THE CALL FOR MORE MEN

Dominion, Volume 9, Issue 2642, 13 December 1915, Page 6

THE CALL FOR MORE MEN

LOCAL RECEIVING CAMPS ASKED FOR DEPUTATION TO THE PRIME MINISTER i VIEWS OF MEMBERS OF PARLIAMENT. MR. MASSEY AND NATIONAL SERVICE

"I would like to say," said the Prime Minister of New Zealand (the Right Hon. W'. F. Massoy), replying to the request of a deputation of members of Parliament asking for Cabinet's consideration of a proposal to establish "local receiving" or "holding" camps-as a means of. stimulating recruiting, "that I have bccome, since the war commenced, a very much stronger sup-i porter of national servicc than ever I have been previously. I don't know what is going to happen, but I don't think that the lesson of this war will be forgotten."

A deputation to the Prime Minister on Saturday. jjiit forward a strong plea for local receiving camps to stimulate recruiting. The deputation was headed by Dr. Thacker, of Christcliurch, and was solely composed of members of Parliament, the following other members being present: Sir Jas. Carroll, Messrs.' C. E. Poole, S. Dickson, G Witty, G. R. Sykes, C. Parata, J. Payne, J. T. M. Hornsby, and T. A. H. Field. There wore present with tlin Prime Minister the Minister of Do--1 fonce (the Hon. J. Allen), BrigadierGeneral Robin, Commandant of the New Zealand Military Forces, and Colonel Gibbon (Chief of the General Staff). The object ,the deputation had in view ivas that the whole question should be fully discussed by the National Cabinet, mid it was indicated .that if the resultant decision were against, the proposal put forward, that decision would be abided by. The Prime Minister, after hearing the views expressed, promised that all the argument would be placed before bis colleagues at the earliest opportunity. It was made plain by the deputation before they withdrew that in ieferring to local camps they really meant receiving camps, where men could be drafted immediately they had enlisted. . Dr.jThacker handed in opinions —in response to requests —frjm reai-ly all members of ; Parliament to the deputation's suggestion, the majority being in favour. of the establishment of the local camps. ]

Mr. Poole said that they were' exceedingly anxious to help the Defence Department' in, securing the necessary recruits for the Reinforcements. Numbers had been devoting their energies to making recruiting speeches, and it had beon pointed out to them that some evidence of military display in other districts would facilitate matters. The South Island, particularly needed local camps, where direct enlistment could' he encouraged. There were many men still eligible for service. Members ■ were generally opposed to conscription, and it was thought that local camps for direct enlistment would liolp matters. Agricultural Societies and Racing Clubs had promised assistance, and if the local camps were set up the appeal. "of the men/in khaki" would he irresistible to the young moil who were holding back. Experienced men who had been to 'the front and returned could be utilised to give preliminary instruction at the local camps. The North Island camps m other centres to Welljngton had been an incentive to recruiting, and if the system were extended: he though it would provo valuable. The Mayor of Auckland had sent him. a message stating that the Auckland public was wholly in favour nf decentralisation. Ho was of opinion that the present system of enrolling should be abolished in favour of direot enlistment. Personally, Mr. Poole said that they were all anxious to uphold the Department, and to get every recruit possible, so as to get the war over as soon as possible. Local Preparatory Camps. Dr. Thacker 'said that the one sentiment expressed at the large recruiting meetings in the south had beon for local preparatory camps. There was no idea of havihg any rival camps to Trentham. Many civilians were ready to go inty a local preparatory camp, learning the preliminary-work, and at the snrne time pointing out to those called "shirkers" (although he did not think they were shirkers) their duty to do likewise. The Citizens' Defence Committee of Christchurch had again passed a resolution in favour of the establishment of local camps, where men- could be drafted as soon as they had enlisted. He added that the New Brighton Trotting Chb had offered their land and buildings to the. Department for a camp site. It had been pointed out that the men in the local camps would know the local men who were not enlisting, and the_ encouragement of khaki ■ would be given them. 0 The policy of the Defence Minister that he could not decentralise had been shattered, continued the doctor, by the fact that there were several camps in the North Island. He had assurances from tent-makers in the south that an unlimited number of tents could be made if the orders were given. They did not want camps like Trentham, and the question of staff could be got over in. the south by using, returned South African veterans ' for the preliminary training. A Patriotic Offer.

air would be a tremendous factor in drawing recruits. The questidn of conscription need not enter into their minds while there were : 109)000 men ori the register willing to serve. Not a Parochial. Matter. Mr. Field said that the matter had not been approached from a parochial standpoint. The need for a receiving camp had been, felt from the very beginning of recruiting. Ho thought that local training on, the militia system could bo inaugurated. He was aware that this would involve the calling out of tlie militia, and perhaps some system of National Servico t but lie believed this would come. Mr. Hornsby thought that if they were to have local camps they should merely be receiving places. Men were lost through not being takeu. on at once. Mr Allen: Don't we get them later on ? •Mr. Hornsby: "Some of them you don't get. They come in hot foot, ready to go into camp, and they are sent. away. ■It hurts tliem, and you lose them." He said that the men in the! country districts went back to their work, and were lost through not being received at once. Mr. Dickson, endorsed the remarks of other speakers. They could have got a good mauy more recruits at Auckland during' the recent Carnival had they had local camps. He knew that a good many men had gone from Auckland to Australia to . enlist. Every effort had now to be made to keep up their reinforcements. While he favoured conscription, he thought tho local camps should first be tried. Mr. Sykes said that he believed there was something in local camps, especially ,in country districts like Poverty 'Bay. Thero was no doubt that the best recruiting agent was the young fellow in khaki. The Military Point. Colonel Gibbon replied to some of the, romarks made, and pointed out that local camps for local training, and receiving camps, were entirely different things. As regarded receiving camps, which tho deputation said they wanted, ho said that from a .military point of view they preferred to handle tho men first themsolves, with their own officers and staff. By doing iso they could get a better grip and discipline over the men. It had been said that the men in khaki were a great recruiting agency, and he replied that under tho new training system every four weeks thero would oe a huge inundation of men from the central camps all over tho Dominion, to every centre. Further, lie said that amongst their best districts for recruits were Hawke's Bay and Taranaki, which had never seen a camp. If a man wanted to come in, lie would come in. He was not in favour of local camps, because the training ought ,to be perfected, and they prepared for drafts. Men could not be shoved in here and there, and now that they had the reserve stand-by they could meet all the sudden calls made 011 them. It was said that local camps would encourage recruiting,' but' local camps had been run in Australia from the commencement of the war, and at the present moment they were considerably behind there, while hei'Oj up to the present they had had 110 difficulty, and now it was simply a question of Christmas. All districts assured him that there would be no difficulty about the drafts after Christmas. _ His own impression was that there might bo a surplus. Even if they had first-class instructors in tho local camps there would be the disadvantage that tho men v," on Id have to change from one set of instructors to another.

Mr. Payne said that there were numbers of men in the fcackblocks w ho gave up their work and then had to hang about for two or three weeks.

Colonel Gibbon: For the last seven i weeks I have had a slight margin in 1 the reserve, and all districts know _ I 1 will take every man up to a certain number who would go into camp immediately. They won't do it. They want : to get put down for a future date. Sir James Carroll: There are a number of men I know who have enlisted and would like to go into camp right away. , . Mr. Witty:' And the same in my district- ' „ . ' , . Colonel Gibbon: It is not so during the last seven weeks. There are vacancies for 50 men in camp, and I cannot got them. Full Training Necessary. General Robin said that the two questions, local or receiving camps, and tho effect oil recruiting, had been discussed, and the request made was that they should be considered by the National Cabinet, which might see fit to get the advice of tho military officers, and to go into the matter in detail. The members of the deputation, who were interesting themselves in getting recruits, had brought forward a proposal of a receiving camp, and there was a great deal in it to be thought over, provided it was on the linos suggested by Sir James Carroll, but they had to remember that there must not be one daytaken off the training in the central camps. Everything else would have to be in addition. If there was any attompt to reduce the training in the central camps, then "the blood would be on their heads." Our training system had been complimented, and requests had been received for particulars of the training system from other parts of the world. Dr. Thacker: You have the men m this country with brains. You must give them credit as well as the system. General Robin: That is so, but the Australians and Canadians must bo considered just as brainy. What the National Register Discloses. | Tho Minister of Defence (the Hon. J. Allen) made reference to the recruiting in Otago. Ho 6aid that lie had discovered the day before that tho accusations made against' Otago were absolutely unfounded. He was going to givo the par- ' ticulars, and that would bo his answer as to whether local camps were necessary! The "National Register had disclosed that there were in Otago between tlie ages of 10 and 44 33,382 men, 'that was 16 per cent, of tho whole. Otngo : hod aotunlly sent to camp up to Ootobcr !.1j11,_0866 16.6 flgr ijenji, at jfcJjs

Sir James Carroll said that he_ could , only speak from a Gisborne • jjoint of view.' While in sympathy with the j; appeal, ho referred to an application « ■made from Gisborne. that a holding camn should be established there, men 'in that district enlisted, passed tho doctor, and then drifted away. It was ( hard then to collect them again. Cos- ; borne was, prepared to establish a hold- < ing camp at any time, and the whole t cost would be borne by tho district, ] so -that there would be no expense on \ tho Government. i Mr. G. Witty said that if Me wonted ] to win the w«r we. woold have to have j every man. They should give the nen ] every encouragement, and ho did not tl-ink we were'doinc that. Be nitri- i buted the heavy Wellington enlistment : to the fact that men from the south ( camn here to enlist, and wero pnt down as Wellington men. _ In replv to Mr. Massey, Mr. Witty said that" his idea was .that, the young men should stay in ' the local camps till they were wanted to go to Trenthnm for the last month's training. Mr. Witty contended that there were not sufficient men for the 11th Reinforcements. ■Mr. Allen replied that this was not the case. ■ Mr. Mnssey said that the posiwm as he understood it. was sufficient men had signified their willingness to go into camp, but a number' waited to stay with their friends till after Christmas. Mr. Witty said that he was afraid if the.v did not harp 'eomethinf like local camps conscription would be necessary, and they did not want that if it wns possible to do without it. Mr. Payne contended that tho deputation was putting forward a scheme that would ensure the men beinrr secured. Afterwards tho of' training could be dealt with. He felt - that tho matter was one for- consideration bv the Notional Cnhjnet._ Training, the. preliminary breaking in, could be easily done in the local ramps, and I the meli would bo a hie spur in pettinu i.othejw in, The military spirits h tlic.

whole, that was point six per cent, more than her share. THE PRIME MINISTER'S REPLY. CABINET WILL CONSIDER IT. The Prime Minister (the Right Hon. V. F. Jlassey) said tbat lie considered it the duty of Ministers to meet members to discuss questions of so much importance. Whatever their individual opinions might be, ho was certain the discussion that morning would do a great deal of good. He would be very glad to convoy the representations made to Cabinet at the first opportunity. He had watched the matter very carefully during the past sixteen months, and everything pointed favourably to the present system. Ho did not want to make comparisons, but they had been told that our soldiers, as far as military cajiacity was concerned, were ahead of other soldiers raised in different parts of the world since the war broke out. That must be gratifying to .every one of them, and they had to be careful how they interfered with a system which had done so well. He honestly believed the members of the deputation were just as' anxious as the Government to do their duty during the present crisis. Mr. Witty had described the effect of khaki as being responsible for tho large recruiting in Wellington, but his (Mr. Massey's) recollection-was that the Wellington district had the largest- population to draw on. It was also worth remombering that Taranaki, Hawke's Bay, and the southern parts of tho West Coast of the South, Island had also done quite as well as other districts. . a Tha 34,000 Who Answered "No." Mr. Massoy said 'that he thought that some of the newspapers had been a bit premature in some of their comparisons. The fact that 109,000 ha"cl oftered their services if they were needed, and undoubtedly some of them would be needed, was a matter for congraulation. Ho noticed, however, a tendency tp look askance at tho 34,000 who had answered "No" on the schedule, and to class them as .shirkers. There was no question but t-hat they had an antimilitarist class to a certain extent here, but he thought that in the 34,000 there were quite a number of physically unfit men, or men. who had entered into very serious obligations, and they had to think of such men. Mr. George Witty: They must give their reasons! Mr.'Massey: They -are being classified now, and 1 hope to be ablo to give more information than the public has now. Don't think that I am trying to apologise for the anti-militarists, but it is just possible that injustice may be done to those people till fuller information is given. Mr. Massey and National Service. "I would like to say," he added, "that I have become,' since the' war commenced, a very much stronger supporter of national service- than ever I have been previously. I don't know what is going to happen, but I don't think tho lesson of this war will be forgotten." Referring to men said to have been lost to New Zealand, he said that ho did not think quite so many men had gone to Australia as some peoplo Some lie knew personally who had been medically rejected here, and had then gone to Australia, thinking that the conditions would not be so stringent, but unfortunately they had been rejected there, too. Quite a number had gone to England to enlist. Mr. Massey concluded with tho promise that tho matter put forward would bo well considered.