A SQUARE IDEAL.

Dominion, Volume 6, Issue 1692, 7 March 1913, Page 6

A SQUARE IDEAL.

PREMIER'S LABOUR POLICY. THE HUNTLY TROUBLE. FEDERATION'S ALLEGATIONS. MR. MASSEY'S REPLY.

Some warm words were spoken by the members of/ a Federation of Labour deputation which interviewed the Hon.- W. F. Massey (Prime Minister and Minister for Labour) yesterday in regard lo the present state of affairs ,in the mining township of Huntly. The deputation was introduced by Mr. J. Robertson, M.P. Its members were: Messrs. ,T. Fulton, AY, -R, Leather. J. Glover, It. S. I?oss, P. Hickey, and W. T. Mills, the last-named representing the United Labour party. A Petition. Mr. Robertson read and presented to the Prime Minister a petition which lie said bore the signatures of considerably over five hundred Huntly residents, more than half, the total population of. the township. The petition is a long one. It asks, in effect, for an inqmry> into the recent formation and registration of the new Hun(ly Miners' Union, and into the alleged victimisation of, members of the old union and of others who have sought admission in the new organisation, and, it is stated, have been excluded.

The first speaker was Mr. J. Fulton, president of the Woikato Miners' Union. He contended that the new union at Huntly had been brought into existence illegally, and said that he was prepared to stand in any court of law and testify that when the union was formed it lacked the number of members specified bv the Arbitration Act. At the time of its application for registration, 'Mr. Fulton declared.. the union had only three financial members. The Registrar of ' Industrial Unions (Mr. Lomas), he added, did not take steps to see that it was a bona-fide union that was applying for registration. Another point was the; illegality of the rues adopted by the uiiion. One of the rules gave the members the right to dissolve the. union. This was contrary to the Arbitration Act- which ,made provision only for cancellation. It was on these grounds that they asked for an in-' omry. The inaugural meeting of tlio nnion, supposed to have been held on October 28, Mr. Fulton continued, was never held. The Federation of Labour had tried vainly to get from the Department a list of j-the members «lio formed the union; He was prepared to say . that some of the s;Bnatnres on the form of application for registration were forged. -The law.' Mr J'ulton asserted was being- prostituted. The intention of the law had never been to bring into existence an prganisation of this kind, wh'le an overwhelming majority of men in the industry were against it. It was not in accordance with democratic principle _ that a injnority should rule: The Prime Minister would not like a minority to rule thb House of Representatives.

The Law. > ,1 he Prime Minister: lou*are referring Jo ths provision that allows fifteen men to form a union ? : . Mr, Fulton: Yes. / .Mr. Mnssey: That is the (aw. Mr. Fulton: It may b? the law, but it is not the intention of the Haw. It was ridiculous, Mr. Fulton went on to contend, that a number >of grocers, butchers, and "beer-chewers" should be able to become members of,a union, and to coerce tho miners 'engaged h'n the industry. It would lie easy toibring in 509 or 600 such members and upjet tho business of a union. , , . .. , "I am'dead against arbitration," continued Mr. Fulton. "I am .straight out for federation. I am dead i, against an organisation whoro a man has>to crawl-on his belly and beg for his'rights; I want him to up, and ask for ithein." After some further remarks on tj;e relations of employers and employees, II r. Fulton expressed the opinion, that "the lamb would have to be inside the lion before the two could lie down■ in peace." He added a hope that all good unions would break all laws and ' Vestrictions rather than endure the conditions that existed at Iluntly. When the new union applied for registration,•. Mr. Fultoii stated its rules were back in " the hands of the secretary' the day the union was registered. This was speedy work: "We ho'.d documentary evidence," said Mr, Fulton, "that you as Minister for, Labour were pushing the" matter through. "Answer My Question," . Mr. Massey: Kiiidly produce it. ' Mr. Fulton; I can produce it. Mr. Massey: Produce it how. 1 Mr. Fulton: You wero pushing the matter through. i v,

Mr. Massey: I)o you mean that I was pushing it thrpugli improperly or Ull- - . ' .Mr. Fulton: You were pushing it through. Mr. Jlassey: Answer my question! Mr. Fulton: Yes, I will say improperly. Mr. Masscy: 1 say that statement is' contrary to fact! Mr. Fulton: I shall produce the evidence. Mr. Massey (rising): You must accept my statement. If you-don't X refuse to hear you further! Sir. Fulton made some inaudible remark, and added that he had a copy of a wire in which. Mr. Massey said that he was "pushing the rules through." Mr. ilassey: Traduce that-statement.

There was a lull at this stage, during which -Mr. lto!::rlioii passed round tho table and spoke to Mr. Fulton.

Mr. Fulton then read n telegram from a man named Walsh, which read: "lie* ceiycd wire from Massey, Prime Minister, that application had been received, and that lie was pushing it through." Mr. Massey: That is not my. wire. I don't accept it as a copy of anything I forwarded. You said that yon would produce a copy of. my wire, .and you have done nothing of the sort. I am prepared to stand by anything that 1- put into a wire; make no mistake about that. That seems to indicate, that there had been some delay and that he wired me to expedite matters. 1 am prepared to place tho original upon the table of the House. Now we get back to the point that we left. You made a most improper statement with regard- to myself— you said that I had pushod the matter through improperly and unfairly. Mr. Fulton: I said improperly, perhaps. Flat Contradiction. Mr. Massey: I give that statement a llat contradiction, and ask you to accept my statement. Mr. Fulton: Well, I accept your statement. In his concluding remarks, Mr. Fulton contended that victimisation had been rife at Huntly siuee the lormation of the new union. He stated that those responsible had not been content with victimising nine men, of whom he was one. On December 20 nineteen other men were dismissed, and on February 3 six men were dismissed because they signed a requisition for a meeting of the union. On February 17 eight men were got rid of for taking «n active part in matters connected with the union. Men from Home were being brought in, Mr. Fulton asserted, with a view to quietening things down, but these men were receiving an education that would produce further unrest.

Strong Words. Mr. W. R. Leather, fanner and cxpresidcut of the Waiknto Miners' Union, said he had been connectcd with unions for a number of years. Although the lluntly miners had gone to the Arbitrntl.iii Court from time to time it had become progressively more difficult to earn a living at the mines, as the pils had none deeper. The company had now abolished the union minimum, and raised the schedule rate twopence per ton. Coiucideiilly it had raised the price to the consumer Is. per ton. "You will pay another shilling a ton when you gel. in your coals this winter, Mr. Massey," remarked the speaker. Twopence, he added, went lo tlio men, and tenpence to the company. In all his experience, he added, he had never known such a, dastardly outrage oil decency n> the formation of the new union at Huutly. It was composed of

the "rag-tag and bob-tail and the scum of tho earth." The' time had come, Jlr. Leather continued, to give the old unionists a fair and square deal, not altogether by an amendment of tho law, but also by mi amendment of the tactics followed by the employers in forcing men to join tho new union. The coal-miners worked hard. Many of them had sacrificed and saved to get homes for themselves, yet they were coming to tho opinion 'that they would havo to get out of it. Such a state of intimidation and coercion in a democratic oountry was intolerable. .He asked tho Prime Minister to go to Huntly and conduct an inquiry. The employers said that the miners should not organise. The Prime Minister: Has anybody said that tho miners shall not organise? •Mr. Leather: Well, tho employers say that they shall not organise as they like. We ivant you to deal out that big square deal that you promised to both workers and farmers (he went on to remark), "especially to, the farmers, and I am ono of them. Mr. Massey: Y<jU are a combination of miner and farmer, a very good one too. The Square Deal. Mr. Leather reiterated his request for a "square deal." Mr. Masf-.oy: I suppose you will admit that during the six years I represented Huntiy both sides got a square deal? Mr. Leather: Oh, yes; but now we expect something more. Kcmember the poor! Mr. Massey: Then lam afraid that you would be overlooked! You have set forth your grievances very nicely. Now I want to have your suggestions for remedying the trouble. Mr, Leather said that an inquiry should be made into the working of the provision that fifteen men may form a union. Mr. Massey: Do you suggest that the number should be increased? Mr. Leather: I maintain that it should be done by a majority of the men employed in an industrv.

iho Prime Minister mentioned that he had before him the report of Mr. llarle Giles (Conciliation Commissioner), who had paid a visit to Huntly to inquire into the industrial trouble there. Mr. J. Glover said that there had undoubtedly been' Something "crook" in connection with the formation of the new union at Huntly. This charge lie was quite perpared to prove. Not long ago, Mr. Glover added, some minutes asked for at a meeting of the union were found to have been torn out of the book, and now the;,- could not be'found. The Waikato Miners' linion had proof that a statement had appeared in the book that the minutes had been .confirmed on a date when 110 meeting had been held. The position was that six self-appointed men had been allowed to draw up an agreement that governed 500 men. The five hundred had 110 say as to who should represent them at the conference preceding tho agreement. Tho Federation of Labour was prepared at any moment to accept the result Of a ballot of the Huntly miners as to whether they should have aii arbitration union or a union under the Trades Union Act. The law should ba amended to provide that when a union had been formed in any industry it should be illegal to form another union unless a majority of the. men in the industry favoured that course. Trouble Threatened.

Mr. J. Robertson supported most of what had been, said by the previous speakers. Ho said that he did not deny that the formation of the new union was quite in accordance with the law. lie did not advocate the repeal of the provision enabling, fifteen men to form a union, but held that where a union existed no other should bo formed, save at the wish of a' majority.. .The rules of the new Huntly union were designed to keep the men right down under the heels of the bosses; The Court litfd made an award which would never have been given had the case been fought in the ordinary way. It was a fact that men had been dismissed because they signed a requisition asking for a meeting of the union. During the last two months 43 men had been dismissed under similar circumstances, and most of tliejn had had to leave the country, although others wcro being brought'in.i n,,;;. ' Mr. Massey:. No State-assisted miners ore brought in-as immigrants. Mr. Robertson: lam aware of that, but they came as assistod labourers, just as domestic servants come in, to get married next week. It was a fact, lie' continued, that men of good character, recognised as good workers, had been domed admission to the now union. It was also a fact that the m£n responsible for tho formation of the new union were the' rag-tag and bob-tail of the place. Popular, sympathy in Huntly had swung round in favour of the miners, and personally he wondered why they had not kicked over the traces long ago. He had addressed a meeting of miners at Huntly. and believed that if he had said "strike," they would have struck. There was .going., to., lie .trouble unit's something was done to remedy the position. ' In replv to a question, Mr. Massey said that ho did not'want to tie himself down in the matter of a majority governing the formation, of a union, beoausel he wanted to hear both sides. lie. read the amended rules of the union to show that honorary members were no longer' admirable.- • • Mr. Mills said'that in dealing with tho question of majority rule it'was necessary to carefully guard the interests of the actual workers in an industry.' Mr. J. Lomas. Secretary for Labour, said that when the application for registration of the new union came before him he sent >to the local agent and asked him if the 11 nines of the. signatories were bona Me- He pot a' reply in the affirmative. Then he submitted the'rules to the Crown 1.0.iv Office,' after consultation with tho Prime Minister, and the Crown- LawOffice advised that he was bound to register. ' ' . ■ PRIME MINISTER IN REPLY. A SECOND INQUIRY.

The Prime Minister, speaking in reply, said that it' had been suggested that Mr. Ilarle Giles should, go to Huntly and report. .Mr. llnrle Giles visited Huntly in January, and. his.report was.before' him (the Prime Minister) alt tho present tinm. Later, lie had received a' letter frojn Mr. O'Regan, solicitor to tho' Federation of Labour, calling liisatlontion to 'the grievances at Huntly..After. receiving this letter he had given\ini>tructions that Mr. Newton, a Labour department inspector at Auckland, mid a very capable and conscientious officer, should visit Huntly. It was quite likely that Mr. Newton was at present inquiring l into .the condition of affairs there. At all events, Mr. Newton had received instructions in that direction. The discussion that had v taken .place had cleared up one' or two points.. He assured members of tho deputation' arid the public that the Government understood that its first duty was ito ndminister the law as they found it. Mr. Lonias', who was a trusted and capable officer, 1 would bear him out when he sMd thai: the instructions given !o' him (Mr. I.onias) had always been that ho was to administer the law fearlessly and impartially. "And I think," added Mr. Massey, "that ho has always done it. That is the position at the moment," lie continued. "If the law is defective, then it is the duty of Parliament to alter the law. As head of the 1 Government, 1 'wish to say that we can find nothing better than-the Arbitration Act to take ; its place. Fvery opportunity will bo given to the Parliament and people of this country to mend the Labour laws of the country during next, session. A square deal lias been referred io this morning. I will uso that: term again, and slate tliat it is the desire of the Government and my own desire to place such an industrial Act on the Statute Book as will give a square deal to all concerned—to employees on the. one hand, whether unionists or not, and to employers on tho other. 1 beliove that we shall be able to achieve that object and to restore the industrial peace, which I am sorry to say has been disturbed during the last twelve months."

In reply to questions, Mr. Massey paid that Mi\ Newton would be instructed to communicate ■with the Waikato Minors' Union, as well as with other parties eoncorned in the troubles at Iluutly. Men who hud been discharged would' also bo interrogated, and Mr.- Newton Would inquire into the circumstances under which men were reported to have been refused admission to the new unions both at Waihi and lluntl.v. Mr. Robertson thanked the Prime Minister for receiving the denutation.