THE NO-CONFIDENCE DEBATE.

Evening Star, Issue 2996, 25 September 1872, Page 4

THE NO-CONFIDENCE DEBATE.

We continue Mr Ormond’s speech : IMMIGRATION. • The next question upon which I wish to say a few words is that of immigration. And in the first place, I desire to deny, simply and absolutely, that the arrangements of the Government in respect to immigration are m any way deserving of blame. The Government docs not admit any such propo ition, and I think, Sir, that those who are prepared to review fairly the whole action which has been taken in connection with this subject of immigration, cannot justly bring any such charge against the Government. When they consider the time which has elapsed since the House was last in session, when the carrying on of immigration devolved upon the Colonial Government ; when they consider that it was in November last that immigration became a Colonial work, and that, as the papers before the House will show, when the AgentGeneral first received instructions it was almost impossible to obtain any immigrants from Great Britain, I think it will be seen that those honorable members are altogether wrong who censure the Government in respect to their conduct of immigration. The greatest blame which has been attached to the Government has been in respect to the Otago branch of immigration ; and the principal item of censure there was the fact that some Scotch immigrants Avere taken to London, instead of, as was formerly the case, their being sent by direct ship to Otago. The Government have already expressed their regret that such a course should have been necessary, but up to the present time they have abstained from doing that which I am now going to do, namely, to state the reasons Avhich caused the Agent-General to take the action Avhich he did. If, it had been a mere matter of blaming the Government, I should not read the letter which I am now about to place before the House, because it somewhat reflects upon firms of high standing at home, and its publication may possibly interfere with future communications betAveen the Agent-General and those firms ; but it has been Avrohgly stated by honorable members that the AgentGeneral has been to blame in this matter, and it has been still more Avrongly stated that the Government coincide in attributing blame to the Agent-General. It is due to the Agent-General that the information I am going to furnish should be given, and but for that, the letter would not have been made use of by the Government, The first object of the Agent-General, Avhen he received instructions to make arrangements for sending out immigrants, A\ r as to endeavour to reduce the cost of passage to the Colony. The House will agree that it Avas the duty of the Agent>-Gencral, whpn the Colony was

entering upon a large system of immigration, to see to that as one of the first matters to which he should direct his attention. I will, in the first instance, refer to one of the printed papers on the table of the House, to show that the Agent-General was not only fully alive to the subject, but lhat he also thoroughly apprehended that it was only right that he should give every fair consideration to those linns who had been long connected with the Colony and its immigration—Shaw, Savillc, and Co., and Messrs Hebert Henderson and Co. The AgentGeneral writes as follows, under date the Bth February, 187*2 “'lhe Government are aware that nearly the whole of the emigration to New Zealand from London has been for many years in the hands of Messrs Shaw, Saville, and Co., and that Messrs Henderson and Co. have, almost ever since the foundation of Otago (with the exception, I believe, of an interval of two years), conducted the emigration from Glasgow to Dunedin. This monopoly has enabled these two firms to charge whatever they thought tit, whether for emigrants or cargo. j ‘•With the prospect of a large emigration and of the shipment of large quantities of railway plant, and with the certainty that almost all (if not all) the ships despatched to New Zealand will secure return cargoes, it seem unreasonable that the past rates should

be maintained. All attempts (and they have been many) hitherto made to break up the I monopoly have failed, No sooner does a linn start, or propose to start, a line, than Messrs Shaw, Saville, and Co., either buy them off, by undertaking to charter their vessels, or induce them to abandon their opposition, by threatening to reduce the freights to a rate that could not possibly pay. They have done this more than once since my arrival in England. It is only right to add that the two fums I have mentioned have performed the emigration service so efficiently and satisfactorily, that I have felt myself bound to use my best endeavors to induce them to continue the service on terms demanded by the change of circumstances. The concessions they are disposed' to make I d.em wholly inadequate, or, rather, no concessions at all. “ I have, therefore, recently visited Glasgow, Newcastle, I iverpool, and Bristol, explained to leading linns in each town the large operations in which the New Zealand Government are engaged, the resources of the Colon}', and the magnitude of the trade now being developed, with the. view of inducing them to enter into the field. “ Some of them have promised to send in tenders for the conveyance of both emigrants and railway plant. What the result may be remains to be seen. 1 ’

I quote that to show that the AgentGeneral fully recognised the claims of Messrs Henderson and Co., in common with the other firms who had carried out their duties satisfactorily, although they charged as much as they could possibly charge. A few linns only sent in tenders, as the result of these efforts of the Agent-General. I will now read extracts from the letter of the AgentGeneral, reporting the means which' these linns took to secure to themselves the monopoly of the trade to this Colony. He says, writing from Hamburgh on the 24th Mav, 1872 : “ 1 detailed so fully iu those letters the steps I had taken to induce leading firms in some of the chief shipping ports in the United Kingdom to enter into the New Zealand trade, .and to undertake the emigration service, that it seems unnecessary for me to travel over the same ground ; but there are one or two points to which it may perhaps be well that 1 should again refer iu elucidation of the difficulties I had to contend with.

“ Although several linns promised to tender, only three really did so, and these in collusion with one another. It Avas arranged or understood between them that the emigration from Scotland was to he left in the hands of Messrs Patrick Henderson and Co., of

Gibbs, Bright Brothers were to obtain the contract for emigration from England, they were to hand it over to Messrs Shaw, Savilie a nd Co., in consideration of receiving a commission on every transaction connected with it. “ After I had rejected the tenders sent in under this arrangement, but especially after it had come to their knowledge that I might possibly find shipping outside the United Kingdom, they seem to have become distrustful of one another, and at last opened up separate and independent negotiations with me, “When Messrs Shaw, Savilie and Co. finally closed with the terms I offered, Messrs Gibbs, Bright Brothers, in very unmistakable terms, declared that they had been sold, while Messrs Shaw, Savilie and Co., on the other hand, maintained that, after my rejection of the cooked tenders, they were perfectly free to act on their own hook, irrespective of any previous arrange* ments or understandings with Messrs Gibbs, Bright Brothers, You have already been advised that I was obliged to come overbore in the month of February, in consequence of Mr Sloman demurring to the draft prepared by Mr Mackrell, and that it was only after some considerable difficulty that the contract was executed.

“You will probably be rather surprised, but nevertheless amused, to learn that the day before it was executed, a special commissioner arrived here from Messrs Shaw, Savilie and Co., and offered Mr Sloman, in consideration of his refusing to sign it, ‘ a much larger sum’—to quote Mr Sloman’s own words—‘than he (Mr Sloman) could reasonably expect to make out of the contract.’ “ Mr Sloman’s answer simply was, ‘ I have given my wordand thereupon Messrs Shaw, Savilie and Co.’s special commissioner sloped,” Mr Stafford ; Is that a private or an official letter ? Mr Ormond : It is an official letter, and I have read it in justice to the Agent-Genetal, He has been blamed for having made arrangements by which the Scotch immigrants were transmitted to London and shipped from thence instead of from Scotland ; but I hold that the action he has taken has been in the interests of the Colony, that it has been fully justified, and that no other course was open to him. The result of the negotiations to which these letters refer was, that the contract price with Messrs Shaw, Savilie, and Co. was reduced to Ll3 ; the contract with Messrs was Ll4 for each single woman, and LlO for each other adult; while the tender of Messrs Henderson and Co. was Ll4 5s to Ob'go, and Ll4 15s to other ports. The Agent General offered Messrs Shaw, Savillej and Co.’s price, but the firm refused those terms. My own belief is, that the actiomof the Agent-General will not only result in his

having refin ed the cost of passages for immigrants brought out to iSew Zealand by Shaw, Saville, and Co , but that the Otago people will see their service re-established, and at a proper price, and if that is done, it will be through the action of the AgentGeneral. When statements are made by many honorable members that immigration has been a failure, it is well to look at what has been done. The instructions to the Agent-General were sent in October, and be did not receive them until the end of December. The House will be fully aware that there is a season for emigration as there is a season for everything else ; that people arc not in the habit ol leaving Europe, certainly not Great Britain, or Germany, or Scandinavia, during the winter months, and that the Agent-General was necessarily unable to promote immigration to any appreciable extent for a period of some four months after he received his instructions. It is well to inquire what result has the Colony got from the immigration which has been conducted by the Colonial Government ? 2,578 souls have arrived or are on their way to the Colony, and a vessel for each principal port in New Zealand is to follow in the course of the present month, bringing some 1 5(10 more, while the settlers in the Colony have nominated 1,514 immigrants. The class of immigrants who have arrived have been, by accounts, good, and suited to the wants and requirements of the Colony. That is the result of the w rk of the Agent-General within the very limited time which he has had to give effect to the instructions of t ie House last session. Honorable members are altogether wrong in blaming him, and instead of doing so, they will be themselves to blame if they do not admit that the Agent-General has done his duty, and done it very fairly indeed. (To he continued.)