THAT £500,000 CLAIM.

Dominion, Volume 2, Issue 541, 23 June 1909, Page 9

THAT £500,000 CLAIM.

;. HOW IT ORIGINATED. MORE ABOUT THE "KING OFWAIHOU." , WHAT THE RECORDS SHOW, Ever since 1887, practically, the claims of the American whaler, Webster, for lands, or indemnity for the alleged loss of such, have engaged the attention of the New Zealand Government. As no settlement apto have been arrived at, tho United States Government, on behalf of Webster (or hiS executors) is now stated to bo pressing for .♦ An examination of the .Parliamentary records at the Assembly Library show that, in 1874, the Governor of Now Zealand, ia a dispatch to tho Secretary of State for tho Colonies, traversed the various aspects and stages of the negotiations which had, up till that time,' taken place between Webster and the Government, together with the legal opinions of Mr. (now Sir) G. M. O'Eerko, then Crown Lands Commissioner, and Dγ Pollen (the Colonial • Secretary). Indulgent 'Treatment of Webster. The dispatch covered an exhaustive report on the question; and, among other , points dealt with, was the following — "That his (Wobster's) present claim I should have been considered strictly as that of an American citizen The records show that ho elected to have his claims referred to tho commission appointed'for the purpose of adjudicating npon such "claims to land not granted by. the Crown after he had been in'formed by the Governor that he could only consent to their being 'laid before the commissioners m the usual way if they were lodged as a British subject' Mr. Webster, indeed, made no such explicit, declaration, but replied, after some hesrtation. 'I wish my claims to bo laid before the commissioners, and am willL ing to take my chance with all others.' Hβ appeared and prosecuted his claims before the commissioners. There is no irtoord of hie having made any protest against their awards, and he must be held to have accepted them as he received the Crown grants made in purettdnce thereof and sold or mortgaged all the lands so granted His claims Were," in fact, treated with exceptional indulgence, and admitted to a larger ex- , , tent 'than those of any other individual '! Webster was no doubt accorded every atlention in bringing forward his ] claims In 1887, Mr. (non Sir Robert) Stout drafted a report upon tho bona fides of the clams, and, in the interval between then and 1893, when Sir Robert Stout submitted a second roport, the ntatter came before Parliament at vani ous ' times Tho 1887 report concludes with'.the following comment — I "From a perusal of the documents I cannot but feel assured that tho United States Senate will feel satisfied . . I Mr , Webster has been treated with very liberal justice, especially seeing that the auards were made in. his favour, or in favour of his acknowledged assigns, of * ' every single aero which the Native owners admitted he had justly bought from them: More than this he could not have received, whether claiming as a British subjeot or as an American citizen " .Again,, in 1893 Sir Robert expressed tha eame'opinion. "The fact is," he wrote, "that there was neither 'seizure nor sale' by thp Government of New Zealand or Great Britaiu of a single acre ever claimed by Mr. Webster. If the title , of purchases of lands from tho Natives prior to the Treaty of Waitangpwas not proved to the satisfaction of the various commissioners who investigated the'claims, or if thp Crown grants were not fosued, 'the lands claimed and not awarded ' remained Native lands—that is, the Government recognised that these lands belonged to the aboriginal inhabitants ... If, then, Mr. Webster has any olaun it must be against the Native owners, who obtained all •the lands which, though claimed, were not awarded to him." > ' 'The Amerloan'Point of Vlow.

It 'is interesting to note that the United States Senate took a different view of the matter, as appears from the following resolution, which nas forwarded to the President — "That the president is requested to take such measures as, in his opinion,' mav bo proper to eecure ... a just settlement and finAl adjustment of his claim against Great Britain, growing out of the Joss of lands and other property in' New Zealand, of which he has been *■ depnved by the act or consent of the British Government, and to which he had acquired a title under' purchases arid deeds of convejance from the Native .chiefs prior to 6th February 1840, and prior to any right of Great Britain to the said islands " S}f Robert Stout appended a minute, commenting in the above resolution, to his report Hβ observed — ici"i If 11 be = atice| 3 ttat the (United Statee Senate) report concludes with a suggestion that if the Government of Gieat Britain refuses to consider Mr. Webster's claims for reparation 'special reprisals' should be resorted to I am not I aware whether it is usual, in a document asking for consideration of claims' of a citizen, to threaten the Government to which such a document is adoressed in such a manner. In private society, an a civilised State, it is not unusuiU to threaten your antagonist with revolvers and bowie knivos, or oven to state there will be an appeal to a judicial tribunal if your arguments are not listened to; and I would respectfully subm?Vhat » ba P" 84 * of reprisals shows weakness" ' Webster originally claimed for 500,000 ? C I l i? f n ls ' 500 ° acres were awarded to hub,personally, and, altogether, the awards mite m respect of conjoint interests—WebBtot'and others-totalled 41,924 acres ; THE CLAIMANT'S BRIEf. HELD Bγ MINtNC COMPANIES. dROUKDS ON WHICH THE CLAIM IS \ BASED. ' I (By Telegraph-Special Correspondent.) JiU. i i , ,' • Auo « , ancl, June 22. -The big land claim made by an American citizen, and which has necessitated the Solici-tor-General proceeding to England, has created 1 great interest here, and the Herald,' after a 6oarch of old documents dating away back to the arrival of the first WhalerS in New Zealand, has secured tho history'of the case, including tho brief dated 1878 on whirh the claim is based. This brief, apart from the question at issue/ is interesting, as having a bearing on tho very early history of New Zealand. The claimant originally was one Wm Webster, who, if alive, must be about 104 years of age atfleast, but it is presumed that his heirs-atlaw are making the claiin. Away back'in'the dawn of tho nineteenth century a'few whalers visited these islands, and somo tifao prior to 1840 there came Wm Webster, an, American who seemed to havo had tho capacity, if never the real opportunity, of a king of finance, In those very early days, WebBlor saw the possibilities of the Coromandel i district as a mining area, and ho acquired sections of land all over the peninsula (as fnlJy stated in yesterday's issue) Ho traded in beads, guns, rum, blankets, sugar, etc, for big loads of produce, euch as maize, kumaras, flax, timber, otc , and so Webster waxed nch. His time of arrival in Now Zealand is not quite certain, but' one Auckland gentleman well versed in titf details of the rlaim places the dato as 1833 or 1839, and Wobster was prooably one of tho first to deal extensively in kauri gum He'also dealt largely in ship's spars, went in for whaling, and embarked in mining, the latter venture costing him a large portion of his wealth Before 1840, when New Zealand became a separate colony, tho New South Wales Go-

yernment appointed a commission to inquire into /land, claims in New,: : Zealand, .and after, this proclamation of New Zealand as a Crown • colonyrthe commission made a report, sotting ■ tbeliniit' of land to be allowed to Europeans ; at 2560 acres, and later on Governor. Hobson appointed a -commission which declared ■ all claims above a cortain. small area to bo void. In -the'earlyfifties, Webster returned to (California, and then made a claim for the lande he/had, acquired from the Natives, and. which transactions were repudiated by the Government. H3e urged that the Government' in; repudiating his title had never handed back the land to the aboriginal von-, dorsj'.but had retained it as Crown property; and; as .he." was an American' citizen the Crown'hud no right to dispossess him as it had .'dispossessed British .'subjects. :If his claim:is substantiated,'it is' stated there are numorous'other ones which may. bo brought, forward;, as -there were other aliens dispossessed ■.'■ at .the same. time. Webster's claim has propped.up,frequently between 1840 and the.'present day.' ■■' i: , "■■', -.• •:. -." .■:':'. The land he lays claim to is. principally scattered 'all over the. Coromandel district, and includes several areas now: held by. mining companies. Some of the sections front the ■water at Mercury' Bay, some are at Maraetai,-; some; about Tairua, some about Coromandel .township, .itself, and; it .ispossible, there are;a!so areas on the Great Barrier, and' down-along the shares of Hauraki .Gulf.:r.-v,-;yv-' :;^',;;'.- : -';:, -... ;':■:.) ":■■ : )y p :A^'':^'' r :. The/Brief,';'■:-,-.■ ■"•: { :: j^ : ' .-.-: ■' following 1 is'.a copy .of the -:' ; brief on which' Webster's heirs resume the now, torio claiiE i— ••'"■"•■' -■'/-/>/ -v///''<* -j :'. .' William' Webster; • a citizen'of the; United StateSiOf America, claims/ from the.British Government compensation to the amount of £224,624 in respect, of lands ; in the .North Is-Md-of-New. -Zealand ■ purchaeed by him | from the/original /owners, .and, ps'-to,'alleges, , . wrongfully taken by the Crown -.and afterwards sold or otherwise disposed of- in violation qf/pre-existing ■rights.,.- ■:/'■; ''■ :/-,■'.■■.■ I:/:: : j : In April,'lß4o,'Lord John Russell,-the then Secretary of State for the Colonies, addressed a. memoraiidnni. to lord Palmerston, Secretary for. Foreign Affairs', in- which,the follow., ing /passage occurs:- 1 ;'■'. :■';■•'. ] "]:-\\. ,'.;../.- :-' ; -.;-,- \ 'The British statute-book has in the present, century, Jin' three- distinct enactments,' clared.that 1 New Zealand.is npta part' of the British Dominions,.'.and, , 6eepndly, : King William IV made the most public solemn and anthentic declaration/which.,it .was possible 1 tomake. thatNewZealand was'a. substantive and independent/State.:. InHer/Majesty's instructions; conveyed. by ; the . Marquis or' Nor-. m&nby to Mr. Consul him , to treat with'the aboriginal Natives ,oi New. Zealand-for, the cession of tho sovereignty of their, country,..and-'the- rightyof pre-emption over their lands -to: the' Crown of Great Britain,'it is distinctly affirmed /of the Native, ownersjthat their title- to.thesoil and. sovereignty of New Zealand.is-indisputable, and has vbeeri;/ solemnly .recognised : by ,the British \ ' /Government. : ■• The Treaty of j Waitangi, which : wasjthe! immediate , result of /Consul Hobson-s----negotiation; :was inVeffeot 'a- : treaty of iunion. It.provided for the cession'to Her; Majesty of | all r fshol rights and Ipowsr /of- sovereignty; while;confirming ..and 'guaranteeingi.-.to:. the, chiefs ; .and tribes of, 'JjSew Zealand .tho full ex- ■ elusive and: undisturbed possession '.'of their, lands arid 'estates/''and it /reserved .;to v vHer Majesty- the';exclusive right 1 of-.pre-emption '6ver, : such l lands,'as'the proprietors thereof disposed to/alienateY' The treaty has .lioi reference to .lands which the : Natiye ;own r | ers had:already 'alienated at a tinie'ivhcn Now) Zealand,/ was ..in tho position "of !;an 'inde- , -pendent; State;: The Crown; in taking : possession', in 1840," found; British, subjects, and .others/.(to the .number, of about 2000) in ■■■ quiet' and undisturbed possession of tracts; of lands ,by. .virtue•; of ;■-.purchases i made . direct", 'from the; acknowledged Native owners.'■■■ = In.a pro-: hclamation'.issued by .-Governor Hobson,.-of even' date .'with ;that: proclaiming the Queen's. sovereignty :in. New Zealand (January '30, 1840),^ it; is*';notified';. "to, .all,. her Majesty.'s. Bubjectß.■that;her;Majesty does!hot .deem it espedie'nt.to recognise' any titbsto'-iarid in i New Zealand'which we: not derived. from or confirmed ;by.' ; her•Majesty."; Allowing that. the_;p'ower. to cpnfiscate ■: existing-- -.purchases which-this'iprpclamation 'implies would be enforced ;'in the case of British.'subjects, the terms of; the -proclamation cannot -be held to extend'to'subjects , of other nations owning no allegiance 'to the Queen,- and who ;had :preyibusly;acquired land there. V : As Mr.; Everett very clearly:.pnt' it- in his communication to Lord Aberdeen (pecember,'. 1843),./'Whatever right? qpuld. be "acquired to England :by> the cession ;of : sovereignty-;6ver ■ the Islands '.or New' , Zealand ;'must,: of course, be by ;ariy .pre-existing 'rightsof other nations. Neither : : .the'!United:St!ites;noranyi Power; ;if; so, disposed), would be ppnnitted without opposition -': by' England .in 'establishing .an 'ex-; elusive.', sovereignty over.• previously. inde'pen-idsnt:islands-;in the -Pacific Ocean to proceed at; pleaSure ( \to : vacate purchases of, land mado by British 'subjects,' or tSiiinterfere with other before such '•"assertion of sovereigntyi.was-made."■■'•;HiM;:.Secretary of to the.Gpyernor of. ;New-; Zealandun. March,;. 1841, /says' ;thatj'in' .thecase, of where the fact.ofjthe ,pur-i chase ;is--'undisputed,\y"the'.'claims -should be acknowledged''.- ! without at.present i ing ;■ the /blocks ; Pn' which;;crily one', part of, the paid. ..Mr .'Webster (who'.-iß."a, citizen;.;of the tlnitcd States, anfl an- alien/in the meaning of tho Royal,instruc-': tipnß);.was,. ; it is. submitted, entitled to have his.' undisputed ... claims of ..;241,000 acres. al r lowed ;;in-;full.",'Of. the; claims .admitted ,by: the Commissioners,:as undisputed only 16,468 acres.'h>.ve.;been granted \ to/Mr.. : ..Webster, ■'or/ hia aßsigns,-.and it-is contended that his .-.title' is undisputabiy.gopd'to the remaining; 226,624' acre's, ..the-land. haying beenrdisposed of;by grants from'.the.'iCrown'in violation, of; these rights.i--,The : pla.im'3nt:,is; entitled to., cpiripensationj- and he 'claims at. the /rate; of' £1. per •S^'-'r'.':.' : ■■'■'■'■■'■■•■;■:■.':. /■■';//: '.}.:■ ■••' ;': Note':/'■ The .claim - argupd." above.; is indeperiderit;'of;/ alleged rights arising out, of" .incomplete ./'purchases-,-;(amounting,: / it; is stateo^/.t0'250,000 acres /oi-inore), arid ipe;, oial;damage ; in /respect, of claimant's kauri timber," taken and appropriated by -the Crown.'. - .'.The ; above /brief was originally prepared; in 1878,: but'/aince/then the ;ampuht ; vbas been added-to;o». account of- interest, increasing values;/ etc , .,:/till- the/cost now reaches.,'ovor ■ half..a'million''sterling.-" '" -./"i'/; /.".,/. ; VvThe.Kew Zealand .G9vernment;has .declined ■to' recognise'.'- any /.liability in the. matter;. "\ ;■■■.-;

CLAIMS EXCEED THE WHOLE COUNTRY.

(By Telegraph —Press Assoclatloa ) Chrlstohuroh, June 22. Interviewed in Christchurch, the Minister for. Education (Mr. Fowlds) said the Webster claim that was before the public at present and was taking Dr. Fitchett to England was a \ery old thing. Webster was an American, who had been a settler in New Zealand in the days before the colony was actually founded, and he had lodged a claim for certain lands, supposed to have been bought from the Maoris. All claims of such description had been 'adjudicated on by a commissioner, and Webster was then given what was considered his proper allowance. The claim had been .appearing'Snd reappearing within the past 40 years, but he did not think that the present case would have very serious,.results:..to . the Dominion.; , I-...--" , '. ,- x---.:':'You-'know," Tadded vMri.-- Fowlds, "claims hnve; bean -.lodged, for /land : \boUßhts; from ' Maoris',- .mostly;:;iri". ; the vNorth Island, '.and 'the!:total; area 'claimed exceeds the area of - the r.Nprtii - and ; the South 'Islands by. nearly. ' a{miUioh' : ;aores;"/;;^'-, ! ..'.■•>.;.;■;■.';•>.;:;. .'■ :'';; : c;.',.!. ; ->. :