would be conducted. He asked someone to more that the Dean be allowed to give this information. Mr H. J. Wood moved —" That the Dean be requested to state the nature of the inquiry, and manner of conducting the same." Mr Woodford seconded the motion, which was agreed to. The Very llev the Dean began by saying his explanation would be a very simple one. His Lordship the Bishop had appointed the churchwardens and himself to hold the inquiry. It must be obvious that a public meeting was totally incompetent to act as such a court. It was manifest that the result of an inquiry held in that way would be unsatisfactory to the church, the parishioners, and the incumbent; unless it was carried on in a more formal manner, the charges taken down in writing, with the incumbent's replies, and the usual rules of evidence in reference to the exclusion of hearsay statements, and so forth, no proper result could be arrived at. If he, as chairman of the commission, was at fault iq

conducting the inquiry, he trusted his assessors —as he might term them —both magistrates, would give him the best advice. This he trusted would lead to the best results. A public meeting in such affairs was likely to be led away, and in such a meeting there was no calm judicial inquiry to be expected. It was for the purpose of ho'diug a calm judicial inquiry that the Bishop requested him to act. He had given him no commission as to how the inquiry was to be held, but had left that question entirely in the hands of the churchwardens and himself. He was always in favor of openness and publicity, and when the matters were so much published, it would not be well to conduct the inquiry in a secret way. [Cheers.l The churchwardens were of the same opinioD, and he would trust to those present to maintain decorum while the business was going on. That meeting would, he presume, terminate as a meeting, the chairman leave the chair as soon as its business was over, and the inquiry would forthwith proceed. [Cheers.] Mr E. Revell asked to have the Bishop's commission to the Dean read. The Dean replied the letter just read was all that existed. Mr W. P. Wilson considered the letter was quite sufficient. Mr J. C. Porter asked if, when the enquiry was opened, all would be on their honor not to communicate with the Bishop regarding it. The Dean replied the result would, be sent to the Bishop, not in the form of any report, but simply the facts as taken down, and he could make no regulation on the question pat by Mr Porter. It would however be impertinent to refer the matter to the Bishop in any other way than through that court. Mr R. S. Bean asked how long the enquiry might be expected to continue. The Dean replied it was impossible to say. The Bishop would return to Christchurch by the second Sunday in December, and then receive the result of the enquiry. So far as he (the Dean) was concerned, he should hold himself ready, so far as other engagements would allow, to go on with it. Mr Bean had put the question because the parishioners were anxious to have the affair settled as speedily as possible. [Cheers.] Mr Beswick asked at whose instigation the enquiry had been instigated by the Bishop, from the newspaper reports or at the instance of some person. The Dean thought his Lordship decided to hold the enquiry in consequence of what he had seen in the reports. After the last meeting Mr Carlyon, as every clergyman would do, consulted his Bishop. Next day his Lordship asked him to hold an enquiry, and brought him a draft of the letter read. He wished to speak out all he knew. When the Bishop brought him the draft letter he asked for his suggestions. It was of the Bishop's own motion, he believed, that the enquiry was proposed. Mr Beswick said he intended to move a resolution that the meeting proceed to discuss the conduct of the Rev H. B. Carlyon. The Chairman persisted that this could not be gone into. If they had met to consider his conduct, b* would leave the chair. Mr Beswick considered they were met to discuss Church matters. This was one, and he moved—" That the parishioners request the present incumbent to resign." He then proceeded to give his reasons, remarking it was no use losing temper over the matter, and useless to allow the time to be taken up by discussing side issues. What he wished to do was to draw attention to parish affairs on the part of several present who had not perhaps for some time taken much interest in Church matters. On enquiry, he had found that, although one of the oldest of the Church members at Kaiapoi, he had lately been struck off the register, and because he was not a communicant was not entitled to take offiee, although a communicant in England. When the incumbent was nominated he declined to take part in the thing because he considered the nominators decided the question too hastily. Well, he soon became bo dissatisfied with his preaching that he refused to allow his children to be examined by Mr Carlyon for confirmation. He told him one of his servants desired to be confirmed, and gave her every facility for attending Mr Carlyon's instruction. She was told she could attend his Wednesday class, but could not be spared by her mistress on Fridays. During the time he was at Akaroa the lady left in charge of his household reported that Mr Carlyon had wanted the servant to attend his Friday class, and several times had desired her to break faith with her mistress in regard to it. The incumbent therefore by such an act had caused and would cause a considerable amount of mischief by causing members of families to disobey their parents or guardians. (No.) Well he could point out—[A Voice : " Point away"]—that it would be so. When he returned from Akaroa and found the girl had not been confirmed, he expressed his surprise, and found she had received a book; on which her parents had refused to allow her to go. Hearing Mr Bean had resigned, and there was to be a parish meeting, he obtained the book, from which he was satisfied in the opinion that he had already formed of the incumbent, and attended the last meeting to represent the matter. If the meeting would allow him he would read extracts.

Mr Montague Smith thought this was part ,of the question for the enquiry. Mr Beswick continued —This was a book •put into the hands of a child. It might be right for some grown up persons, such as bachelors, but not for children. He would read " An examination of conscience" (reTised) third commandment, " Have you— The chairman would interrupt the speaker a, few moments to say if this went on he would leave the chair, the Dean would take it, and the inquiry proceed. This was a parishioners' meeting, but if his conduct was to be discussed he would leave the chair. Mr Beswick asserted his right to go on and state his reasons for the motion. He had taken legal advice on the matter, and meant to have it out. The question he was reading was, " Have you ever spoken of Holy Scripture with irreverence, or read it to gratify an improper curiosity, looking at portions which might suggest impure thoughts? Have you ever marie a jest of God's House, or of God's priests? How often ? " and, on the seventh commandment, " Have you ever indulged in any immodest conversation ? Have you begun it, or joined

and listened with pleasure? Have you ever read improper books? Have you ever had impure thoughts and given way to them ? Have you committed any acts of impurity alone or with others—how often ? Have you looked at improper pictures ! Have you sinned by gluttony, or spending money merely to gratify your appetite 1 Have you indulged in too much sleep? Have you been vain of your personal appearance? Have you tried to attract the admiration of the other B'x ? Have you lo»ed to look at yourself, or thought much of dress? &c." In heaven's name, he asked, who would give such questions to a child 1 Was the man who would do so a proper man to remain in charge of the parish. [" No, no."] He learnt that the parents of this girl had simply withdrawn her from Mr Carlyon's instruction, but if it had been given to a child of his, he (Mr Beswick) would have taken a more active and vigorous course in the matter. He moved the motion as read. Mr 8 S. Powell seconded the motion. Mrß. McKenna, V. 0., moved—" That the meeting proceed to the next business." Mr E. Hevell raised a point of order.

Mr McKenna continued by saying there were several very sensitive persons present, no doubt, one of whom appeared to be Mr Beswick, whom he recollected on one occasion at the institute objected to the removal from the library of " Rabelais," a work filled with filthy reading, yet liable to be taken out by boys or girls as well as adults. Mr C. E. Dudley asked if Mr McKenna was in order.

Mr F H. M. Walker wanted to know what this had to do with the question before the meeting. The chairman ruled Mr McKenna quite in order.

Mr McKenna continued, and he wanted to show how inconsistent some folks could be, and yet pretend to be very delicate at times. The book alluded to, Mr Beswick told the members was fit to be in any library, in fact aimost on a drawing-room table—[Mr Beswick—" No ;" several voices—" Yes "J —and only by the persistency of the members was it removed, several of those who saw it laughing over it, and yet at this meeting they were quite demure over the questions just read. To show that very few knew what the Church Services really were, he one day quoted the exhortation to the Communion, and used the word " absolution," which was objected to by his hearer as not in the Book of Common Prayer. On reference to the book there it was found. Then his hearer said, '■ Oh, but it has a general meaning." Were they to attach general meanings too in this way. He thought not. Another instance to show the inconsistency of these modest people, who construe the questions into an improper meaning: a short time ago a book was found, containing a list of the sins of mankind, written in a lady's handwriting, which was shown in a public-house, and gloated over by several now active persecutors of the incumbent. [Confusion]. The person who wrote this list was going from house to house trying to upset the minister. [Mr Beswick —" How long is this ago ?" Mr McKenna—" A month or so."] Mr Beswick, he said, tried to put any one else down ; he always wanted to hold the floor. With regard to heads of families, Mr Beswick had a number of children, but he [Mr McKenna] had six, and he hoped to God that every child would have the same teaching as his children received from Mr Carlyon. The chairman wished to say a few words on the amendment.

Mr Beswick, amid cries of " sit down," said he protesttd that the chairman's action was unusual in his replying to each speaker. The chairman explained he wanted to speak to the amendment. Mr H. Revell asked if the amendment was carried would it be in older.

The chairman thought that as these dreadful things would affect his character, he should be allowed to state what he knew about them. They ought to treat one another as brothers, though he must say he thought Mr Beswick as a brother somewhat an unkind one. In reference to the girl spoken of, he did not ask her to break faith with her mistress. He might have naid if the could attend the Friday class he would be glad to see her, but did not press her. Regarding the books, as he did not know that the girl had parents he could not possibly have requested the girl not to show the books to her parents. In fact he thought the girl was a stranger, whose parents were living away at some distance. Mr J. 0. Porter moved—" That the suggestion contained in the Bishop's letter of November 17th be acted upon re an enquiry." Mr Whitefoord, seconding the motion, pointed out that as some of the church officers had reflections cast on them in statements made that they wanted to burk enquiry, he would be anxious to see it held, and that persons should not throw dust in their eyes with a view to hinder the enquiry. In regard to Mr Beswick's motion, he considered the meeting was not competent to ask Mr Carlyon to resign in a summary manner or without due enquiry and proof of the charges being given. There were perhaps more serious charges than those named last which ought to be investigated, and if proved, then a resolution could be proposed to send the incumbent away. fOheers.] It was a quite unheard of and unßnglish proceeding to pass sentence oh a man before he had his trial and was convicted. At any rate it was a course which he was unused to, and he thought he had not come to Kaiapoi to learn that such affairs were managed differently here than elsewhere. | Cheers.] They all owed a duty, not only to themselves but to the church, and in fairness to the incumbent the enquiry would ultimately have to be held. The Bishop's action must have been taken in consequence of the reports in the papers, as neither Mr Birch or himself had an opportunity of communicating to him. The Bishop had, therefore, scut a proper officer to make full inquiry and report to him in a legal manner; as the Dean had already stated the Court would make no report, but simply collect and forward all the evidence, and his Lordship decide. The incumbent would also be allowed to make his defence. The parishioners really ought to consent to the inquiry. Mr M'Kenna withdrew his amendment.

Mr B. Revell said several had agreed to support a motion Bimilar to that proposed by Mr Porter, provided that this meeting was adjourned till after the inquiry. Mr Porter moved tbe addition, " That this meeting be adjourned till after the inquiry is held." Mr "Whitefoord again expressed a hope that all would agree to the amendment. Mr birch, before it was put, said he had urged on this inquiry for the sake of promoting order in the church and parish. He was glad this was to be brought about, and would accept the amendment, although any protest which was made regarding the curate ought to be done under certain rules, viz, through the churchwardens to the Bishop. He then went on to show that, in acceptinrr the inquiry, he might be bound to make public his charge against his clergyman, which he would have preferred doing in the constitutional way. Also, showing that the inquiry put him to a disadvantage, it might be necessary for some of his household to be brought into it, and how did they all feel when females and members of their families were dragged out in that manner. However, for the sake of bringing about peace and order, he concurred in the inquiry being now held.

Mr Powell rose to speak to the motion. Mr Whitefoord maintained that the seconder of the motion could not speak to it. The amendment was again read. Mr Beswick again came to his feet to say that the position taken by some of the meeting was an illogical one. It was competent to consider the conduct of the clergyman without reference to the court of enquiry. At the last meeting it was decided to have this meeting, and not to take up the statements of the " man in the street;" but it appeared the Bishop had acted on the authority of this personage. The Dean said he stated that Mr Carlyon had laid the result of the last meeting before the Bishop. Mr Birch—That's not the man in the street.

Mr Beswick again came to his feet amid calls for "Order." He said no request had gone from the parishioners for the Bishop to interfere. When the Bishop was asked then let him do his duty in regard to questions of of doctrine preached by Mr Carlyon; but it was for the parishioners to consider whether from the book read the incumbent was fit to remain in charge. This was the real question at issue. He was surprised to see the people performing the literal impossibility of turning their backs on themselves. Mr C. E. Dudley asked if the Bishop had not a right to act in the interest of the parish. | Cheers ] Mr Beswick maintained he had no right to interfere. He had taken legal advice on the question. He had done his part. He would divide on the question and see whether the meeting was with him. Mr M'Kenna had said with regard to the book at the institute that he (Mr Beswick) said it was in every library, and fit for a drawingroom. He could prove from men present that he said no such thing. [Oh, oh.J (Mr M'Kenna said he was present and could call others to prove what he said.) At any rate he vas sorry a few were taking this up as a personal matter and raising opposition on his account, | No, no.] Mr C. B. Dudley asked that the motion should be withdrawn until after the enquiry. He was prepared to vote for it then, but meanwhile it would be better for the enquiry to be held, and the allegations against the curate received in proper form. He did not think it fair for them to condemn him till he was heard.

The amendment was put, that the meeting agrees to the enquiry and adjourns till after it had been held, and carried on the voices, Mr Beswick's being the only one against it. A vote of thanks was then passed to the chairman, who then left the chair.

The court of enquiry was immediately opened at 8.45, before the Very Rev the Dean (presiding), Messrs J. Birch and C. Whitefoord. Having decided on the conduct of business, a number of objections to the incumbent were received, to some cf which he replied, and others stated he would give written answers to. At 10.35 p.m the enquiry was adjourned till 7 p.m. on Friday, at which all objections, the Dean announced, must be sent in, if possible, in writing, though he was fully prepared to take oral statements.