PROVINCIAL COUNCIL.

Evening Star, Issue 3515, 29 May 1874, Page 3

PROVINCIAL COUNCIL.

Thursday, May 28. Mr Browne moved—“ That the pastoral leasing of lands on the Goldfields, that have been opened for agricultural purposes, is detrimental to the true settlement of the country, and at variance with the Act under which the land was thrown open ; and this Council is strongly of opinion any further leasing as above referred to should be discontinued,” —Negatived on the voices. Mr Browne moved—“That'the forest and scrub land on the Goldfields should not be alienated under the Agricultural or Residence Area Regulations, but such land should be taken up under the Forest Regulations; and that the Government be requested to give such instructions to the different officers throughout the Goldfields.”—Carried. On Mr Sumpter’s motion asking the Superintendent to take stringent measures under clauses 3 and 4 of the Adulteration of Food Act to prevent the use of deleterious drugs, the Provincial Secretary said the Government had in contemplation the appointment of an officer who would undertake this work in connection with hia other duties. The Otago Roads Ordinance, 1871, Amendment Bill* and the Clyde Corporation Borrowing Powers Extension Bill, were read a fihizd timd and passed. \

At the evening sitting, the Provincial Secretary moved that the House should go into Committee to consider the following resolutions : That this Council having considered his Honor's Message Mo. 10, relative to the construction of certain lines of railway, and recommending that application be made to the General Assembly to raise a loan for that purpose, Resolved—- “ Ist. That a respectful Address be presented to his Honor the Superintendent, recommending that application be made to the General Government to introduce a Bill to the General Assembly, at its next session, to raise a loan of not exceeding L5C0,000, on special security to be given by the Province, such loan to be expended m constructing railways and other necessary works within the Province. , of der to give special security to tne Colonial Government for the repayment or the loan, an area of acres of waste lands be set apart; and until the loan has been repaid, the revenue arising from the sale or rents of the lands set apart as security shall be paid from time to [time in liquidation of the charges on the loan as they may arise; but Jh® lands set apart as security shall be liable to be sold and disposed of in the same manner in all respects as other waste lands of the Crown, and shall be subject to any laws which may be in force for the disposal of lands, either by sale on deferred payments or for special settlements. The proceeds of sales or leases of land set apart as security to be paid to a separate account, and to be applied towards payment of the interest falling due on the moneys raised, and to a repayment of onetwentieth in each year of the principal sum of such moneys. “ 3rd. That the construction of the lines already authorised, and for which contracts have been accepted, be prosecuted during the current year, payment to be made from revenue or loan.

4th. That surveys and estimates in detail of the following lines be prepared during the cecess; and that in the event of a loan being sanctioned, the Government be authorised to invite tenders and to accept contracts for their construction provided the tenders are within the estimated cost: - Length in Amt. Allies. Main line through ‘I Seaward Bush ... 10 £20,000 Waipahi to Tapanui Main Line to Kaitangata and ex- Total cost tension to Coal ready for , Point 10 27,750}- Rolling Mam Line to Out- Stock ai ram . 4 12,000 approxiI okoxnainro Branch matelv. Railway 5 14,000 J Palmerston to Waihemo 10 25,000 Edendale to WyndLam/ 3 10,500 J ‘‘ sth. That surveys of the following lines be undertaken as soon as practicable, with a view to the sanction of the Council being obtained to their construction ; Length , in Miles. Otautau to Night Cap Coalfields 15 Lawrence to Teviot ' 40 Orepuki to Waiau " . 14 Waihemo to Clyde . Kaitangata Station to Inch Clutha An amendment, moved by Mr Browne, that the resolutions should not be considered until the balance sheet and estimates were before the Council, having been negatived, the Provincial Secretary remarked that he thought it would be generally conceded that it was desirable to obtain a loan to carry out the proposed works. It was recognised throughout the Province that it was desirable to connect with the main branch railwaps districts likely to be thickly settled by means of branch railways. That being conceded, it was quite clear that it could not be done without either, on the one hand, forcing the lands into the market—and even then they could not be sure of obtaining purchasers—or, on the other hand, entering the market to secure a loan The feeling of the Council would be against the sale of pastoral lands, even if they were sure of purchasers. Of course, they had to take into account the probabilities of a loan bsing obtained ; but at the same time, if they went to the Assembly, offering a good security, and with an expression of opinion from the Council in any degree unanimous, he did not think they need despair of a loan being granted. Those works formed a part tf the colonising scheme at present being carried out by the Colonial Government, and they had experience of what was done in 1872, when the North Otago District Loan was passed on security similar to that now offered. Referring to the security they proposed to offer—-more particularly referred to in the second resolution—he proposed to fill in the first blank in that resolution with the words “2,070,423 acres.” The laud had been selected so as not to interfere with any reserves which had already been set apart for educational and other purposes, and the reserve of that land in the manner proposed would not in any way debar the Province from dealing with it as was done with the security for the North Otago Loan. The present revenue from this area of land in the shape of rents was L 22,529, which would be ample security. While there might be sales of certain portions and no doubt there would be sales of certaiu portions—of this area from time to time, it would be ample to form a safe security for the Colony. Again, the value of the laud would be increasing, inasmuch as some of the pastoral leases would fall in in 1878, and no doubt when the land was re-let it would be still- better security for the Colony. The points he wished the Council to confine themselves to were : was it desirable to raise a loan for the purpose of constructing these railways 2 and, if so, to what extent/ and on what terms? The other matters would have to be taken up as consequences of the first resolutions. An objection had been raised in some quarters that the Province might rush into those works too hurriedly, and might perhaps expend the whole of the money at once, while in reality the money could not be profitably expended in a shorter period than five or six years, and he know that such apprehensions were entertained by some who would have a, share in the final determination of this matter. In order to meet such an objection he would add the following words to the first resolution “Such loan to be raised from time to time as may be required for the construction of railways and works to be approved, and to be extended over a period of not less than live years.” Mr Gillies feared the resolutions from their wording would not obtain the confidence of the Assembly. ‘ ‘ And other necessary works ” was too indefinite, and with the view of removing that serious objection be moved that the latter part of the first resolution should read “Such loan to be expended in constructing branch lines of railways within the Province ” Several members opposed the addition of the proposed words as unnecessary, and the Provincial Secretary, in replying io many of the arguments brought forward, said not the Province, but the General Government were to raise the loan, and receive security over the lands mentioned in the second resolution. It would be disastrous for the Provinces to enter the money market and compete with the Colony. LIOO.OOO was only required at present, but they asked to borrow the 1500,000 extending over five years. If the Council demanded a specific schedule of the works to be constructed, and the precise sum required for those works, it could not be done this year. • The Government had approximate estimates, which it was believed would cover the cost Of the works under the fourth resolution. They wished to show to

the Colonial Governmentthat schedules would be produced from year to year of the specific works to which the loan was to be applied, and this was the principle upon which the Bill would be prepared. If the argument that the Province should not undertake any main lines were adopted, this princ p e had been departed from in the line from Invercargill to Orepuki. It was difficult to say where main lines ended and branch lines began. Mr Gillies contended that the Government could not come down year by year with the works to be done, because they had provided for the absorption of the whole of the loan, and they would have cast upon them the responsibilty of providing for other works that might be initiated out of the general revenue, and by the sacrifice of the lauds for Settlement. The risk he spoke of was rendered doubly great by leaving the resolution in its present form, Sooner than see the sacrifice of the pastoral land, he would rather not have these works constructed at all. Mr Bastings had hoped a redaction of the amount to L100,00l) would have been moved. Half a million was not required now, and he "did not think the Government sincere in their statement that they expected the General Assembly to give them that amount. He had always advocated the policy of the construction of railways; but there was a medium, and it was unwise t:> rush into the market at the present time with large public works. During the last year there had b-en an increase in wages, and however much the Government tried to disguise the fact, the lands would be sacrificed in large blocks, in order to complete their public works. The General Government should be urged to go en with the construction of the lines from Lawrence to the Clyde and from Balclutha to Mataura. Mr Gillies, after consulting with the Provincial Secretary, withdrew his amendment, with a view to the substitution of the following addition to the motion : —“ Provided that no works shall be included iu the Bill authorising the raising of the loan except such works as have been sanctioned by this Council. ” The resolution as amended was agreed toon a division, the voting being Ayes, 27 ; Noes, 8. Progress was then reported, and leave obtained to sit next day.

Friday, May 29, The Goldfields Committee reported on the petition of Kirton and party, who prayed for a reward for the discovery of the Orepuki goldfield ; and on the petition of John Aldred, who prayed for a reward as the prospector of the Longwood goldfield—that the petitioners had no claim on the Government. The Private Petitions Committee reported on the petition of John Gantley—ffiat the petitioner left the police service some eighteen months ago, and made no application through the proper channel for retiring allowance; and therefore he had no grievance to be remedied by the Council. On the. petition of'certain town c unpanies of Volunteers, who prayed for the granting of land certificates under the Volunteer Land Act—the committee recommended the granting of the petitioners’ prayer subject to the recommendations of the Council in June, 1871, viz , that the Act should be altered so as to allow the issue of certificates conditionally on onethird of the land being cleared and cultivated within three years from the date of the certificate; as soon as the c nditions are fulfill d a Crown grant to issue ; in the event oc them not being fulfilled within the time specified the certificate to be cancelled. In reply to questions, the Government said (I.) That the papers asked for with regard to the light railways would probably be laid on the table on Monday, The Provin cial Solicitor’s opinion with re pect to the compulsory residence of licensees under deferred payments might be laid on the table during the day. fie (Mr Reid) could not say whether the statement of the revenue and expenditure of Southland would be laid on the table in time to be bound up with the '■mtes and proceedings of the preseut session. (2.) The balance-sheet was never lost, and consequently could never have been found. It was substantially made out, but, owing to a small discrepancy in one of the subsidiary accounts, had not been brought up. If this discrepancy were not traced, the balance-sheet would be laid be fore the Council on Monday along with the Estimates (3) The Government were not aware that the revenue collected in the Waitahnna district, under ordinances, as described in the schedule in the Local Revenue Ordinance, 1872, had been paid to the Lawrence Municipal Council. It had been collected and paid into the Provincial Treasury. (4.) It was the intention of the Government to remove the police camp from its present position at V*aitahuna to the township of Havelock, but they did not know whether the sura on the .Estimates would be sufficient for the purpose. (5.) That it was a condition of the sale of turnpikes that the expense of preparing the leases should be borne by the lessees, and it would be unfair to those who were unsuccessful bidders were the Govern* ment now to pay for preparing them. In answer to Mr J. C. Brown's question—- “ If the Government will afford any explanati >n with regard to the truth or otherwise of a report now current that a sura of L7OO has been lost to the treasury of the Province” —the Provincial Secretary replied that the questioner had not done himself justice, and he (Mr Reid) was at a loss to know what was the subject on which an explanation was a-ked. No doubt that bon (member would be greatly pained were anything prejudicial to the Government to happen, or them to be lowered in the estimation of anyone. Mr Brown retorted by saying that he thought his explanation in asking his question was sufficiently intelligible. During a debate a few days ago this matter was referred to, and it was stated in reference to the leasing of some lauds on that particular day that the conditions of sale before the day of sale contained a provision that a certain rate of interest would be charged purchasers ; but that when the conditions were read on the day of sale that provision was omitted—(Mr Kisu : Hear)—which resulted in a loss to the Government of something like L7OO. To which the Provincial Secretary replied that he now understood what was meant. Before the hon. member oould make out there had been a loss to the Province he first required to show that the Province had gained something. It was true the advertisement stated interest would be charged, but the conditions of sale read at the auction were the terms upon which the land was sold ;and the persons purchasing would not be so blind as to give as much if they had to pay interest, as they would give when giving a given sum, and be free from interest. It would require a little more to inform hon. members that the Government had lost L7OO. It was perhaps an oversight that mention of interest was made in the advertisement : he did not know how it came to be put in, though he himself signed the advertisement. He did not believe 700 pence had been lost. Permission to do so having been given, Mr Fish asked the Government to state whether it was an omission on the part of the Government that the conditions of sale contained the clause that interest would be charged, or whether it was a result afterwards arrived at that interest should not be attached to the conditions of sale. The Provincial Secretary replied that the matter had no bearing upon the subject, and he declined to be dictated to. Mr Fish : Then I shall put the question on Monday. The Provincial Secretary ; And I will answer it if I think fit. I [Left flitting.]