COUNCIL CONTRACTS

Dominion, Volume 3, Issue 736, 8 April 1910, Page 8

COUNCIL CONTRACTS

:: -^-^ v ';' : :--IQPESTION/pF,"PRINCIPLE. HEATED DEBATE. . i ; \; : -' : Important carried. ; '-" ; The relations of: the City Council : 'iith business enterprises in which Councillors, are or may "be interested' ■'""■■■•.'. was 'again the subject of discussion at '-. the .City Council last evening, and an .'.■;,' V important resolution was passed.". /.Councillor Atkinson moved, in acco'rd- ■■: knee. with. ....-. ' . / "(1)' That' in the. opinion' of this .:.'.,; council paragraph (h) of Section 42 • "..J of the Municipal Corporations Act, : ■ 1908, relating to the, disqualifica- •' tipri of councillors', should be amendr- ." '• ,-ied, so that. the. exception therein. -v ;bontained will read as follows:—. .;..;' : -"other .than as;a shareholder in an .incorporated company which con-; . tains .more than twenty members,' and is not. a.private company/ and. : of which such' person is not a di- ■-.;'.'"■.■ rector.'.or the.general'manager, or . in an association or partnership. .';■'... consisting of more", than twenty : ■;-members." : ,'..'., ' .' ;.;. , ■■;■■-• (2) That-pending such alteration. :\ .' in the law., this council should decline to accept any'tender from any • .";...::. company in which'.'a councillor is.a ■ ..:..'shareholder, and which' does not come withinthe exception above set ■:'::;, :■■•'.'. out."_ .'; :.■■' -■ . . Ji ■■.:- "k "On' Grounds., of Principle." :;'•'-., vln.moving as-above, Councillor Atkiri- ..-. ''■ son. said the question was a rather delicate one, and- lie had no-doubt that 1 .-;'":. other councillors felt that as keenly as !';> v '■ he did himself.' The law was not now - in satisfactory 'position, and the _'.: council ought to do its best to put it . on.a.better<footing. He had'based his - motion on grounds of-principle, and he :[. . • ,hoped the discussion would be kept to y .those grounds, and would not descend .. -...to. personalities. He, .strongly: objected ■-. .to the personal turn; which the .dis- :.'■' cus'sion on; this subject had-' taken on a i previous occasion. So far. as;his own 'V. experience... went,- he had seen no . .'.. ground to, suspect that anything cori rupt or improper had been done by,any ■".;■' member',of the council.., He did not.beHieve that, any member of the council I -was getting any advantage in his busi- -. ■_', ~-ness through being a councillor. ,He. . ( ' did not believe any. business man could , ..;%e- a memberof .the.council; and give : ;"th'e' attention that a number of..the : ■ -..; most valuable members did give to' the' .-. 'councfl's affairs without being a'serious '■'■:■'.;.. loser inMiis business. ; ; He had so high >an opinion of• the members that he did not; believe that there would be any more' impropriety, if any council- :'.'; '.." tors ;• were free to contract like''non- . members'. The present system was just ,:': as. much, open to.abuse as.if the restric- ;■••:';■• tions were removed- altogether. Was it ~'.-, any, better than-, a farce-that it-kin-■ son must.not contract with the council, ;,bnt. was'at'liberty-'to-make himself'.into ■.'.:..... a -company, and contract as though he •'■ . were a stranger. ; Alluding- to . Mr. Joliffe's comments on Section 42 of the .}'■ Municipal Corporations. Act;[.Councillor { 'Atkinson said that.it. was, clear . .that

■ ■■;'; r . shareholders ih ; an incorporated. - companywere perfectly free to deal with'a ...... municipal corporation through their ',: •. company." Legislation passed since the V; Municipal-. Corporations- Act authorised ... the;, formation' of private, companies in : which the number of shareholders might ."-_.- ;De333; 3 small aa two;' A company might' of: ; a, councillor and his wife 1 or ... *wo councillors.' It was very desirable that legislation . should; be passed to '■ ■".'.-. . bring such companies under the : re ; . ■ . Btrictibns 'of'Section'^42,"ahd- : that.was' '■ . the.object of the motion, It \was im- '-}\~ possible, to say-that even-that change , ~'.: would make. the law; quite- satisfactory,' :'■'.- pause's member might have most of -. .the shares ,in. a company,, and there X : . ".might bo 19 other 'small shareholders, ': - "who would be . practically dummies, ..- but ,'ir lis,- v further'." suggestion "were; \. adopted,'- and; no company: of which a ;.'councillor was a director, or general .manager was .'eligible, then the condi- . .tion'of the law would be fairly satis-, 'factory.: He did not-claim any originality in these, suggestions. After puzzling over.the question [a good deal,.his atten--1 tion had. been called .to the fact'that part. '.' of . what ■. ■he now ..proposed was, in ' the- new ■;Hospitals and CharitaMe' Aid'' Act. He had added ■-.'■ the provision suggested by. Mr. Joliffe .': relating,. to private companies. every councillor to say whe- ., : &er there was ho' dangeryin allowing . : a cotmcillor to contract .with the coun- . . .cil. If there was no .''''danger,*' they , should; abolish the present restrictions. 'If,- on 'the other hand, there was .'any. : danger, was it-not as bad to, approach Mthe council, under the style of "Coun-..';-..'■.";.'-tailor, Limited," as ~in. one's .own. person. This council'should seek''to'.set a •standard-for other municipal bodies and give', the country a- lead.... :. ■:. Further: Safeguards Suggested. Councillor' Carmichael seconded the motion,- but : said he thought Councillor • . .'Atjdnsoh, somewhat -stultified it by, his '..- xemaris.' ,'He had said that ho mem- '•., ier' of the council was affected,, yet ,the. :'..-.;,-' anotion practically said some of .them -.-.;.-.. were.' .Ho understood" that the infor- '■'■;- jnation; supplied in pursuance of his «wn resolution was not complete, and - le desired to have it made complete.•Hb hoped the officers, of u the, council .-; .would.,secure from: the officers of other "'--- Ibodies ;on which councillors sat particulars of the way in wliich such niat-

iters', were, dealt: with by. those, bodies. (Some councillors had had opportunities yof obtaining information that the outeide. public had not had. That was "/■known, and must be admitted. Nobody' Bhould be a member of the council and also of a' limited liability company, thereby practically doing work for"the ■council. . Moreover, a good'many members of, the council had had work given • ; "to them by; officers of the council with-' ■-' out • tenders being'called for at : all. was no check on' anything done in that way; When a:tender had been ..accepted the tenderer should be allowed to do any other work that,was,requir- ,'• ed at the-same rate. The tender was at-the lowest'price,ySnd the contractor was entitled to further work rather . ihah.' a councillor.

Personal References." .Councillor Hindmarsh supported the motion, .because it would carry out'the intention of the Act, but ho deprecated ihe references of Councillor Cannichael to other councillors. Councillor Carmichael himself on one occasion had Bsked.the.councilnot to prosecute Mr. Gilmer in 1 ' connection ■with certain elosets at Island Bay, and he had been clerk of works on certain big jobs. He Hindmarsh) did not believe that"Councillor Balliriger, or Councillor ILuke, or Councillor Trevor, had profited or studied their own business before the fcnsiness of the council. Councillor iCarmichaelought to have known'better than to suggest that ; Councillor Ballinger's position on the Technical School Board should bo looked into/ Councillor Cannichael: I didn't say that. ".. -.-■:. .Councillor Hindmarsh: You meant it. 'And I hope you'll remember what I said sbout sticking up for your employer. Councillor Hindmarsh then moved to jßmcnd the motion as follows: — V-i (a) By inserting the words "or 'secretary" after ','general manager" in Clause L. ~. s .•..

(b) By making Clause 2 apply to any contract, whether tendered for or, not. .' , . ■

(c) By making Clause 1 a remit to the Municipal Conference, which sits in Wellington next June.

"Innuendoes" Deprecated.

Councillor Fletcher seconded the amendment. He said ho did not agreo with any. member, entering into ' contracts with the council. The principle was wrong. ,He did not think that any member of the council had acted in any way dishonourably. All work had been undertaken in a proper and honourable manner. It was not the right thing to cast reflections upon, or make innuendoes against, fellow councillors. If there was any reason for doing so; a man should come out. into the open.' Councillor Devine supported the amendment. The innovation in the law . permitting . the formation' of a company consisting of the principal and the : office boy was,a fraud on the public. Councillor Atkinson accepted - clauses '(b) and (c) of the amendment. Where Will Councillors Come From? ,"I cannot allow statements to be made in reference to me or my com,pany without some rebuttal," said Councillor Ballingar. At the previous meeting, he continued, it had been stated that ho (the speaker) owned 999 . out of 1000 shares in his company. That was absolutely untrue. He held only 29J per cent, of the shares of the company. There wero 12 members in the company; not two- as had been 'suggested by councillors. ' At this 'stage Councillor Devine. "objected strongly." He.said that he had wished it to be clearly understood that there was nothing of the personal'element in his remarks. . • .

Councillor Ballinger went on to say that his company had been formed, many years ago, long before he became a member of the council. .His company had done business with the' council for many years, in,large and small contracts,'and if members of companies were to be debarred from doing business' with the council, he failed to see where the councillors were to come from. People said that business men were wanted oh the council, but nearly all business men' ran-their businesses on company lines. One of the chief reasons for this was that a business might then still be carried on after the death of. a principal. Companies paid double, the income tax that was required of private individuals, having to'pay, away Is. out of every 20s. of profit. He had ■ never had a, penny for his services for the city, and', he disliked suggestions such as were made By Councillor Atkinson. If his firm did not tender, what price would the other mari-iget from the city, he asked. ' His was a big firm, and it had cut the prices pretty low. ; A big staff of men was kept in constant amployment by his firm through the City Council's contracts. In a recent tender his firm had quoted a price. £10 lower, than anybody else, and was >it. wrong, he asked, for the council to-accept such a tender? - In letters to the papers there' had been insinuations," made by persons who were ashamed to sign their names, to the effect that councillors were able to get inside information .about contracts. He never went near the officers or made any inquiries about such matters. He did not even draw up tb,e tenders, as his business was being managed by his sons. He was giving up so much of his time" to the city that .he was'not able- even'to ; control his own business. - •-.;•'.-. v....-.'.. :'■'/■ ■->-;...

"Phave "served- the'-city'faithfully for five solid years," .concluded Councillor Ballinger, "and, if, this ,is,..j<p be the .reward—well, I shall not. resign, but I shall certainly not stand again." : Remarks by'. cpunolj!Qr::;lliiike...

Councillor-Luke said'that'-he had looked; up the dictionary.for the meaning of "pickings.". Webster's diction.ary.'gave.one definition as "pilfering." Now'; -if that 1 was 'being- suggested about any/member' of .the council, it was ; , a. very-, serious -..matter;; The two councillors singled out 'in;.the present case'were'not';the-only-'councillors- affected. -He would.refer!to the case.of a gentleman' of the , highest' rank, esteemed by everyone,'-who had been elected to the Mayoral office for five years. , He had been a -director of a company which supplied the- municipality from time to time. Then there was'the case of- a-very eminent legal gentleman,.'- who 'had been honoured by the King in-being made King's Counsel. As of .'the city, he; bad occupied a-scat on t|ie Wellington Harbour- Board, .and, on taking, his seat on,'the.;• board, he. intimated ,that; he' would not continue to do any work for the board in a professional capacity so long as he remained a member. There had been no suggestion of pilfering on the part of the Mayor who had sat in the .chair for five years.''. The whole thing now before- the council had been got up in' a crude, and; clumsy way, and was an ungenerous piece of work. He had been a member of th'e council, he said, for. 12 years, -and had never been rejected as a councillor. On one occasion, he .had had the- bad' luck to be thrown out when he stood for the Mayoralty. In regard : to ■ this matter of pickings, he had expected to seo a spirit-of generosity and. fairness. If Councillor Ballinger and he (the speaker) tendered their • resignations, they would be branded in the same way by a large number of .the.'community,, who bad no appreciation of the true position: ':'; :

"Let the People Judge Me." "I am going to see' my term of office *out," Councillor Luke went on, "and if it were not. for ; m^, business engagements and family affairs, I should stand now for the office of Mayor, and let the people say whether. I am a fit and proper person to carry" on the business of their city. I should let the people be■ iny : judges." . \ ■:■ .' ' Councillor Carmicnaef rose to make a personal explanation. ■ He said .that neither he nor anybody else. had : suggested that the councillors had been guilty of pilfering.:/ . J ".' , Councillor Luko: I was quoting the dictionary.. - ■.

Knew No Corruption. Councillor Fitzgerald said that Wellington owed a good deal to its business men, and he personally knew of no corruption. He regretted that the personal element had been introduced. While he believed that there was no corruption .in Wellington municipal methods at present, the motion would make its : occurrence impossible. ■ The Mayor said that he approved of the' resolution. •. However honest it might be, he said, it was unwise for councillors interested in firms to be constantly tendering for city. works. In his reply, Councillor Atkinson said that he was sorry the two councillors particularly interested were not present to hear. his concluding remarks. They had, with, perhaps, one exception, listened ' sympathetically to the moving statement those councillors had made of their private affairs. • Mt had been noticeable, however, that they would not face the principle of the thing, as it appeared to independent men. Could Atkinson the indivadual label himself as "Atkinson, Limited," and 'trade honestly with the council? If there were interests in the, council which were hostile to the interests of the public, there was then the. likelihood. of two of the worst forms of corruption. The motion, with Councillor Hiffimarsh's amendment, was carried. .