PROVINCIAL COUNCIL.

Evening Star, Issue 2888, 22 May 1872, Page 2

PROVINCIAL COUNCIL.

Yesterday. provincial administration. Mr Tolmie moved— *• That in view of the radical changes about to be effected in the administration of the affairs of the Province by the introduction of such measures as the Counties and Road Districts Ordinances, this Council is of opinion—That the present system of responsible government should be abolished as cumbersome, and calculated to retard business. “ That for the future the Government of the Province should be carried on by a Board, to consist of the Superintendent and members of the Council (to be nominated for that purpose by the Council: such Board to meet two days in the week (or oftener, if necessary); that the Superintendent act as chairman of such Board, or in his absence a chairman to he elected as hereafter provided. “ That the proceedings of the Board be duly minuted and signed by the Superintendent, or in his absence by the chairman to be elected as provided in the following resolution.’’

[. he remainder of the resolutions had reference to matters of detail. The seventh provided that all money payments shall be made under the authority of the Superintendent. and countersigned by two menibers of the Board.] Speaking in support ,of his motion, the hon, member remarked that, as it was evident to all, Provincial institutions and resources were being curtailed from time to time. It would be well, therefore, to curtail in time their various administrative machinery. He considered that the duties devolving on the Superintendent of this Province were nut greater or more responsible than were those devolving upon the head of various banking and mercantile firms. As to the various members of the Executive, it led to much confusion. If a person wanted to see the Government about auy particular matter, he had now to see the Superintendent, then one and another member of the Executive before he had seen every link of the chain upon which tne result he wished to bring about had been accomplished. Under the system he proposed, it would simply be necessary to see the Superintendentj and one would know the opinions and intentions of the Government at once. The Hon. Mr Holmes seconded the motion.

Mr Macassey moved as an amendment—- “ Ist. That this Council shall consist of not more than nineteen members, who shall be elected for, and returned by, the electoral districts created by the .Representation Act, 1870, and Amendment Act, 1871. 2nd. That the Executive Council shall consist of not more than two members of this Council, in addition to his Honor the Superintendent.” In speaking in support of his amendment, the bon. member pointed out that the original motion, while professing to upset one system of responsible government, in fact set up another, by retaining power in the Provincial Council to nominate certain members of the proposed Government; and he presumed that the members thus nominated would be held responsible to the Council, so that it would be essentially the same system in another shape. Our Provincial institutions were too gigantic and too expensive, and he would like to see them brought into reasonable extent, if they were not to be abolished altogether. He thought his amendment, if carried, would have this effect. Mr Lnmsden would oppose both motion and amendment; and when the proper time came, he would himself move an amendment that he thought would better meet the requirements of the case. The Provincial Secretary concurred that the principles contained in the original motion were really such as were at present in operation, the only difference being that, under the system proposed, it was to be fixed by Ordinance how often the Executive should meet, and that when they did meet, his Honor the Superintendent was to take the chair. But it so happened, as a matter of fact, his Honor the Superintendent did take the chair, aud the Executive never mat until there were real necessity. The hon. member disputed the statement that there was any fair comparison between the duties devolving on the Executive aud those discharged by banking and mercantile institutions. He would oppose any reduction of the present number of members of the Provincial Council, and also any interference with the present system of responsible government. The Hon. Mr M'Lean thought nothing could be likely to result from the passing of the original motion, but hardly thought either of them was really necessary. Still, if the amendment were pat as against the original motion, he would certainly vote for it. Mr M'Glashan was in favor of the amendment ; Mr Mervyn would oppose motion and amendment; Mr Eastings would support the amendment; Mr Hutcheson would oppose motion aud amendment; Mr Bathgate also would oppose both. Mr Shepherd favored any arrangement by which local self-government could be given to outlying districts, and by which a large portion of the legislative functions of the Council could be taken from it by the General Government. Mr Reynolds wo v ld support the amendment, because he believed that with a Council of nineteen members the affairs of the Province would be much better conducted.

A Council of nineteen members would give the electors a better opportunity of choosing representatives, and possibly tlmce fourths of the present members Immvlf included, Would not find scats; and ho believed a touch better class of representatives would be returned. - (Laughter.) Throughout the Province there had been given expressions of opinion that the present system was too cumbersome and expensive, and a general wish that the number of members should he reduced and the legislation of the Council simplified. Mr Tolmie, in replying, took exception to the remarks of some members, and the hon. member for Waikari in particular, that it was not intended by his resolutions to make the Board he proposed to form responsible to the Council. His intention was that they should be. The resolutions, crude as they were, had had this advantage : they had elicited a certain amount of discussion which might go for nothing at the present time ; but there had been expressions of opinion from several hon. members which deserved great consideration, and those remarks would not be allowed to pass unnoticed by the outside public. When he brought down the resolutions, be had no idea that they would be passed ; at the same time they had served their purpose, and he was pleased that the question had received the attention it had.

The question that the words proposed to be omitted stand part of the question, was negatived on the voices ; and Mr Macassey’s motion was put, with the following result: —

Ayes, 13. —Messrs Basstian, Bastings, Bell Clark, Holmes (teller), Macassey (teller), M‘Glashan, M'Lean, Reynolds, fehand, Shepherd, Tolmie, and Webster. Noos, 23. Messrs Allan, Armstrong, Barr, Bathgate, Bradshaw, Browne, G. F. C, Daniel. Green, Henderson, Hickey, Hutcheson, Innes, Lumsden, Menzies. Mervyn (teller), Mnllison, M‘Arthur, M'Dernnd, M ‘Kenzie, Reid, Smith, Sumpter, Thomson (teller). THE CHINESE PETITION, The Speaker again brought under the notice of the Council the request of the Select Committee to whom the Chinese Petition, presented by Mr Macassey was referred, that it have leave to summon from Queenstown as witnesses Messrs Bcetham, G. B. Barton, Hayes, and Alloo, at a probable cost of LIOO ; and asked for an expression of opinion by the Council in reference thereto. , , . , , Mr Reynolds (who had just been prevented from giving a notice of motion by the Speaker rising): Sir, Ib: g to call your attention to the state of the clock, [lt was just past the half hour.] The Speaker : When the Speaker stands up all members must occupy their seats. The honorable member will therefore be good enough to resume his seat. —(Laughtei*) The Speaker being about to put the quesIdr Reynolds : I protest against the Council being called upon to vote an expenditure of LIOO without having sufficient time to discus? the question. Mr Shepherd : Can a motion be discussed when it is put by the Chair ? Mr Reynolds : Ceitainly it can. The Speaker: The matter has already been discussed, and was postponed to receive the decision of the Council when there was a fuller attendance of member ß - I think the Standing Orders simply eay I am to get the opinion of the Council. 1 am simply asking for a direction ~ „ , Mv Reynolds ; The Standing Orders say that at half-past five the Speaker shall leave the chair. The Speaker : I wish to get at an expression of opinion as to whether this expenditure shall be incurred. Those who are in

favor ~ , Mr Bell: Ido not think, sir, you are bound to insist upon the question being decided before the members make up their minds upon it. I see no necessity why it should be proceeded with immediately, and for one shall object to it. _ _ Mr Thomson also expressed his intention to vote against the proposition, if pressed. Ultimately it was agreed to adjourn the matter till seven o’clock, _ On the Council resuming at that hour, the Speaker brought the matter up again. After some discussion, the following rcsolution was passed:—“ That in the opinion of this Council it is undesirable that the witnesses which it is proposed to summon from Queenstown, should be summoned; that the Committee be discharged ; and the allegations contained in the petit on be investigated by the Government during the recess.” the financial statement Mr Thomson, in criticising the statement, referred to the necessity that existed foi devisin" ft scheme by which the encroachments of the General Government could be prevented, The change in the policy of the Government in reference to the imposition of school taxes and the sale of land at 10s per acre was owing to the pressure on tbe 1 rovincial revenues, in tact all owing to the great scheme of the General Government. Dr. Webster presumed that it was necessity that induced the Government to put it for sale at 10s an acre. The fact of the lands remaining unsold for seven years was proof they were not worth LI an acre. Mr M'Dermid regretted that the Government had not made an effort to find a remedy for the absorption of their revenues by the North Islaud. Mr Keid failed to understand what remedial measures could be devised. Did the member for Port Chalmers mean that the Province should rebel, for that was the only measure that would relieve them from their contribution to the revenues of the country ? He was not a party to the passing of the Payment to Provinces Act, and could not be charged with being one of those who Lad encouraged the General Government scheme. The proposal to levy school rates was not a matter of necessity. It was a measure which ought to have been in operation since the alteration was made in the Ordinance, The House then resolved itself into COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY, When considerable progress was made with the Estimates. On the item ‘ ‘ Commissioner of Police, L 400,” Mr Daniel moved its increase to L 50 0; but the Chairman pointed out that the item placed on the Estimates could only be reduced. In the course of the discussion that ensued several members urged the desirability of the pay of the police being restored to its former amount. Ultimately Mr Daniel agreed to bring on a motion that the items he referred to the previous evening should be increased by a sum to he placed on the Supplementary Estimates.

This Dav. The Speaker took the chair at 2 p.m. Several petitions were presented and received. NOTICES. Seventeen notices of questions and motions were given. PAPERS LAID ON THE TABLE. The Provincial Secretary laid on the table a circular respecting the employrmnt of Chinese on the public works of the Colony ; and also a report from the Rector of the High School of Otago. NEW BILL. The Provincial Solicitor laid on the table a Bill to be intituled “ The Education Ordinance 1872.” The Bill was read a first time, ordered to be printed, and its second reading made an Order of the Day for next sitting. REPLIES TO QUESTIONS. 11l reply to Mr Green, the Secretary for Works stated it would not bo possible for the Government to complete the formation of the road from Port Chalmers to Blucskin during the present financial year, as they were not in a position to expend the amount that the work would cost. In reply to Mr Green’s question—when he expected the road Dunedin to Blneskin, via Water of Leith, to be open for dray traffic ? —the Secretary for Works replied that the Government were very anxious to complete the work as soon as they wi re able, bu*. it would cost close upon L2OOO, and besides that, as the line passed through private property, negotiations would have to be carried on with the owner of the land; so that he could not fix the exact date when the road would be open for traffic. [ eft sitting.]