THE GAMING BILL

Dominion, Volume 7, Issue 2263, 24 September 1914, Page 7

THE GAMING BILL

THIRTY MORE PERMITS MR. HUNTER'S PROPOSALS ■ ■ ■ ' * ' • ' • Mr. G. HUNTER (Waipawa) moved the second reading of the Gjwning Amendment Bill. 'He said tho Bill was similar to tho Bill which passed its second reading in tho Uouso last session by the substantial majority of 28 votes. Encouraged by this knowledge be was confident that this Bill wouJd havo the same favourable reception from members this year. The ouject of the Bill was to repair <a very great injustice done to tho minor country clubsby the legislation of 1910. Honourable members i would remember that in that year a Royal Commission was appointed to reduce tho number of race days from 305 to 250 per year. That Commission was authorised by Parliament to give due consideration to those clubs using the totalisator on only.,one day in the , year, • but, disregarding, , : this instruction theCommissiqn struck"oif fronf the list of totalisator clubs a large number of very promising country clubs which had spent considerable sums 'of money in improvements. The object of the Bill was not to encourage racing in the ■ main'-contreSj-but ra-therin the outlying centres' 'whero ' races- J "todk more- of a picnic character, where people attended races to have a day's outing, to meet ■their friends, and to enjoy, a healthy l class of sport. He thought , honourable members would agree iwith him that probably at no other time in tho history to the Dominion was it more important to encourage the breeding of horses, and if .people' were to be encouraged to breed horses they should be■■ given some opportunity to.go in for sonie sport in connection with it. Rac- . ing clubs, he would remind honourable -members, had liberally subscribed to the War Fund—something like £7700 —and he thought it would be a very graceful action the part of Parliament to pass the Dill, ft provided for an increase of thirty in the.number ofracing days, of which 1 not more than 17 were to be granted to racing clubs, nor 10 to hunt clubs,_ nor three to trotting clubs, all permits to be given to one-day meetings. The president of the Racing Conference, Sir George Clifford, in his report of 1912 expressed himself very strongly indeed in regard to the action of Parliament in curtailing these meetings. He characterised the legislation as ill-advised and ill-considered, and declared that it would do harm to horse breeding. Mr. Poland: Who's Clifford? 'Mr. 'Hunter: Sir George Clifford is president of the New Zealand Racing Conference, and the only member of the English Jockey Club outside' of Eng. land, tho English Jockey Club consisting of not more than seventy-fivq men. Mr/Poland: He ought to be in the Upper House. . .. .• . Mr. 'Hunter: If he were put in. the TJpper House he would be an ornament -to ithat Chamber. In conclusion, Mr. Hunter commended the Bill to the favourable consideration of honourable members, urging that it was a moderate measure, an equitable measure, and a just measure which ought to be"placed on the Statute Book. With, regard to tho schedule, he was prepared to conskier in Committeo suggestions for its amendment. The Most Useless Brutes. SIR JOSEPH WARD (Awarua). said it,was somewhat exhilarating to him to have an opportunity of Bpeaking upon racing matters again. Hβ had some years previously had a thorny and difficult problem to 6olve in dealing with racing, and,he had noticed this: that those people most anxious for reform in tho racing laws were least in favour of reforms that were introduced. He would support the Bill, for the reason that under the conditions now existing as the result of the findings of the Commission, country districts suffered an injustice. He would not, howover, support the allocation of permits as proposed in the Bill. He would favour an increase in the number of days for trotting clubs in the country, but not for so great an increase in the number of' permits to be given ,to hunt clubs nnd ordinary race meetings. Especially he thought it desirable that an increase sliould be made in trotting permits to encourage tho breeding of trotting horses. Mr. Pearce: They are no good for remounts. Mr. Wilson: The most useless brutes in the country. , Sir Joseph Ward did not go on to discuss tho relative merits of trotters and huntore, tho claims of which wero pressed by interjections from supporters of tho Bill. Sir Joseph Ward said that there was a demand for an increase in tho number of -footling. meetings in his district. Those meetings wero becoming, more aiul more the people's meeting as compared with galloping meetings. Mr. Buick: Bigger gambling. That's why. Sir Joseph Ward said he could not argue- this point. Mr. D. BUICK (Palmorston North) said it was quite clear that -the Right Honourable gentleman did not know what ho was talking about when ho argued the claims of a trotter as against a hunter. On thc< contrary, tho hunter was tho best horse wo could have, tho most useful, and the best for remounts. Tho trotter was the worst horse possible, also, for tho encouragement of gamblinc. . Mr. a; S. MALCOLM (Olutlia) saidj

that he would vote against the Bill. Tho measure would not necessarily promote sport, but would increase tho opportunities for gambling; and sport which could not get along without gambling was not worth encouraging. Ho would have no objection to a roallotment of days, but opposed an inoroaso of the days. Mr. G. V. PIEARCE (Patea) eaid that tho horses needed were not trotters (wliidi vivid bo ousted by tho motor), but good sturdy animals fit to do good sorvico in tho back country. He advocated tho Government's doing something to encourage the breeding or hunters. He roferred to the case of tho Egmont Hunt Club (Hawera), half of whoso members had gono to the front, with tho result that the remainder might not bo able to sufficiently finance tho club to carry it on unaided. A race day would bring this club £400 or so in revenue, and would, therefore, bo a good thing.. The question of riding horses was going to be a serious thing in Now Zealand, and ho hoped to seo the number of hunt clubs increased. Hβ would support tho Talk of Licensing Vice. . Mr. G. M. THOMSON (Dimedin North) expressed strong disapproval of tho Bill. It was a most undesirable thing for the Government to license any form of vice, and tho totalisator meant a license for vice. Ho was told that it was a matter of a choice betweea the totalisator and the bookmaker. The bookmaker was a pariah, and should bo treated as a parasite. A member: The bookmaker is not licensed. Mr. Thomson: I know that. Another member: He is thriving, though. Mr. Thomson: Yes, ho is. Mr. {Thomson went on to 'say that the Bill did not aim at the improvement of horses, nor was racing held with the object of improving ttie race of horses. The Hon. D. BTJDDO (Kaiapoi) said that tho Bill gave too much support to racing clubs, and too little support to trotting and hunting clubs, and when tho Bill got into Coininittee. he proposed to move with the object o* remedying these conditions. He would support the Bill, but thought that'the Government might have obviated the liiecessity for the measure by redistributing tho days now allowed. Mr. 0. K STATHaM (Duncdin Central) said that he was not in agree* nient with Mr. G. M. , Thomson. Hβ had not yofc arrived at "the conclusion that the making of a bet was a vice, but when he did come to that decision he would vote for the abolition of the totalisator. - dosired to see hunt clubs encouraged, and would support the measure. Mr. W. D. S. MACDONALD (Bay of Plenty) stated that he would support the Bill. . He believed that the greatest abuse of racing was the concentration of race meetings in the large centres, and lie advocated inoro meetings for country districts. . Thore was no question that the hunters in this country could be improved by the totalisator—by an offer of hotter prizes.. Our hunters neoded vast improvement; roiuiy.of them were "broken down gees of any kind."

The Country Districts. •Mr. 0. K. WILSON (Taumarunui) expressed tho opinion that the question was whether or not the four big centres wore to retain their great control oi racing. Parliament was absolutely gagged on this subject by tho big centres. Racing should be distributed somewhat on a population basis. This Bill aimed at a redistribution of racing days. ■ t> . A member: How are you. going to vote? ' ■ Mr. Wilson: I am. going to vote for the second reading of this Bill—make no mistake about that. Mr. Wilson said that race weotings should be fairly distributed' over tho ■country districts) so that tho people in 'the rural areas could get a :heap day's, amusement of this kind occasionally. He did not believe that the breeding of trotters should be encouraged; trotters generally wero mongrels. Mr. L. M. ' ISITT (Christchurch North)' supported a redistribution of permits, but opposed the increase of the number of racing days, and therefore opposed the Bill. \ If tho Government really wished to encourage the breeding of cavalry horses they could dp so much more effectively by increasing the tax upon the totahsator, and spending tho money in procuring good stallions, suitable for the breeding of these horses. Mr. A. H. HINDMARSH (Wellington South) argued the cause for the, towns. He said that if it was really a fact that the breed of horses could be improved by offering substantial at races, then the totalisator permits should be concentrated in tho towns and citios, where the revenuo was likely--to be greatest and the prizes consequently bigger. Advocates of Redistribution. Mr. G. J. ANDERSON (Mataura); in explaining his position in regard to the Bill, said that he recognised that .'horseracing was one of our national sports, aud that wherever there was horse-rac-ing thero would be gambling.. He did not think that the Bill was neoded, aad thought that it would have been bettor for. the Minister of ■• Internal Affairs to havo- taken advantage, of tho power given him by the Act to effect a readjustment of Taring days. If this was done, and , there was still a demand for more race days, it would be tim'o for the present Bill to be introduced. He did not favour the plan of tho Bill, and it, seemed to him that it would not suit the South Island at all. Ho would vote against the second readme of the Bill, because he considered thata readjustment of thb "metropolitan" days would get over the difficulty. ■ Mr. H. G. ELL (Christchurch South) announced that he would oppose the Bill. His opinion was that there were too many racing days allocated to the metropolitan areas, and that tho cry for the Bill would never have been heard had the days at present available been redistributed. He believed that the country would produce better horses if dprint events were eliminated from racing club's programmes. An hon. member: You would like to 'see them cut but by Act of Parliament? ■■ Mr. Ell: Yes, I would. Mr. H. ATMORE (Nelson) supported a redistribution, of permits, but not an .increase of them. , the House went to a division on the Bill at 7.55 p.m. The Division List. The following was the division list: —- Ayes, 38.—Allen, R. F. Bollard, Bu'chanan, Buddo, Buick, Campbell, Colvin, Escott, Fisher, Forbes, Fraser, -Ghithrie, Herdman, Hunter, LctvM'Cal-i j lum, M'Kenzie, Nosworthy, Okey,Poland, Pomare, Ranßihiroa, Reed, R. H. Rhodeß, T. W. Rhodes, Robertson, Scott, Seddon, Statliam, Sykes, Veiteh, Ward, Wilford, Wilkinson Wilson, Young, Mac Donald, Poarco. Noes, 10.—Atmoro, Buxton, Davoy, Hindmarsh, Hine, Mander, A. K. New--1 man, Parata, Ell, and Malcolm. Pairs:— Ayes: Dickeon, Hemes, Coates, J. Bollard, Webb, R. W. Smith, Carroll, Myers. Noes: <1. M. Thomson, Isitt, Anderson, Hanan, M'Combs, Russell, Craigie, Sidey. In Committee. Mr. Hunter asked leave to hnve the Bill committed forthwith, and , tho concession being granted by tho House, the Bill was committed accordingly. Mr. G. Forbes moved to alter the allocation of the extra permits to be grnhte'd. Tho Bill provided for 17 permits for ordinary race meetings, 10 for Hunt Clubs, and three for Trotting Clubs. Mr. Forbos's proposal was to Rrant 14 ordinary race permits, seven for Hunt Clubs l and nine for Trotting Clubs,. Tho object of.liia.amendment woe to inoroaee theuumbor of days for

trotting meetings, and the proposal Rave rise to a debate on the merits of the trotting horse as compared with the hunter or the thoroughbred. It developed into a squabblo between South and North Island members, the South Island members favouring trotting, which is a growing sport in tlio South Island, and the North Islanders advocating .the claims of tho hunt clubs. The member in chargo of tho Bill, Mr. Hunter, accepted tho amendment as a compromise, but it was opposed by most of the eupporters of tho Bill. \ An Important Amondment. After considerable debate, Tho Hon. F. M. B. Fisher suggested that tho total number of days proposed should be altered from 30 to 31 eo that trotting might bo allowed eight days, hunting eight days, and ordinary meetings 15 days. This was agreed 'to, and the Bill was amended accordingly. Tho Bill was then reported from Committee, read a third time, nnd passed— this shortly before midnight. FACTORIES ACT. The Factories Act Amendment Bill , was put through Committee without amendment, read a third time, and passed. At midnight the House rose till 2.30 p.m. on Tuesday next.