GAMING AMENDMENT BILL, NO. 2

Dominion, Volume 14, Issue 27, 27 October 1920, Page 8

GAMING AMENDMENT BILL, NO. 2

COUNCIL REVERBES ITS

DECISION

POWER TO INCREASE PERMITS

RESTORED

Tho recommittal of the Gaming Amendment Bill (No. 2) was moved in the Legislative Council yesterday by Sit Francis Bell, who proposed that tho Council should reconsider its amendment of the measure.

The Bill as passed by the Lower House provided for the setting up of a commission to investigate the questions whether the number of totalisator permits allowed to-day should be increased, and whether there should be a redistribution of permits. In the event of the Commission's recommending an increase in the number of permits, the Government was to have the power to net -upon the recommendation, but its action was to be_subject to review by Parliament early next se.ssion. The .Council decided, on Friday last, that the Government should not lie Riven the proposed power, and the Bill was amended accordingly. Beasons For Recommittal, Sir Francis Bell 6aid he felt it was only <lu« to tho Council and to Parliament that a further opportunity for consideration of the matter should be given. He was not in the habit of disputing a decision arrived at by the Council, but everybody knew that if the Council were polled apart from the votethat was taken on Friday it was most probable that the decision would not be such as had been recorded on that division. It might well be said that, after all, the totalisator question was not a very important one. Hon. gentlemen, however, who took the view that the question was one of great consequence to the community could hardly complain if a further optiortunity was given the Council to consider the Bill. After a long debate in the House, the Prime Minister had. -proposed the method of compromise that the Bill embodied. That method reserved to Parliament the right by resolution of either House to prevent any increase in the. number of permits or any redistribution. It was contemptuously Tejoctod by the Council. That was serious to liini. He thought that members might waive their personal view when a real difficulty had arisen in the Legislature and a way out bad been prorosed bv thos- who for tho time being had. by the will of Parliament, the conduct of the business of Parliament. It was not suggested that the Government claimed nny right to dictate to Parliament, but 'it. was a. matter of the conduct of business. He did not think thai the Government ought to abstain from offering another opportunity to the Council of agreeing to the method that the other branch of the Legislature had adopted. Those who had rejected the nronosal had by their, vote given an effective warning that any considerable increase in tho number of permits was. likely to be met by an adverse vote of tho Council next year. "We must work together," said Sir Francis Bell. "We are business men. This is the business., of the country we are conducting, and in a matter which seems to me to be of such trifling importance as compared with tho great 'business that we have to deal with, that either branch of- the Legislature should take the opportunity of refusing to allow the Prime Ministei to intervene with a suggestion disposing of a difficulty, is to create a precedent which is of very great danger in mattera of far greater importance. I trust that the Council will let the Bill pass in its original form, with the emphatio warning which the vote of the Council necessarily conveys."

"Grievously Disappointed." The Hon. J. Barr said_ that he was grievously disappointed with the words of Sir Francis Bell. Ho did not considei that the Leader of the Council was ai all justified ill'saying that the Council had "contemptuously" rejected a proposal of tho Prime Minister. The Bill had the Prime Minister's name upon it, bui there was no reason for which it should be regarded in a different way from othei moasures that the Prime Minister promoted. The principal provision had been fairly debated. Sir Francis Bell had admitted at tho very outset that one oi the effects of the Bill would be to increase the number of permits, and certain members of the Council had quite openly stated that they were opposed to Hie Bill and had eventually amended it. He could not see where any contempt had been shown. Surely, the Leader 0; the Council did not pretend that the Council had no right to amend the Bill. Strong supporters of racing had exaress ed to him the belief that the opponents of any increase in the number of permits were right. They had said they realised that tho sport had to be kept within hounds for its own soon- JJd could not see how the Leader of the Council could claim that the question involved wns of flnin.ll importunes when in reality it affected the problem of industrial production. The Hon. E. Mitchelson agreed that 'every member of the Council liad a right to express his opinion on measures brought before it. He thought it was incorrect, however, to suggest that the Leader of tho Council was attempting to dictate to members. Mr. Mitchelson supported the proposal of Sir Francis Bell becauso ho considered thnt the I rime Minister had offered the two parties interested an opportunity for a fair comPl The Se ilon. J. B. Gow supported Mr. Barr. He thought that those who wer6 in favour of the Bill had not taken then (ipf«nt on Friday in a sporting spirit. • There was some further debate, in the course of which members wpiwwd opinions .similar to those which thev had already expressed upon the second reading and the committal of the Bill. The motion for recommittal was carried by 1G votes to 10. Tho division list was as follows 1— Ayes (1G). Bell' Mitchelson Alison . Buchanan Sanniel Clarke hcott Fraser Geddis Sinclair Griimnond Stewart lliiwke „ ' tbu .° Noes (10). » KniT -Tones Cohen Mao Gibbon Jlanishaw MacGregor Gow Smith Hall-Jones Thomson Pairs: Ayes—Ncrheny, Collins. Louis-' son, Harris, Michel. Nces —Tzard, Fleming, Moore, Garland, Ilardy. In Committeo Mr. Barr made reference to members who before tho division had "unaccountably disappeared." Sir Francis Bell: I don't think the hon. memlwr ought to make those statements. Mr. Barr: Are they incorrect? Sir Francis Boll: I think they areMr. Barr: Well, "who have accountably disappeared." (Laughter.) The amendment restoring the Bill *o the form in which it reached the Council was carried by lo votes to 10. The division list, was as follows-— For tho Amendment (15). 801 l Mitchelson Alison Patuki Buchanan Scott Clarke Simpson Fraser Sinclair Geddis Stewart Grimmond Tukino Hawke Against (10). Barr Jones Cohen MacGibboti F/arnshaw MacGregor Gow Smith Hall-Jones Thomson Pairs: For the amendment—Michel, Collins. I.ouisson. Nerhenv, Harris. Baillio. Aeainst—Hardy, Fleming, Moore, Izard, Garland, I'isher. An Indignant Member. Speaking upon the motion for a third Tcading, the Hon. G. Jones said that when lie first heard of the proposal 10 recommit tho Bill he thought it must be for tho purpose of striking out tho claus© granting more permits to hunt. «lubs. He bad been surprised to find

the Leader of the Council trying to make port in such heavy weather. The lion, geiitloman had rcuchcd port, Imf. with his sails all blown to smithereens. Sir Francis Bell had succeeded in some degree in cloaking tho real intention, 'i'ho volo of tho Council showed that, lie (tho speaker) was not proud to be «i member of tho Council al'ter that vote. If ever a vote had been given for tho abolition of the Council he thought it had been given that afternoon. Ho felt, humiliated by the attitude the Council had adopted. The Government, in order to gain its ends, had used menus that he "dared not attempt to describe in the Council."

, This expression was ruled out or or der.

llr. Jones: It is very difficult to describe one's feelings when one has to put up with what has just transpired. Tho Hon. J. MacGregor produced a division list showing that in 1914 Mr. Jones had voted for a Bill increasing tlie number of permits. ' "Hon. gentlemen," he commented, "may attach tmcli weight as they think proper to the very indignant speech that my lion, friend has delivered this afternoon."

The Hon. W. liarnshaw said that ir Sir Francis Bell had not had a reduced Council ho would not havo succeeded in carrying his amendment. Tho Hon. J. Barr said it was plain from what had happened that the number of permits would bo increased. The country clubs were asking for more permits. The city clubs thought it politic to refrain from making a similar request. Certainly moro permits would bo issued unless peojle who had tho economic and moral welfare of tho country at heart made their influence felt at once. Members of tho Council ought «i oliservo their responsibility to the "people and not to the Government that appointed them. If they were not prepared to observe their responsibility to the people, they should be out of tho Council. The Bill was read a third time and passed.

• The Bill was returned to the House of Representatives with minor amendments which were accepted by the House on Affaire ° f Minister of Int «nol MINING LAW"AMENDED

THE PRODUCTION OF GOLD

ABOUT THE WATER-FEED DRILL

The Prime Minister moved the second reading ot the Mining Amendment BiU which makes a number of small amoidl menu in tho mining 'law... A new clause added to th# Bill (by the Mines Committee extends until December 31, 1920 in cei tain cases the period allowed fo'r'the instalation of water-feed drills at tiie quartz mines. The Government, stated Ally Massey, would not pay any icomppnsation to the companies which were being compelled to install the pw drills. Tho use of these drills was expected to effect a great reduction in the prevalence of miners' disease.

Mr. Suddon (West)and) said the Bill was disappointing. It was merely nil amending Bill, whereas the mining districts were looking for a policy of development. Gold'production was falling off in. New Xcalaiui, and this wns a serious matter for the whole country, "ho easily-won gold had been mined in the past, and the time had come now for piospeoting in the high and back country. The assistance given to prospectors now was not adequate, and he would suggest a more literal use of the powers already possessed by the Minister of Mines, legislation was not required to cover these points. Sympathetic administration would gir<> the miners most of tlio tilings they wore asking for. The (fold miners had not beon treated fairly in.regard to the price of gold during lie war. The .export of gold had been prohibited, and the miners had been forced to sell to tlie banks at the pre-war price of about -El per ounce, when the world's market price was as 'high hs .£6 an otm.;e. Objection to the extension of time lor the instalment of water-drills was made by Air. I£. E. Holland (Bailor), who suggested that somo of the mining cornpa iies, when given nine months' noticti to install !7io drills, had used the time ! : rst in trying to get compensation and then iu trying to get an. extension of time. Many of the companies had made 110 effort to secure the. drills, although Parliament: .had said in that the old drills, which causal the deaths of many miners, must not be used after Octobe l .' 1, 1920. The miners on the Heefton field wero now idle because they refused to ■break the law by working with the old drills. I'urliament ought not to.be asked to validate the delay of mining companies that had made 110 effort to comply with the law. Mr. 11. Poland (Ohinemuri) stated that the miniug companies, by delaying the installation of the machines ordered by Parliament, had saved some thousands uf pounds. It was a fair proposition that they should compensate tlid miners who had refused to work with the old drills, The men probably would continue this refusal, and would be justified in doing so.

The debate was continued by other members. Dr. A. K. Newman (Wellington East), speaking late in tho evening, urged tho Government to press the development of mineral resources, including bron'll coals and ircu-sand, The Primo Minister, iu replying, paid complaint had been made that not enough was being done for mining. But not an industry in the. country was at present fully manned, and what could be done in these circumstances i For all that, mining was being encouraged. During the last few .£32,000 had been handed over or promised for th* promotion of gold-mining and other mining. The subsidies for prospecting had been recently increased by thirty per cent. Deductions of relit had been agreed to over and over again. Tho Government was prepared iu every way io assist the bona-iide miner or prospector. As regarded the water-drill, 'lie was not even now sure that flie experimental stage had, been passed. The mine owners had teen distinctly told that they wero to comply with the law. On October 2 (the day after that on which tne law came into' operation) the mine owners had been circularised upon tho matter. The Government was flot favouring 0110 class to the disadvantage of another. 111 dozens of cases he had prevented miners from being prosecuted— that was, where they seemed to have anything like a good defence. He knew something about the difficulties of obtaining new appliances to-day. The difficulty the Government had had in obtaining railway engines was an illustration in point. Moreover, there was evidence that some of the miners were doubtful about the effectiveness of the water drill. Mr. Masse.y quoted testimony to this effect.

Mr. Holland: That's the old machine —with the spray.

Mr. Massey: Even putting it as tho honourable member puts it, they doubt tho efficacy of the use of water to keep the dust down. The men were hard to convince that they had to use water. When tho men were so hard to convince, what do you expect of the emplover? /

Mr. Massey proceeded to say he believed that the country was 011 the eve of a revival of mining, but he was assured that until labour and appliances were cheaper not very much could be expected.

When tho Bill was committed. Mr. Holland divided • the House upon the clauso proposing to extend the time allowed for the installation qf the axinl water-feed drill.

The clauso was carried by 38 votes to 16

The Bill was reported without amendments, and was rend a third time and passed.