ADDRESS-IN-REPLY

Dominion, Volume 13, Issue 238, 2 July 1920, Page 8

ADDRESS-IN-REPLY

' OPPOSITION LEADER'S , ~ . AMENDMENT ; - STATEMENT OF REASONS •• The debate on the Address-in-Reply mo- • «on.-was resumed ak 3.10 p. - • ■ Mr. W. D. S. MACDOinALD (Leader, of the Opposition) 'said that whereas both v -the mover' and the seconder had said that His Excellency's Speech w optimistic, he thought it .was ■nessimistic—' "bordering 1 on the • tragus. But he agreed that the financial' position ' ' "was, as'stated in .tho Speech, venndiificult .It ivaa a time for • the Readers of the country to, be very watchful of tlie ' country's interest, ajid he wished to repeat.his former statement Jhat it would not'bo the aim.' of tho Liberal Party this session tc harass or. embarrass the Government. But. the Oppo&ition.had a ' duty to the people of tho Dominion no less than the Government, and he did not prop-cee, as some Conservative papers lad suggested, "to take Morm.dopo and • ■ PO to deep.'" There' were always people opposed to the Government's leguution, and the Oppcßitionrsvas a sort of Court of Appeal. Ho wished to put one or mo pertinent questions to the Government, and this was his reason for moving his . . amendment to the" motion before the ■House, As to the general appeals now made for. unity, he thought it o. great ■nity that some of that feeling had not Wn manifested at the ; recent genera •elections. The late Leader of tho Libei al Party had been pursued oT-1 .ever. the , country with relentless malignity, such : as had not before been exampled. Mr. Mac Donald referred briefly to one or two portions of the speech of Mr. D. Jones, the seoonder.of the motion. ._ f As to -his own no-confidence amendment, • he had special reasons for moving it, and some of these he proposed to state. -For 6ome time past tho Prime Minister , : had not had aMI Cabinet, and he W _ 6ure that this'had not been in the interests of tho. country He did not agree that,the Prime Minister ha<l<«altaby :: with the Labour prokein. Why did tho - Prime Minister discredit his own Mini^ ■ ters?r Why. was the Railway Department ■ taken from Sir Wifliam Herncs. ■ _ Mr. Massey : Because he handed_it over. Mr.. Mac Donald said that ; Sir William Herries had held the confidence cf-the people, and he (Mr. Mac Donald) was opinion that some of these troublesi " 'the raiCwavs would not have uccurrec '''had Sir . William Hemes ii I charge. He did not suggest that Mr. Mas (: . eey.had not enough ability to run the rail ways, hut he was very much overloads with work already. Mr. Massey, appearec m 'to aim at "running 'the whole show, t< p.' he obsessed with the idea that he ougli f, : to he the mouthpiece and forefront o ! everything. But most of all ho hai £■' moved his amendment to allo,w member i of the new Parliament to declare tnei ('' opinions on the question of electoral re ' firm. He hml not thought ofsconnp i 7victoTV over th& Government. The "rittu ' . Minister had promised electoral reform f when tho Second Ballot Act was repealed, P and it was because there was no such rc- ! ' form that there were four parties in the

I mouse. Who Opposed Reform? | He referred also to the proposal to in- [,; troduce the elective principle in ' the f;;Upper House; : • • • Mr.-M'Comljs: And who opposed elec- !''• * -' toral reform there? The Liberals! / Mr. Mac Donald: The Liberals have not ft, . 'had a chance to do anything since 1912. & J Mr. M'Combsl It was one of. the con•■•ditions of the Coalition. ■ ; Mr. Mac Donald .urged generally that ' there ought to be reform in the system i . of voting. „ _ i Mt. Massey,: What do you want? Do you want proportional representation ?_ Mt. Mac Donald said that his opinion ■ 1 was that , the Government should bring down proposals, and then. it .would-be for , Parliament to deal with tho question. Mr. Massey: You asked; for no reform bo long as you had a majority. Mr. Mac Donald went on to discuss the results" of the elections with intent to • - show that some of the members, were minority representatives. He urged that a Parliamentary Committee or a Eoyal Commission should be set up. to investigate the whole question. r "•••• 'Mr. Massey s They'had a committee in England, and they. could not find anything better than the present system, al- •: though they sat for months, under the • presidency of the Speaker. Mr. Mac Donald said that the people i of this country would not ibe satisfied > without very full inquiry with tho pre- ! * sent first-past-the-post system. . Mt. Mac Donald proceeded to refer- to - t land settlement, malring the demand that ' e owners, of large areas of land oueht to n be compelled to part with their holdings, f If the owners would not do it voluntarHy, then Parliament must compel them c to sell. Many soldiers' night to be setp tied on land, but because of' trJe hi?h • market prices of land and the withholding from 'sale of largo areas of_ land ninny could not get land. The policy of drift in connection with this matter was so serious that it was no longer a | crcdit to be a, representative in tho Pnrliamcnt of this country. He was sure that' if the demand were put fairly to ; .. . these, ftwners they would sell, and would ■ 1 accept payment in Government bonds, so relieving the Government of financial embarrassment. More might bo done_ to • help the soldier settler. Often on land . costing <£70 an acre the soldier had to

. -live in "a shack hardly fit for a hen- ■ roost." There were huge estates that ■t could yet be acquired for soldier settlement, «ind the people would not be satis- , fled unless these llanda were purchased. He was sure tho Minister of Lands was ■ most anxious to do what was right, but he could do little without an improved land policy. Mr. Mac Donald spoke of the to amend the Board of Trade ■ Act. Ho was sure tho board had done much good, but he'urged that clause 32 of the Act, which permitted of ( tiivml ' 'complaints,: was making the task of tho board impossible and bringing the Act Into ridicule. He urged that a commission of experts should be set up to deal with currency and kindred matters. He • ■urged that inquiry be made also about shipping, about State colliers • for carrying coal from th© West Coast and from Australia, and about the production of coal in' New Zealand. He supported Sir Joseph Ward's scheme for the establishment offa/;Stjite'.'ljahk in New Zealand. i "Mr. Massey: We've got a very good State bank now. , ~ ' . Mr Mac Donald moved his amendment to add the following passage to His Mcellenoy's speech:— •' Wo feel it our duty to submit to '*■ • Your Excellency that! it is essential that Your Excetfonoy'a Government

should possess the confidence of this g . House and of the country, and re- $ spectfully* to represent to Your ; Excellency that such- confidence is' not repose! in the Government as at pre- a . eent constituted. ;t THE MINIBTER OF LANDB. SOLDIER SETTLEMENT. The Hon. D. H. GUTHRIE (Minister of Lands) .'replied to the Leader of the " Opposition. He said that he saw nothin? "tragic" in the note of caution that had been sounded by the Govern- ' ment in the Governor-General s speech, <: New Zealand-had need of caution,-but it ■ had no need of fear. It. < could look back over the events of the last five years . , with gratitude, and could congratulate on the position of to-day, thanks chiefly to the . excellent financial results of the Imperial contracts. Mr. Guthrie point- , ed to the financial strength , that had- ■ been displayed by the Dominion during ( the .war. The addition of 000 to the public debt on account of the' war '■ was serious,.hut Now Zealand could bear ( tho burden, and lamentations were unnecessary, as well as useless. The essential fact was that production was being- maintained. Mr Guthrie referred to , the responsibilities arising from the war. including obligations to the returned soldiers. Ho thought it timely to remark thai while'everything reasonable 6hould be'done for the.returned soldiers, other .sections of tlie community must also.receive consideration. He had seen cases of real hardship caused by the reservation of all available land for returned soldiers, to the exclusion even of experienced men with large families. . The Minister described, the measures, taken by the Government to secure tlie successfill settlement of land. by, soldiers, and said that the available evidence showed that the percentage of failures was going to be very much smaller than lie had expected. The Government ha'd at present in . hand an area of 691,141 acres, available for settlement by soldiers. This .land would be settled month by .month, and'every district of New Zealand'.was represented in tho total. The total expenditure on account of the repatriation of sOldiers' so far had been close upon this including tho purchase of land, advances for buildings, stocks, and houses, assistance in business, and vocational training. The record of the Government in this respect was ■' a good one. Special attention had been given to maimed men and "T. 8." men, but the number requiring assistance so | , far had not been large. Every care had been taken, and would be taken, to give thesn men a .fair chance., . Turning ,to.' ' the financial aspect of the soldier settlement scheme, Mr. Guthrie said that the ' provision made by Parliament last year 1 had amounted to i£M,OOO,OOO. Tho expenditure had exceded txpoctations, and 1 it was .because tho money ras' : running I 6hort that the Government' had decided i to "taper off" pending the voting, of more j money, by Parliament. The scheme liad ' never been stopped. The' House would ' have the question before it' again when r the Loan Bill came down, and he thought " the House would bo satisfied with the 1 provision proposed to be made.

Electoral Reform. The Lender of the Opposition, continued Mr. Guthrie. had tnlke<l of electoral reform. What reform did lie want? Other countries had tried various schemes with very little success. He could not Bay if there would be any electoral reform this •session, or if'the Government was satisfied with the existing system. Mr. Massey: "We are quite satisfied. (Laughter.) Mr. Guthrie; The Leader of the Opposition and his friends were ouite satisfied, too, for very many years, and when thoy tried a Teform—the second ballot— they absolutely fled.from the ghost they haa raised. | OTHER SPEAKERS. COMPLAINT .AGTOST WASTE OF TIME. Mr. T. K. SIDEY fDunedin South) was the next speaker. He discovered in the .Speech a suggestion that a deficit of ordinary revenue was going to bp met by borrowing.' He considered, moreover, that thp Speech was notable chiefly for what it left unsaid.- The secondary industries of tyie country had too • loner been neglected in favour of the primary industries.

"Waste of Time." , Mr. E. NEWMAN (Manawatu) said that he would.be intensely disappointed if, after the experiences of.the war, they wero to drop into tho eld methods in the conduct of business of tho House. He would like to hear adequate reasons .for the holding up of the business of the country. He would have, expected to hear charges of broken pledges, charges of incapacity, but no such charges had been made. There were many serious questions facing the country—finance, housing, and others—which could engage the attention of the House. There was a new Parliament to which new members of obvious capacity had been returned, and it was surely a sorry spectacle to see .the older members of tho House holding up tho business of the House with a futile no-confidence motion, when everyone knew that tho decision of tho Houso could only go'in one way. Ho was surprised that tho Leader of the Opposition Party should think the present a fit and proper time to move a voto of no-confi-dence. Ho was" sure that if the leader of. the Opposition had declared his intontion of supporting tho Government in every possible way ho would have earned much kudos in 'the country and have achieved much satisfaction himself. He (Mr. Newman) believed that the Leader of the Opposition would yet decide to follow this course.

Mr. M'Combs: What are you complaining about? Mv. Newman: "I nm complaining about the waste of time in bringing down' a motion which must be defeated. Tho honourable gentleman may not agree with me, but tho country threes with what I am saying. They consider that this noconfidence debate is a completo waste of time and a farce." .Continuing, Mr. Newman said he did not agree that tho last election had not been\fought cleanly, although lie confessed he-had no knowledge of electorates far from his own. As to the complaints about tho inequalities of the 'election results, lio said that this country might be the better for somo electoral reform, but this reform must not be proportional representation, for the reason that this would mean the alwlition of the country quota. He thought country settlers were entitled to some ndvantage in voting strength in view of the difficulties they had in voting as compared with people residing in the cities. Also he did not agree with all the analyses of results that had been made. Votes were counted against Reform in electorates where

there was no Reform candidate standing, and -the other candidates had been credited with votes that they would not have Lad if Reform candidates had stood. Mr. Nowma;: spoko of educational leform cr.d industrial peace. The solution of industrial problems would be easier if the Dominion did not contain people who coneidereel it their mission to stir up «■ trouble. The official! Labour group did not lepiesent the average worker, who wanted a fair share of the profit of in- , dustry, but did not want to abolish pri- „ vate enterprise and ' private employment. He concluded by asking ' what Government the twenty. Lib- . orals in -the House had to offer m Tilaco of the Government they wero attacking. A Liberal Landowner. Mr. R. M'Callum (Wairau) talked #1 of the "unearned increment of *lana, and described Mr. Massey as the representative of the large 'landowners. S1 Mr. Massey: Why, you are one yourB< Mr. M'Callum: "I do not hold any ?] land I did not pav for" (laughter. He proceeded to declare that the Libei ■»! Q Party' was proud of its new leader, Mr. Mac Donald, the successor of such. men as Sir George Grey, Mr Ballance, Mr. j Seddon, and Sir Joseph A\ard, Kobody knew whafwas the stock on tho Govern- , ment benches.' (Laughter.) The conservatism of tfie Inform Party was of a ° kind to "breed revo.ution, and its land , policy was almost entirely objectionable o good Liberals. If tho Government « iad left the accumulated surpluses 111 London last year, as proposed oy Sir Joseph' Ward, and had borrowed merey for soldier settlement, rates of interest would have risen and then the eo.diera would have got cheaper land, because dear money meant cheap land. , . , "I BUKsest that we now take the <;:vi- * eion, ana get' on .with tho business of the country," said Mr. Massey, when Mr. M'Callum sat down at 9.30 p.m. Tho suggestion evidently did not meet with the approval of some members. . j The debate was adjourned, on the motion of Mr. W. D. Lysnar (Gisborne), and the House rose. ( DAYLIGHT-SAVING COUNTRY MEMBERS PERTURBED. Somo country members ara perturbed , about the Government's Standard Time Bill. The proposal of this Bill is to ' f\ x . New Zealand mean, time at.'twelve hours' ahead'of Greenwich time instead of eleven and a half hours as at present. L The change would mean the advancing of tho clocks half an hour on a date to be fixed, so that the sun would rise half . an hour earlier all the year round, as f measured by the standard time. the t daylight savers, headed br Mr. Sidey, » have long advocated a change m this : direction, and Mr. Sidey's Definition of J Time Bill has been before the Honso in Z many sessions without ieachin« the I Statute Book. The Government BiU r proposes to give the- advocates of daylight •saving a part of what they have asked, i Country members' Ifavo always opposed ' the change of standard time almost „ unanimously on the ground that it would cause hardship to the farmers, who al- . readv rise very eauly in the morning and ; might have to rise earlier still if train I time-tables and . city business hours were advanced. The object of the Governi,i ment in making the proposal, already ,r explained, is to effect 1 economies in light- ' ing and Dowor in the cities and towns L" where the "peak loads" Sate,™ the afternoon add greatly to tho difficulties .j of the municipal authorities, in these • d a y s of fuel shortage nsxl inadequate ,1 plants. Country members are suro_ to , n have something to say on the subject s. when the Bill is discussed in the House. 1 "I DEFENGEIOUCY ' ' id "Will the .Prime Minister, inform the «- House when he intends to announce the ;s, Government's proposals in regard •to the ■s. Defence policy of New Zealand? asked >y the Hon. J. A. Hanan (Invercargill) yeshe Mr. Massey's reply was non-committal.' •e- "Later in the .session," ijaid the Prime en Minister. ho - J MEETING OF REFORM PARTY , ■ A meeting of the government Party a was W.d>-yesterday morninfH-the, first * n meeting of this session. The Prime Min;n' ister eivid after the meeting that mem* bers had discussed the present situation [ n & and business to come during tho seslve sion. .It is understood that some anto nounceiuent about the appointment of'a 'J®' new Minister mivy soon be made, but he no t nn til after the no-confidence amend--ftr ment by Mr* W- 3D. S. Mac Donald had ex " been determined. . \