THE HOUSE.

Dominion, Volume 5, Issue 1257, 12 October 1911, Page 6

THE HOUSE.

QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS. AN OFFICIAL'S RESIGNATION. COMPLAINS OF DEPARTMENTAL INTERFERENCE. The House mot at 2i30 yesterday afternoon. Tho following Bills were read a first time:—Christchurcli District Drainage Amendment (Hon. D. Buddo), Dating Amendment (Hon. D. Buddo), Elingamito Behearing (Hon. J. A. Millar), Dunedin Technical School Site (Hon. T. Mackenzie). . , DAYLIGHT SAVING. The M to Z Petitions Committee, reporting on several petitions praying that the House would pas 3 tho Daylight Saving Bill, recommended that they should bo referred to tho Government for conBideration, but added: "There is no evidence before tho Committee to show that tho Bill would bo of any advantage to tho people in tho country districts." Mr. C. H. POOLE (Auckland West) ■urged that tlio Government should tako ■up-i'ho Bill. Mr. G. V. PEARCE (Tatea) opposed the Bill which he said would be against tho interests of the farmers who lmd to get up at.daylight now. Tho Farmers' Union in Taranaki had. passed a strong resolution against it'. Ho also mentioned that tho Committee had only rejected by tlio chairman's casting vote a motion opposing the Bill on the ground that it' would be injurious to. farming interests. Tho roport was adopted.

A RESIGNATION. NATIVE LAND BOARD AND DEPARTment. •Mr.' HURRIES asked the Native Minister (Sir Jas. Carroll) whether his attention hart been drawn to the following etntenient reported to have teen made by Mr. A. Keef'er, president of the Tairawhiti land Board, witli reference to liis • resignation: "Gentlemen of the Bar, X ■wish to annonuco that in all probability this will be my last sitting as president of the board. 1 have had interference and dictation from the head of tho Department in the administration of my judicial duti«s, which I immediately resented; Jo, preferring not to sacrifice my manhood and the dictates of my conscience, I liave tendered my resignation to tho Hon. Sir James Carroll, Native Minister, preferring to do this and give up my position and remuneration in place of occupying any false position"; and whether he did not think it desirable to placo officers holding judicial positions out of reach of interference in. their judicial duties? The MINISTER replied that matter had been brought under his .notice. There had becn.no interference or dictalion by tho Department of Native Affairs in respect of tho performance of any judicial duties by the president of the Tai.rawhiti Maori Land Board. The Maori. "Land Boards had important 'administrative) functions, and in the exer- . cise. o£ these functions they were properly subject to general supervision by the Department. In thiis respect tho relation between the Maori Land 'Boards anil the Undersecretary of Native Affairs was very similar to that which exists between the Crown Land Boards and tho UnderSecretary of Lands. This supervision was absolutely necessary for tho proper mid uniform administration of Native laud?, and the Minister had no reason to believo that it has been exercised in any improper manner in the case of the Tairawmtr Maori I/and Board. Mr. HEKEIES said it was rather pocnJiar that tho president of the board and the Minister should differ as to whether there had been interference with the former ill his judicial dirties. So far as one from .the correspondence there had been considerable interference. He Imped the Minister would lay on tho tablo alt papers relative to this resignation, lire only conclusion the public could w.iw was that there had been Departmental interference with an oflicer in his judicial capacity. Sir ,/. as ' said he was sorry to Jose this officer, but he had not been Ion? in the service, and had not had tho trai£ IBS which made 0110 recognise official refKf?' 1 ® u \ control by an important JXpartinenK As president of tho board lie had performed his work honestly and fairly and with every dispatch, in the TO-eamt case the Minister thought that Mr. Keefer had erred on the side of ultra ron-sitiveness. Ihe.ro had been no interview'm I 0 ™ -1 departmental P oi,lt of pinl JJ 'r 110 ',"i prfprell ce with his jurtitS nT'tl, t? Hon was whether tne head of the Department, who w is rewTenHtl | r t 0«t Of tILO Act, entitled to transmit DepartmentnJ TMWion auestions that might cKrfo™ the board ln ito, administration of tte rasi >aS TIm r" s done iu tll= T«sr xfssv*. of e H ha< ' subdivision jjr pQ.rturo-11 oi the lutci-est in this blook lhe president of the board Krantpd iru plications for certain areas of tho block. Mr. ller.ries: It «-a S within tho law Sir James CARROLL said it « haies a question which part of the hw land ''ind wen partitioned by (he CoLi-t 'Ph;= " 'iSLt ««'£: °' Mr MASSLY said he was glad-that the Minister had agreed to lav the pawrs on tho (able, and had admitted fhatMr Ivcefer i\as a good officer. If the Seere tilry 01 the. Department in Wellington Tieie permitted to interfere with tlionre tiCiilly took that official's place. Mr '•*] m° lclt n s™d (k-ai of svm- / i"! i *' ilau who had resigned 31© Sad her. rd of cases in which the nrethinn4 °fW' ln 'l <l Boml luul things that were not within the four corners ot tho aw, and in these ca=es no Wont a tnkon ll) ' tl,e BUDGET ERRORS. MINISTERIAL EXPLANATION. . jk' r - ALLEN (Bruce) aske<l the Minister lor I mancc—(l i Whether the statement on page XXV of his Budget— name y, that ,C2!> Us. Sd. is lid. in the Jjound on <£700— is correct; if not, how he proposes to corrcct the error; and (2) whether the statement on page XXV of Ins Budget—that in N OIV Zealand a tax--1S 1" ','! vi - 11 W 1I(I ' in t,lc pound on tiib> ■ 111 excess °f tho exemption of is correct; if'not, how he proposes to correct Clio error? Sir J. G. WARD replied: Instructions were given, as usual, lo have the whole tf the figures in the Statement, checked. , I find, however, that, owing to a misunderstanding between two Departmental officers, each supposing the othor had dono so, tho figures in this case wero inadvertently not checked by either. Tho amount of it.come tax should have been calculated at Bd. in the jxuind, not lid. giving ,£23 Gs. Bd., inatead of ,£29 lis*, 15(1. as stated. It will, however, very el early bo seen that Iho error in cmestion was, vpon the comparison I "was making, in my favour, thus showing that I_ was not endeavouring to understate tec amount paid by tho taxpayer in New Zealand who is in reccipt, of*on incomo of .CIOOO per annum. The armwiut, „C 23 Gs. 8d„ compares most favourably with the 18s. Id. paid in Knglnnd and .£9O in Frankfort by a per«>n iece.iving a similar incomt3. Attention will bo called to the error in, tho usual way when tho bound ixx»rds. of Parliamentary papers are being inado no. Mr. ALLEN remarked that tho occnrrencc of errors in this way made one very doubtful as to what volno could be placed -U£on tlip statemcnte contained in the

budget. It was unfortunate that so important a document should l:o laid upon the table in such a condition. He liad unearthed some half-a-dozeu errors in going through only two or three pages in the itudgct.. Mo doubt ou close rxaiiiina-

tiou, other errors woulil bo disclosed. Tliis sort of tiling was to bo deplored, and if they distrusted tho Budget they were ' not to lio blamed. Mr. ISITT said that ho looked upon | tho presence of n lew clerical and statistical erroi's in the Budget as a kindly dispensation designed to lighten tho gloom that would otherwise permanently descend on the member for Bruce. Sir Joseph WARD said the member for Bruce was not satisfied with a straightforward reply. He winded (o make out that the whole of (ho financial Statement was incorrect. 31 r. j\!lon: No, I said a good deal of it. Tho Prime Minister said the member for Bruce had never been able, to show that any Statement presented by him was wrong. * The latest Financial Statement had becu produced in its entirety after his arrival in .New Zealand. NEW ZEALAND FISHERIES, FOREIGN EXPLOITERS.Answering a question by: Mr. Poole, The MINISTER FOR MARINE said it was understood lU'at certain Norwegian iirms proposed to carry on whaling oil' tho New Zealand coasts, and to moor vessels in suitable harbour* for use as floating factories, for the purposo of working up tho by-products into marketable commodities. There was no law to prevent this provided the harbour and health regulations were complied with. It was not likely that many whales would be caught in'territorial waters, and it was not within the power of,tho Dominion to prevent anyone taking tnem outside such waters. Mr. POOLE complained that the reply was not very satisfactory and not very encouraging. If a floating factory of this kind was to be permitted in our harbours it would introduce competition of a veryunfair and very- unsatisfactory nature. Complete charts were available and this foreign vessel might scrape our fishing and whaling grounds-bare and prevent any possibility of a local industry being developed. If legislation did not exist to prevent this sort of thing, it. should be provided as soon as possible. Ho was also informed that the seal rookeries on the islands to the south were being exploited by foreign schooners. Their crews were aware of the periods at which the Government steamers visited the islands and avoided them at these periods. It was no doubt right that seals should be protected, but if foreigners were t'o be allowed to exploit the rookeries in. this way tho same privilege slionld be granted to New Zonlandors. Mr. HA NAN simportcd the view taken by Mr. Poole and contended that there was ground for a national complaint'. WORKERS' COMPENSATION. A NEEDED REFORM. Mr. M'LAREN drew the attention of the 3linister for Labour to the case of Sherwood v. the New Zealand Shipping Company—a claim under tho Workers' Compensation for Accidents Act. In this casxs plaintiff's husband (from whom she was separated) met his death by accident whilst ill tho employ of tho company. Tho Court held that the woman was not a dependent under tho Act, although sho had.a claim against her husband (under an order of the Court) for maintenance at tho rate of 15s. per week. Mr. M'Laivn, asked tho Minister whether he would make provision, in tho amending Bill before the House, for the adequate protection of women who may hereafter ' bo placed in tho same position as plaintiff in this case. Tho MINISTER replied that he had noted the decision referred to and was construing the Crown Law Officers on the subject with a view, if possible, to giving any persons likely to be similarly affected the protection of tlie Act. CROSS CREEK COTTAGES. "MISERABLE HUTS." Mr. BUCHANAN nsked the Minister for Rail ways to cause the railway employe?';' dwellings at Cross Creek "to bo renovated, and replace tho present tworoomed cottages by more suitable buildings. Mr. Buchanan stated that the present buildings are shabby and unworthy of the Department, that there arc no inducements to keep tho surroundings neat and cleaii, and that the whole place needs improvement. The MINISTER replied that .the railway cottages at Cross Creek were kept in a state of good repair. They compared favourably with houses in other parts of the district. Thero were no two-roomed cottages at Cross Creek. It was recognised that the location, owing tu climatic conditions, made it difficult'to keep the exteriors of the cottages bright and cheorful. The samo remark applied.?in other localities to houses, both private and Government-owned; situated near engine depots. Mr. BUCHANAN said that (he denial as to there being any two-roomed cottages at Cross Creek was very disingenuous. Some of the cottages had a lean-to which made them'.of two and a. half rooms. The wholo answer to his question was unsympathetic, and had tho hard and unyielding character usual in replies from this Department. Ho had previously had occasion to complain of tho miserable huts in which railwaymen had to live, and ho regretted that there was to bo no improvement. Mr. G. AT. THOMSON said it was quite true tliat tho buildings at Cross Creek were shabby and unworthy of tho Department. The Hon. J. A. MILLAR said tho member for Wairarapa had called him hard and unsympathetic. Whero in tho country were private employers building cottages equal to those provided for railway employees? The Cross Creek cottages were kept in repair, and tho peoplo living in thorn made no complaints. It was another ease of manufacturing grievances. Tile Railway Department was as sympathetic towards its employees as anv other employer, but there were hundred's of cottages built years ago which could not bo dispensed with at once. Nothing could bo done to beautify the cottages at Cross Creek or to cultivate gardens. The MINISTER FOR KAIL WAYS declined to accede to a request by Mr. Buchanan that the Department should repair the road and foot-bridgo leading to tho Cross Creek railway station. Mr. Millar stated that, this road was neither erected nor maintained by the Railway Department, but by the Roads Department. There was a store on the railway sjdo from which supplies could bo obtained, and a crossing adjacent to the station anct■present requirements. ' Mr. BUCHANAN said that the existing facilities for crossing tho stream by no means met requirements. He hoped" the Minister would look into it and remedy it. Tho MINISTER said that if the footbridge at Cross Creek had been carried away it would be repaired when a gang was available. RAILWAY CASUAL LABOUR. Replying to Mr. M'Laren, the Minister for Railways Stated that all employees, whether permanent or casual, who are paid at a daily rate havo been granted a day's leave on pay for Dominion Day. The arrangement does not, however, apply to casual men who are employed by tho hour. Such men are paid only for the time they work. Mr. M'LAREN said it was time that the Government considered the question of employing men by tho hour. Somo men had been employed as hourly casuals for years, and they should be placed upon a better footing. Mr. ELL urged that all casuals should be placed upon the same footing as men employed in the goods sheds. Mr. MILLAR said the Railway Department employed 7000 men from hour to hour, and he did not know of anyone \£ho paid men so employed for time not worked. COROMANDEL GRANITE. Mr. TAYLOR asked tho Minister for Pnblic Works to direct that tenders should be called for erecting the wholo front of the new Parliamentary Buildings ' in Ceromandel granite or, in tho alternaI five, for erecting the base up to the first floor in that material. Tho MINISTER replied that the Government would select material on the advice of responsible officers. STUDY OF ASTRONOMY. Mr. T. jr. WILFORD (Hutt) asked the Minister for Defen :e whether he will allow a small portion of the Kelburno Defence Rcsorve to bo vested in trustees for the purpose of uu astronomical observa*

Tory for the City of Wellington; and whether, in tho event of legislation being necessary, he will introduce a short clause this session to give legal effect to (lie necessary disposition? iSir J. U. WA It I) replied that a quarter of an acre of tho reserve will be set apart by the Government for this purpose, and a long leaso given to tho society. AN INJURED PROPERTY. Mr. A. L. IITIRDMAN (Wellington xsertli) asked tho Minister for Lauds whether lie is prepared to give effect to tho report of the Lands Committee upon tho petition of .Mi's. O'Connor, praying for compensation for injury done to her proP"rl.v in the Northland district. Sir .1. (I. WAIil) replied: This inaiter was considered upon a former occasion when, upon reference to the Crown Law Ollicers, the Government' was advised that the petitioner had no claim either at law »:■ ill equity. The question will, however, be further considered with other petitions in tho customary way before the supplementary estimates are finally dealt with. JUVENILE GAMBLERS. Mr. T. K. SIDEY (Cavorsham) asked the Government whether their attention his been called to certain articles which appeared in the Dunedin ""Evening Star" ot September 1G last on tho subject of gambling in chocolates by okildren. and will lie, as toon as possible, endeavour to obtain legislative power to enable him to effectively deal with this form of lottery and put a stop to tho objectionable features disclosed by tho articles referred to? Sir J. G. WARD replied: My attention has been called to tho matter, which is recehing coirsidor.ition. It is most desirable that children should, if possible, be prevented from indulging in a practice of the kind referred to. DEBENTURES. Mr. W. If. UKRRIKS (Tauranga) asked the Minister for Finance wliy the following debentures, which camo due in the yeaT ended March 31, 1011, do not appear in 11. —lSn, in the table of loans or debentures matured during 1910-11— namely, .£500,000 due September 1, 1910? riSotc.-In tho Year liook of 1910, page 1173, tho total amount of debentures maturing in tho year ended March 31, 1911, is given as <£1,123,415, whereas B.—lSn only accounts for ,£025,190.1 Sir .1. G. WARD replied: The debentures for <£500,000 referred to were only issued temporarily for a few months, as security for an axlvanee of that amount obtained from the Hank of England pending the raising of a loan fox Government advances to settlors purposes, nnd were rightly excluded from B.—lßb, as being only a. working transaction and not a part of the permanent debt. A reference to Ji.—lßn for the previous year will show that tho amount did not appear in that return in the list of debentures to mature during 1910. ' NATIVE LICENSING POLLS. Mr. POOLE asked the Nativo Minister whether he was aware that the taking of licensing polls in certain Maori areas liad been delayed, and what reason could be given lor this, seeing that the Maoris had notified their willingness to proceed? Sir Jas. CARROLL replied that owing to the general election taking place at an early date it was considered desirable to follow the European procedure, and tako the two polls on the same date, as by so doing expense would be considerably minimised. A CONCESSION REFUSED. The MINISTER FOR RAILWAYS doc.lined to accept a suggestion by Mr. J. C. Thomson that excursion tickets should bo granted to school teachers during the term holidays. Mr. Millar said he saw no reason why teachers should bo given a concession not granted to other sections of tlio public. HOUSE ALLOWANCE. The PRIME MINISTER stated, in reply to Mr. Luke, that it was not intended to increase tho house allowance of detectives at present. SMALL GRAZING RUNS, Tho lion. T. DUNCAN asked the Hon. D. Buddo whether he would see that clauses in the Rating Act of last yeai which altered the rates on small grazinj runs wero amended, so as to leavo the rates as formerly. The Hon. D. BUDDO replied that tin Minister for Lands had been looking intc tlie matter, a,id proposed to remove th< anomaly by which small grazing rum were affected. It might l>o possible to d< it by a revaluation, and if this wero not effective, then an amendment of the lav would be introduced.

BUSINESS OF THE SESSION. TO END NEXT WEEK At the evening silting, The PRIME MINISTER (Sir .T. G. Ward) moved that on arid after Monday next tho House should meet on Mondays at 2.30 p.m. for Government business only. The LEADER of the OPPOSITION (Mr. Massey) asked that next Monday be not included, as several members (not himself) had engagements to address meetings in the country. He also asked tho Prime Minister to state what Bills ho proposed to go on with. Mr. J. ALLEN (Bruce) asked whether full opportunity would be given to deal with local Bills. Sir J. G. AVARD said that what could bo' done with local Bills on the morrow would bo done, and then if nocessarv a further opportunity would be given. Unless tho second ballots wore to be takon after Christmas, which appeared to bo the only possibility under existing conditions, the House would recjiiiro to sit at 2-30 next Monday. He would imiko a statement next I'riday as to Iho business tho Government proposed to put through this session. The Public Works Statement would bo delivered next Monday, and a time for discussing it would then be fixed. If the Leader of the Opposition and House generally would 00-oper-ate with the Government, he saw no reason why tho session should not 1m brought to an end on Thursday or Friday week— or certainly on Saturday week. Mr. MASSEY suggested that tho House should meet at 7.30, not 2.30, next MonT'iio PRIME MINISTER agreed to this. Tho motion was amended accordingly, and passed. PUBLIC SERVICE CLASSIFICATION. Th? PRIME MINISTER made a statement to tho House in reference to tho Public Service Classification laid on tho tablo that afternoon. As yet it had no force of law. It had only been laid on the table by leave of the House for tho information "of members, ns promised in the Budget. The classification could not enmc into force that year. He had made this clear to the House at an earlier date. Tho classification as prepared was to be submitted to the Governor. ]f approved by him, it would bo published in tho Gazette as tho provisional Classification of the Public Service, together with the nominal roll of officers in the Service, showing their position under the new scheme, together with their annual salary. It would then be open to any mombor of the Service dissatisfied with his position or salary to apply to have the matter reconsidered. The board having dealt with appeals would make a recommendation to tho Governor. Subsequently the amended classification would bo laid before the House, and it would come into force only when a resolution to that effect had been parsed. Payments under the suggested classification scheme would not, of course, be made that year. This was why he had mentioned, in the Financial Statement, tlmt ordinary increments of the Public Service would be provided for on the Supplementary Estimates. There was ample time for everybody concerned to take the necessary procedure to appeal. AUCKLAND UNIVERSITY COLLEGE. Tho House went into Committee upon the Auckland University College Amendment Bill. Mr. Jits. ALLEN suggested that the Government nominees upon tho council might, bo reduced to two, as was intended in the case of the Otago Universitv Bill. The Hon. T. MACKKNZIK said ho did not propose to bring down the amendment suggested. Mr. Jos. Allen a.skcd whether it was proposed to alter tho latter part of Clause Hi which provided that, fees misht bs paid to professors or lecturers.

He understood that fees were now paid to professors at Auckland, but tho practice might be discontinued in the ease of neiv appointment?. Mr. G. M. THOMSON said it was a highly undesirable tiling that fees should bo paid to the lecturers at any university college. The Hon. T. MACKENZIE said that the clauso must stand in order to givo the council discretionary power, which was necessary in view of existing contracts. The clauso did not make it obligatory to give these fees. Mr. A i.r,l;.\ said ho had received a letter from tho registrar of the Otngo University pointing out that the Court of Convocation, which was entitled to return four members to tho council, included all graduates of the University wherever they might bo resident. It would be almost impossible to send voting papers to somo of these graduates, and it would be convenient if those outside Now Zealand wero deprived of the right to vote. The Hon. T. MACKENZIE stated that he would consider tho proposal, and if necessary have an amendment introduced in another place. lie asked leave to go back to tho earlier clauses, in order to insert a provision authorising school committees to e!ect one member to tho University Council. Mr. G. M. THOMSON suggested that technical schools should bo granted a similar privilege. The amendment giving school committees tho right to eleet a member was agreed to. The Bill was reported with amendments. OTAGO UNIVERSITY. The University of.Otago Council Bill was considered in Committee. The Hon. T. MACKENZIE moved that two members oi the council, instead of four, should l>o appointed by the Governor. This was agreed to. A proposal, by the Minister, to reduce the representation of graduates from four to two was resisted by Mr. G. M. Thomson and Mr. T. K. Sidev. Mr. Jas. ALLEN took an opposite view. Ho said it had come to be recognised that other people than the graduates were interested in university education. This Bill went some wav towards giving outside people a say in the control of university education. Moreover, most primary and secondary school teachers were graduates, and they were empowered to elect members to the council. The proposal to reduce the representation of the graduates (Court of Convocation) from four to two was negatived 011 the voices. It was agreed that one member of the council should be elected by the Otago School Committee, and another by the Otngo. Hospital and Charitable Aid Board. Tho Bill was reported with amendments.

TRAMWAYS AMENDMENT. NO JfDlii: "I'ALACE CAES." When the Tramways Amendment Bill was considered in Committee, the amendments introduced on the previous day wero agreed to with the exception of Clause 9 providing that certificates of competency should be issued only to mo to nil en who had been employed in that capacity for not less than ono year preceding the passing of the Act. This was struck out. Mr. T. H. DAVEY (Christchurch East) moved to add the following new clause:— A (1) All tramcars shall bo so constructed as to provide a passageway from ono end of the car to the other. (2) At least ten per centum of the existing cars (including cars constructed pursuant to a contract entered prior to the passing of this Act) which aro not in compliance with (his provision shall bo converted annually so as to bring them in compliance therewith. Mr. LUKE objected that if the amendment were carried lreavy expense would bo incurred, and fares would have to be increased. Tho local bodies should bo left to introduco improvements on their own account. Mr. ISITT said that where it was a case of tho dollar versus the man he would go for the man evcrv time. Messrs. HOGAN and M'LAEEN supported the view taken by Mr. Luke.' Mr. DAYJ3Y said that even if it cost J!6ofl to convert six cars per year, this would bo better than that one inan shduld be killed. 110 would exempt cable cars. Private tramway companies did not want the reform, but the people did. Mr. FISHER said tho real value of tho amondment was that it would induce the local bodies to build a more suitable type of car. It was agreed that a proviso exempting cable cars should be inserted in tho amendment. Tlie amendment was agreed to. Mr. WITTY moved an amendment to empower tramway authorities to levy rates to make up deficiencies on the working of tramway extensions in special districts, whejte polls for such extensions have beeji carried. Objection was taken to the elauso on tho ground that it was in part retrospective, and Mr. Witty consented to withdraw* it, and hayo it printed and circulated with a view to getting the Hill recommitted for tho purpose of addiDg it. Tho Bill was reported as amended. METHODIST CHURCH BILL. The Methodist Church of New Zealand Bill was passed through Committee without amendment, and was iepoited. The House rose at 0.49 a.m. I