THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

Evening Star, Issue 3920, 16 September 1875, Page 2

THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

fKy TklkukaphJ

Wellington. September 16

Tn the Legislative Council yesterday, Mr Mantell moved that it be an instruction to the Disqualification Act Infringement Committee to inquire and report upon the question whether a member of this Council, holding an honorary appointment under the Executive Government, can receive any travelling allowances or free passages whilst travelling on the duties of his honorary appointment, without contravention of the Disqualification Act. Carried.

The Public Health Act, 1872, Amendment Bill was introduced by the Hon. Dt Pollen. The Highway Boards Empowering Bill, to adjust differences between Road Boards, was read a second time and ordered to be committed next day. The Bill will be general in application. The Kaknnui Harbor Board Bill was passed through Committee without amendment, and Jead a third time, and passed. The Tiinaru Municipal Council Empowering ar.d Waterworks Bill was passed through Committee The preamble having been amended, the third reading was fixed for Friday. In the House of Representatives, at 2.30, Mr Steward asked whether the Marine Department proposes to take steps to guard against accidents during the daytime to vessels passing alon.r the coast of Otago, between Oamaru and Port Chalmers, by marking the position of the reef off Moeraki, known as the Fibli Reef, by moans of bell-buoys or floating beacons ; and when the proposed lighthouse at Moeraki will be available as a beacon and guide for vessels passing this portion of the coast at night. Mr Reynolds said th". position of the ieef

was well laid down, and iu ordinary weather any navjeaor ought to be able to give it a wide berth. There was no doubt it, waß a dangerous reef in thick weather. The Government intended to erect a li :hthouse at Moeraki, so that >tny vessel in passing could take the bearing and so avoid the reef, a s soon as the money ■'.'.■>s voted, no time would be lost in proceeding with the work. Ihe foilo-Aiug motions by Mr O'Neil were to, in as far as the information required iViiiid be supplied :—Tlfat reports of various Hoards of He-dth laid upon ihe table during the present session be printed. That returns laid before the House showing the quantity aud value of coal imported into New Zealand

from Ist duly, 1873, to 30th Juue, 1875, giving locality whence imported, the po;L whe.iv discharged, be supplemented by a return showing the quantity of the coal imported annually, from 30th June, 1870. to 30th June, 1875. For return of the nameß of all persons who have been drowned in any river or stream in ew Zealand, from 30th June, 1870, to 30th June last, giving the nam.- of such river or stream, and of the Province in which it is situated, in con;inua-ion of a rer.urn ordered on the motion of Mr Stafford for the names of all i.erhoiis drowned in anv rive; or stream in New Zealand from Ist January, 1840, to 30th June, 1870. For a return showing the number of mining accidents in New Zealand, specifying the localities, from the date of discovery of gold iu 1857 to the 30th June last. Return to ■■ how the number of yearly accidents, the. causes, far as is known, verdicts, inquests, aud any general remarks, together with the names o persons killed, whether married or single, au<l the number of widows and children of porsons so killed; und that, in continuation, theie shall be laid before the Hous. e.ch session r< yearly return of ad mining accdenra. Sir Donald M'Leau, after announcing that the abolition debate would be postponed until tomorrow at half-pa«t two, stated that the House was adjourned on Friday evening last, in con sequence of the Government having rec ived a proposition from the Opposition members in reference to tbe Abolition Bill and other matters before the House. That led to several interviews between the Government and members of the Opposition, the result of which was that it had been agreed that the Abolition Bill should pass the House this session, and that the Bill should be considered entirely upon its merits, and without offering any unreasonable opposition to its main principle, It was agreed that the Bill should come into operation one day after the close of the first session of the new Parliament. That was the concession made by the Government, and he believed hon. members acting with the Government would find that the principle of the Bili would be fully affirmed, and the Bill du'y placed upon the Statute Book. The Government had insisted upou that, and it had been complied with. Upon the question if, when the iiill should be brought into operation, they had met the views of the Opposition so far as to allow the Bill not to become law before the day named, and with regard to the discussion between the Government aud the leaders of the Opposition, he wan glad to state it had been conducted im a way that evinced a desire to expedite the busiuess of the country, and he hoped all future business would be conducted in a like manner, as they had a great deal to do before the bession ended. He hoped the results arrived at would meet the general ooncurreuce of the House.—(General applause.)

bir George Grey concurred in substance with the statement of the Native Minister. He wished to add, however, that, personally, he was not able to act in the matter with those wi'h whom, upon all other suiejects, he was united. But the agreement having been come to, he would do his best to give effect to the views expressed. For hitosoif, he could not altogether concur or acquiesce in the course taken, lie was, however, able to state that the Opposition would taiihtully carry out the arrangements, and the arrangements which had been made he should in no way interfere, object or embarrass. '

Mr Sheehan moved that the report of the Native Affairs Commiitee, on the petition of certain Natives of Hauraki district, having reference to restrictions on the sale of' land to .Maoris' representatives, and the neglect to place Maoris on thefjury lis*-, ba now taken into consideration. He wished to see some law of general application that there should not be restrictions in regard to one tribe while others had no such res' notions imposed. With regard to the latter part of the motion, he thought that, if the Hpecial representatives now g-anted :o the Natives were not increased to something like a fair proportion to a race who numbered at least 5;»,000, it might be found the better [dan to place, them at once upon an equality with the rest of Her Majesty's subjects in yegard to voting at elections and serving upon juries. '

The Native Minister said the Governm-nt tully recognUed the importance of the matters referred to. The question, however, was too large to introduce any change in the Native land laws this session. No doubt there had been a great deal of disßatisfactiom amongst the Natives on this very question. Much of this, however, was due to the works of Europeans' ■■ybo, for interested motives, made the Natives iv-oontented. 'l'ee Act. of 1873, he thought, met a immi miiuy wi' the objections, ami he thought it should be left to its opemtitm until

there was » great** necessity for cfaxiim 4m at present. The question of representee*!! HwS°h. Wuß ' orceil "Pon the Governuu-nt. at the time and lt could not be made otherwis. the direction of eee ing the Natives fulW and fairly represented, and it was with thatriew hjK n t?"^th m Th ,y Way tbe *«** ™ ine dative j outh Ihe present Maori Renreseutat.on Act exp red in 1877, and he fc.Sw that tune the Natives w nld be able to ££ to ltJi?tt n?" I™***™ 1 ™***™ who could address them u the language. With ro K ardto juries, the 14/thciau..: o. th« Act of 1868 provide, tor Maoris nerving upon juries, : ,nd they had done so in sonic instances.

Mr Takamo.iri* h->pcd the House alone would deal_ witli the matter, and not leave it to the Native Mhvsler.

Mr Katene urged that the petition ehould be referred to the Government. In reply to a question from Sir George Grey, The Native .<<imsi,er said that when the • ■overnment had considered the questien of Natives sitting ->; i juries, he would inf rm the House what action, they proposed to take. MrTaiaroa w.t- ve y much dissatisfied with tlu-preseav repree.nti.ii.m to the Maoris, lie had mo\ed or ob,ainiug more, but the House took no notice of him. In f ao t, he could see little um> in the Maoris being in the House. or his own part, he. did not intend to come back next Parliament, and he hoped no other repreßen-ntw would. Why did not Government bring ( Mi.-irßul at once it they had one. not postpone ir, tiil next session? elstt he should think they were working j.tT 'ha extinction of the Native race.

Mr Stout moved-1. That in the opinion of the House the most desirable and profitable way >to disposo of the was re lands of the Crown is by a leasing sy«em. 2. That the Government should, during the reces*, prepare a bill to gi-e effect to the above resolution. This question ruLht at present be considered a theoretical one, but he felt •hj day was not far distaut when it would become a most pressing one indeed. Although many might consider it Utopian, he had no doubt a party wauld gradually arise who would advocate the principle. The hon. gentlemen referred the House to a number modern thinkers, who, whatever their differences, all agreed in that theory—that: a nat>on should not part with its lauds, The que-iion had even been brought up in the Oa,:) Tiovineial Council and the no,ion w;is d fe.ited only by eighteen to fifteen. In Victoria, toy, some of the ablest men voted in favor of it—men who, like Grant aod 'iigi»ibot;i.i.i:i. had made the suhj»ct u special study .\t prevent a single individual could buy up all the land in a city or distriot, and by right of property could prevent auyone reni.iiii%- there, just the came .-ib wholesale < viotions ware possible in Scotland and Ireland. Looking »t the question fro-n a point of expediency, hv thought the portion ut this Colony was stronv'y m favor of the theory lie advanced, ag wot:id be se- üby the threat value the lands of the ''-> tony would reach in course of time. Th'- principle was not new, as it seemed the iiv ory was canied cut in practice by granting i' -serves (,o hdncation Boaids, Hae'<or !'.o-ir«M, •riu;ici)aiirieß, and other soci:;-.' belies, fc» v o tair these lands in their hands for ;he fO'.irpo.-o of f-.ture profit. The iion j-enUeni:tn qmoteo Iroin -'tuart Mill and MVDonald, and claimed to show the wisdom of the States ownmg the land. Taking this ColoHy, they saw the State, by making a railway near a pen-ou's land, increasing the value" of the Jand fourfold, without the owner having done anything to make his land more valuable. It might be urged that the jj.no ipl e was opposed to industry and ent.-rprjf-e, but it did not do that, for me?' would luv* wealth, and everything open to them that couM he got by exertion excepting the ownership of the soil, which he could not create. Grey, who was a gieat political writer, certainly ur>,ev' with all hig weight that the best men should enjoy the land, but experience ha<i shown that the best meu did uot eiijoy the laud. ..nd that mouopoly had nothing to do with r .rising n race of clever men. He agree.! with Emerson, who, saying that at Eiigi.shmMn born with a nice comfortable living as an inheritance larely developed into an intelW; ual light. So long' as they believed in the existing practice :n*oy could not oomplam at the wholesale evictions'which teok plaoe in Scotland and Ireland. It had been urged that if yem destroyeil the freehold system of laud agriculture would languish, as men would not display the same earnestness in improving thy laud that they would if it was their awn property ; but the facts were against that Nations had been built up and agriculture developed under the tenant Bystem. and at the present day, in the lowland- of Scotland, where ,<ome of the very beßt farming-was carried on, fa'-mere were all tenants. If the system of only leasing the land were introduced into this (Julmy, we could do without taxation altogether. if the runs ware niaced in the market open to the whole the purely pastoral runs tnigSi' be made to yield a quarter of a mil.ion rent yea.ly. I'tie rrennumß now paid to squatters showed they were at a ridiculously low rental. He estimated that the vas ! tracts in Mtago, partly pastoral and partly agricultural, ought to realise another L 160,000 yearly. Applying the same calculations to the rest of the Colony, there would be such a revenue derived that the Treasurer would absolutely not know what to do with the money. Take it from another point of view : Ought the Colony to be expending its millions for the benefit and creation of a capitalist class? While recognising the usefulness of capitalists, he iontended tho Colony was at present going in the wrong direction. We left Europe in the hope of coming to a country where the evils of the Old Country did not exist; but what was the fac*;? In Canterbury, which was held up as a model in the way of dealing with its lands, he could mention several instances where one individual owned miles of land in one block. Those who thought that when the land was sold the land question would be disposed of were entirely mistaken. That would be one of the first things to lead to an agitation on the land question. Even in America, whose lamlß might be thought illimitable, the question was assuming great importance, and eie long it must be a leading one amongst American politicians. It was urged as a difficulty against the scheme that the State could not resume possession of lands already sold. But he saw no obstacle to that that could not be overcome. In bringing forward this question, he did so only from the desire that the question should be brought under the notice of the people, with the hope that the next Parliament would take the matter up and idti.te a system which would prevent the ruinous taxation new before them. Had the originator of the gieat scheme they were now carryiug cut made the same provision for a rise in the price of land conse-iueut on the e f eoutlo !» <>f public works, he would have placed his soheme upon a comprehensive and statesman-like basis. If the Colony would but take the leaa in the matter, it would not only be setting a good example to older councils iu a great social qnestidn, but would get rid of all h'-r financial difficulties, and iuitiate a new theory of government in the system of progress such an had nut heretofore heeu Been. Mr Kowen hoped the motion would be withdrawn, because it wou'd be impossible for the Government to introduce legislation uj.on suoh a many-Hidi.d question. Although political economy proposed to regard tne greatest happiness of the greatest number, yet the science, which was comparative iy new, neglected many features in the problem that were essentia! to human happinetis; such, for instanoe, as the eeutinhmtal side. They must look to the attractiotis which brought the people here from the overcrowded countries of the old world, and one of the strongest instincts was a desire to possess a piece of the soil, and nake a homo for themsvdves and families. While admitting the great weignt of the eminent men quoted by the member for 'Daversham, it must not be forgotten they were pioneers of thought. Tbey were men feeling their way in different branches of the political science, and who, though they often sttp forward here and there, had as ofun to retrace their steps. They no doubt did great good, but it would be rash to follow them at once, wherever they led, until their theories were endorsed by the experience of the world. For instance, Herbert bpeneer wondered how constituencies would be so foolish as to send lawyers into the House of Commons as their representatives. Another point was the dan.er of creating a dead lerel, and limiting thu ambition of uien. Our anbl« tidn ought to be, give all a fair start, W«

should not say you shall reach ro far, aud no farthor. As to the owners reapine an advantage by the expenditure of Government money in rail ways, ac, and so increasing private land or property, he thought it was practically impossible to prevent persons reaping benefits from the exertions of other people. Thousands of insfctncea of this must be seen in ail the workings of industry and commerce. There was no doubt that there were conditions which would justify the State in stepping in in the. interest and for the happiness of the greatest number, but he feared that if such a scheme as that proposed were introduced, a perpttual agitation would follow, which would lead to n running sore in the conflict that would ensue between those who were fortunate enough to be occupants of Crown lauds and those who were not. The hou. member held out a dazzling prospect of the surplus wealth of the Colonial Treasury, but to him tliat appeared to be rather an evil than otherwise. It would be better to have the Treasurer to come to the tax-payer for money if he wantei it. The money would come out of the people's pocket in some way, though it might not be quite apparent, and it would be morn in accordance with their ideas that they should find the money. Mr Ballance thought the question of such importance as to call for considerable discussiou. He therefore moved the debute ba adjourned till Wednesday next. Mr Steward moved that the Interim Report of tho Reporting Debates Committee, presented on ths 14th inst., be taken into consideration. The Committee, having gone into the matter, saw only two courses open to them : either to m»:ce the practice general, and make provision accordingly ; or else prevent a few members from havi'ij. an undue advantage over others. And they nad no reason to alter their decision. The debate was adjourned at 5.30.

Last evening's sitting was entirely occupied with private business. The Bankruptcy Act Amendment Bill was read a second time.

A good deal of discussion took place on the Munioipal Corporations Act Amendment Bill, specially on tho eighth clause, which provides that no bye-law shall come into force until submitted to the Governor. This was regarded as an interference with the liberties of the people •who might be safely trusted to make their own bye-laws without the intervention of the Colonial Government. Clause postponed. Mr Stout moved, as an amendment, in the clause for the election of Mayor, that the bur genes have one vote only, irrespective of whether they hold property in other wards or not. The amendment was carried by twenty-five te nineteen.

Mr Ballance moved the second reading of the Municipal Corporations Loan Act. The Bill provides for giving borrowing powers to Municipal Corporations throughout the Colony, and the revenue of tho Colony from any claims of creditors for corporation loans.

Major Atkinson signified that the Government approved of the Bill, and said the thanks of the House were duo to the member for Bangitikei for bringing foiward so useful a measure. It was time that greater freedom should be allowed to municipal bodies throughout the Colony, and if the hon. gentlemen did not proceed beyond the second reading with hi* Bill the Government would next session bring down a measure consolidating the various Corporations Acts and also embodying the main principles of that Bill. As the opinion of the House was strongly in favor of the hon. member proceeding with his Bill this session without trusting to the Government the Bill was read a second time and ordered to be committed on Wednesday next. The House adjourned at 1.45 a.m.