THE PRIME MINISTER'S SPEECH.

Press, Volume XLIX, Issue 14840, 4 December 1913, Page 9

THE PRIME MINISTER'S SPEECH.

Tho Prime Minister traced the history of New Zealand s contribution since the time when it was only £20,000 annually. Recently the Australian Squadron bad been withdrawn, so that it the moment thero was no protection for New Zealand excepting two light cruisers and the Australian ships. If •Sir Joseph Ward had been in his (Mr •Massey s) place, would he have been satisfied with the two ships they had? Sir Joseph Ward: Or course not. Mr Massev said the Government wouid not have been doing ita duty if it had cxnresaed itself as satisfied with two ships (the Psyche.and Pyramus) offered by the Imporial authorities. Ho challenged any member to look at tho Bill and see if there was provision for tho expenditure of one penny outside of £100 000. Mr Witty: There will be next year. Mr Massev: "Ah, next year in talking of this Bill! The naval adviser will not oost ls; he will be in chargo of the Philomel." Mr Massey traversed Sir Joseph Ward's figures with regard to the expense of the Bristol cruiser. Tho official figures were: —Building and armament, £377,000 *, maintenance, £19.900; interest, £25,300; wages, '.'28.800: an annual outlay of £72,000. Early this year they had offered the Imperial Government a further £50,000 a year if two Bristols were sent, out here, as originally arranged. He quoted the speech of Lord Tweedmouth where he advocated exactly what New Zealand proposed to undertake. The First Lord or the Admiralty had given expression to similar sentiments, holding that when the decisive point came, tho Dominions should protect outside stations and trade centres beyond tho theatre of war. Mr McKenna also had supported local navies. It had not been decided what Canada would dee, but there was no parallel between New Zealand and Canada, as the latter country, especially the eastern side, was really right under the wing of England. There was no ground for the statement that the Government was contemplating a partnership with Australia. Neither bad approached the other, but ho believed they would always work well together. Regnrding the proposals in general, he said they were making a start on a New Zenland Navy, and today's proposals would be something to count on. Ho considered there should be Imperial conferences, and they should be held every two years at the outside, and should not be confined to England. If the Empire was to be held together—and he thought it, would be held together—it woiild bo by sentiment, ties of kinship, pride of race, .*md the confidence of the people in.the Empire itself. That was the thing to look forward to. OTHER SPEAKERS. .. Mr G. W. Russell said ho protested against the Bill;. because thero was no limit to the number of men to be raised, nor was Parliament,! to bo consulted. Everything was to bo done by regulation. The Minister had said the Bill was limited to estab- ] iish a training ship, but it went further than that, and implied the existence of a local Navy from which there would be no going back when once it was started. Hei also objected to the Bill because it made New Zealand a recruiting ground for the British Navy while wo were short of .boy labour, and were actually importing boys under the. Sedgwick system, to do tbo country's work. In proof of the, impossibility of keeping down expenditure on.projects such as this, he quoted the growing cost of tho Territorial system, oh which the Dominion, had spent £295,000 in the first six.months of" the .year, and which had .become as a ravenous -wolf ,in. conaiexion- with our finances. Where was the enemy -.of whom wo were afraid that justified the expenditure of this enormous sum? No German invasion was possible till the British Navy . was knocked out of the water, while invasion from Japan was quite as impossible. :

Tho Hon. W. H. Hemes, said he could not understand the consternation of. the Opposition over a small Bill which simply provided for the"continuance of the existing subsidy. He did not believe in building up-a navy of Dreadnoughts to compete with. Japan, because neither Australia nor New Zealand could stand the.expense, but they should bo able to provide protection for the trade-routes, so that commerce could b© convoyed to,, say, ..the Cape, and England could then take charge. Mr \ Wiiford. 'said he was . totally against a local navy, but admitted that there was no evident desireoh the part :of the Minister to separate the local navy to be formed from the British Navy. Tho danger of the Bill, however? Was not in what it said but in what it implied, and he would prefer to vote £140,000 a'year'arid allow Great Britain to expend it upon the Imperial Navy, rather than.attempt the formation of a local navy. The debate was carried on by the Hon. F. M."_J. Fisher. Messrs G. M. Thomson," Hanan, and Buddo. THE MINISTER'S REPLY. In his reply j the Hon. James Allen said members of the Opposition had ignored the Bill in their criticism. If they voted against the Bill they would voto against New Zealand training her own personnel. He claimed; tho votes of the other side on the ground that the peoplo of New Zealand should have a say in the disposal of the money, and the making of their own naval reserve. They .hoped to get 80. men for tho Philomel during next year- Ihey could not engage an unlimited number of men, because they could not pay them. The Psyche and Pyramus served the purpose of prbtectiric tho trades routes, but one "Bristol" could do as much as these two together. vSBCOND READING CARRIED. The second reading was agreed to by 31 votes to 21. .-..-. The following is the division list:— For tbe Bill (31V—Messrs Allen.' Anderson, Bell, R. F. Bollard, Campbell, Coates. Dickson, Fisher. Fraser. Guthrie. Harris. Hemes, Hine. Hunter, Malcolm, Mander. Massey, Nosworthy, Okev, Pearce. Pomare, Reed, R. H. Rhodes. T. W. Rhodes, Scott. F. H. Smith. Statham, Sykes, G. M. Thomson. Wilkinson? Young. Pairs—For the Bill: Messrs J. Bollard, Bnick, Buchanan. Scott, Herdman. Newman. T_ee. Wilson. ' Against the Bill (21)— Messrs Atmore, Brown, Buddo, Buxton, Craigie. Ell, Forbes, Glover, Mac Donald, Ngata, Parata? Robertson. Russell, Seddon, Sidey, J. C. Thomson, Veitch, Webb, Wiiford, Witty, and Sir Joseph Ward. Pairs against the Bill—Messrs Colvin, Dickie, Isitt. R. W. Smith, Clark, Davey, and.Sir J3me6 Carroll. I IN COMMITTEE. - The House went into Committee on tho Bill. Sir Joseph Ward moved an amendment to test the feeling of the Honse as to whether members were willing to support a proposal for a separate navy or whether a referendum should be taken before severance from the Imperial Navy was completed. Tba. amendment was lost by 31 votes to 10. ■P* sjj ™f still under consideration when the Telegraph office closed at 3 a.m. -Th.. "*"ffi^kAMP..M : _S $ "WHITE HORSE" i_ limited, and Mackie and Co. only supply approved;^- «_ jealous are they of their reputAtL, *h« mih'ic'! should therefore W_w M i ♦ Jl fOr "WHITE Bnpsigß_g»fnl to ask.for get it. :• ;**£*& 6ee that th ST i