EVENING SESSION.

Auckland Star, Volume VI, Issue 1699, 29 July 1875, Page 3

EVENING SESSION.

Second Eeadings

The Goldfields Amendment and two Wellington Reserves Bills were read a second time. Mr Eeader Wood's important question then came up. He entered into an explanation of the doubts respecting the powers of the Assembly to abolish the provinces. • The first time his attention was drawn with any seriousness to the legal aspect of the affair was some months ago by the late member for Auckland City West, whose absence from that House was much regretted, and whose legal ability and skill had subsequent to his retirement been rewaided by the present Ministry. On a public occasion that member (Mr Gillies) had stated that he had given the question his most earnest consideration, and came to the conclusion that the House had not power to abolish the provinces throughout the colony. (Hear.) The Speaker said it was a debateable question. Mr Wood said he was simply stating a fact. The first section of the Constitution Act provided that there should be provinces. Then occurred a sharp conflict as to the right use of debateable statements between which Mr Woood adroitly inserted his arguments on grounds of simple facts. The third section of that Act says there shall |be Superintendents and Provincial Councils, and no amending Act gives this House power to alter that provision. The Speaker here ruled lb.e member out of order. Mr Wood continued, subsequently in 1566 the Imperial Parliament passed &n Act the title of which declared the power of General Assembly of New Zealand to abolish any province or t withdraw from any such province any part of territory thereof. The question was whether the Act could be understood to imply "all" the provinces. The next point was the despatch from Earl Carnarvon in reply to the petition sent Home by the Superintendent of Auckland in which he referred to the powers of the House on the question under notice. Earl Carnarvon stated that this was a subject which the General Assembly was in his opinion, quite competent to discuss, as they had already fully and ably done in the debate of the House of Eepresentatives, but he did not say (as the Speaker apprehended he ■would have done) that the Assembly had full power to settle and determine that the whole provinces should be abolished. This was followed by a further interruption, it being asserted that the statement was debateable.

Mr Wood continued : His whole object in putting the question was to show that the doubts entertained were reasonable doubts, and he had no doubt that as the subject had been brought under the notice of the Government some time since they had taken steps to have those doubts dissolved, and he now asked whether this was the case ? Sir Donald McLean said he felfc quite certain the power rested with the House. Upon that he felt no manner of doubt. They h?d also taken the opinion of the present Chief Justice on the subject,. Sir Donald McLean then read the following letter, which was listened to with growiDg interest till the last paragraph, when laughter and uproar followed, and the scene presented was the most animated in the House I have seen this session:—

"To the Honorable Col. Secretary,— "The Act of the Imperial Parliament (31 and 32 vie, c 92) is intituled 'An Act to declare the powers of the General Assembly to abolish any province or to withdraw from any such province any part of territory thereof.' It expressly authorises the General Assembly to abolish any province. This means any, one or more, or all of the provinces. Upon the abolition of the province or provinces, the Provincial system will have no existence in the district or districts theretofore included within the province or provinces abolished, and the General Assembly must provide for local concerns of such districts. Questions have been raised as to the construction of the Act above referred to; and, thongh I see no room for doubt or question, I think that it would be well that the Secretary of State should be asked to take the opinion of law officers of England, and, if any doubt whatever is entertained by them, that a bill should at once be passed for removing that doubt.— (Signed) James Prexdekgast, December 1, 1874. The effect of the reading was electric, especially on the Opposition, and the doubts implied in, the last paragraph seemed to descend like a black cloud on the Ministerial ranks.

Mr Fiizherbert moved that the document be printed.

Sir George Grey said the present Chief Justice gave an opinion on this subject a few years since, in which he said the meaning of the words abolish a province was simply alter its boundaries. He would ask the Government if they would have the kindness to produce that document also. Mr. Fitzherbert asked the Ministry if they would be good enough to have the document to which the member for City West referred printed alongside (in parallel columns), the present opinion upon which Ministers so implicitly and credulously relied ? Mr. Bunny : Are we to understand the Government is willing, or will it be necessary for some member to move a motion for the production of that opinion in order to see the difference of opinion in various stages of a man's life 1

Sir Donald McLean said he would have no objection to producing it if thought desirable. Mr Murray wished to know whether the suggestions of the Chief Justice had been complied with.

No reply was elicited for a long time. Mr Rolleston pressed Mr Murray's enquiry, and for a time the Ministry was played with by the House from all sides, which came down to bandinage. The question was pressed at laat, and Sir Donald McLean replied that the Government had not acted on the recommendation of Mr Prendergast. The reply of Sir Donald McLean was followed by great laughter and continued

merriment all over the House, the Miuisteriajists endeavoring to join in the fun.

Other Measures. Several bills of purely Southern interest Were at advanced stages. The Highway Empowering Amendment Bill was read a first time. It has six clauses, the object being to continue or repair the ontinuationjof road? brought to the boundary by another district. It provides for application to the District or Supreme Court. Mr Shepherds resolution for the formation of an Institute of Civil Engineers was negatived.

WT Miner's Rights Inquiry. Kin reply to Sir George Grey's motion for the production of the renort of the Commissioners' inquiry into "Oninemuri miner's rights, Sir Donald Maclean said the report nad been received and submitted to the law oflicers of the Crown, whose opinion was wat the evidence did not bear out the conclusion arrived at. The Government had, therefore, determined to institute an open enquiry into the matter, to be held at the xnames at as early a date as possible. air George Grey expressed dissatisfaction unless an assurance was given that the enquiry would be concluded and the report brought up speedily. c Sir Donald McLean assured him that it would be done immediately— long before me close of the session. tJIJf Kolleston moved' that all correspondence relating to the recent changes in the distribution^ Supreme Court Judges. ComL c- V'eWed the • hibtory of the Select on the Ward-Chapman case last kC a- Said the recommendatien 14 i n the ,reP° rfc as adopted by the Act * not been attended to by the oftW? 1 asßerted, and the .recent action w.we in moving some judges,

tended to create an increased feeling that independence of (Le judges were not secured to them ; ako, that a reflection v ai caht upon the judges.

Mr Bowen promised the correspondence which was vejy little. The Governmen, had not the least" idea of imputing anything like partiality to judges, nor the least intention to interfere with their independence. Mr Bolleston explained that the recommendation of the Ward Committee showed that judges were likely to be more independent if occasionally removed frcm places where they coittvacted social ties. Mr Shepherd held that the same system ought to be extended to wardens and resident magistrates.

_ Mr. Bolle&ton replied that whether intentional or not a wrong was done. The remaining motions were only of Southern interest. The House rose at 9.30.