AN INCREASED VOTE

Evening Post, Volume CXIV, Issue 120, 17 November 1932, Page 11

AN INCREASED VOTE

LABOUR. OPPOSITION

AMENDMENT DEFEATED

Strong criticism of the Naval Defence Vote of £400,800 was indulged' in by Labonr members of the House of Eepresentatives last evening. Exception -was taken to the fact that the vote was' bigger by £6377 than last year, but it was explained on behalf of the Government that last year's expenditure had been considerably reduced by credits resnlting from the sale of oil to Australia and that the estimated expenditure this year • was actually less than the amount voted last year. Government members took up the attitude that New Zealand was paying very little for naval defence compared with the amount paid by taxpayers of the United Kingdom. As a protest against the apparent increase, the Rev. C. Carr ,_ (Labour, Timaru) moved that the vote be reduced to the amount expended last year, but after a discussion, at times rather heated, the amendment was lost on the voices, the Opposition not forcing the matter to a division. Some members of the Labour^ Party termed the New Zealand Division a "comic opera navy," but this view was vigorously opposed from the Government benches, it being stated that the ships were capable of successfully engaging any foreign vessels of their own class. Mr. W. E. Barnard (Labour, Napier) said he- noticed that repairs to the Diomede were to be carried out at the dockyard at Auckland, and he would like to know how much work it was proposed to do, and if the vote of £4000 would be sufficient to cover the cost. It was very satisfactory to know that the Government proposed to spend as much, money as possible within the Dominion. The cost of sending ,the warships to England for overhaul was very great. Mr. Barnard said that one might be loth to criticise -the Naval Defence Vote, but it had to be admitted that .there, had been a very considerable increase compared with last year. He supposed that the fighting value of the New Zealand fleet was not very great, and he hopecl the Government would give some consideration to the possibility'of reducing the number of vessels that were maintained in the New Zealand squadron. • Mr. C. A. Wilkinson (independent, Egmont) inquired as to the length of the agreement between the- New Zealand Government and the Imperial Government. An inquiry was made by Captain H. M. Eushworth (Country Party, Bay of Islands) as to the extent of air training given, in the New Zealand Navy. IF WAR AROSE. ' In. confirming the statement that repairs to the Diomede were to be carried out at Auckland, the Minister of Defence (the Hon. J. G. Cobbe) said sthat it was now the policy of the Government to- spend as much money as possible within the Dominion. Eeferling to the fighting value of the New Zealand squadron, the Minister said that it was absolutely necessary that a certain number of warships should be maintained. There were quite a number of islands in the Pacific which, it was the duty of the New Zealand Navy to control. Up to the present no good reason had been shown why the number of warships should be reduced. Mr. Barnard: It is really a police squadron. - • ; The Minister: You may call it that if you wish, but I have no doubt if war arose it would render excellent service. Mr. Cobbe added that the term of the agreement with Great Britain was indefinite. There had -certainly been an increase in the vote this year, but that was almost entirely accounted for by the extra expense incurred in connection with the Dunedin. The Navy did not specialise in aerial training, but they had the help of one Fairey aeroplane at Auckland, which was associated with the warships in manoeuvres, and it was intended to purchase a second Fairey machine. A HOSTILE AMENDMENT. . The Eev. Clyde Carr (Labour, Timaru) entered an emphatic protest against the increase in the vote. The increase was most inconsistent if they intended to honour their signature to the Pact of Paris. It was totally inconsistent that they should be increasing the Naval Vote at such a time as the present. He moved that the vote be reduced from £400,800 to £394,045, the amount of the vote last year. If the public of New Zealand were sufficiently educated, he would move the total elimination of the vote. The Minister of Public Works (the Eight Hon. J. G. Coat'es) said he considered that the amendment was quite unjustified. When they thought of what had been contributed by the British taxpayer to keep the trade routes open, when they remembered that the taxation per head in- Britain for naval defence was something like 30s as against between 7s and 8s a head in New Zealand, surely the least they could do was to maintain the cruisers which they had agreed to maintain. The increase in the vote was purely for the purpose of making provision for maintenance—maintenance - of equipment for which New Zealand had become responsible by • agreement. He ■thought Mr. Carr should reconsider his action, and he was sure many Labour members did not wish to do other than carry out the terms of the agreement.. ACTUALLY A DISCOVERY. The Minister of defence claimed that there had been a considerable reduction in the vote for naval defence during recent years, although this year there was an increase of £6000 owing to the absence of the eredits-in-aid arising out of the scale of oil to Australia last year. Actually there was a decrease in. expenditure. "lam sorry -that'any New Zealander should stand up in this House and talk about wiping out the British Navy," added the Minister. -•• According ~o Mr. W. A. Veitch (Government, Wanganui), if Mr. Carr had his way and the Estimates were wiped out altogether, the stage would be reached where it would be possible for a canoe containing half a dozen Chinese to com© up the Wellington Harbour and take possession of the city. No doubt the member for Timaru would meet them on the wharf with a typewriter and call upon his colleagues to passa resolution. The enemy would immediately turn, back and New Zealand would again be safe I Mr. D. G. Sullivan (Labour, Avon) declared that Mr. Veitch .had put up a straw man for the purpose of knocking it down again. The question before the House was merely a proposed reduction in the vote. NO REFLECTION ON COUNTRY. '"It is no reflection on this country to suggest a reduction in naval def enco" ■was the contention of Mr. H; T. Armstrong (Labour, Christchurch East), who pointed out that there had been substantial reductions in the United Kingdom and that the National Expenditure Commission had suggested cuts in New Zealand. Mr. Veitch had sought to convey the impression that Mr. Carr wished to wipe out the vote altogether. Mr.-G. E. Sykes (Labour, Masterton): lie said so. . Mr. Carr: He did not. ' ' Mr» Armstrong declared that -the-ships

being maintained by New Zealand were not worth a "twopenny tart." If the Dominion were attacked by an outside Power it would have to depend entirely on the British Navy for its defence. He would sooner sco a subsidy to the British Navy increased than continue the present "comic opera" in New Zealand. \ Mr. Carr said that if it was the policy to reduce, as circumstances permitted, the Naval Defenco Vote, then he would bo willing t_. withdraw his amendment. Mr. H. S. S. Kyle (Government, Eiecarton) expressed astonishment that a member representing a seaport constituency such as ' \inuru should be advocating a reduction iv the Naval Vote. SHIPS ARE OBSOLETE. The Leader of tho Opposition (Mr. H. E. Holland), in declaring that Mr. Carr had been misrepresented, said that the Dunedin and Diomede were obsolete, and even if they were not obsolete they would not be able to defend New Zealand. If this country waa to be attacked, it would be attacked by fleets of airships laden .with poison gas bombs. In the opinion of Mr. W. P. Endean (Government, Paraell) ■ the critics of naval defence did not know what they wero talking about. He pointed out that the Philomel was not intended to go to sea—that vessel acted as a depot ship. He urged that provision be made for enabling New Zealand youths to take up a sea career, and said that there should be sufficient seamen trained in New Zealand to enable a branch of the Eoyal Naval Reserve to be established.

Mr. Carr's amendment was lost on the voices.