UNIVERSITY REFORM.

Dominion, Volume 5, Issue 1269, 26 October 1911, Page 9

UNIVERSITY REFORM.

TALK IN PARLIAMENT. PREMIER ANNOYED. THREATENS TO POSTPONE ELECTIONS. A.n nnimntcd discussion arose in tlio House of "Representatives yesterday upon tho report of tho Education Committco upon tho petition of 'J'. H. Laby anil others praying for the. appointment of a Eoyal Commission, lo inquire into tho questionof university administration and education in Xev; Zealand. Tho report states inter alia, that the committco is of opinion that a case has been made out for reform in tho constitution of tho New Zealand University, moro particularly in tho direction of the utilisation in a larger measure than at. present of tho professorial stall's of the colleges in the framing of curricula and syllabuses and in tho conduct of examinations, but that tho appointment of a Koyal Commission is not necessary at present,' as tho committee believes that the university is itself moving in a direction which will grart■ually evolve a schemo of reform, lhe committee also states that fees at all tho colleges should bo uniform, that all tho colleges should be adequately endowed, ond that Parliamentary grants of a permanent character should be .statutory. It Teconimends that the financial position of each college should be inquired into on its merits,' and that the Inspector-General of Schools should be unpointed to inquire into this matter, and that of the strengtnening of library equipment. Tho report adds that, considering its age and other factors, the University has done good work, and that, with reform on lines indicated, it will extend its usefulness and become increasingly identified with tho practical life of the community. Mr. T. K. Sidey (chairman of the committee) moved that the report be laid on the table, and be referred to the Government for consideration. An Important Report. Mr. Herdman declared that the petition w.ns the most important presented to the House that session. The report v a s correspondingly important. Mr. Russell interjected that it was impossible to discuss tho question that session. . , ~ Mr. Hordmnn: "But tho lion, gentleman may not be here next year!" Mr. liu.ssell: "I will back my chance against yours." Mr. Heirdman: Then you have an excellent chance. You have got a certainty. The Prime Minister at this stage broke in with a remark that ho proposed to ask the House to defer tho elections for another three weeks. Mr. Massey: "That's all right! 'Mr. Herdman said that it was absolutely wrong that members of tho Ilouso should bo asked not to discuss important questions because- business was being hurried through. He could not understand why the committee had failed to recommend that a Eoyal Commission should be set up. They had found that reform was necessary, but said that tho universities could euro themselves. Tho report was thus illogical. It was equivalent to saying that one who was sick should be able to euro himself without the aid of expert medical assistance. Experts had united in declaring that the universities in Now Zealand were out of date, and tho burden of evidence went to show that a Eoyal Commission was necessary. The Inspector-General of Schools could not do what was necessary, and the Senate could not reform itself. It had never •admitted that reform was necessary. During the thirty 'years of its existence the New Zealand Universityhad drifted. It would bo of no use setting about-tho task of reform in a halfhearted way. Tho best advico obtainable should be got from some high authority outside New Zealand altogether. If such an authority, after duo investigation, promulgated a scheme, ho felt sure that it would be unanimously accepted by the people of this country. He had suggested to the committee that it should obtain the services of Dr. Hill, an English exjjert of high standing, and get two local men : of business ability to assist him. Had this been done, a report so authoritative would have been obtained that the House would not have hesitated to act upon it, and the result would have been good for the country. Ho moved as an amendment:—"That the evidence and papers lie on the table, that the evidence bo printed, and that tho report bo referred back to tho committee for reconsideration." Mr. G. M. Thomson (Dunedin North) deprecated the attempt to . burke a discussion on such an important question, lis thought Mr. Herdman was wrong in claiming that the petitioners had proved their case. , It was well known that there was much hostility to tho prayer of tho petition on tho part oi men engaged in the administration of the university colleges. . In his opinion tho university course was defective because in tho majority, of cases a degree was made the single objective of tho students. It would be advisable that action in.tho matter should be postponed until tho senate of tho university had an opportunity at its next meeting to formulate its scheme, and the Inspector-General of Schools could give his advice on tho subject. "A Contemptible Triviality." Mr. G. Lauronson (Lyttelton) asked irhcthor members were going to spend iny more timo in discussing a question upon which they could not possibly arrive at a conclusion. It was a mighty easy thing for the member for Wellington North, living hero in- Wellington, to spend time on a question. like this, but it did not add to his popularity with eighty men who were wanting to get back to their constituencies. Mr. llcrdman had f-Xfken only in the interests of a couple oi dozen well-paid gentlemen. Tho Prime Minister would raise troublo ■ in his own party if lis appointed a Royal Commission to inquire into a question of this kind when so many moro important questions were awaiting consideration. Mr. Lauronson registered his strong and bitter protest at this unncccsBary waste of time. Oppositionists: .Time! Mr. Laurenson mid he would take his time. Ho protested again against the "unneighbourly action" of tho member for Wellington North, who was free to practise his profession and address the electors whenever ho pleased, while other members wero prevented from returning to their constituencies. Concluding, Mr. laurenson described tho question before the House os "a contemptible triviality, which the House ought to deal with in a couple of hours." Mr. Russell said tho question was so important a_oao that it could not bo intelligently discussed at this late hour of the session. As Mr. Russell continued speaking he was interrupted by a cry of "Don't waste timo" from the Opposition benches. Mr. Fisher said ho did not wish to keep the House, but if they did not discuss th: matter they would bo a party to laying an adverse report on tho table of the House, no would like to spo.nk on the motion, . a.nd had all the notes for a ppeech, but would agree not to make it if the House would refer the matter back to tho Committee. Extraordinary Speeches. Air. Massey referred to tho extraordinary speeches delivered by tho two Can tcrbiiry members. One said universit.i training was ?. contemptible triviality and the other said it. was so importan Hint it mvuld not bo properly disenssec this session. He would Irave these Iwc mombers to settle their differences. Tin vituperative and abusive speech of lh< incmbfr for Lytlelton was tho sort o thing tli.it would lead to waste of tirrr and, moreover, the time of the Parlia ineiit was wasted by discussing t.rivinli ties at the commencement of the session Mr. Sidey deprecated tho appointmen of a Royal Commission. Ho did no think it "was noctsrary. The' Prime Minister said ho reeognise< that thore was not tims to discuss th report before tho House. Any forcei discussion would do more harm thai good. There was a certain amount o work that must be done. He had no attempted to drive the House. 'I'M session they had not had an all-nigh sitting. Mir. Massey: We have sat up till fiv o'clock stveral times. Mr. Isitt: That was when the hor gentleman set up r. stonewall! The unparliamentary expression wo withdrawn by order of tho Speaker. Tho Prime Minister said that if it too until the end of next week or tho wee

following ho proposed to ask the House to do its work. On some days lately practically nothing had been done. Tho General Election. Ho had sonic thought ot asking tho House lo po.-tpmn.' the coining general election unlit lhe middle of January, it was iiiipo.-.siblo fur him to climate when the general clu-tkm was g-.iing to lake place. The position at present seemed to bo that it would be necessary to have the general election clu»o up to Christmas, and thu Njcuiul ballot close up to New Year. The elections would thus take place at a time when the people were entitled to be clear of the turmoil of politics. Tho Prime Minister, niter some further allegations of time-wasting by tho llou=e, repeated that it might be necessary—ho could not speak definitely— to postpone the general elections until lhe ea.iiy pan «i next year. He was not going to drop measures, as tho Leader of the Opposition had suggested. Homo oi them had to go througn, and, it necessary, ho would telegraph members on his own side who had left tor their homes to como back and complete tho business before the House. SpeaKing to his own party, the Prime Miniver said tliat he believed the constituencies oi members who Had stuck to their duties would honour and appreciate tliein all the more for it. The work done since Monday had been infinitesimal, and at the rate at which they were going it would be impossible to cunclude the business, certainly tins week, and probably next week. The term oi the present Parliament expired on November •_'), but he was not going to drop Hills on this account. Tho Prinio Minister was proceeding lo make some general remarks about the Opposition, when iir. James Allen raised a point of order, on the ground that the Prime Minister's speech was irrelevant. Tho Speaker remarked that the Prinio Minister was making a Ministerial statement. If a member objected ho could not proceed. Mr. Allen: Then I object to the waste of time! Sir William Steward moved the adjournment of the debate. Air. Allen hoped tins would not bo carried, because if it were the report would not bo laid on the table and the evidence would not be printed. He suggested that both amendments should bo withdrawn and the matter could then como up next year. Mr. Herdman agreed to this course. Sir Joseph Ward: I object. (Laughter.) The Prime Minister went on to explain that already time had been wasted, and as they would have a discussion on answers to questions, they would lose tho whole 'tiltcruoon. He/sides, if the amendment wero withdrawn, who was to say that some other members would not discuss the report. Mr. Herdman, speaking with some warmth', said no member had a right to stand that sort of thing. Tho question was a most important' one, and members had a perfect right to discuss it if they pleased. He had no intention of wasting time. Sir Joseph Ward rose to a point of order. Mr. Ilerdmaii could not, ho said, discuss speeches that had been made. Mr. Speaker said that was so. Mr. Herdman said ho had been misrepresented, and ho was entitled to a personal explanation. It had been said that he was wasting tho time of tho ; House. Ho wanted to make it perfectly ' clear that as a member of that House ' he had a duty to perform to the coun- ' try, and to .his" constituents, and he would ' not be deterred i'romjloing so. "So long ; as 1 stand in the iiouso here," added ■ Air. Herdman, "no matter what tho ■ Right Hon. gentleman may say, and no • matter how ho mav threaten, I shall ■ do it." : Sir Joseph Ward again rose to a point > of order. Mr. Herdman was speaking, '■ ho said, on a motion for adjournment, . and discussing tho speeches that had been . made. He asked it' ho could do that. ; Air. Speaker: No. : Sir Joseph Ward: Well, ho is defying ' your ruling. Hon. members: No! No! Air. Speaker: I don't think he is doing. ) that, but he was going beyond what ' was necessary in making a personal exi planation. Air. Herdman: Very well, Sir. ; This ended the discussion. Sir William Steward's amendment was lost by 50 votes to 3, and A[r. Hcrdnian's amendment was withdrawn on tho voices. _ The report of the committee was laid on the table.